Future of the UND Football Program

[Midwestern Hawk]

6 minutes ago, F'n Hawks said:

Nope. This coaching staff can be fairly and rightly criticized for a lot of things but I feel like there are some on here that are trying to reach and criticize for things that simply aren’t accurate or we have no way in knowing whether it’s accurate.

Go back and look a the film.   Two handoffs and then a throw.  Q was going out for a pass.  

I admit, Friday and Saturday was tough for me.  We are not only the little weak brother to NDSU at this point, we are also the little weak brother to SDSU.  This staff has reached its Zenith, however long it is in place, we will be treated to frustrating 5-7 win seasons, with an occasional 3-4 wins and if everything falls into place 8-9 wins.  It could be worse, we could be Indiana State or Western Illinois, but that level of football would not be accepted in Grand Forks.  

[Midwestern Hawk]

On 12/17/2022 at 8:01 PM, shep said:

That contradicts another expert's view that UND only recruits D2 players. Coaching could get them there?

I disagree on the recruiting(it can always be better).  Look at this fall.  Look at last fall.  Which had better players.  It's easy to make the case that the coaching decisions were directly responsible for a minimum of 2 loses in 2021 fall season.  Who were all the great players playing for NDSU Friday night?  A LT who came to Fargo at 225 pounds?  Is the the great recruit or was he developed?  The QB who completed 1 pass?   I saw a team which used home field advantage and some great coaching adjustments to beat a superior team.  I hate the frickin' Bison with a passion, but that is what I saw.

[The Sicatoka]

UND is a top 15 FCS program. 

That ground can not be given back. 

But to move forward the remaining vestiges of the "Roger Thomas" mindset must go. SDSU made the playoffs one season before going FCS. One. Now they're on a 12-straight roll in FCS. They committed when they moved. And there is a difference. 

Armacost must set a mission and put the resources in place, commit, or walk away. It's a priority or a distraction. The middling ground serves no purpose but frustration and internal enmity. 

[The Sicatoka]

1 minute ago, Midwestern Hawk said:

A LT who came to Fargo at 225 pounds?  Is the the great recruit or was he developed? 

Mentioning that guy, he either has a 40 or a 140 IQ. He's a fool or a savant. Performance points to the latter. 

[Midwestern Hawk]

3 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

Mentioning that guy, he either has a 40 or a 140 IQ. He's a fool or a savant. Performance points to the latter. 

I watched him on a few plays, one being where he lined up on the right in unbalanced and he was 20 yards downfield blocking a DB.  Very impressive every play I watched him.  Was he a 5 star recruit?  Why don't we ever develop any lineman like that?  If we have lately, someone please remind me.

[F'n Hawks]

19 minutes ago, Midwestern Hawk said:

Go back and look a the film.   Two handoffs and then a throw.  Q was going out for a pass.  

I admit, Friday and Saturday was tough for me.  We are not only the little weak brother to NDSU at this point, we are also the little weak brother to SDSU.  This staff has reached its Zenith, however long it is in place, we will be treated to frustrating 5-7 win seasons, with an occasional 3-4 wins and if everything falls into place 8-9 wins.  It could be worse, we could be Indiana State or Western Illinois, but that level of football would not be accepted in Grand Forks.  

You asked me if I forgot if the first fumble was a trick play, and I said nope, wasn’t disagreeing with you lol. 
 

I agree, Friday and Saturday were tough for all of us fans on here.

[geaux_sioux]

2 hours ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

If UND plays better before the fumble, perhaps that situation never occurs.
 

Did the fumble hurt? Of course. That’s what that the “win probability graph” shows, but it goes beyond just one single play. It calculates the cumulative effect of all plays up to that point. Football is a 60 minute team game. Probably biggest team game of them all. 

Soooo you looked at the graph or nah?

[The Sicatoka]

9 minutes ago, Midwestern Hawk said:

Why don't we ever develop any lineman like that?  If we have lately, someone please remind me.

That is a legitimate question.
They put 100 pounds of mean on a redheaded kid from Hankinson. 

What's the NDSU/Kramer method that works like that so often. 
And why isn't UND doing it. 

[geaux_sioux]

Just now, The Sicatoka said:

That is a legitimate question.
They put 100 pounds of mean on a redheaded kid from Hankinson. 

What's the NDSU/Kramer method that works like that so often. 

He was out of the same mold as Heag. Tough athletic kid. Pack on some pounds. He came in as a TE fwiw. They didn’t make him grow taller though. That was pure luck.

[UNDBIZ]

Wasn't Ventrelli relatively slight when he came in?

[The Sicatoka]

There are times it feels like even UMary Strength is more engaged and active than UND Strength. 

[UND1983]

11 minutes ago, UNDBIZ said:

Wasn't Ventrelli relatively slight when he came in?

