Future of the MBB Program

[UND Alum]

They’ve got to move on from Sather ASAP. He’s had time to get his recruits in and they simply are not good enough. I’ve spoken with an assistant coach from another Summit league team who thinks UND has the weakest in-conference roster he’s seen during his tenure. 0-8 in the conference is embarrassing for our school. 

I’m really missing the days of Crandall, Hooker, Stewart, etc…. What a fall from grace since Brian Jones left.

[SiouxFan100]

I am not smart enough to know the answer but I know I don’t like these types of threads

[UND Alum]

2 minutes ago, SiouxFan100 said:

I am not smart enough to know the answer but I know I don’t like these types of threads

Sorry. I am new to this but needed to get it off my chest and see what others are thinking. Hate to talk about a man’s job like that but it’s evident the talent recruiting is not there. 

[sioux24/7]

I disagree. 

[gfhockey]

I disagree to

 

give him another year and see what attrition we have

 

everyine bails? Might be a sign of somethjng

[iramurphy]

It takes time and patience. Sather has a good resume. Those guys say you missed, were recruited by the last coach who people on this board wanted fired. Very few of the fans who call for the coach to be fired have an understanding about what it takes to build a successful program. Most of us aren’t going to give the kind of money it takes to turn things around quickly. We lost some nice players who transferred out. You dump Sather now, I would bet a lot of money we lose the best kid on this team and probably our best incoming recruit. I can see the lack of overall talent but I don’t believe the problem is the head coach. Even if we needed a change, ASAP would not be smart. Instead, we should be asking Chaves and Sather what else they need to turn this program around and what we can do to help. 

[Oxbow6]

Curious why he hasn't offered the Sem kid (So.) from North on a flier. Way better talent than Klabo (Fr.) from Davies who was offered by NDSU. Sem has some off the court issues but is better D1 prospect than 3/4 of the current roster.

[UND Alum]

17 minutes ago, iramurphy said:

It takes time and patience. Sather has a good resume. Those guys say you missed, were recruited by the last coach who people on this board wanted fired. Very few of the fans who call for the coach to be fired have an understanding about what it takes to build a successful program. Most of us aren’t going to give the kind of money it takes to turn things around quickly. We lost some nice players who transferred out. You dump Sather now, I would bet a lot of money we lose the best kid on this team and probably our best incoming recruit. I can see the lack of overall talent but I don’t believe the problem is the head coach. Even if we needed a change, ASAP would not be smart. Instead, we should be asking Chaves and Sather what else they need to turn this program around and what we can do to help. 

All fair points. But to play devil’s advocate, I’m not necessarily worried about potentially losing our best player or recruits, given what we’ve seen this year and the couple prior. They’re just not that good. I know people wanted Jones fired, but the recruits he brought in seemed to be on a much higher level. I wanted him to stick around. I’m not sure what more you can expect than playing #2 Arizona competitively in the NCAA tournament. Not to mention back to back mid-major POYs in Hooker and Crandall. Personally I think it’d be easier to find assistants that can improve the X’s and O’s than it is to get help recruiting. That seems to be the issue now. 

[ND1]

9 minutes ago, Oxbow6 said:

Curious why he hasn't offered the Sem kid (So.) from North on a flier. Way better talent than Klabo (Fr.) from Davies who was offered by NDSU. Sem has some off the court issues but is better D1 prospect than 3/4 of the current roster.

Off the court issues is an understatement…. He has been suspended the last few games 

[iramurphy]

10 minutes ago, UND Alum said:

All fair points. But to play devil’s advocate, I’m not necessarily worried about potentially losing our best player or recruits, given what we’ve seen this year and the couple prior. They’re just not that good. I know people wanted Jones fired, but the recruits he brought in seemed to be on a much higher level. I wanted him to stick around. I’m not sure what more you can expect than playing #2 Arizona competitively in the NCAA tournament. Not to mention back to back mid-major POYs in Hooker and Crandall. Personally I think it’d be easier to find assistants that can improve the X’s and O’s than it is to get help recruiting. That seems to be the issue now. 

I don’t believe we can fairly judge X’s and O’s until we have better talent. I don’t believe I have payed close enough attention to even be able to render an opinion on game management anymore other than by wins and losses.  I wouldn’t assume replacement coaching  options would be as good or better than what we have right now. 

