UND- NDSU GDT 9/7/2019

[fightingsioux4life]

2 minutes ago, WestDakota2313 said:

No one sincerely wants Bama or Clemson, don’t be so dense. I don’t know why GFCC fans can’t accept the fact that NDSU may be an FBS... no is an FBS caliber opponent. Hence why they beat the last 6 FBS opponents they play.

You also forget that if NDSU moves up they too get 85 scholarships? I know math is hard, but that seems like a pretty easy one. 

Yeah, you guys beat FBS teams, kudos to you for doing that.

Having said that, you are the one that needs a math lesson if you really think NDSU could move up, get 85 scholarships and then recruit against teams like Michigan, Ohio State and the like. The budgets of FBS football schools (even G5 schools) are much larger than either UND or NDSU. Those extra 22 scholarships won't be cheap either.

Beating an FBS team early in the season is great. But it's totally different than playing an entire schedule of FBS teams, week after week. Sustaining that year after year would be difficult, which is why NDSU isn't going to move up.

[Bison06]

3 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said:

So should we get his Heisman bust ready?  This guy making the Heisman "watch list" is beyond ridiculous, particularly with the kind of athletes in the top echelon of FBS.

Honestly, it is a little concerning to read some of these comments. "Would love to see us get someone even close to that", "we won't play a better team than this again this year, so don't worry", and so on. It is like we are now accepting of the idea that all we will ever do is finish 6-5 every year with no playoffs and most of our wins will be against bad teams. It is very easy to get "used to" a negative situation and then accept it as the "new normal". It is human nature. But it is also a very dangerous trap to fall into. And we need to avoid falling into that trap.

Sometimes making a list like that early in the season isn’t a sincere attempt to say a guy has a legitimate chance to win the award, but more of the writer’s “tip of the cap” to a guy and a program that the writer is impressed by.

So, it’s not ridiculous. NDSU, like it or not, has had better QB play than nearly every FBS school for the last 6 years and Trey looks to be continuing that trend.

Laugh at that if you like, but the NFL scouts would disagree with you.

[geaux_sioux]

1 hour ago, Bison Dan said:

I thought both played with class (no cheap shots).  One thing I noticed was und showed little to no emotion.

It’s been a concern of mine for years. May be a reflection of Bubba. 

[Bison06]

2 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said:

Yeah, you guys beat FBS teams, kudos to you for doing that.

Having said that, you are the one that needs a math lesson if you really think NDSU could move up, get 85 scholarships and then recruit against teams like Michigan, Ohio State and the like. The budgets of FBS football schools (even G5 schools) are much larger than either UND or NDSU. Those extra 22 scholarships won't be cheap either.

Beating an FBS team early in the season is great. But it's totally different than playing an entire schedule of FBS teams, week after week. Sustaining that year after year would be difficult, which is why NDSU isn't going to move up.

I’ve never heard one single NDSU fan who knows the slightest bit about college football think we could actually compete with the blue bloods.

I think they could definitely become a G5 powerhouse like a Boise State though.

[fightingsioux4life]

2 minutes ago, JohnboyND7 said:

If you have any sort of success in the Big 12, I think that would make you a pretty decent FBS program.  

Obviously NDSU is not FBS.  But NDSU is certainly better than most FBS teams(lots of them aren't particularly good) lately.  They'll play a few more of them over the next few years that will provide a different challenge than what they are used to seeing.  That'll be interesting to see.  

The Big 12 has some really bad programs at the bottom. Obviously, Texas and Oklahoma are elite, but after that it drops off significantly. The Big 10 is deeper, but does have some dogs like Rutgers (which UND is becoming a mid-major version of, unfortunately). The MAAC is mediocre, but not as bad as the Sun Belt (or Sun Belch as FU fans like to call it). But all those programs can hope for is a bowl game nobody really watches or cares about. No CFP. No National Championships. Perennial 6-5 or 7-4 records. NDSU is not going to move up for that.

[fightingsioux4life]

4 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

Sometimes making a list like that early in the season isn’t a sincere attempt to say a guy has a legitimate chance to win the award, but more of the writer’s “tip of the cap” to a guy and a program that the writer is impressed by.

So, it’s not ridiculous. NDSU, like it or not, has had better QB play than nearly every FBS school for the last 6 years and Trey looks to be continuing that trend.

Laugh at that if you like, but the NFL scouts would disagree with you.

I am not even going to touch that one. Lay off the Jack Daniels will you? #cantmakeitup

[Bison06]

Just now, fightingsioux4life said:

I am not even going to touch that one. Lay off the Jack Daniels will you? #cantmakeitup

Name the schools that have had their last two QBs drafted. Have fun with that research, they are very few and far between.

[fightingsioux4life]

2 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

I’ve never heard one single NDSU fan who knows the slightest bit about college football think we could actually compete with the blue bloods.

I think they could definitely become a G5 powerhouse like a Boise State though.

