Stony Brook Seawolves

[SiouxFan100]

Numerous wide open receivers and numerous wild passes by UND. Big step backward with not having our QB make normal - easy looking passes - especially the first half. Heck, MSUM has QBs who can connect with open receivers. Terribly disappointed with that aspect of this game.

The only way we lose the game the game in the 4th quarter is by a turnover. The D was in complete control. We were outcoached by the blocked punt. We NEED to get the punt off and we probably win.

[UNDColorado]

1 hour ago, bkbroiler said:

Sorry. I wasn't sure how to reference UND-1 and Oxbow's conversation. Wasn't talking about you.

Also, thanks for embracing a newbie. Real class act.

My patience is thin this morning as I have heard enough from "experts" on this board both old and new. 

I was the one who tried to post a positive comment regarding Stony having a good year so whether you knew it or not you were referencing my post. Have a great weekend.

[UNDBIZ]

[siouxfan512]

33 minutes ago, SiouxFan100 said:

Numerous wide open receivers and numerous wild passes by UND. Big step backward with not having our QB make normal - easy looking passes - especially the first half. Heck, MSUM has QBs who can connect with open receivers. Terribly disappointed with that aspect of this game.

The only way we lose the game the game in the 4th quarter is by a turnover. The D was in complete control. We were outcoached by the blocked punt. We NEED to get the punt off and we probably win.

ok, lets see MSUM play the SB defense then. I get your point, but even when the ball did get to the receivers there were multiple drops. Can't place all the blame on 1 player. Everyone, including Studs, knows he played a bad game. 1 bad game, compared to like 7 good ones last year. He'll bounce back.

Yes, coaches could have done something different to protect the punter, but there are multiple areas we could have won that game. I've already stated I feel bad for Clive, but he put himself in a very vulnerable situation stretching out the way he did, when he was already being taken down. Instead of tucking and securing the ball, he tried to extend for a few extra inches. He already had the first down and should not have extended the ball like that. Do that and we likely, score, win, and keep our top WR.

[Big Green]

I don't get the idea that Clive should not have fought for the extra yardage idea.  Granted I did not see the play as I was listening on the radio at the time.  But you can't settle for going down at the 2 yard line.  You should fight for the extra yardage and try to score.  Can't assume you are getting a TD in the next couple of plays after. 

Question for people who saw the play.  Did he fumble because he was hurt?

[siouxfan512]

3 minutes ago, Big Green said:

I don't get the idea that Clive should not have fought for the extra yardage idea.  Granted I did not see the play as I was listening on the radio at the time.  But you can't settle for going down at the 2 yard line.  You should fight for the extra yardage and try to score.  Can't assume you are getting a TD in the next couple of plays after. 

Question for people who saw the play.  Did he fumble because he was hurt?

If you saw, he was already being brought down. He wasn't going to carry the defenders for another 4 or 5 yards to get into the endzone. Aside from putting himself into a vulnerable situation where he gets seriously injured, he fully extended the ball out in front of him. He basically handed the football to the defender. Gotta secure the ball.

I'm not opposed to fighting for extra yards, but you have to take care of the football.

 

[Cratter]

Fighting for extra yards over a historical amount of time ends up on the positive. 

It's just the "negatives" that are remembered.

Sorta like every year people with little football knowledge complain how far the defensive backs are playing off the line of scrimmage...then they get burnt on a long ball and its play back some!

[77iceman]

7 minutes ago, siouxfan512 said:

If you saw, he was already being brought down. He wasn't going to carry the defenders for another 4 or 5 yards to get into the endzone. Aside from putting himself into a vulnerable situation where he gets seriously injured, he fully extended the ball out in front of him. He basically handed the football to the defender. Gotta secure the ball.

I'm not opposed to fighting for extra yards, but you have to take care of the football.

 

You see a goal line . . . you make the effort.  Everyone will have different opinions, but I don't see that Clive did anything wrong.  Had he fought through the tackles and scored on that play, this thread would read waaaaaaaay different.  I'd rather see extra effort made, than not enough.

[Cratter]

Just now, 77iceman said:

You see a goal line . . . you make the effort.  Everyone will have different opinions, but I don't see that Clive did anything wrong.  Had he fought through the tackles and scored on that play, this thread would read waaaaaaaay different.  I'd rather see extra effort made, than not enough.

