Some Thoughts on UND's FB Program

[SIOUXFAN97]

14 minutes ago, UND08 said:

To be fair...has anyone from UND asked him??

exactly....fundraising at UND is goofy/weird/lazy

[Sioux>Bison]

Does UND even have enough football donors to fund a NIL collective? One that’s could actually raise enough funds to pay players? 

[SIOUXFAN97]

9 minutes ago, Sioux>Bison said:

Does UND even have enough football donors to fund a NIL collective? One that’s could actually raise enough funds to pay players? 

there are millions out there........

https://wallmine.com/tsx/txg/officer/1700987/david-fennell

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Chipman

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irv_Kupcinet

jimmy k

chris kuper

weston

 

[gundy1124]

39 minutes ago, Sioux>Bison said:

Does UND even have enough football donors to fund a NIL collective? One that’s could actually raise enough funds to pay players? 

I believe so.  It's a way different ask to say A.) we need funds to bring in Player X and this can help win games this fall and for the next 2 years compared to B.) we're going to make improvements to the film equipment so the GAs can work less hours. A = winning  B = Who gives a sh_t.

[Sioux>Bison]

1 hour ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

there are millions out there........

https://wallmine.com/tsx/txg/officer/1700987/david-fennell

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Chipman

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irv_Kupcinet

jimmy k

chris kuper

weston

 

Are those top guys even football fans? Those bottom 3 football legends I’m sure would donate but they are not bank rolling the entire thing. Honestly we need to sell out the alerus before thinking we will have a big collective 

[SWSiouxMN]

2 minutes ago, Sioux>Bison said:

Are those top guys even football fans? Those bottom 3 football legends I’m sure would donate but they are not bank rolling the entire thing. Honestly we need to sell out the alerus before thinking we will have a big collective 

They all played FB for North Dakota.

[SIOUXFAN97]

15 minutes ago, Sioux>Bison said:

Are those top guys even football fans? Those bottom 3 football legends I’m sure would donate but they are not bank rolling the entire thing. Honestly we need to sell out the alerus before thinking we will have a big collective 

bison>sioux guy.....no offense but you should know dr death if you know und football

[Sioux94]

15 minutes ago, Sioux>Bison said:

Are those top guys even football fans? Those bottom 3 football legends I’m sure would donate but they are not bank rolling the entire thing. Honestly we need to sell out the alerus before thinking we will have a big collective 

Chicken and egg scenario there. Won't consistently sell out the Alerus until we have better players. The NIL thing doesn't have to start with huge amounts initially, just get it started and try to evolve it over time. 

[CMSioux]

A successful business owner in the town near me gave six figures to Team Makers to finish their football practice facility. He did not play for them, just went there. The money flows to UND just not to football. 

[UND-FB-FAN]

23 hours ago, gundy1124 said:

Nicer locker room vrs top safety to start next season........I am writing a check for one and making excuses for the other.

Nice locker room could give you several good safeties, whereas paying a player might give you 1-2 seasons of good safety play (more likely only 1 season given transfer rules).

There’s no question that the infrastructure for UND football needs to improve, and thankfully phase 2 is underway. 
 

As for NIL collective, it’s also important, no question, and should be looked at closely since UND finally seems to have the locker room/meeting room issue under construction.

[iramurphy]

21 hours ago, CMSioux said:

A successful business owner in the town near me gave six figures to Team Makers to finish their football practice facility. He did not play for them, just went there. The money flows to UND just not to football. 

Former player gave 6 figures last summer for FB.  Hadn’t planned on it decided that am.  You might be surprised. 

[Sioux>Bison]

On 6/12/2023 at 5:03 PM, SIOUXFAN97 said:

bison>sioux guy.....no offense but you should know dr death if you know und football

I probably wasn’t born yet old balls…..

[Sioux>Bison]

On 6/12/2023 at 5:04 PM, Sioux94 said:

Chicken and egg scenario there. Won't consistently sell out the Alerus until we have better players. The NIL thing doesn't have to start with huge amounts initially, just get it started and try to evolve it over time. 

