Chewey Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Lately the Herald has been publishing too many letters to the editor from people who support sundogs. For example, one of the letter was from a u of Minnesota alum who lives in Grafton. So I got off my butt and submitted a letter last night so hopefully it gets published. If it doesn't, here is is for everyone of this forum: (special thanks to RD17 for doing the research on the institutions that usetheir state motto) What the heck is a sundog? I will begin this by conveying my dissatisfaction with how this entire nickname process has played out thus far. Do we really need pay consultants to help us pick a new nickname? The old saying about consultants goes something like this: “A consultant is someone who borrows your watch to tell you the time, and then keeps the watch.” Now to my main point: Sundogs. This is a weather phenomenon that does happen in North Dakota, among other cold weather states. Sure it is kind of cool to see, but is this a name that merits the nickname of the states flagship university UND? Some have said this represents Grand Forks. This is not the University of Grand Forks so let’s think bigger than that. To me the answer is a resounding no. I do not want my U’s nickname to be a weather phenomenon. I definitely do not want the logo to be some sort of rainbow. There are many state universities that use their states motto as a nickname. Of the seven names the committee and consultants deemed “popular”, there is one that does stick out. Roughriders. Which happens to be one of North Dakota’s state mottos. A common argument is that RRHS is the Roughriders. Hazen High School is the bison, the exact same name as another major university in the state. I can live with that. Here is a list of state universities that use their state motto as their mascot: Razorback State (Arkansas)The Bear State (California) Buffalo Plains State (Colorado) Blue Hen State (Delaware) Alligator State (Florida) Hoosier State (Indiana) Hawkeye State (Iowa) Jayhawk State (Kansas) Terrapin State (Maryland) Wolverine State (Michigan) Cornhusker State (Nebraska) Tar Heel State (North Carolina) Buckeye State (Ohio) Sooner State (Oklahoma) Coyote State (South Dakota) Volunteer State (Tennessee) Mountain State (West Virginia) Badger State (Wisconsin) Cowboy State (Wyoming) I love the Fighting Sioux nickname and will continue to identify as such for quite some time, and I am happy that in the past UND was respectful enough to only use a logo. However, we must move on for uncontrollable reasons and there are not enough pages in this fine publication to explain how we got here. If we have to pick a new nickname please pick something that I don’t have to explain every time someone asks: “What the heck is a sundog?” That's a very good letter. As this process goes forward, be prepared to see every sniveling, whining progressive write letters to the editor about how great "Sundogs" would be. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSSioux Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Why NoDak's would work. This is my second choice behind remaining North Dakota, because I cannot stomach the idea of condoms being thrown on the ice or courts of our hockey, basketball, volleyball etc. teams. I think the closest analogy to NoDak's is the Illinois Fighting Illini. The NCAA originally had them on the naughty list, but they said they could not get a tribal support because there was no such thing as the Illini tribe. Illini was a generic term for Illinois people, hence NoDak's would be for all North Dakota people. Granted Illinois did have Chief Iliniwek (spelling?), but the NCAA was OK with their reasoning as long as they did away with using him as well as any Native American imagery that they had used in the past. I think there are good marketing and copyright phrases that could be done by the marketing group and the symbol of what a NoDak would look like is the only concern that I have based on what the marketing company would come up with. Things to go along with NoDak Nation and old terms such as Roll Tribe could be used since a tribe is a group of people. Just my opinion on why it is my second choice ahead of the others. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWSiouxMN Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Why NoDak's would work. This is my second choice behind remaining North Dakota, because I cannot stomach the idea of condoms being thrown on the ice or courts of our hockey, basketball, volleyball etc. teams. I think the closest analogy to NoDak's is the Illinois Fighting Illini. The NCAA originally had them on the naughty list, but they said they could not get a tribal support because there was no such thing as the Illini tribe. Illini was a generic term for Illinois people, hence NoDak's would be for all North Dakota people. Granted Illinois did have Chief Iliniwek (spelling?), but the NCAA was OK with their reasoning as long as they did away with using him as well as any Native American imagery that they had used in the past. I think there are good marketing and copyright phrases that could be done by the marketing group and the symbol of what a NoDak would look like is the only concern that I have based on what the marketing company would come up with. Things to go along with NoDak Nation and old terms such as Roll Tribe could be used since a tribe is a group of people. Just my opinion on why it is my second choice ahead of the others. Just 1 question. What's your idea for a logo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Teeder11 Posted June 26, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted June 26, 2015 Why NoDak's would work. This is my second choice behind remaining North Dakota, because I cannot stomach the idea of condoms being thrown on the ice or courts of our hockey, basketball, volleyball etc. teams. I