Future of the UND Football Program

[Midwestern Hawk]

2 hours ago, Shawn-O said:

God forbid we get some bright, young, ambitious coach that becomes wildly successful here only to *gasp* leave Grand Forks after four or five seasons.   Hire someone along those lines, someone who leaves the program in a better state than which they found it.  Talk to some of the old timers here about their time with Gene Murphy, I bet they wouldn't trade those two years for the world.   Granted, Gene was a promotion from the inside.   

Screw this "we're in a position to win games".  You are what your record says you are.   

A great case can be made that coaching was the difference in 4 of the losses.

[The Sicatoka]

13 hours ago, Shawn-O said:

... "we're in a position to win games" ...

So was the other team, yet you didn't and they did. 

[Midwestern Hawk]

40 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

So was the other team, yet you didn't and they did. 

I was listening to this weeks podcast and Kelly brought up some of the OTHER 3rd and 4th down calls vs the Bison.  Going for it on 4th and 1 at your own 20 with the lead was so bad it had overshadowed the other 3rd and 4th down calls.   We use 2 QBs, a maize of sets and motions, many "trick" plays and have scored 

10 vs NDSU

13 vs USD

21 vs SIU

28 vs MSU

In the MVFC stats, we have the 3rd highest YPC at 5.25 and the 2nd LOWEST total rushes...only Western Illinois has less.  Football isn't rocket science.

http://www.mvc.org/football/stats/Valley Football Stats.pdf

[F'nHawks]

2 hours ago, Midwestern Hawk said:

I was listening to this weeks podcast and Kelly brought up some of the OTHER 3rd and 4th down calls vs the Bison.  Going for it on 4th and 1 at your own 20 with the lead was so bad it had overshadowed the other 3rd and 4th down calls.   We use 2 QBs, a maize of sets and motions, many "trick" plays and have scored 

10 vs NDSU

13 vs USD

21 vs SIU

28 vs MSU

In the MVFC stats, we have the 3rd highest YPC at 5.25 and the 2nd LOWEST total rushes...only Western Illinois has less.  Football isn't rocket science.

http://www.mvc.org/football/stats/Valley Football Stats.pdf

If the argument is that 5.25 yards per rush attempt is good, then wouldn't it need to be acknowledged that the "quirks" to our offense that you mentioned would be a contributing factor to that average?  I don't disagree that there may have been times when a more straightforward playcall might have produced a better result.  But, I don't know that we can completely oversimplify and expect to average 5.25 yards per attempt if we made dramatic changes to the offensive scheme (i.e. completely eliminate the "quirks" and "trick" plays).

I think the plays within Danny's offense are good.  But, probably room for improvement on the timing of certain playcalls and making sure the personnel involved are the right guys to execute the play being called.

Of course, we're all frustrated with the record right now.  But, I don't think things are as bad as it may seem at the moment...

[GoHawks]

19 minutes ago, F'nHawks said:

If the argument is that 5.25 yards per rush attempt is good, then wouldn't it need to be acknowledged that the "quirks" to our offense that you mentioned would be a contributing factor to that average?  I don't disagree that there may have been times when a more straightforward playcall might have produced a better result.  But, I don't know that we can completely oversimplify and expect to average 5.25 yards per attempt if we made dramatic changes to the offensive scheme (i.e. completely eliminate the "quirks" and "trick" plays).

I think the plays within Danny's offense are good.  But, probably room for improvement on the timing of certain playcalls and making sure the personnel involved are the right guys to execute the play being called.

Of course, we're all frustrated with the record right now.  But, I don't think things are as bad as it may seem at the moment...

The record speaks for itself (3-5) so things are as bad as it seems. No ifs, ands or buts! This team is not making the playoffs this year so it's considered a failed season! 

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

43 minutes ago, F'nHawks said:

If the argument is that 5.25 yards per rush attempt is good, then wouldn't it need to be acknowledged that the "quirks" to our offense that you mentioned would be a contributing factor to that average?  I don't disagree that there may have been times when a more straightforward playcall might have produced a better result.  But, I don't know that we can completely oversimplify and expect to average 5.25 yards per attempt if we made dramatic changes to the offensive scheme (i.e. completely eliminate the "quirks" and "trick" plays).

I think the plays within Danny's offense are good.  But, probably room for improvement on the timing of certain playcalls and making sure the personnel involved are the right guys to execute the play being called.

Of course, we're all frustrated with the record right now.  But, I don't think things are as bad as it may seem at the moment...

Would agree that the reasons mentioned in your first paragraph help the 5.25 yards, but would be respectable in any manner.

Keeping in mind that Bubba is the HC. I think these non straight forward plays of Danny's are more so for the smart, more talented, and experienced players, we are getting closer. Maybe Danny is smart enough to realize we will be bit a few times, but this is really our best chance for the W. The NDSU game was not as close as comments on here seem to make it. NDSU defense was the true winner in that game. Entz realized/knew their defense could control us even with the fake relax pause touchdown. Therefor he played an ultra conservative game on offense. He didn't want the crowd to take over the game, especially with turnovers.