Unless the G5 and P5 formally split, that won't get you much beyond a mid-level Bowl game. And I don't think NDSU fans would be in favor of that.

[Bison06]

1 minute ago, fightingsioux4life said:

Unless the G5 and P5 formally split, that won't get you much beyond a mid-level Bowl game. And I don't think NDSU fans would be in favor of that.

Agreed, which is why until/if the structure of FBS changes, I wouldn’t advocate for a move up.

[Ozzie82]

25 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said:

NDSU is NOT an FBS program. And if they ever moved up for real, they would find that out pretty quickly. They could win the Sun Belt (which is pure garbage) and have some success in the Big 12 (lots of bad programs in that conference). But anything above that, they would get worn down by the depth and athleticism of FBS teams and their 85 scholarships. Look for some "Bring on Bama" or "Bring on Clemson" nonsense from the Moo U faithful in the coming weeks and months.

IMO they absolutely are an FBS level program. Obviously they aren’t nowhere near the Alabama, Ohio State, Clemson level, but they  are a better program than a significant number of FBS schools. Their last 2 QBs are in the NFL, they’ve won however many FBS games in a row, however many FCS championships... I think the data is pretty clear. 

[fightingsioux4life]

Just now, Bison06 said:

Name the schools that have had their last two QBs drafted. Have fun with that research, they are very few and far between.

You are putting NDSU's QBs on the same level as the QBs at Alabama, Clemson, Oklahoma, Ohio State and God only knows who else. That is what your original statement implied:

Quote

.....better QB play than nearly every FBS school for the last 6 years

So you really think the top schools in the SEC and ACC would have been better off with Easton Stick than what they had to "settle for"? Please take your fantasies to whatever discussion forum LakesBison has set up for himself. Because that is the only place anyone will take them seriously. #koolaidisbadforyourhealth

[Hawkster]

I was stuck at a wedding yesterday so I just watched the game this morning and then gave up in frustration.    As so many people have said for years, Bubba can't recruit and this shows.   We played 3 QB's yesterday and all looked just OK, nothing outstanding, and 4th QB is out injured.   Next week will a biggie, need to win and move forward or everything will just regress.    If that happens Bubba's days should be numbered.

[Bison06]

5 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said:

You are putting NDSU's QBs on the same level as the QBs at Alabama, Clemson, Oklahoma, Ohio State and God only knows who else. That is what your original statement implied:

So you really think the top schools in the SEC and ACC would have been better off with Easton Stick than what they had to "settle for"? Please take your fantasies to whatever discussion forum LakesBison has set up for himself. Because that is the only place anyone will take them seriously. #koolaidisbadforyourhealth

“Nearly every FBS school” you realize doesn’t mean ALL.

The same Easton Stick that just beat out Cardale Jones in San Diego? Yeah, I’d take him over many P5 starters.

Name the schools who have had their last two QBs drafted when you get a chance. I’ll wait.

 

[Irish]

18 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said:

So should we get his Heisman bust ready?  This guy making the Heisman "watch list" is beyond ridiculous, particularly with the kind of athletes in the top echelon of FBS.

Honestly, it is a little concerning to read some of these comments. "Would love to see us get someone even close to that", "we won't play a better team than this again this year, so don't worry", and so on. It is like we are now accepting of the idea that all we will ever do is finish 6-5 every year with no playoffs and most of our wins will be against bad teams. It is very easy to get "used to" a negative situation and then accept it as the "new normal". It is human nature. But it is also a very dangerous trap to fall into. And we need to avoid falling into that trap.

We have already fallen into that trap and seem comfortable there.  I wish the good old boys and former players and alumni that lobbied so hard for Bubba even though he was a .500 coach because he was "one of us" would put a little pressure on him and the administration.  

[dlsiouxfan]

Yesterday only showed that after 5 years with Schweigert as coach, UND is pretty much in the same place they were the last time they played NDSU in 2015.  The program has not advanced at all under his tenure.   It's time for new leadership of this program.

[Taz Boy]

Game was fairly pedestrian.  Two very different levels of talent, which is what the Bison typically have to deal with week in and week out being top in the FCS.  They need to move up into G5 FBS, in which they could certainly compete as long as the financials are there.

[fightingsioux4life]

Just now, Ozzie82 said:

IMO they absolutely are an FBS level program. Obviously they aren’t nowhere near the Alabama, Ohio State, Clemson level, but they  are a better program than a significant number of FBS schools. Their last 2 QBs are in the NFL, they’ve won however many FBS games in a row, however many FCS championships... I think the data is pretty clear. 

There is a big difference between playing an FBS money game early in the season and being able to compete weekly with 85 scholarship FBS schools. FCS Appalachian State made huge waves when they beat Michigan on the road, not to mention the three consecutive FCS titles they won before that. That hasn't translated to consistent winning at the FBS level, certainly not vs. the middle to upper echelon of the Subdivision. They are basically bottom-feeders in FBS.

If they are that good, why don't they schedule two FBS money games each and every season? Because they know it's a big risk to get banged up before the MVFC and FCS regular season schedule. And that is what would happen.