Is this how it worked down at the SU schools?

[Sioux>Bison]

On 6/12/2023 at 5:04 PM, Sioux94 said:

Chicken and egg scenario there. Won't consistently sell out the Alerus until we have better players. The NIL thing doesn't have to start with huge amounts initially, just get it started and try to evolve it over time. 

So these 6 guys are holding back the program because they haven’t fully funded it to its full potential? Why haven’t they donated the money we need?

[UND-FB-FAN]

On 6/12/2023 at 7:46 PM, CMSioux said:

The money flows to UND just not to football. 

Spot on, UND football is (unfortunately) not the priority and hasn’t been since the Engelstad foothold circa late 1990s / early 2000s. 
 

This ship needs to be righted. President Kennedy attempted to fix it, as he clearly identified it, but was booted. Chaves (and apparently Armacost) aren’t even attempting to bite the hand that feeds them. Cowards, and a poor prognosis for UND football, unless donors like those on this board rise up and state otherwise with our words and our wallets. 

[fightingsioux4life]

Just now, UND-FB-FAN said:

Spot on, UND football is (unfortunately) not the priority and hasn’t been since the Engelstad foothold in early 2000s. 

I would argue it never has been a priority. It has succeeded in spite of the higher ups at UND, not because of them.

However, Division I (FCS or FBS) is a different animal. We cannot win at this level with a shoestring, "more with less" budget.

[sioux24/7]

 

[UND-FB-FAN]

1 hour ago, sioux24/7 said:

 

UND with greater revenue than NDSU, yet the two football programs are on completely different levels. Again, my previous post holds true. UND and UND athletics are not allocating nearly enough to football.  Remember, hockey hockey hockey, !@#$ !@#$ !@#$! 

[jdub27]

2 hours ago, sioux24/7 said:

First off, almost positive these are 2021-2022 numbers. The fiscal year end for most schools isn't until 6/30 and the EADA reports this info comes from aren't complete until a few months after that.

I'd take some of it (good and bad) with a grain of salt as pandemic issues had not fully washed out yet.

I know UND's numbers pre-covid and during/post have shown slightly different stories. Guessing that is the case for a lot of institutions.

[siouxfan512]

32 minutes ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

UND with greater revenue than NDSU, yet the two football programs are on completely different levels. Again, my previous post holds true. UND and UND athletics are not allocating nearly enough to football.  Remember, hockey hockey hockey, !@#$ !@#$ !@#$! 

Right on cue with your same tired argument. You're correct, Football does need some additional funds, but comparing UND and NDSU purely based on funding isn't exactly accurate either. I'd be interested to know what NDSU's funding was prior to them going FCS and really taking off. Seemed like as they found success they continued pumping money in.

Worth remembering that while hockey gets a ton of funding, they also bring in the majority of the revenue. You don't fund it and your program takes a set back, your revenue source struggles. Football needs more funding, but also needs to find success on the field, put butts in seats, get people in apparel and generate additional revenue.

[Irish]

2 hours ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

Spot on, UND football is (unfortunately) not the priority and hasn’t been since the Engelstad foothold circa late 1990s / early 2000s. 
 

This ship needs to be righted. President Kennedy attempted to fix it, as he clearly identified it, but was booted. Chaves (and apparently Armacost) aren’t even attempting to bite the hand that feeds them. Cowards, and a poor prognosis for UND football, unless donors like those on this board rise up and state otherwise with our words and our wallets. 

I hear what you are saying but in my opinion the main problem is that there is not a demand for excellence in Football and now apparently in Hockey due to a succession of weak AD's and indifferent Presidents.  We hope for excellence and try to achieve but programs are allowed to be mediocre to good but not great forever without significant changes.  We have won a total of two playoff games collectively in Football and Hockey since 2016.  This is far from where we need to be yet here we are doing the same things again this year.