[UND Alum]

2 minutes ago, iramurphy said:

I don’t believe we can fairly judge X’s and O’s until we have better talent. I don’t believe I have payed close enough attention to even be able to render an opinion on game management anymore other than by wins and losses.  I wouldn’t assume replacement coaching  options would be as good or better than what we have right now. 

I’m not judging X’s and O’s. I’m saying I’d rather have talent and bad X’s and O’s than what we have now. Impatient? Sure. But we’re getting to the point where he’s gotten a few recruiting classes in and I don’t see much promise. Just keep kicking that can down the road I guess…. 

[nodak651]

2 hours ago, UND Alum said:

I’m not judging X’s and O’s. I’m saying I’d rather have talent and bad X’s and O’s than what we have now. Impatient? Sure. But we’re getting to the point where he’s gotten a few recruiting classes in and I don’t see much promise. Just keep kicking that can down the road I guess…. 

Let's see whether or not he brings in a ball handling point guard who can dribble.  This eaglestaff kid sounds promising but I don't know what position he plays. 

There's a good chance Sather has 4 freshman of the year in a row though. The first two left.  Seems like the guy is a good coach but I want to see some legit D1 athleticism come in. Given how unathletic this team is, they do decently well as a team despite losing every game, considering how bad everyone is at shooting also.  I think overall you have a legit gripe about recruiting.

I'd say give him another year as he was kinda screwed with so many guys leaving as he came in and he had to find replacements during covid.  

Gotta be at least 500 in conf next year.

I'd still rather have Sather over Jones.

[ND-fan]

I watched some of tonights game and i was wondering what SDSU would look like if they would have lost type of talent we lost in the past year. We lost Rebraca one top players in the Summit, Inhenaco the top rookie for the Summit last year, Simms juco player that could play both guard and need be front line, Suecker one big outside wing players that could score from outside or could do so on inside, and we have had several other players hurt this year. That is four starters off this team and some of the depth to this team. Then i was looking were getting pretty good play out some new players one with one year of jucco experience, and two first year freshmen and we have been close to winning some of these games. I don't think any team in the Summit could loose four starters off a team and even think about being in consideration contending for the Summit. The only one that would have chance would be South Dakota State the deepest team in the conference. Then you add in we have had almost two years of covid and new coach moving up a division it has been almost recipe for total disaster. The big question going forth is can we rebuild a team by starting with new young players and building up a team that can win conference championship or is that not possible if players want to go to transfer portal and we become farm team for more successful college programs. I hope that is not the case or else we will be left with constant new team every year and hard pressed to find top talent that want to come here and play. I am worried about this, and we may be on the wrong side of this in the future. The two South Dakota schools have in place good programs, so they have winning tradition so it easier for them to keep players on long term. Also the way Summit conference tournament is always played close to them giving basically home court advantage and big crowds helps their programs in retaining players and recruiting players. NDSU also has established program and good tradition, so they have advantage in keeping their talent and finally last is ORU where basketball is there main sport and they come from area rich in talent. But getting back to Sather i believe he can coach the x and o's and i think he has shown he can recruit good young talent i look at last two years in Inhenaco and Bruns they have been some best new talent in the Summit.  The elephant in the room is can we keep this talent and add to it each year and if that is the case he will be successful coach in the Summit. Now we as fans have to have patience to let him build the program and winner and most people think it can be done over night and that is not the case. I look at Denver how many coaches have they gone through in past few years trying to get to a winner.

[bincitysioux]

It is really unfortunate that this is the position that the program finds itself in, here in Sather's third year.  This program has really fallen on hard times.  Aside from Hooker's senior season, UND basketball has basically been irrelevant for about 20 years.

I don't know if Sather is a good recruiter or not.  Bruns is fun, but the rest of the roster is DII talent in my opinion.  Ihenaco was very talented, but he left.  In this day and age part of recruiting has to be retention.  Nobody is going to have success if there is 50% roster turnover every season.

[SWSiouxMN]

40 minutes ago, bincitysioux said:

It is really unfortunate that this is the position that the program finds itself in, here in Sather's third year.  This program has really fallen on hard times.  Aside from Hooker's senior season, UND basketball has basically been irrelevant for about 20 years.

I don't know if Sather is a good recruiter or not.  Bruns is fun, but the rest of the roster is DII talent in my opinion.  Ihenaco was very talented, but he left.  In this day and age part of recruiting has to be retention.  Nobody is going to have success if there is 50% roster turnover every season.

