2020 Dumpster Fire (Enter at your own risk)

[UNDlaw80]

1 hour ago, Bison06 said:

Not refuting your information, simply asking the question. How are they distinguishing these excess deaths, which in this article are attributed to Covid, with deaths that are occurring because people are avoiding necessary and in many cases life-saving medical treatments?(which I know from personal knowledge of medical facilities in my area is a very real reality, chemo, dialysis etc.

 

1 hour ago, UNDBIZ said:

We can't attribute all excess deaths to covid, as many of them are attributable to society's reaction to covid.

 

Well that's the million dollar question.....  To what extent are these numbers a reaction to covid and not covid?.    Perhaps if someone has the time to do some research we could obtain a clearer picture; at least in a general sense.    

Some thoughts: 
1. For a variety of reasons death rates almost always drop during economic downturns.
2. To what extent is the lockdown saving lives via traffic accidents?
3. What are the raw numbers (estimated) of people dying due to avoiding necessary treatments?

I just looked up homicides.  The rate is exponentially high this year, but in terms of raw numbers the increase is rather negligible.   <1,000  

[mikejm]

 

1 hour ago, Nodak78 said:

You can have a 100% of citizens of NY, CA and other east and west coast.  means nothing.  You need a majority in 38 states. 

You really have no idea how the electoral college works, do you?

A candidate can be elected POTUS by winning in a certain 12 states. Study civics, at least to the level required for new citizens and then come back.

[NoiseInsideMyHead]

3 hours ago, Redneksioux said:

ND leads the country in Covid cases per 100,000 residents.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-us-cases.html

Can't talk about "cases" without talking about total tests administered.  Test more, find more.

[jdub27]

2 hours ago, Bison06 said:

I haven't followed the "excess deaths", how many MORE people have died this year than have died in previous years. That is your answer for how many died right? Or is that simplifying it too much?

Here are the CDC numbers, which gives a buffer before saying a weekly total is at "excess".
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/excess_deaths.htm

 

[Redneksioux]

1 hour ago, NoiseInsideMyHead said:

Can't talk about "cases" without talking about total tests administered.  Test more, find more.

Not true.
 

ND is the only state of your top 18 testing and also in the top cases/100,000

 

 

[TheFlop]

4 hours ago, Redneksioux said:

ND leads the country in Covid cases per 100,000 residents.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-us-cases.html

Let's keep up with the carelessness and maybe we can stay atop. Don't be a close contact though Floppy or you may end up with a class b misdemeanor on your hands for staying wide open and not quarantining. Can we get another tantrum on how this is infringing on your precious civil liberties?

https://www.kfyrtv.com/2020/09/23/close-contacts-ordered-to-quarantine-too/

 

 

 

Come again?

https://www.grandforksherald.com/opinion/6677597-Port-After-urging-from-lawmakers-Burgum-expected-to-rescind-order-making-failure-to-quarantine-a-crime

[MrEdway]

2 hours ago, 1972 said:

out of the 200k excess deaths, how many of those folks were not going to see 2021 no matter if they got covid or not?   that is the number i would like to see

190,000

[Frozen4sioux]

4 minutes ago, MrEdway said:

190,000

Winner Winner.

[Walsh Hall]

46 minutes ago, Redneksioux said:

Not true.
 

ND is the only state of your top 18 testing and also in the top cases/100,000

 

 

You need both data points to draw any conclusion.  It’s like saying I scored 1,000,000 points in a pinball game.  With no reference it’s impossible to say it’s good or bad.

The data indicates that ND is high on the first list only due to the high number of tests.  The same can’t be said for SD.

[NoiseInsideMyHead]

36 minutes ago, Redneksioux said:

Not true.
 

ND is the only state of your top 18 testing and also in the top cases/100,000

The only truth is that in a limited statistical analysis, ND is hamstrung by small population and aggressive testing.  Blind reliance on "cases" reeks of ignorance, or worse, a desire to spin cherry-picked data to fit a narrative of fear.  Throw all the cards on the table, correct for all of the gross discrepancies, and let's see if there's a meaningful difference between states.

Why does it feel like so many people are promoting and/or posturing for worst-case scenarios?  Bottom line is, are you dead?  If not, are you sick?  If not, live your freaking life and stop worrying about that over which you have no control.  Tomorrow is promised to no one.

[TheFlop]

1 minute ago, NoiseInsideMyHead said:

The only truth is that in a limited statistical analysis, ND is hamstrung by small population and aggressive testing.  Blind reliance on "cases" reeks of ignorance, or worse, a desire to spin cherry-picked data to fit a narrative of fear.  Throw all the cards on the table, correct for all of the gross discrepancies, and let's see if there's a meaningful difference between states.

Why does it feel like so many people are promoting and/or posturing for worst-case scenarios?  Bottom line is, are you dead?  If not, are you sick?  If not, live your freaking life and stop worrying about that over which you have no control.  Tomorrow is promised to no one.

It's ok for the Rednecks of the world to choose that it's in their best interest to shelter in place.....no issue with that at all.  The problem comes in when they expect everyone to stop living too because they are scared of missing out.    

