New Nickname

[mksioux]

If the committee wants this to be successful they should narrow the list to Roughriders and No Name. I honestly believe Roughriders would win at this point. These two options are far and away the most popular and unifying.

 

I agree.  These are the two most popular options at this point and the public vote should decide it.  But....it is pretty apparent that the committee has no appetite for moving no-nickname on to the public vote.  

 

If I had to guess, the final 3 will be Roughriders, North Stars, and Sun Dogs.  I think Roughriders would win in that scenario if the vote is truly limited to UND constituents.  But I have concerns over this vote, particularly considering the poor nicknames still under consideration.

[jdub27]

They were two votes away from basically ending this circus but only 4 people on the committee had the guts to remove "no nickname", short of the 6 needed.  Not like they were going on a limb either since it ranked 7th out 9, coming in slightly behind the powerful Green Hawks and Fighting Hawks.

 

 

Despite that, there were a couple relevant quotes from last night that at least gives me hope that there are some on the committee who "get it":

-Carla Christofferson: "Majority of public wanted North Dakota as nickname but many are just mad about Sioux logo retirement".

-Chelsea Moser: "Saying we're going to be North Dakota to me means saying we're going to stay the Fighting Sioux"

-On keeping North Dakota, Lowell Schweigert says "What is popular is not always right.  Have courage."

[siouxfan512]

My take on the Silly Seven, and I see these seven in four categories: 

 

< adjective > Hawks: This is the standard consultant template. Look at Miami and a host of other schools that have dropped Native related names. It's so pattern and predictable that it's a running joke. And it needs to be dismissed out of hand. 

 

The Unimaginative: Yes, that's Nodaks and North Dakota. Nothing says unique and creative like using the state name, or better yet, shortening it to a postal code abbreviation. The unimaginative is not worthy of a center of creativity like a university. 

 

The State Nicknames: Well, that's what Roughriders and North Stars are, state nicknames; except, North Stars is not North Dakota's but is Minnesota's and must be dismissed as such summarily. 

 

Duckies, Bunnies, Rainbows, and Unicorns; aka The Kumbahyas: Sundogs are light and sunny and rainbows ... just sunshine on ice crystals, ... or are they. Sundogs mean it's cold and going to be colder. If you're from North Dakota sundogs are not something you want to see in January. Or it means something very different and that is a Class A misdemeanor (or is it a Class C felony). 

 

 

Run through that list of trite template solutions, the completely unimaginative, and sunshine on ice crystals which also means a crime (sex in public) and what are you left with? 

 

Minnesota - the Gopher State

Iowa - the Hawkeye State

Nebraska - the Cornhusker State

Kansas - the Jayhawk State

 

North Dakota - the Roughrider State

 

Agree with all of this. Still like the ideas of North Dakota or NoDaks, but this just does look like it is going to happen.

 

No Hawks for me.

No Kumbahyas for me

North Stars would be cool, if we were in East Grand Forks

Roughriders has a good sound, with some really cool logo potential.

 

Cavalary should have been in the mix. This committe just keeps showing how stupid they are and KG should be banned from any University committee moving forward.

[jdub27]

If the committee wants this to be successful they should narrow the list to Roughriders and No Name. I honestly believe Roughriders would win at this point. These two options are far and away the most popular and unifying.

 

Choosing "no nickname" will be the opposite of unifying.  There are groups already sharpening their claws if it happens because they, all along with anyone paying attention, realize "no nickname" is just a cover for Fighting Sioux.

[Cratter]

They should really only need one meeting to narrow it down to the final three.

Every member picks their 3 favorites. Add the scores. Public vote (three polling places on campus and mailed ballots to alumni.)

Hire Ben Brien to develop Roughriders logo.

[mksioux]

North Stars - The support on this committee for North Stars is baffling.  If it weren't for the fact that it's Minnesota's motto and on their flag, I could see it being an okay nickname.  I might even be able to get past the fact that the North Stars used to be an NHL team (the younger and next generations won't know or care about that). But it's Minnesota's nickname and there's no changing that.  As such, it should be disqualified.  Not only is it not unique to North Dakota, it doesn't even belong to North Dakota.  And it doesn't sound good when you say "North Dakota North Stars".  I'm not sure what the committee members are thinking by giving North Stars such high marks.