Players are taught to reach out as they are going down.

[SiouxFan100]

20 minutes ago, siouxfan512 said:

ok, lets see MSUM play the SB defense then. I get your point, but even when the ball did get to the receivers there were multiple drops. Can't place all the blame on 1 player. Everyone, including Studs, knows he played a bad game. 1 bad game, compared to like 7 good ones last year. He'll bounce back.

Yes, coaches could have done something different to protect the punter, but there are multiple areas we could have won that game. I've already stated I feel bad for Clive, but he put himself in a very vulnerable situation stretching out the way he did, when he was already being taken down. Instead of tucking and securing the ball, he tried to extend for a few extra inches. He already had the first down and should not have extended the ball like that. Do that and we likely, score, win, and keep our top WR.

You are absolutely correct. We could (have) listed multiple way we should have won. The deal with Studs is that he was playing so well at the end of last year. I guess I just expected that to continue. The bar has been raised for him because he set it higher last year. The open pass misses I am talking about are the ones that the QB is not being rushed and the receiver is wide open. Miss one or two a game, not the many we did. Yes, receivers need to catch but try not to put the receiver in a vulnerable position. We found about five ways to lose that game. This one hurt and will haunt us no matter how well we play going forward. We need to find ways to win.

[gundy1124]

2 hours ago, Big Green said:

I don't get the idea that Clive should not have fought for the extra yardage idea.  Granted I did not see the play as I was listening on the radio at the time.  But you can't settle for going down at the 2 yard line.  You should fight for the extra yardage and try to score.  Can't assume you are getting a TD in the next couple of plays after. 

Question for people who saw the play.  Did he fumble because he was hurt?

This is the concept, and you'll see guys in the NFL do this, protect the ball and yourself when you've made the necessary yardage.  You see guys in the NFL do this because they were savvy enough to know when the play is done.  Clive would be way more valuable to us securing the 1st down and not gaining an extra foot and getting crushed.  For every guy in the NFL their are 2-3 that were just as good, but didn't survive due to injury.  So call the real talented players that know when enough is enough 'pussies', Chis Carter for the Vikes is a good example, or call them whatever you want.  But CC is in the HOF I believe in part because he avoided taking big shots from defenders.

[gundy1124]

On the game in general, everyone has touched on the major points.  When I am at Heaven's gate I am going to punch the 1st Football God I see right in the face!!

[siouxfan512]

9 minutes ago, gundy1124 said:

On the game in general, everyone has touched on the major points.  When I am at Heaven's gate I am going to punch the 1st Football God I see right in the face!!

bahahahaha

[siouxfan512]

22 minutes ago, SiouxFan100 said:

You are absolutely correct. We could (have) listed multiple way we should have won. The deal with Studs is that he was playing so well at the end of last year. I guess I just expected that to continue. The bar has been raised for him because he set it higher last year. The open pass misses I am talking about are the ones that the QB is not being rushed and the receiver is wide open. Miss one or two a game, not the many we did. Yes, receivers need to catch but try not to put the receiver in a vulnerable position. We found about five ways to lose that game. This one hurt and will haunt us no matter how well we play going forward. We need to find ways to win.

agree wither everything you wrote. I would have like to have thought Studs would have moved seamlessy into this season too. I'm sure we will see improvement in the next two games.

[Oxbow6]

1 hour ago, UNDColorado said:

My patience is thin this morning as I have heard enough from "experts" on this board both old and new. 

I was the one who tried to post a positive comment regarding Stony having a good year so whether you knew it or not you were referencing my post. Have a great weekend.

So that we can all enjoy our weekend can we all agree that a loss or a win vs BG next weekend is a good thing?!?! 

........I feel better now. 

 

<group hug>

[UND-1]

3 minutes ago, Oxbow6 said:

So that we can all enjoy our weekend can we all agree that a loss or a win vs BG next weekend is a good thing?!?! 

........I feel better now. 

 

<group hug>

Loss.

[siouxfan512]

25 minutes ago, 77iceman said:

You see a goal line . . . you make the effort.  Everyone will have different opinions, but I don't see that Clive did anything wrong.  Had he fought through the tackles and scored on that play, this thread would read waaaaaaaay different.  I'd rather see extra effort made, than not enough.

