Crime and Punishment II - This topic is not yet closed to further replies.

[NoiseInsideMyHead]

https://www.grandforksherald.com/news/crime-and-courts/7171655-GFPD-uses-prostitution-sting-to-study-human-trafficking-in-the-city

Saw this story on WDAY Friday night and was puzzled.  The gist was that GFPD ran a typical John sting, with a non-existent prostitute.

Quote

The goal of authorities is to find the link between the commercial prostitution industry and human trafficking. 

"What we are specifically going after is to find those people, those individuals, to find those individuals who are doing this against their will and free them,"

Here's the problem:

Quote

Officers posed as adult women online offering sex for money.

No indication of trafficking here.  I've watched "COPS," and I can tell you that adult women can and often do voluntarily engage in sex-for-money.  What about this setup is even remotely related to "individuals who are doing this against their will"?  Could they not at least have posed as an adult offering the services of a minor, or the services of a "young woman new to town" or an "immigrant"?  You know, to draw in the real scuzzballs?

The CVIC person is quoted as saying that ordinary Johns "are doing harm and may not realize the person providing sex to them is going through, they may be being beaten, held against their will, starved."  But all you could possibly accomplish here is to soften the market for ALL prostitution.  You could bust 1000 Johns (ruining countless lives) and not put a single dent in 'human trafficking.'

Would this not have been infinitely more intelligent to set up as a reverse sting, drawing in the trafficked, or the traffickers, rather than three horny, lonely dudes who were just looking for love in the wrong place?

I really hope that the Herald and WDAY either got the story wrong or that certain details were left out.  Because otherwise this sounds like a Keystone Kops exercise, devoid of logic, and I want to believe that the GFPD is better than that.  If you want to bust regular Johns, fine, but please don't pretend it has anything to do with some greater evil.

(Discussion time) What say you...is it time to legalize and regulate the sex trade in ND?

 

[JohnboyND7]

6 hours ago, NoiseInsideMyHead said:

https://www.grandforksherald.com/news/crime-and-courts/7171655-GFPD-uses-prostitution-sting-to-study-human-trafficking-in-the-city

Saw this story on WDAY Friday night and was puzzled.  The gist was that GFPD ran a typical John sting, with a non-existent prostitute.

Here's the problem:

No indication of trafficking here.  I've watched "COPS," and I can tell you that adult women can and often do voluntarily engage in sex-for-money.  What about this setup is even remotely related to "individuals who are doing this against their will"?  Could they not at least have posed as an adult offering the services of a minor, or the services of a "young woman new to town" or an "immigrant"?  You know, to draw in the real scuzzballs?

The CVIC person is quoted as saying that ordinary Johns "are doing harm and may not realize the person providing sex to them is going through, they may be being beaten, held against their will, starved."  But all you could possibly accomplish here is to soften the market for ALL prostitution.  You could bust 1000 Johns (ruining countless lives) and not put a single dent in 'human trafficking.'

Would this not have been infinitely more intelligent to set up as a reverse sting, drawing in the trafficked, or the traffickers, rather than three horny, lonely dudes who were just looking for love in the wrong place?

I really hope that the Herald and WDAY either got the story wrong or that certain details were left out.  Because otherwise this sounds like a Keystone Kops exercise, devoid of logic, and I want to believe that the GFPD is better than that.  If you want to bust regular Johns, fine, but please don't pretend it has anything to do with some greater evil.

(Discussion time) What say you...is it time to legalize and regulate the sex trade in ND?

 

Prostitution is wrong and shouldn't be legal. But the police should not go hunting for Johns

[FSSD]

15 minutes ago, JohnboyND7 said:

Prostitution is wrong and shouldn't be legal. But the police should not go hunting for Johns

Is prostitution legal in ND?  And I agree - this sting seems a bit much.

[JohnboyND7]

6 hours ago, NoiseInsideMyHead said:

https://www.grandforksherald.com/news/crime-and-courts/7171655-GFPD-uses-prostitution-sting-to-study-human-trafficking-in-the-city

Saw this story on WDAY Friday night and was puzzled.  The gist was that GFPD ran a typical John sting, with a non-existent prostitute.