Retention to me is the bigger issue than the talent.  He couldn't do anything with Rebraca, but why Ihenacho and Sims decided to bail will always be baffling.  They both made poor choices to leave. 

It is unforunate that Levias got hurt, because he would have brough something that UND needed right now. 

[Oxbow6]

If he can't recruit at least try to poach Moni from Saul.

[sioux24/7]

The problem with today’s day is not only do you have to recruit kids to come play for you but you also have to recruit your own players to stay. I think as @SWSiouxMN pointed out, Sather needs to retain any talent he has. Losing Tyree and Sims last year sucked let’s not do it again this offseason. He has recruited some talented kids but then some have left and he gets left having to fill a big roster in short order. I’m not saying this isn’t his fault but let’s give it another year or so and see where we are at. I can tell you this much, he is a far better Coach than Jones ever was. 

[Kab]

Last year you could see certain kids wouldn’t be back just by playing time, I was surprised by tyree and sims.  I think rebracca would have stayed if he could.

anyone see any surprises for next year leaving?  To me the portal hurts more kids than it helps, the same as hockey players signing early 

[RogerRoger12]

The team coached by Sather seems to be trending down:

19-20 15-18 7-9

20-21 9-17 8-8

21-22 4-17 0-8 

with that said I think a coach needs at least 4 years before a fire thread or firing consideration should start.. takes time!  IMO

[Sioux>Bison]

The new transfer rule has really screwed Sather. If his top talent wouldn’t have left this team would be very good. How does he replace that top talent . It’s not like Grand Forks is a top destination school.

[UNDFan2577]

I am not quite on the fire Sather immediately train but I don’t know if I want him getting another contract either. The team does play hard and he doesn’t seem to have lost the locker room.

The talent just hasn’t been brought in. Plain and simple. That’s not arguable.

 

The game last night was the first time I actually questioned coaching ability. Not doubling Wilson in the post with Brady and Ethan guarding him is flat out a terrible game plan. And re-watching the game today, it actually looked like that was the plan. It’s not like those guys got switched onto Wilson, they started the possessions guarding him. And got no help in the post. That’s poor coaching.

[GoodGood]

Not saying we need to fire sather today but at some point this has to fall on him. I don’t like the transfer excuse. Almost every other team in the country has dealt with it, we’ve just handled it poorly. St Thomas was playing D3 basketball last year and they’re better than us! First year was Sathers best year. Those were all Jones guys. Year 2, lots of roster turnover and not as good of year. Year 3, lots of roster turnover and now we have the worst D1 team at UND? Worst team in terms of talent in the summit in the last 5 years? Bottom 10 team overall in D1 basketball. If we even want to be competitive next year the roster is going to have to turn over again. Just not enough talent. Not many D1 guys. If we run it back next year with basically the same roster plus Eaglestaff maybe we’re fighting for 7th or 8th place?

[The Sicatoka]

53 minutes ago, UNDFan2577 said:

The game last night was the first time I actually questioned coaching ability. Not doubling Wilson in the post with Brady and Ethan guarding him is flat out a terrible game plan. And re-watching the game today, it actually looked like that was the plan. It’s not like those guys got switched onto Wilson, they started the possessions guarding him. And got no help in the post. That’s poor coaching.

Or was it a choice?
Doubling Wilson means some other bunny is running loose to shoot from the perimeter. 

[bincitysioux]

1 hour ago, Sioux>Bison said:

The new transfer rule has really screwed Sather...................

The rule applies to all schools, not just North Dakota..........

[MoSiouxFan]

1 hour ago, UNDFan2577 said:

I am not quite on the fire Sather immediately train but I don’t know if I want him getting another contract either. The team does play hard and he doesn’t seem to have lost the locker room.

The talent just hasn’t been brought in. Plain and simple. That’s not arguable.

 

The game last night was the first time I actually questioned coaching ability. Not doubling Wilson in the post with Brady and Ethan guarding him is flat out a terrible game plan. And re-watching the game today, it actually looked like that was the plan. It’s not like those guys got switched onto Wilson, they started the possessions guarding him. And got no help in the post. That’s poor coaching.

The way that they shoot the 3, would you rather give up a 2 or a 3?  Pick your poison.  IMO, that's not poor coaching.