I'm all for playing tough, but you have to be smart too. You want to make the extra effort fine, but you have to secure the ball. It was tough to see, since the quality wasn't great, but it really looked like he stretch the ball out and the defender just took it out of his hands.

Maybe it was just an unfortunate situation with Clive basically landing on top of someone (preventing him from being down by contact). Its certainly easy to critique the play when you are watching from the couch with a beer.

I guess in the end it doesn't matter, sucks for the team to have lose the ball and lost the game. Sucks for Clive. Sucks for the fans.

On to Bowling Green.

[nd1sufan]

6 hours ago, Oxbow6 said:

Bottom line this team lost a game they needed to win and should have won. I get all the hype coming in but that was an egg laid. I also get the SB D ranks 2nd all time only behind the '85 CHI Bears. I also understand it's only one game but that performance last night was not good.

Perhaps the most concerning for UND fans is a team that needs to rely on the running game having a suspect o- line. 

[homer]

10 minutes ago, nd1sufan said:

Perhaps the most concerning for UND fans is a team that needs to rely on the running game having a suspect o- line. 

Name me a team with 4 new o-linemen that hasn't struggled out of the gate.  That is a lot to replace.  

[bang]

3 hours ago, bkbroiler said:

I'm confused. A loss is never a good thing. Period.

I understand you are hoping that Stony Brook turns out to be good, so that loss doesn't look so bad. But a win over Stony Brook, regardless of whether they end up with a good record, is better than a loss to Stony Brook, regardless of their ending record. That is everyone else's argument.

As for last year. It wasn't the "good" loss that got the 6-5 team in, it was the "very bad" loss to a bad Idaho State that cost us way more. Not saying I agreed with that decision, just saying that loss was worth 2 losses in the committee's mind.

Let's put it this way. It's kind of like on the movie the "Hangover" when Phil finds the Hospital identification band on his wrist and Stu found the receipt for $900 at the ATM machine. Both bad things but as Phil said "no, no this is a good thing". Hopefully, the staff finds in film what bad things happened last night to correct and win ball games. Just like Stu, Phil and Allan were able to find their friend Doug. Get it?  

[tnt]

2 hours ago, homer said:

Name me a team with 4 new o-linemen that hasn't struggled out of the gate.  That is a lot to replace.  

That's very true, but perhaps we all were too optimistic that Santiago could run behind any offensive line.  Knowing that football is all about the struggle in the trenches, we all could be in for a rude awakening if they don't gel.  Having said that, even the O-line group from last year struggled a bit finding space for Santiago against tough defenses early last year, then started giving him the little creases he needed to explode.

 

 

 

[77iceman]

4 hours ago, gundy1124 said:

This is the concept, and you'll see guys in the NFL do this, protect the ball and yourself when you've made the necessary yardage.  You see guys in the NFL do this because they were savvy enough to know when the play is done.  Clive would be way more valuable to us securing the 1st down and not gaining an extra foot and getting crushed.  For every guy in the NFL their are 2-3 that were just as good, but didn't survive due to injury.  So call the real talented players that know when enough is enough 'pussies', Chis Carter for the Vikes is a good example, or call them whatever you want.  But CC is in the HOF I believe in part because he avoided taking big shots from defenders.

I totally agree...in Clive's case the "necessary yardage" was the goal line. 

It's easy to step out at the 40 knowing you have the first down, but that's not where Clive or that game was at.

[VMeister]

[gundy1124]

2 hours ago, 77iceman said:

I totally agree...in Clive's case the "necessary yardage" was the goal line. 

It's easy to step out at the 40 knowing you have the first down, but that's not where Clive or that game was at.

Perhaps, I only saw it once live but watching it and seeing it I could see he was about to get crushed by not going down and his momentum was stopped.  

What are defenses coached to do, gang tackle, punish, strip the ball.  When you see a guy, momentum stopped, their d-backs were licking their chops!!

Even if he didn't get hurt, but took a shot, I am just guessing Fruend would of told him, know when enough is enough, know the down and distance, don't expose yourself and get yourself killed.

Clive isn't exactly setting any weight lifting records, for his size, that was reckless.  'A' for effort.  Wish him the best, very unfortunate.

[77iceman]

by the way . . . log back into the stream site and there is a replay of the game posted (if you have the stomach for it)