Yes we're frustrated, tomorrow will show how bad we want a W.

[F'n Hawks]

23 minutes ago, BarnWinterSportsEngelstad said:

Would agree that the reasons mentioned in your first paragraph help the 5.25 yards, but would be respectable in any manner.

Keeping in mind that Bubba is the HC. I think these non straight forward plays of Danny's are more so for the smart, more talented, and experienced players, we are getting closer. Maybe Danny is smart enough to realize we will be bit a few times, but this is really our best chance for the W. The NDSU game was not as close as comments on here seem to make it. NDSU defense was the true winner in that game. Entz realized/knew their defense could control us even with the fake relax pause touchdown. Therefor he played an ultra conservative game on offense. He didn't want the crowd to take over the game, especially with turnovers.

Yes we're frustrated, tomorrow will show how bad we want a W.

The NDSU game was very close, if we convert that 4th and 2 we likely have a chance at a FG to take the lead.

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

6 minutes ago, F'n Hawks said:

The NDSU game was very close, if we convert that 4th and 2 we likely have a chance at a FG to take the lead.

How I truly wish that would of been the case.

[zonadub]

That 4th and 2 changed the momentum for the game…

 

and the rest of the season.

[Sioux>Bison]

1 hour ago, zonadub said:

That 4th and 2 changed the momentum for the game…

 

and the rest of the season.

No the 2nd down fumble did. Good teams run out the clock.

[UND-FB-FAN]

On 11/4/2021 at 12:34 PM, NDRA said:

So it looks like Bubba was 22-21, about like here, in his other HC job.  What was thinking behind him somehow making a great improvement on that previous record?

Bubba Schweigert interviewed “well” and sold Brian Faison. Also Bubba had support from backers who recognized his name and put up the $ to buy out Mussman. Ultimately, UND ignored a chance to go big time with the hire of a proven winner (Kalen DeBoer) in order to keep the inbred coaching tree intact with Schweigert’s return. 

[Midwestern Hawk]

18 hours ago, zonadub said:

That 4th and 2 changed the momentum for the game…

 

and the rest of the season.

I agree with this.  Season changing call.....

[CMSioux]

You really believe one play can change a season? 

[Bison06]

13 minutes ago, CMSioux said:

You really believe one play can change a season? 

I'm curious about that mentality as well. Even within that game with NDSU what are the other outcomes if that plays out differently?

 

Say UND converts that fourth down, you're still deep in your own territory with no guarantee or even likelihood, given how the game was going, that another first down would have been gained, so the drive ends in a possible punt.

Or, Bubba decides to not go for it and punts and NDSU has the ball down 2 I believe at the time with decent field position depending on how good of a punt UND gets off.

It was a hard fought game that could have gone either way in my mind. That play certainly changed momentum, I'm not denying that, but there's no guarantee the game plays out to a UND win if that play goes differently. So saying that one play would smooth over all the rough edges that have been UND's 2021 season seems to be going a bit far.

[Cratter]

Sometimes they do.

Sometimes they don't.

Words of wisdom by Cratter.

[Bison06]

22 hours ago, F'n Hawks said:

The NDSU game was very close, if we convert that 4th and 2 we likely have a chance at a FG to take the lead.

Am I remembering the details wrong here? Wasn't the 4th and 2 deep in UND territory? Why would a conversion there "likely" lead to a chance at a field goal?

[F'n Hawks]

2 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

Am I remembering the details wrong here? Wasn't the 4th and 2 deep in UND territory? Why would a conversion there "likely" lead to a chance at a field goal?

We are talking about a different play, UND tried a reverse on 4th and 2 a little past midfield halfway through the 4th

[Bison06]

4 minutes ago, F'n Hawks said:

We are talking about a different play, UND tried a reverse on 4th and 2 a little past midfield halfway through the 4th

Gotcha, my mistake.

[UNDBIZ]

On 11/2/2021 at 4:04 PM, The Sicatoka said:

Can we do a real search where "while at UND" is not a de facto requirement on the resume? 

Or if that requirement will always be ... an option. 

 

[Midwestern Hawk]

On 11/6/2021 at 11:18 AM, CMSioux said:

You really believe one play can change a season? 

Absolutely.  The 4th and 1 vs NDSU was a huge play in the fall 2021 season.  So was the 4th and 2 vs Missouri State.

[nodak651]

On 11/2/2021 at 7:23 PM, Irish said:

Some on this board act like the entire hockey team went into the AD's office in 2008 and demanded like they hire Mussman - but only if they promised to keep him for 6 years.  Then, in 2014 they went again and insisted that in spite of other candidates they hire a coach with a 22-21 D II record - but only if he got Rudy for an offensive coordinator and kept him for 5 years.  Without the Bubba factor we would have at least 5,000 more fans in seats this Saturday.  With what Bubba has given us this year no one gives a crap about the opening video.  The Athletic Department has let down the Football program, but mainly in their hiring and inability to hold coaches accountable.  