 

 

[UND-FB-FAN]

44 minutes ago, siouxfan512 said:

Right on cue with your same tired argument. You're correct, Football does need some additional funds, but comparing UND and NDSU purely based on funding isn't exactly accurate either. I'd be interested to know what NDSU's funding was prior to them going FCS and really taking off. Seemed like as they found success they continued pumping money in.

Worth remembering that while hockey gets a ton of funding, they also bring in the majority of the revenue. You don't fund it and your program takes a set back, your revenue source struggles. Football needs more funding, but also needs to find success on the field, put butts in seats, get people in apparel and generate additional revenue.

We can agree to disagree. You’re just repeating your same old argument, also, which I adamantly disagree with.
 

At the FCS level, you’re not going to have a lucrative funding model with a bunch of revenue. That’s reserved for FBS football with large stadiums. Bottom line, collegiate athletics requires major investment/funding to begin with, and is not typically a huge return on the investment, especially in ND. Large football and basketball programs certainly do produce a lot of revenue for the NCAA and their respective institutions, no question, but those programs aren’t in North Dakota. Hockey has a return because there was a huge investment in the form of a gift from the Engelstads. It would only be a surprise if an $100M gift *did not* produce some revenue. 

[UND-FB-FAN]

3 hours ago, Irish said:

there is not a demand for excellence in Football and now apparently in Hockey due to a succession of weak AD's and indifferent Presidents. 

True. Have to have donors demand excellence and funds matter. 
 

ultimately, I think we’re saying close to the same thing and we understand there needs to be more administrative leadership (vision) and also backing from the supporters (donors). This is perhaps obvious but it just isn’t at the level needed for UND football to take the next step 

[JohnboyND7]

On 6/12/2023 at 1:01 PM, nodak651 said:

One other thing to mention is that the NCAA changed a rule and schools are now allowed to provide about 6K in additional payments, above and beyond schollarship and cost of attendance costs..  https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/33684066/only-21-130-ncaa-fbs-level-schools-say-plans-provide-allowed-academic-bonus-payments-athletes-year

UND might be working on this with something called The 701 fund?  This would essentially allow the school to pay key players directly if they get good grades, but I'm not sure if they are allowed to pick and choose if certain players get the money (based on athletic contribution).  

https://undalumni.org/giving-impact/colleges-programs/athletics.html

That's new, right?

Very new. Had a chance to hear your AD and alumni association (I think?) president talk about it tonight at a place in Mandan. Couple of small sport coaches talked too. 

Sounded like the plan is to allocate X amount to each team on campus for good grades, retention, etc relating to PAST PERFORMANCE. So I think it was kinda like "you got a 3.1 last semester and you came back for this season, here is X amount." It sounded pretty modest. Nothing huge, but it is something worth trying. If it flames out then it flames out.

Nice thing for UND it sounds like there is a lot of investment going into modernizing indoor practice place and the athletic offices and all that. From reading the board in the past, you guys have complained about that for quite awhile? That'll be nice. 

He talked a bit about the new NCAA boss too. Sounded very optimistic that Charlie Baker can get things done to get NIL and such sorted out.

I could've asked some questions after but I figured these guys were there for the UND folks, not me. So I left them alone.

[nodak651]

27 minutes ago, JohnboyND7 said:

Very new. Had a chance to hear your AD and alumni association (I think?) president talk about it tonight at a place in Mandan. Couple of small sport coaches talked too. 

Sounded like the plan is to allocate X amount to each team on campus for good grades, retention, etc relating to PAST PERFORMANCE. So I think it was kinda like "you got a 3.1 last semester and you came back for this season, here is X amount." It sounded pretty modest. Nothing huge, but it is something worth trying. If it flames out then it flames out.

Nice thing for UND it sounds like there is a lot of investment going into modernizing indoor practice place and the athletic offices and all that. From reading the board in the past, you guys have complained about that for quite awhile? That'll be nice. 

He talked a bit about the new NCAA boss too. Sounded very optimistic that Charlie Baker can get things done to get NIL and such sorted out.

I could've asked some questions after but I figured these guys were there for the UND folks, not me. So I left them alone.

Appreciate the info!