The Sicatoka Posted January 7, 2013 Posted January 7, 2013 I stand corrected, thank you for pointing that out to me as I honestly had no idea there was a DIII hockey.... why don't they just call it DII though? Scroll through and you'll see some familiar DIII names: http://masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=ch&yr=2013&sub=11620 Someone else already answered the DII question.
Bison06 Posted January 7, 2013 Posted January 7, 2013 To be honest, there were fewer and fewer teams in D-II hockey when it existed. Many moved up to D-I. (UND was always at D-I level..) They eliminated it and gave schools the option of D-I or D-III. Seems odd to have a D-III, but not a D-II. Anyway, you can disagree with the FCS designation and call for a change if you really don't like it, but I-AAA/I-AA/I-A caused much more confusion for the general public than FCS does.
dmksioux Posted January 7, 2013 Posted January 7, 2013 I stand corrected, thank you for pointing that out to me as I honestly had no idea there was a DIII hockey.... why don't they just call it DII though? Not sure, but probably has to do with Scholarships just as in football. Not sure that DIII offers hockey scholarships...I also believe Concordia (Moorhead) plays hockey at the DIII level in the MIAC.
Siouxperfan7 Posted January 7, 2013 Posted January 7, 2013 Not sure, but probably has to do with Scholarships just as in football. Not sure that DIII offers hockey scholarships...I also believe Concordia (Moorhead) plays hockey at the DIII level in the MIAC. In all sports, scholarships are only given to schools that are D1 and D2 only. So schools that play D3 hockey don't have to award any. Making it more affordable for schools to have hockey without committing a huge portion of their athletic budget to do so.
JohnboyND7 Posted January 7, 2013 Posted January 7, 2013 Outside of discrediting the name "D-I FCS football", saying that it is D-I In name only, point out where I have ever put specifically down UND football? I hope they win a D-IAA championship very soon. I just don't like it called something it is not. Call it something it is not? I am 100% ok with you saying it is not the big dog D-I. If you want to watch the best teams in the country, the elite FBS teams are the ones to watch. Football Bowl Subdivision. These teams play a regular season with the hope of going to a bowl game. Football Championship Subdivision. These teams play a regular season with the hope of going to a playoff championship tournament. Would you be less upset if they called it the FPS? Football Playoff Subdivision.
jdub27 Posted January 7, 2013 Posted January 7, 2013 Call it something it is not? I am 100% ok with you saying it is not the big dog D-I. If you want to watch the best teams in the country, the elite FBS teams are the ones to watch. Football Bowl Subdivision. These teams play a regular season with the hope of going to a bowl game. Football Championship Subdivision. These teams play a regular season with the hope of going to a playoff championship tournament. Would you be less upset if they called it the FPS? Football Playoff Subdivision. Wonder what will happen in 2014 when the FBS has both bowls and a "playoff" that determines a champion.
JohnboyND7 Posted January 7, 2013 Posted January 7, 2013 Wonder what will happen in 2014 when the FBS has both bowls and a "playoff" that determines a champion. I won't call it playoffs til it is a legit playoff system. Get 8-12 teams in there! If in 2014 they want to change things again to keep confusion down, I don't see a problem with that.
WeAreNorthDakota Posted January 7, 2013 Posted January 7, 2013 I agree with this. UND should be in the division now known as FCS. I though they should have moved to D-IAA years ago. I would have liked to see the now defunct NCC move up. I just don't like the D-I designation without it's proper identification as a sub-division of college football. Nothing wrong with being in a sub-division, but to call it other than what it is is deceptive and wrong. Many schools at the FBS level have no prayer of playing for a true Division I championship. I would venture to say that schools outside of about five or six conferences and Notre Dame may never see a true D-1 championship. Schools like weith programs like 'Bama, Nebraska, Florida, Michigan, Notre Dame, etc., are out of reach of most athletic department's budgets. it is mind blowing the money involved at that level. But, to discount the sub-bowl games as being below any school's dignity is wrong. Schools at the lower end of the FBS see playing in a sub-bowl game as a goal a the beginning of the year for them. The schools at the lower end of the FBS have absolutely no desire to play in the FCS. If you don't believe me, watch how Idaho is desperately trying to avoid doing so. They prefer the sub-bowl to an FCS playoffs. The brass ring achieved by some, like Boise State, Northern Illinois, is to jump up and play in a major bowl. For Boise State, it is put them on the edge of gaining a national championship. If there were an 8 team playoff, they would have a chance to prove if they belong with the big boys. But, the big boys are the big boys. Tonight, the big boys play for the real D-I championship. 'Bama and the Irish. I'm pulling for the Irish, but I think 'Bama will win. FCS. Football Championship SUBDIVISION. It's right there in the name. We are a D1 school who plays football in the Football Championship Subdivision of D1. Seems to me like you're the only one who is confused.