 

Sun Dogs - if the goal of this process it begin the healing from the nickname ordeal, they couldn't pick a worse replacement than Sun Dogs.  It's not even a good nickname even it hadn't be the choice of the anti-Sioux activists.  It's a stupid weather phenomenon that nobody has heard about.   People think a Sun Dog is some sort of prairie dog. 

 

_____________ Hawks - Unimaginative "safe" nicknames by stupid consultants that are playing way too active of a role in this process.  They are meaningless nicknames.  

 

NoDaks -  NoDaks is similar to no nickname, but is a little different because there is a branding opportunity to turn NoDaks into an actual nickname. But without knowing what the logo or mascot would be for NoDaks, there's no telling if this is a good or bad idea.  

 

North Dakota - The idea of having no nickname has been discussed to death on this board.  Everyone has an opinion.  Whatever your position, at this point, you need to compare it against the remaining alternatives.  To me, of the remaining options, only Roughriders is better than not having a nickname.  

 

In sum - Roughriders.

[Cratter]

Can we get a guy riding a horse on the football field like the Florida Seminoles?

Again, there's a roughrider statue outside the Ralph. Native Americans were the original roughriders.

Roughriders were Bison Slayers.

[nodakhoops]

Were these the numbers? Saw on bisonville.

Roughriders - 48

North stars - 46

Sundogs - 46

Nodak - 42

One of the hawks - 41

The other hawk - 35

No nickname - 21

Quick observations

It looks like no nickname barely made the cut. If it goes down like that fine but also eliminate one of the hawk names, we don't need 2 to choose from. Eliminating both Hawks and Sundogs would be the better. Hawk names and Sundogs seem very PC consultant driven in my mind.

Also, If this hired consultant hasn't heard of the USC Trojans, why did they hire him? Isn't that the exact same meaning he is talking about? Trojans is also a way bigger condom brand than Roughriders. If high schools are mature enough to have those names I think colleges can.

In the end...

Roughrider state > North Star state. Roughrider logo potential > North Star logo potential.

Hire Brien to make us some sweet logos and let's go.

Teddy R, American Soldiers/heroes, badass horses, - if you can't get behind that.....

[dagies]

The consultants need to get over themselves regarding Roughriders. They probably would tell the U of Southern California Trojans to change their name. 

 

In North Dakota, the TR Rough Rider Award is the highest honor given. 

http://governor.nd.gov/theodore-roosevelt-rough-rider-award

 

When in Rome, do as the Romans; when in North Dakota, its the Rough Rider Award. 

We need to not be afraid of how that nickname might be twisted by others.   The response by the organization and by the media MUST be, if said situations occur, to repeat the positive images and meanings associated with that name and express disappointment that fans of (insert team here) aren't able to conduct themselves in an adult fashion and debase themselves in such a way.

 

Take the high road that clearly points out the lower level behavior associated with fans of the "other" team.   Sooner or later that will quit being fun and it will eventually just go away.

[tnt]

North Stars - The support on this committee for North Stars is baffling.  If it weren't for the fact that it's Minnesota's motto and on their flag, I could see it being an okay nickname.  I might even be able to get past the fact that the North Stars used to be an NHL team (the younger and next generations won't know or care about that). But it's Minnesota's nickname and there's no changing that.  As such, it should be disqualified.  Not only is it not unique to North Dakota, it doesn't even belong to North Dakota.  And it doesn't sound good when you say "North Dakota North Stars".  I'm not sure what the committee members are thinking by giving North Stars such high marks.

 

Sun Dogs - if the goal of this process it begin the healing from the nickname ordeal, they couldn't pick a worse replacement than Sun Dogs.  It's not even a good nickname even it hadn't be the choice of the anti-Sioux activists.  It's a stupid weather phenomenon that nobody has heard about.   People think a Sun Dog is some sort of prairie dog. 

 

_____________ Hawks - Unimaginative "safe" nicknames by stupid consultants that are playing way too active of a role in this process.  They are meaningless nicknames.  

 

NoDaks -  NoDaks is similar to no nickname, but is a little different because there is a branding opportunity to turn NoDaks into an actual nickname. But without knowing what the logo or mascot would be for NoDaks, there's no telling if this is a good or bad idea.  

 

North Dakota - The idea of having no nickname has been discussed to death on this board.  Everyone has an opinion.  Whatever your position, at this point, you need to compare it against the remaining alternatives.  To me, of the remaining options, only Roughriders is better than not having a nickname.  

