UND VB players Dismissed

[nodak651]

I hope he tried to sit down and have a conversation with her about this, face to face, before going to social media.  Maybe the coaches could have facilitated something like that and everyone would have an opportunity to learn.  

[Northcountry]

1 hour ago, southpaw said:

Being a white male is so tough in American. Combine it with being a Christian, and it's practically the most dangerous minority to be a part of!

To quote Tim Hennessy, ARE YOU KIDDING ME? You feel threatened every day by .......... what?

 

[Undfan23]

2 hours ago, siouxhockeyaddict said:

The thing is... what if it’s actually true? It’s 2020 and could very easily happen. Now it’s a game of “he said, she said”. 
My thought is if they wrote/said those things then it was stupid of them to do so, but wasn’t malicious enough in nature to ruin a 19 or 20 year old’s life like some people want to do. Everybody in this thread is pretty level headed and not calling for their heads which I think is right. 
On the other hand, if they actually were hacked then this is a sad situation that they can never win without solid proof and their lives just got messed up because of it.
At the end of they day, these girls are going to have hate filled people tracking down everything they’ve ever done and may do in the future and threatening them for something stupid like this. 

I agree it would be sad if everything was a fake, however I have an EXTREMELY hard time believing this was made up, why would anyone do that? Especially risking scholarships and likely knowing that again, it wouldn’t be hard to discredit that video if it were not true....as you said it is 2020. There are people at UND with the knowledge to figure that out. Again, far fetched. I’ve seen the video, looked at it multiple times, there is absolutely nothing to indicate it is not real and more to indicate that it is.

IMO two girls made bad choices, then followed them up with additional bad choices. That speaks to character, and not in a good way.  

[siouxhockeyaddict]

4 minutes ago, Undfan23 said:

I agree it would be sad if everything was a fake, however I have an EXTREMELY hard time believing this was made up, why would anyone do that? Especially risking scholarships and likely knowing that again, it wouldn’t be hard to discredit that video if it were not true....as you said it is 2020. There are people at UND with the knowledge to figure that out. Again, far fetched. I’ve seen the video, looked at it multiple times, there is absolutely nothing to indicate it is not real and more to indicate that it is.

IMO two girls made bad choices, then followed them up with additional bad choices. That speaks to character, and not in a good way.  

Ya and that’s why I threw out both scenarios. Whether it’s believable or not or it happened or not, I think it’s still not something to brand somebody a racist over and ruin their lives forever.

[UND1983]

24 minutes ago, Northcountry said:

To quote Tim Hennessy, ARE YOU KIDDING ME? You feel threatened every day by .......... what?

 

It was sarcasm, ace. 

[Undfan23]

10 minutes ago, siouxhockeyaddict said:

Ya and that’s why I threw out both scenarios. Whether it’s believable or not or it happened or not, I think it’s still not something to brand somebody a racist over and ruin their lives forever.

I’m certainly not advocating for ruining someone’s life! But I do agree with removing them from the team, or an amiable breakup between undvb and the girls.

[siouxhockeyaddict]

5 minutes ago, Undfan23 said:

I’m certainly not advocating for ruining someone’s life! But I do agree with removing them from the team, or an amiable breakup between undvb and the girls.

Oh I know you weren’t. I also agree with them stepping down because I can’t imagine what would happen at volleyball games if they would have stayed on the team.

[NoiseInsideMyHead]

57 minutes ago, siouxhockeyaddict said:

Oh I know you weren’t. I also agree with them stepping down because I can’t imagine what would happen at volleyball games if they would have stayed on the team.

Maybe opposing teams would turn their backs in protest while these two were serving. Could be a huge tactical advantage.

[southpaw]

2 hours ago, Siouxphan27 said:

Yes, it’s true. Being a white criminal, you are more likely to be shot and killed by the police during an arrest than a black criminal during an arrest.   
(But don’t let that statistic rain on your violent riots)

Your interpretation of that statistic is wrong. Just because more white people than black are shot and killed by police, it does not mean it's more likely to happen. 

The percentage of white criminals killed by police vs total white people arrested is smaller than that for blacks. Thus, the likelihood (i.e. percentage compared to total population) is actually significantly higher for black people. 