[TheFlop]

2 hours ago, UNDlaw80 said:

 

 

Well that's the million dollar question.....  To what extent are these numbers a reaction to covid and not covid?.    Perhaps if someone has the time to do some research we could obtain a clearer picture; at least in a general sense.    

Some thoughts: 
1. For a variety of reasons death rates almost always drop during economic downturns.
2. To what extent is the lockdown saving lives via traffic accidents?
3. What are the raw numbers (estimated) of people dying due to avoiding necessary treatments?

I just looked up homicides.  The rate is exponentially high this year, but in terms of raw numbers the increase is rather negligible.   <1,000  

I really think that is all most people are looking for.  It's the lack of a comprehensive look at the damage that Covid causes directly as a virus by itself, versus the damage of what some/a growing number IMO have perceived as an overreaction to Covid has caused.  Admittedly it's a tough talk to have when weighing whether an 85 year old person dying 6 months early is ok if it means a class of 20 kids can meet face to face for a school year.   

[Redneksioux]

48 minutes ago, Walsh Hall said:

You need both data points to draw any conclusion.  It’s like saying I scored 1,000,000 points in a pinball game.  With no reference it’s impossible to say it’s good or bad.

The data indicates that ND is high on the first list only due to the high number of tests.  The same can’t be said for SD.

If the argument is more testing brings more cases, why is that not the case for the other 17 high testing states?

[Redneksioux]

1 hour ago, TheFlop said:

Come again?

https://www.grandforksherald.com/opinion/6677597-Port-After-urging-from-lawmakers-Burgum-expected-to-rescind-order-making-failure-to-quarantine-a-crime

Interesting. I think we can agree on one thing, this is a $h1t show!

[zonadub]

2 hours ago, mikejm said:

 

You really have no idea how the electoral college works, do you?

A candidate can be elected POTUS by winning in a certain 12 states. Study civics, at least to the level required for new citizens and then come back.

I think what he is saying is that it will take a two-third majority of the states to repeal the electoral college

[Walsh Hall]

5 minutes ago, Redneksioux said:

If the argument is more testing brings more cases, why is that not the case for the other 17 high testing states?

It doesn’t result in more actual people having it, but it does result is a higher reported number. 

If we tested 100k North Dakotans tomorrow there would probably be 7000 positives.  That doesn’t change a thing from a perspective of the health of the State today.  There would be the same hospitalizations and the same deaths.

[Redneksioux]

14 minutes ago, Walsh Hall said:

It doesn’t result in more actual people having it, but it does result is a higher reported number. 

If we tested 100k North Dakotans tomorrow there would probably be 7000 positives.  That doesn’t change a thing from a perspective of the health of the State today.  There would be the same hospitalizations and the same deaths.

I understand that but why don’t the other states that are also testing more come in with higher numbers?

 

and you really think 7% of North Dakotans are currently infected?

[TheFlop]

26 minutes ago, Redneksioux said:

Interesting. I think we can agree on one thing, this is a $h1t show!

Like everything, consistently inconsistent.  

[Walsh Hall]

The 6-8% seems to be the results.  Not sure why that isn’t within a standard deviation of being representative of the general population.  Being that most are completely Asymptomatic makes it more likely to be true.

In a state by state comparison some are doing better than others as far as their percent of positive tests.  SD has an worse percentage, ND is about average.  Nebraska seems to be doing very well.  Statistically the higher testing states would have the most positives if the same % of the populations in all the states were positive.  ND is high in both, which makes sense.  

[homer]

37 minutes ago, Walsh Hall said:

It doesn’t result in more actual people having it, but it does result is a higher reported number. 

If we tested 100k North Dakotans tomorrow there would probably be 7000 positives.  That doesn’t change a thing from a perspective of the health of the State today.  There would be the same hospitalizations and the same deaths.

If you tested the same 100K two days in a row, would you bet your house the same 7000 would test positive? 

[Walsh Hall]

2 minutes ago, homer said:

If you tested the same 100K two days in a row, would you bet your house the same 7000 would test positive? 

Absolutely not, I’d prefer to not lose my house.  Personally I don’t see the point of most of the testing that is being done.  I just don’t like the overreaction to the reported positive numbers without any context.

[sioux rube]

[sioux rube]

[Redneksioux]

40 minutes ago, Walsh Hall said:

The 6-8% seems to be the results.  Not sure why that isn’t within a standard deviation of being representative of the general population.  Being that most are completely Asymptomatic makes it more likely to be true.

In a state by state comparison some are doing better than others as far as their percent of positive tests.  SD has an worse percentage, ND is about average.  Nebraska seems to be doing very well.  Statistically the higher testing states would have the most positives if the same % of the populations in all the states were positive.  ND is high in both, which makes sense.  

Did you see that 70% of college students in Nd have not been tested?

 

and do you realize that the largest group of people being tested is in long term care facilities? They are testing now where near 7% positivity rates.

 

the higher rates seem to be coming in from people being tested for the first time, meaning these are likely symptomatic or being tested due to contact.

[Sioux>Bison]

5 hours ago, Hayduke1 said:

They would have done it too if it wasn’t for the Republicans..... oh wait they did ban AR15’s and AK’s back in the 90’s so this statement is straight up propaganda! They democrats would take our guns away if they gained enough power!