 

In sum - Roughriders.

The fact that many have accepted Roughriders as a viable choice even though they weren't enthralled with it in the first place, might indicate that it would be less divisive than choosing any of the other names on the list.  If they want to pick a name that would require less time to gain acceptance and prevent discord, then perhaps this could be that choice. 

[rochsioux]

From the start there has been zero chance that North Dakota would make the final three choices. The role of the committee has been to submit three choices that are acceptable to Kelley and the PC. It would not matter if a poll showed that 90 % wanted no nickname, in fact that would further guarantee it would not make the final three.

I believe the no nickname option is favored by enough people that it should be in the final three. It won't though because they could no longer control the outcome and they will not take that risk.

If you are really trying to come up with a nickname solution that UND alumni and fans can support then certainly the no nickname option has to be on the ballot. Otherwise Kelley should just tell us what he has decided and quit wasting everyone's time and money (here comes your University of North Dakota Sundogs...barf).

[SIOUXFAN97]

They should really only need one meeting to narrow it down to the final three.

Every member picks their 3 favorites. Add the scores. Public vote (three polling places on campus and mailed ballots to alumni.)

Hire Ben Brien to develop Roughriders logo.

for one i hope roughriders wins and two i hope its a no brainer that bb is chosen to do the new new logo...and not one that looks like a cartoon of teddy but something along the line of the old/new sioux logo he did a decade ago that is sharp, classy, fierce, and timeless

[nodakhoops]

I mostly liked Roughriders because I like the name and potential of it, but a whole new reason for me wanting it came after reading the article this morning. It seems to be the least favorite of the higher education marketing consultant police. For that reason it goes up even more in my eyes.

UND has been told by to many PC people for the last ten years what to do with their nickname. Roughriders was the committees top choice last night even after hearing the PC police talk it down, and it's a top two choice of the fans along with just ND.

Take a hike marketing consultants along with your urban dictionary, we don't need you telling us what we should like and what we shouldn't. Give us names we want to vote on not Sundogs or some type of hawk.

[petey23]

Choosing "no nickname" will be the opposite of unifying.  There are groups already sharpening their claws if it happens because they, all along with anyone paying attention, realize "no nickname" is just a cover for Fighting Sioux.

So which is worse?

Choosing to go by The University of North Dakota and having The Fighting Sioux as the de facto nickname in perpetuity?

or

Choosing a nickname that is looked upon with disdain and scorn and having the Fighting Sioux as the de facto nickname for the next 15-20 years anyway(See Marquette)?

I think, although by no means do I like the name for my School, that Roughriders is the only name that could possibly shorten the above time frame. If we end up something incredibly lame like Nodaks or Sundogs we will be going through the process of choosing a name again in less than 10 years.

Bring back Explorers, add either the Green or Fighting Hawks to Roughriders and North Dakota. Put it to a ranked vote 1 through 4 on the ballot for UND students, alumni, employees, and large donars only and be done with it.

The whole thing has been a clusterfuck and I just want it over at this point.

[tnt]

I mostly liked Roughriders because I like the name and potential of it, but a whole new reason for me wanting it came after reading the article this morning. It seems to be the least favorite of the higher education marketing consultant police. For that reason it goes up even more in my eyes.

UND has been told by to many PC people for the last ten years what to do with their nickname. Roughriders was the committees top choice last night even after hearing the PC police talk it down, and it's a top two choice of the fans along with just ND.

Take a hike marketing consultants along with your urban dictionary, we don't need you telling us what we should like and what we shouldn't. Give us names we want to vote on not Sundogs or some type of hawk.

Just curious, during this meeting, did the consultants bring up any concerns about the Urban Dictionary and Sundogs?   When the consultants are done here, are they going to talk to the State of North Dakota about changing the Roughrider Award and state motto?  Phil Jackson is pretty PC, and he was the one who originally suggested Roughriders when we still had the Sioux nickname.   Get the consultants out of the process -  NOW!

[Cratter]

Phil Jackson Roughrider Arena

[UNDBIZ]

If Sundogs was chosen and Phil Jackson donated a big chunk of change, resulting in Phil Jackson Sundogs Arena.... would Sundogs be a noun or a verb?

 

 

[The Sicatoka]

If Sundogs was chosen and Phil Jackson donated a big chunk of change, resulting in Phil Jackson Sundogs Arena.... would Sundogs be a noun or a verb?