[Undfan23]

28 minutes ago, NoiseInsideMyHead said:

Maybe opposing teams would turn their backs in protest while these two were serving. Could be a huge tactical advantage.

I think you would have seen more of a reaction from UND student athletes and student body. My opinion after looking thru some public social media accounts.  It’s a complex issue, and I think the girls would have had a very difficult time maneuvering it.

[SIOUXFAN97]

18 minutes ago, southpaw said:

Your interpretation of that statistic is wrong. Just because more white people than black are shot and killed by police, it does not mean it's more likely to happen. 

The percentage of white criminals killed by police vs total white people arrested is smaller than that for blacks. Thus, the likelihood (i.e. percentage compared to total population) is actually significantly higher for black people. 

thomas sowell might disagree with your take on that...maybe read his comparison to NBA refs to break it down for you with a sports analogy

[Siouxphan27]

24 minutes ago, southpaw said:

Your interpretation of that statistic is wrong. Just because more white people than black are shot and killed by police, it does not mean it's more likely to happen. 

The percentage of white criminals killed by police vs total white people arrested is smaller than that for blacks. Thus, the likelihood (i.e. percentage compared to total population) is actually significantly higher for black people. 

No, I’m not wrong. Compare the total number of arrests of white people to the total number of white people killed by police. Then compare the total number of arrests of black people, and compare it to the number of black people killed by police. That is my statistic. And it is correct.

[Siouxphan27]

https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/apr/21/police-kill-more-whites-than-blacks-but-minority-d/?utm_source=GOOGLE&utm_medium=cpc&utm_id=chacka&utm_campaign=TWT+-+DSA
 

should provide all the data needed to support my statement. 

[Big Lubowski]

8 hours ago, southpaw said:

Your interpretation of that statistic is wrong. Just because more white people than black are shot and killed by police, it does not mean it's more likely to happen. 

The percentage of white criminals killed by police vs total white people arrested is smaller than that for blacks. Thus, the likelihood (i.e. percentage compared to total population) is actually significantly higher for black people. 

A Harvard economist, Roland Fryer, who happens to be black, and the youngest to ever achieve tenure at Harvard, set out to prove your premise, that blacks were shot more often than whites by white cops. However, Fryer found, as he put it: "The most  surprising result I have found in my entire career." The result? That blacks are actually 23.5% less likely to be shot by cops than whites. His paper is entitled: "An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force. It's on the internet."

Fryer concluded:  “It is plausible that racial differences in lower level uses of force are simply a distraction and movements such as Black Lives Matter should seek solutions within their own communities rather than changing the behaviors of police and other external forces.”

Fryer,  concluded that racial disparities in police shootings, i.e. wherein the percentage of blacks shot make up more than their percentage of the population in general, stems primarily from racial disparities in criminal behavior. In other words, police shootings are a function of how often police officers encounter violent and armed individuals. 

By the way, Fryer is not a conservative--he is a professor at the most liberal university in the country.

His study and conclusions were echoed in a subsequent paper by the University of Maryland and Michigan State University--"Officer characteristics and Racial Disparities in fatal officer-involved shootings."

So, no, the data does not indicate what you suggest--in fact, just the opposite. 

There are typically about 1000 people fatally shot nationwide per year by cops. That number has held pretty steady since 2015. Blacks consistently make up about 25% of that number. You would argue that shows racism, because blacks only make up about 12.5% of the population. But, in the latest nationwide crime data available, 2018, blacks committed 53% of the homicides and 60% of the robberies--see above about getting shot being a function of how often you encounter a police officer in a high intensity situation. 

In 2018, there were 7,407 black homicides. In 88% of the cases, the responsible person was black. From 1976 to 2005, 94% of the killers of blacks were other blacks. 

The data is out there if anyone really wants to find it.  The 4 cops in Minneapolis should be prosecuted, but cops in general are not the problem. 

 

 

[CMSioux]

1 hour ago, Big Lubowski said:

A Harvard economist, Roland Fryer, who happens to be black, and the youngest to ever achieve tenure at Harvard, set out to prove your premise, that blacks were shot more often than whites by white cops. However, Fryer found, as he put it: "The most  surprising result I have found in my entire career." The result? That blacks are actually 23.5% less likely to be shot by cops than whites. His paper is entitled: "An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force. It's on the internet."