[Wilbur]

11 hours ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

It’ll be several weeks before Ketteringham is healthy so I imagine we have to ride with Zimmerman for awhile.

Grover is not a long-term option and they want to retain shirt on Schuster. UND needs speed on edge so have to keep Boltmann out there.

Zimmerman should get better. He’s only had one start (today) and it was against No. 1 FCS team in the Fargodome. I expect his timing with Wanzek, Maag, Toivonen, etc. to improve with more game reps. 

With all that said, the running game hasn’t got going these first two games and that is most concerning to me. Offensive line needs to play better. None of the 3 starting RBs have jumped out, either; each is OK in certain situations (JJ short yardage, McKinney on edge, etc.) but none are all around every down backs. 

The defense was not awful today, but the lack of ability to contain the QB run game was their downfall. They should look better against Sam Houston State at home, but getting Holm and Jer Dominique back healthy for that game will be key. SHSU will be slingin’ it around the Alerus. UND will need to get good pressure on their QB. SHSU running game won’t be near as good as NDSU’s.

 

Okay, next question.  Moving forward, is Bubba the guy?

[Dustin]

Not ready to write off the season yet, but no playoffs = new coach.

[SWSiouxMN]

1 minute ago, Dustin said:

Not ready to write off the season yet, but no playoffs = new coach.

I'm in the same boat.

Toughest FCS schedule yes, but no reason why they can't

A) go undefeated at home (so far so good)

B) beat the tomato cans (so far so good)

If one of those answers changes to didn't get the job done, change it up (in which I am sure Bubba will be asked to retire and move to a different position in the athletic department)

[zonadub]

20 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

Okay, next question.  Moving forward, is Bubba the guy?

Can’t help wondering where UND football would be if Faison had hired DeBoer. I think he is a better head coach than OC, and he has had some real success at Fresno.

i understand that NDSU has won 7 of the last 8 FCS championships, but it feels like UND will be relegated to the bottom half of the MVFC with the current staff. The Hawks have made no progress against NDSU under Schweigert. And, as mentioned earlier, when the only MVFC teams UND has beat in the last 6 games are South Dakota and Western Illinois, the results are ominous.

its more than just facilities...

[Stand4Anthem]

1 hour ago, Ozzie82 said:

IMO they absolutely are an FBS level program. Obviously they aren’t nowhere near the Alabama, Ohio State, Clemson level, but they  are a better program than a significant number of FBS schools. Their last 2 QBs are in the NFL, they’ve won however many FBS games in a row, however many FCS championships... I think the data is pretty clear. 

agreed, I follow both UND and NDSU closely, just listen to opposing FBS coaches who have played NDSU, they have nothing but good things to say and pretty much sum it up by stating there 1's & 2's are as good as anybody at the FBS level. NDSU has put at least 15 players on NFL rosters over the past 10 years probably more and current player Jabril Cox is arguably the best defensive player in this run and new QB Trey Lance is the highest rated recruit they have gotten at QB (higher than Wentz or Stick---doesn't mean he will be better).

[iramurphy]

2 hours ago, Irish said:

We have already fallen into that trap and seem comfortable there.  I wish the good old boys and former players and alumni that lobbied so hard for Bubba even though he was a .500 coach because he was "one of us" would put a little pressure on him and the administration.  

You are mistaken if you feel the majority of former players “lobbied” for anyone. Some did. Some opposed the choice. Once the choice was made, most of us got behind the choice. To his credit, he has worked his butt off to move the program in the right direction.  The “good old boys” have neither the financial clout nor the numbers to force decisions. Having said that, some end up on the committee to choose a coach and have influence. In the meantime your voice is just as important as anyone else’s.  Let our Alumni office, Wynne, and Chaves hear your opinion.  Venting here may be therapeutic at times but won’t change anything.  

[dmksioux]

1 hour ago, Bison06 said:

“Nearly every FBS school” you realize doesn’t mean ALL.

The same Easton Stick that just beat out Cardale Jones in San Diego? Yeah, I’d take him over many P5 starters.

Name the schools who have had their last two QBs drafted when you get a chance. I’ll wait.

 

Without much researching, Oklahoma for one. Also looks like N.C.  State, Washington St, Penn St, Ohio St, and Western Kentucky have had at least two Qb’s drafted in the last 3-4 years.  Didn’t dig enough to see if they were consecutive though.

Those on here who think NDSU couldn’t play FBS have their head in the sand.  Would they compete with P5 schools, no. But could they be a top G5 school, absolutely.  They have a few big obstacles to overcome however and the two biggest are location and stadium.  The only way they go fbs is if they can get get some of the other regional fcs teams to move up. NDSU runs their program like an fbs program.  

[94]

Until UND administration steps up and gets resources for the football program, this football program will struggle, no matter who the coach is, and especially against the programs that have the resources such as NDSU.

Players win games and with the resources we currently have for the football program it will be difficult to attract those players.