 

 

 

Phil hasn't got the kind of money to make me like that abomination of a word. 

[SIOUXFAN97]

must be a great gig for these consultants....get hired by a school to replace a name...choose the primary color of the color add the word Hawk to it and charge about 100K...

[SWSiouxMN]

must be a great gig for these consultants....get hired by a school to replace a name...choose the primary color of the color add the word Hawk to it and charge about 100K...

 

I picked the wrong line of work. 

[Siouxperfan7]

for one i hope roughriders wins and two i hope its a no brainer that bb is chosen to do the new new logo...and not one that looks like a cartoon of teddy but something along the line of the old/new sioux logo he did a decade ago that is sharp, classy, fierce, and timeless

 

People loved the Fighting Sioux name, but people wnet gaga over the new Brien designed logo when it came out in 2001.  There are people that are still pissed the only nickname and logo are never going to used again.  OK, how bout you get Brien to design a "Roughrider " logo that looks similar to the Sioux logo, but still different enough so it is unique on its own.  This will maybe help the die hard "Sioux forever" crowd to adjust to a logo that is similar to the old one while embracing the new name.  Just my thought!!

[SIOUXFAN97]

People loved the Fighting Sioux name, but people wnet gaga over the new Brien designed logo when it came out in 2001.  There are people that are still pissed the only nickname and logo are never going to used again.  OK, how bout you get Brien to design a "Roughrider " logo that looks similar to the Sioux logo, but still different enough so it is unique on its own.  This will maybe help the die hard "Sioux forever" crowd to adjust to a logo that is similar to the old one while embracing the new name.  Just my thought!!

 

if you look at my avatar and thing below it i was all forthe "fighting norse" for one bc it would be a thumb in the nose of the pc crowd to name our new nickname after the nordic people aroudn here and that it would have a cool side profile of a norse warrior...if roughriders wins have bb do a side profile of teddy and put riders above it and you have the old/new hockey jersey that everyone loved....

[jdub27]

must be a great gig for these consultants....get hired by a school to replace a name...choose the primary color of the color add the word Hawk to it and charge about 100K...

 

Pretty original too.  There are 9 other colleges at various levels who had a Native American related nickname and now have some variation of "Hawks":

 

Chowam Hawks - formerly Braves (2006)

Dickinson State Blue Hawks - formerly Savages (1972)

IUP Crimson Hawks - formerly Indians (2006)

Louisiana-Monroe Warhawks - formerly Indians (2006)

Miami RedHawks - formerly Redskins (1997)

Ripon Red Hawks - formerly Redmen (1985)

Southeast Missouri State Redhawks - formerly Indians and Otahkians (2005)

Seattle Redhawks - formerly Chieftains (2000)

Stonehill Skyhawks - formerly Chieftains (2005)

[tnt]

Pretty original too.  There are 9 other colleges at various levels who had a Native American related nickname and now have some variation of "Hawks":

 

Chowam Hawks - formerly Braves (2006)

Dickinson State Blue Hawks - formerly Savages (1972)

IUP Crimson Hawks - formerly Indians (2006)

Louisiana-Monroe Warhawks - formerly Indians (2006)

Miami RedHawks - formerly Redskins (1997)

Ripon Red Hawks - formerly Redmen (1985)

Southeast Missouri State Redhawks - formerly Indians and Otahkians (2005)

Seattle Redhawks - formerly Chieftains (2000)

Stonehill Skyhawks - formerly Chieftains (2005)

Channel Susan Powter, and "Stop the Insanity"!

[RD17]

Pretty original too.  There are 9 other colleges at various levels who had a Native American related nickname and now have some variation of "Hawks":

 

Chowam Hawks - formerly Braves (2006)

Dickinson State Blue Hawks - formerly Savages (1972)

IUP Crimson Hawks - formerly Indians (2006)

Louisiana-Monroe Warhawks - formerly Indians (2006)

Miami RedHawks - formerly Redskins (1997)

Ripon Red Hawks - formerly Redmen (1985)

Southeast Missouri State Redhawks - formerly Indians and Otahkians (2005)

Seattle Redhawks - formerly Chieftains (2000)

Stonehill Skyhawks - formerly Chieftains (2005)

 

Great find. I knew of DSU, IUP, Miami and ULM but didn't realize there were so many others. What a complete waste these consultants are for even suggesting another Hawks related nickname for UND.