Fryer concluded:  “It is plausible that racial differences in lower level uses of force are simply a distraction and movements such as Black Lives Matter should seek solutions within their own communities rather than changing the behaviors of police and other external forces.”

Fryer,  concluded that racial disparities in police shootings, i.e. wherein the percentage of blacks shot make up more than their percentage of the population in general, stems primarily from racial disparities in criminal behavior. In other words, police shootings are a function of how often police officers encounter violent and armed individuals. 

By the way, Fryer is not a conservative--he is a professor at the most liberal university in the country.

His study and conclusions were echoed in a subsequent paper by the University of Maryland and Michigan State University--"Officer characteristics and Racial Disparities in fatal officer-involved shootings."

So, no, the data does not indicate what you suggest--in fact, just the opposite. 

There are typically about 1000 people fatally shot nationwide per year. That number has held pretty steady since 2015. Blacks consistently make up about 25% of that number. You would argue that shows racism, because blacks only make up about 12.5% of the population. But, in the latest nationwide crime data available, 2018, blacks committed 53% of the homicides and 60% of the robberies--see above about getting shot being a function of how often you encounter a police officer in a high intensity situation. 

In 2018, there were 7,407 black homicides. In 88% of the cases, the responsible person was black. From 1976 to 2005, 94% of the killers of blacks were other blacks. 

The data is out there if anyone really wants to find it.  The 4 cops in Minneapolis should be prosecuted, but cops in general are not the problem. 

 

 

I'm thinking the response would be "This doesn't address that there is a systematic issue".  (Not my thoughts just based on listening to too much public radio during the pandemic). 

[SIOUXFAN97]

just like the corona crazies moved the goal posts from flatten the curve to "not one death"...shows stats disproving then move to ambiguous claims of "systematic ____________"

[Big Lubowski]

30 minutes ago, CMSioux said:

I'm thinking the response would be "This doesn't address that there is a systematic issue".  (Not my thoughts just based on listening to too much public radio during the pandemic). 

Yes, that is a convenient argument, but, if we can’t disprove systemic racism with data, then it can’t be done. We can’t climb inside peoples minds—yet. Until then, I guess we have to take their word for it—“inherent racism” I believe they call it. 

[Siouxphan27]

32 minutes ago, CMSioux said:

I'm thinking the response would be "This doesn't address that there is a systematic issue".  (Not my thoughts just based on listening to too much public radio during the pandemic). 

I hear the buzz words systemic and institutionalized racism thrown around constantly by the left. But ask one of them to explain what that means and give an example and you get no facts. Just emotions based on false narratives that they have all bought into..  

[Oxbow6]

I have an American flag waving outside the front door of my home.

[Hawkster]

Am I the only one who is more confused after reading this thread then I was before I started?

[Shawn-O]

On 6/5/2020 at 5:13 PM, The Sicatoka said:

I’m not telling anyone not to be offended by what they find offensive.

I’m saying be careful what you may have said that someone may find offensive. 

Al Davis had it right.  

https://standfor.containerstore.com/leaders-we-love-al-davis

“When leading, you don’t do unto others as they would do unto you; you do unto them as they would want to be done. You have to treat them the way they want to be treated.”

[SiouxForever]

12 minutes ago, Shawn-O said:

Al Davis had it right.  

https://standfor.containerstore.com/leaders-we-love-al-davis

“When leading, you don’t do unto others as they would do unto you; you do unto them as they would want to be done. You have to treat them the way they want to be treated.”

If anyone watched "The Last Dance" MJ didn't follow in quotes above. He did what he knew was better and he wouldn't push something on his teammates that he wouldn't do himself. He's is a true "leader" the king/verbatim/definition of the word.  He's not soft, he was tough as nails and sometimes came off as a prick. He won what 6 championships with that attitude? I'll let his actions do the talking. In MJ and Lil Wayne's views I trust. 

[SWSiouxMN]

https://www.grandforksherald.com/sports/6533386-UND-volleyball-player-explains-usage-of-racist-word-in-video-and-says-she-voluntarily-left-the-program

 

[90siouxfan]

perhaps cliff notes for the poor among us that don't subscribe

 

[SiouxHawkGuy]

She left the team and wasn't dismissed. Social media mob came after her for singing a song.