WeAreNorthDakota Posted January 7, 2013 Posted January 7, 2013 Seems odd to have a D-III, but not a D-II. Anyway, you can disagree with the FCS designation and call for a change if you really don't like it, but I-AAA/I-AA/I-A caused much more confusion for the general public than FCS does. Not sure, but probably has to do with Scholarships just as in football. Not sure that DIII offers hockey scholarships...I also believe Concordia (Moorhead) plays hockey at the DIII level in the MIAC. There is a D-II. The division just does not sponsor a hockey championship. The schools who play D-III hockey are D-III in all of their sports. Schools like UMD, St Cloud, and formerly UND and UNO are allowed to "play up" a division in one sport while remaining D-II in all other sports. I believe this is also allowed for lacrosse but I could be mistaken. This exemption is not allowed for basketball so the subdivisions were created to allow schools to compete in D-I in basketball, compete in D-I in the olympic sports, and continue to play football without the financial burden of 85 football scholarships. Georgetown is a great example of this.
Hayduke Posted January 7, 2013 Posted January 7, 2013 I won't call it playoffs til it is a legit playoff system. Get 8-12 teams in there! If in 2014 they want to change things again to keep confusion down, I don't see a problem with that. I agree. It's not a legit playoff unless at least that many teams are involved. I think it will go there within a few years after the four team format.
petey23 Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 The Buffalo men's basketball team was and is a D-I varsity team, as defined by the NCAA. There is a clearly defined division for D-I in basketball. There are not two D-I divisions in basketball. It is clearly defined. There isn't any confusion. The fact is, FBS, FCS, BCS is all very confusing. It's time to go back to calling it D-I, D-IAA, D-II, D-III to have clearly defined divisions without confusion. Having two divisions of D-I in football is ridiculous. When what is known now at the FBS division has playoffs, stating with the four team playoff and I would imagine expanding from there, it will become more confusing. No real nice way to say this...You are a fu*kin* idiot. You have actually made some Bison posters here seem semi-intelligent by comparison.
Hayduke Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 No real nice way to say this...You are a fu*kin* idiot. You have actually made some Bison posters here seem semi-intelligent by comparison. How mature of you.
Hayduke Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Actually, it does matter and it's idiotic to not recognize NCAA 1 division hockey for what it is. The vast majority of the really good Canadian hockey recruits end up going the major junior route, even a few Americans go that way. The majority of NHL players come from that system. Occasionally a player like Toews will come along, but he's the exception to the norm. The point is MJ takes the cream of the crop for the same potential recruits as the NCAA. And at the World Junior tournament, the college players ate the major junior players alive. Check out Team USA and how they won. Check the goal count. I'm not saying that major junior hockey isn't a force. But, don't discount college hockey. They got game.
Bison06 Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 On the contrary, I do understand the reason for the change in terminology and that reason is exactly why I am an opponent of the change. It happened because of the basketball teams at I-AA schools suffering from a case of little man syndrome. I can't wait until both (sub)divisions of D1 football have a championship, making this ridiculous FBS/FCS terminology obsolete. Your lack of understanding of this subject continues to amaze me every time you post. Stick to the hockey threads. Gonzaga, Butler, Bradley, Creighton, Seton Hall, Xavier, Georgetown, Northern Iowa. All schools with basketball tradition that exceeds 90% of FBS schools. I'm sure they have a major case of little man's syndrome. Get a new line Dave.