Here's the problem:

No indication of trafficking here.  I've watched "COPS," and I can tell you that adult women can and often do voluntarily engage in sex-for-money.  What about this setup is even remotely related to "individuals who are doing this against their will"?  Could they not at least have posed as an adult offering the services of a minor, or the services of a "young woman new to town" or an "immigrant"?  You know, to draw in the real scuzzballs?

The CVIC person is quoted as saying that ordinary Johns "are doing harm and may not realize the person providing sex to them is going through, they may be being beaten, held against their will, starved."  But all you could possibly accomplish here is to soften the market for ALL prostitution.  You could bust 1000 Johns (ruining countless lives) and not put a single dent in 'human trafficking.'

Would this not have been infinitely more intelligent to set up as a reverse sting, drawing in the trafficked, or the traffickers, rather than three horny, lonely dudes who were just looking for love in the wrong place?

I really hope that the Herald and WDAY either got the story wrong or that certain details were left out.  Because otherwise this sounds like a Keystone Kops exercise, devoid of logic, and I want to believe that the GFPD is better than that.  If you want to bust regular Johns, fine, but please don't pretend it has anything to do with some greater evil.

(Discussion time) What say you...is it time to legalize and regulate the sex trade in ND?

 

Prostitution is wrong and shouldn't be legal. But the police should not go hunting for Johns

[petey23]

Human Trafficking is the recruitment, transportation, transfer, harbouring or receipt of people through force, fraud or deception, with the aim of exploiting them for profit. Men, women and children of all ages and from all backgrounds can become victims of this crime, which occurs in every region of the world. The traffickers often use violence or fraudulent employment agencies and fake promises of education and job opportunities to trick and coerce their victims.

This article doesn't seem to have anything to do with this...but people do play attention when you use words like trafficking. 

[Hammersmith]

I heard of a sting in Fargo back in the Backpage days where police posed as johns and targeted providers. The police used the sting to get the sex workers alone to inquire about their safety and to give them contact information if they needed help. If the pimps showed up, they were arrested. The sex workers were not arrested and I believe some or all were given a gift card to a local grocery store or something like that along with the offers of help. If you're actually trying to stop human trafficking(a noble cause), that seems about 1000x more effective than what GFPD just did.

[CMSioux]

If you want to stop human trafficking then you need to punish those who are creating the market for it. Lots of assumptions that "it's the woman's choice", the reality is even those that claim they are in it by choice really aren't - they are in because of lack of choices, they stay in it our of fear. Abuse and physical violence in the industry is rampant.   

[NoiseInsideMyHead]

I've always found it interesting that a guy can buy a girl a $70 dinner and take her to a $30 movie, after which they have casual sex, and it's called a "date" and the morality police are mostly silent.

Same guy gives same girl a $100 bill, skips dinner and the movie, and it's called a "crime."

But wait, they say...there is at least some economic impact when you go out and spend money on a date.

Well, can't a legal, regulated sex industry be taxed, which would offset the sales tax losses entirely?

[fightingsioux4life]

I smell a thread closing in the near future.

[90siouxfan]

23 hours ago, NoiseInsideMyHead said:

I've always found it interesting that a guy can buy a girl a $70 dinner and take her to a $30 movie, after which they have casual sex, and it's called a "date" and the morality police are mostly silent.

Same guy gives same girl a $100 bill, skips dinner and the movie, and it's called a "crime."

But wait, they say...there is at least some economic impact when you go out and spend money on a date.

Well, can't a legal, regulated sex industry be taxed, which would offset the sales tax losses entirely?

Up the stakes and call it marriage....

[Gma loves hockey]

On 8/28/2021 at 6:50 PM, NoiseInsideMyHead said:

Well, can't a legal, regulated sex industry be taxed, which would offset the sales tax losses entirely?