He played RB and safety at times iirc

[nodak651]

https://247sports.com/player/donnie-ventrelli-46049302/

6-4 235 TE

[gundy1124]

1 hour ago, Midwestern Hawk said:

I watched him on a few plays, one being where he lined up on the right in unbalanced and he was 20 yards downfield blocking a DB.  Very impressive every play I watched him.  Was he a 5 star recruit?  Why don't we ever develop any lineman like that?  If we have lately, someone please remind me.

He probably didn't have a high enough GPA.  We are MVFC GPA Champs in case no one got the memo.

[UND-FB-FAN]

3 hours ago, UND1983 said:

Umm, not really.  Just different.  Some good some bad, ya know, like every other game. 

so … average… like the current UND football program?

More good is better than more bad, ya know?

 

Need to do better. Need to change some things up. Let’s see what happens. 

[SIOUXFAN97]

On 12/17/2022 at 8:30 PM, F'n Hawks said:

Yea, I don’t think it was his fault Otis fumbled. 

which fumble?  the one where instead of playing "bubba ball" (which we are still waiting on ten years later) and smashing it up the middle we decide to do double triple reverse flip back to butter hands and turn the ball over?

[UND-FB-FAN]

2 hours ago, geaux_sioux said:

Soooo you looked at the graph or nah?

Not for that particular game, but I can imagine the probability dropped after the fumble. My point is just that if UND played a better game in the first 3 quarters, it would not have been so critical that UND play a perfect 4th quarter. We all know UND has struggled playing complete games on the road. 

[UND-FB-FAN]

4 hours ago, shep said:

But what about the narrative that the SU game LAST YEAR was lost when Bubba went for it on 4th down?

That play hurt a lot, but what if Schuster doesn’t throw that critical interception to NDSU’s Dawson Weber? What if UND converts the late 4th down instead of getting stopped? Million plays (figuratively) that they could have done better on and it could have led to a win.
 

The game is not won or lost on a single play. It’s what makes it a beautiful team game. 

[UND-FB-FAN]

2 hours ago, F'n Hawks said:

I feel like there are some on here that are trying to reach and criticize for things that simply aren’t accurate

That’s called the homer bias, I believe. 

[UND-FB-FAN]

2 hours ago, The Sicatoka said:

UND is a top 15 FCS program. 

That ground can not be given back. 

But to move forward the remaining vestiges of the "Roger Thomas" mindset must go. SDSU made the playoffs one season before going FCS. One. Now they're on a 12-straight roll in FCS. They committed when they moved. And there is a difference. 

Armacost must set a mission and put the resources in place, commit, or walk away. It's a priority or a distraction. The middling ground serves no purpose but frustration and internal enmity. 

Agreed, other than I think UND is stuck in more the top 16-25 range at this point. 

[UND-FB-FAN]

2 hours ago, geaux_sioux said:

He was out of the same mold as Heag. Tough athletic kid. Pack on some pounds. He came in as a TE fwiw. They didn’t make him grow taller though. That was pure luck.

Unfortunately, at this point, nothing about NDSU is luck. UND still relies on luck from time to time, though. 
 

DISCLAIMER: I UNDERSTAND THIS IS NOT THE POINT YOU ARE TRYING TO MAKE

[UND-FB-FAN]

53 minutes ago, gundy1124 said:

He probably didn't have a high enough GPA.  We are MVFC GPA Champs in case no one got the memo.

What do you think? To take the next step: Bubba for lyfe? Or well coordinated change? 
 

No slam dunk answer. Need to be nice so we don’t hurt any feelings. 

[Siouxperfan7]

UND clearl is making an investment in the football program.  They moved to the Alerus Center in 2001.  But, most recently they have built the Pollard Center and are working on phase 2 with ned locker rooms, weight rooms, offices, film rooms, etc.  Fotr thos that say UNd is not investing in the program, you are blind.  It aall comes down to recruiting the top guys in the FCS.  Upgraded facilities helps that.  Builsing a tradition of winning is huge in landing recruits.  And UND has done that recently with playoff appearances.  

[nodak651]

52 minutes ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

which fumble?  the one where instead of playing "bubba ball" (which we are still waiting on ten years later) and smashing it up the middle we decide to do double triple reverse flip back to butter hands and turn the ball over?

not at all what happened. https://missouristatebears.com/watch/?Archive=1772&type=Archive 56 seconds

Direct snap to Otis who fumbled the handoff/toss to Bo.  Not that complex.  Looks like its as much Bo's fault if anything.

Second fumble at 1:35

[Midwestern Hawk]

17 minutes ago, nodak651 said:

not at all what happened. https://missouristatebears.com/watch/?Archive=1772&type=Archive 56 seconds

Direct snap to Otis who fumbled the handoff/toss to Bo.  Not that complex.  Looks like its as much Bo's fault if anything.

In case anyone has forgotten UND was dominating the game at that point, up 28-17 with 6:32 left.  4th and 2 at Missouri State 29 yard line.  We direct snap to Otis, he hands it to Bo who is going to throw a pass to Q.  I would love to know how many times that play worked flawlessly in practice.  

 

As for fault, its Bubba's fault.  That is how football works.