Hammersmith Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 There is a D-II. The division just does not sponsor a hockey championship. The schools who play D-III hockey are D-III in all of their sports. Schools like UMD, St Cloud, and formerly UND and UNO are allowed to "play up" a division in one sport while remaining D-II in all other sports. I believe this is also allowed for lacrosse but I could be mistaken. This exemption is not allowed for basketball so the subdivisions were created to allow schools to compete in D-I in basketball, compete in D-I in the olympic sports, and continue to play football without the financial burden of 85 football scholarships. Georgetown is a great example of this. Close, but just a tiny bit off on a couple details. A school from a lower division can participate in a DI sport if there is no divisional championship at that level. If there is only a single championship, it's normally called a national collegiate championship. Think rifle, skiing, or fencing. Hockey may be the only sport where there are enough teams for two championships(DI & DIII) but not all three(lacrosse used to be the same, but they now have tournaments in all three divisions). In addition, a DII school may play up a level in one men's and one women's sport as long as it isn't football or basketball. For example, let's look at a hypothetical SCSU. The Huskies currently play DI hockey because there are no DII championships; that doesn't count against them. They could also add rifle or bowling and it wouldn't count because there's only a national collegiate championship in those sports. Even with all those sports playing at the highest NCAA level possible, they could still move volleyball and baseball(or any men's and women's sport) to DI. In NDSU's case, we took advantage of this "loophole" to make wrestling and volleyball move up early in our DI move. The single-sport transition is only two years, so those two sports were tournament eligible three years before the rest of the department. I believe SDSU chose their S&D teams, but it's been a long time and I could be wrong. Many of us were shocked when UND chose not to take advantage of this "loophole" in your DI move. I was convinced you were going to submit the paperwork to declare your S&D teams eligible after two years, but it never happened. Don't know why. edit: Some of the above info is outdated. The ability to move up a single men's and women's sport was removed in 2011, after all of our schools had started moving up. Schools that were already doing it are allowed to continue(there's a good number of DII and DIII schools that play DI baseball), and you can still move up a second sport as long as it's gender counterpart was DI in 2011(say a DII school played DI women's tennis in 2011; they would still be allowed to start DI men's tennis). The stuff about national collegiate championships and ice hockey is still true.
jimdahl Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 No real nice way to say this...You are a fu*kin* idiot. Let's keep our criticisms targeted at the things people have written and not personal, please. Thanks!
Ranger Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Actually, it does matter and it's idiotic to not recognize NCAA 1 division hockey for what it is. The vast majority of the really good Canadian hockey recruits end up going the major junior route, even a few Americans go that way. The majority of NHL players come from that system. Occasionally a player like Toews will come along, but he's the exception to the norm. The point is MJ takes the cream of the crop for the same potential recruits as the NCAA. I don't disagree most top players go the CHL route. If there were viable alternatives to make the pro ranks in football and basketball, as in hockey and baseball, I wonder how many of these kids would go to college. I dare to suggest not many on that Alabama team, or any other team, would be student athletes if there was a solid, respectable alternate avenue to achieve their dreams.
geaux_sioux Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Apparently notre dame isn't up to the varsity level....
jodcon Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 I can't wait until both (sub)divisions of D1 football have a championship, making this ridiculous FBS/FCS terminology obsolete. I think most people would agree with that, though I don't know if we'll live long enough to see it structured correctly...their new plan for 2014 is a joke, until they go to a legit minimum 8 team playoff for the true championship I will consider the FBS flawed.
Oxbow6 Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Apparently notre dame isn't up to the varsity level.... That's a SEC beatdown taking shape...ouch.
jodcon Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 That's a SEC beatdown taking shape...ouch. Speed kills. Put in Rudy.
Oxbow6 Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 After watching L'ville take it to the Gators, I gave ND a shot...oops!
geaux_sioux Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Speed kills. Put in Rudy. And beef. Nd can't bring Lacey down and the bama d is huge
petey23 Posted January 8, 2013 Posted January 8, 2013 Let's keep our criticisms targeted at the things people have written and not personal, please. Thanks! Not really a personal attack....just pointing out a fact.
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