Years ago, Nevada was the only state with legal prostitution.  I haven't heard of any since.        While I morally don't believe in it, the logical side of my brain says:  Legal prostitution is regulated both legally and medically.    It could be a lot safer than a one night stand.          If it was legal, would a man be more apt to stay toward the legal instead of looking elsewhere?       With all the free activity out there, would it be an economical profession?           As far as trafficking, do the politicians get a cut by voting against the southern wall?

 

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

Judge tosses death sentence in slaying of N. Dakota student
Judge tosses death sentence in slaying of N. Dakota student (msn.com)

[Hammersmith]

1 hour ago, BarnWinterSportsEngelstad said:

Judge tosses death sentence in slaying of N. Dakota student
Judge tosses death sentence in slaying of N. Dakota student (msn.com)

Interesting; it's been the same judge throughout. Judge Erickson is judge that sentenced Rodriguez to death, denied his first appeal, and ordered the new sentencing hearing after this appeal. I understand it's typical to do this(the same judge that ruled on the original NFL anti-trust case is the same one that's handled all subsequent NFL cases), but I sometimes forget.

If you don't want to read the article, it boils down to questionable testimony from the medical examiner about cause of death, plus a possible mistake by Rodriguez's attorney in limiting a mental health evaluation that could have helped an insanity plea.

[fightingsioux4life]

23 minutes ago, Hammersmith said:

Interesting; it's been the same judge throughout. Judge Erickson is judge that sentenced Rodriguez to death, denied his first appeal, and ordered the new sentencing hearing after this appeal. I understand it's typical to do this(the same judge that ruled on the original NFL anti-trust case is the same one that's handled all subsequent NFL cases), but I sometimes forget.

If you don't want to read the article, it boils down to questionable testimony from the medical examiner about cause of death, plus a possible mistake by Rodriguez's attorney in limiting a mental health evaluation that could have helped an insanity plea.

The sentence was overturned, but not the conviction. This guy will never see the light of day again, death sentence or not.

[Oxbow6]

Rodriguez should have been dead years ago. Feel awful for Dru's family. He's a worthless POS that has been on the tax payers dole too long already.

[SIOUXFAN97]

40 minutes ago, Oxbow6 said:

Rodriguez should have been dead years ago. Feel awful for Dru's family. He's a worthless POS that has been on the tax payers dole too long already.

that's racist

[Frozen4sioux]

18 hours ago, Oxbow6 said:

Rodriguez should have been dead years ago. Feel awful for Dru's family. He's a worthless POS that has been on the tax payers dole too long already.

This thing should be dragged by his feet spread and naked behind a four wheeler through a dry lumpy potato field, during a bad year for thistle.

Daily, or at least until whats left can be effectively shoveled into a septic tank and forgotten about.

I see this as grandstanding by the judge, I dont know why, but it does. it serves zero purpose, other than to torment the family and friends of young Dru

[JohnboyND7]

Anyone tracking the Rittenhouse trial? Closing arguments going on today.

[gfhockey]

The ada has been lying through his teeth 75% of his closing arufment

 

although I feel he did a good job on it after their star witness rebutted what they thought happend

[Siouxperfan7]

9 minutes ago, JohnboyND7 said:

Anyone tracking the Rittenhouse trial? Closing arguments going on today.

Prosecution finished their closing argument.  Defense beginning their closing argument now.

[SIOUXFAN97]

shouldn't have even been a trial ffs

[Oxbow6]

Can Kyle go back out on the streets of Kenosha with his AR15 to defend the city's businesses again when he's acquitted?

Asking for LeBron........

[The Sicatoka]

"Clown Binger, attorney not so good is he. But lapel pin, he, quality have." -- Yoda 

[FSSD]

2 hours ago, JohnboyND7 said:

Anyone tracking the Rittenhouse trial? Closing arguments going on today.

Are the DA and Ass. DA in trouble for witness tampering with the "did anyone ask you to change to statement?  Yes, you!!"  That does not sound good.

[SIOUXFAN97]

4 minutes ago, FSSD said:

Are the DA and Ass. DA in trouble for witness tampering with the "did anyone ask you to change to statement?  Yes, you!!"  That does not sound good.

hope rittenhouse sues both of  them and the autistic guy testifies again......