On 11/4/2021 at 11:41 AM, Irish said:

Good point - the problem is that Bubba is almost pathologically resistant to change - hell, it took him 5 years to get rid of Rudy.  And our AD (who I once thought would do a great job) seems to be content to let program after program implode.  Not sure where any change is coming from.  

On 11/4/2021 at 4:32 PM, Shawn-O said:

God forbid we get some bright, young, ambitious coach that becomes wildly successful here only to *gasp* leave Grand Forks after four or five seasons.   Hire someone along those lines, someone who leaves the program in a better state than which they found it.  Talk to some of the old timers here about their time with Gene Murphy, I bet they wouldn't trade those two years for the world.   Granted, Gene was a promotion from the inside.   

Screw this "we're in a position to win games".  You are what your record says you are.   

Until UND actually improves support for the football program or Chaves leaves, which will hopefully be soon, I'm fine with Bubba staying.  Look at a promising coach like Paul Sather, who had many of the attributes that you guys are looking for in a new football coach... he isn't necessarily improving the program, and based on the results of the Mayville game, it looks like the team could be even worse than last year and he is in his third year already, so a new coach isn't really guaranteed to give us better results, especially if the program isn't getting the funding that it needs to attract a good one.  I also don't want UND to fire Bubbba, hire a new guy who may have some first year struggles, and then get a new AD who will be looking to fire the football coach again so that he can hire his own guy..   Under Bubba, the team seems to be slowly improving, and the good seasons seem to getting better, and the bad season seems to be getting less bad.  The trend however, is in the right direction.  Yes the offense has made some questionable calls, but Freund is in what, his 3rd year as OC?  He's still relatively young and will learn and improve.  I just don think I want the current AD hiring a new coach given the lack of support for our program.  Look how competetive bubba has this program and compare our football facilites to other top programs in the valley - given the recourses we have, I think he's over performing, to be honest.  Until we have legit facilities, I don't think a young PJ Fleck type guy will be able to make it work here.  The program needs better support more than anything.  For example, did a guy like SDSU's Stiegelmeier suddenly just become a good coach after being mediocre for 10+ years, or is SDSU now a top program because the University decided to fully support the football program?  I don't think the guy just randomly became a better coach...

[nodak651]

Here’s a look at the base salaries of the current MVFC head coaches:

"We mentioned in a tweet that Schweigert’s salary is starting to become more competitive with his peers in the MVFC.  For years he was underpaid by FCS standards and most knew that UND had to increase his salary over time, along with increasing the assistant salary pool, which has happened both due to Schweigert taking less money himself and the AD upping the pool amount."

• Matt Entz (NDSU) – $380,000
• Mark Farley (UNI) – $375,000
• Brock Spack (ISU) – $357,000
• Bob Nielson (USD) – $300,000
• John Stiegelmeier (SDSU) – $255,000
• Bobby Petrino (MSU) – $250,000
• Doug Phillips (YSU) – $250,000
• Bubba Schweigert (UND) – $215,000
• Curt Mallory (ISU) – $210,000
• Jared Elliot (WIU) – $175,000

[90siouxfan]

Promote bubba to AD?   or asst AD?   or is that straight up Dilbert principle at work...

[Oxbow6]

9 minutes ago, nodak651 said:

Here’s a look at the base salaries of the current MVFC head coaches:

"We mentioned in a tweet that Schweigert’s salary is starting to become more competitive with his peers in the MVFC.  For years he was underpaid by FCS standards and most knew that UND had to increase his salary over time, along with increasing the assistant salary pool, which has happened both due to Schweigert taking less money himself and the AD upping the pool amount."

• Matt Entz (NDSU) – $380,000
• Mark Farley (UNI) – $375,000
• Brock Spack (ISU) – $357,000
• Bob Nielson (USD) – $300,000
• John Stiegelmeier (SDSU) – $255,000
• Bobby Petrino (MSU) – $250,000
• Doug Phillips (YSU) – $250,000
• Bubba Schweigert (UND) – $215,000
• Curt Mallory (ISU) – $210,000
• Jared Elliot (WIU) – $175,000

Does Bobby's salary even cover his motorcycle insurance?

[geaux_sioux]

36 minutes ago, nodak651 said:

Here’s a look at the base salaries of the current MVFC head coaches:

"We mentioned in a tweet that Schweigert’s salary is starting to become more competitive with his peers in the MVFC.  For years he was underpaid by FCS standards and most knew that UND had to increase his salary over time, along with increasing the assistant salary pool, which has happened both due to Schweigert taking less money himself and the AD upping the pool amount."

• Matt Entz (NDSU) – $380,000
• Mark Farley (UNI) – $375,000
• Brock Spack (ISU) – $357,000
• Bob Nielson (USD) – $300,000
• John Stiegelmeier (SDSU) – $255,000
• Bobby Petrino (MSU) – $250,000
• Doug Phillips (YSU) – $250,000
• Bubba Schweigert (UND) – $215,000
• Curt Mallory (ISU) – $210,000
• Jared Elliot (WIU) – $175,000

Lotta bang for the buck at NDSU lol