think the closest analogy to NoDak's is the Illinois Fighting Illini. The NCAA originally had them on the naughty list, but they said they could not get a tribal support because there was no such thing as the Illini tribe. Illini was a generic term for Illinois people, hence NoDak's would be for all North Dakota people. Granted Illinois did have Chief Iliniwek (spelling?), but the NCAA was OK with their reasoning as long as they did away with using him as well as any Native American imagery that they had used in the past. I think there are good marketing and copyright phrases that could be done by the marketing group and the symbol of what a NoDak would look like is the only concern that I have based on what the marketing company would come up with. Things to go along with NoDak Nation and old terms such as Roll Tribe could be used since a tribe is a group of people. Just my opinion on why it is my second choice ahead of the others. Just my humble opinion, but you should grow some thicker skin. Is this a problem right now at Red River High School games (I mean, the rivalry between Red River and Central is pretty toxic at times, i.e. the whole "Cake Eaters" vs. "White Trash" thing from a few years ago -- but nothing about condoms -- as I would imagine that is pretty unoriginal by today's standards)? I also have not heard much about this sort of thing at USC athletic contests, again, probably because it comes off as so cliche, as in, one could do a whole lot better. Lastly, it's not as if our rivals were playing nice with us when we were the Fighting Sioux with the stunts they pulled, but somehow we were able to sleep at night. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siouxperfan7 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Why NoDak's would work. This is my second choice behind remaining North Dakota, because I cannot stomach the idea of condoms being thrown on the ice or courts of our hockey, basketball, volleyball etc. teams. I think the closest analogy to NoDak's is the Illinois Fighting Illini. The NCAA originally had them on the naughty list, but they said they could not get a tribal support because there was no such thing as the Illini tribe. Illini was a generic term for Illinois people, hence NoDak's would be for all North Dakota people. Granted Illinois did have Chief Iliniwek (spelling?), but the NCAA was OK with their reasoning as long as they did away with using him as well as any Native American imagery that they had used in the past. I think there are good marketing and copyright phrases that could be done by the marketing group and the symbol of what a NoDak would look like is the only concern that I have based on what the marketing company would come up with. Things to go along with NoDak Nation and old terms such as Roll Tribe could be used since a tribe is a group of people. Just my opinion on why it is my second choice ahead of the others. We cannot worry about what other schools would potentially say or do when they play UND. If fans are going to be that disrespectful and immature, than that is their problem and their schools problem, not UND's. Also, do you really see this even happening? Say it was your intention to do it. How the hell is someone from the stands going to get a condom on to the playing field/court. Would be tough even from the front row!! Unless they intend to throw an entire box out.! Point being, I don't think this is even a clever idea. Condoms aren't really the first thing you think of when you hear Roughriders. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fightingsioux4life Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 That's a very good letter. As this process goes forward, be prepared to see every sniveling, whining progressive write letters to the editor about how great "Sundogs" would be. As a (non-sniveling, non-whining) progressive, I am not in favor of the Sundog name. I support Roughriders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cratter Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 #RollTribe A tribe of Roughriders. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hayduke Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 As a (non-sniveling, non-whining) progressive, I am not in favor of the Sundog name. I support Roughriders. Ditto here. Although I am a progressive, I am happy to call myself...dare I say it... a LIBERAL! And I hate Sundogs and support the name Roughriders just as I have supported the name Fighting Sioux. Go Ridas! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siouxfan512 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 We cannot worry about what other schools would potentially say or do when they play UND. If fans are going to be that disrespectful and immature, than that is their problem and their schools problem, not UND's. Also, do you really see this even happening? Say it was your intention to do it. How the hell is someone from the stands going to get a condom on to the playing field/court. Would be tough even from the front row!! Unless they intend to throw an entire box out.! Point being, I don't think this is even a clever idea. Condoms aren't really the first thing you think of when you hear Roughriders. Back in High School, during a pep rallies Seniors would always throw them at the Freshman. Usually by sticking a bouncy ball into the condom, then chucking it. Waste of condoms; and like you said, not exactly the first thing I think of when I hear Roughriders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSSioux Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Just 1 question. What's your idea for a logo? What is the logo for the Fighting Illini? That is why I referenced them as being direct comparison to NoDak's. I am sure someone would try to come up with some sort of representation. That should be voted on as well. This was just my opinion on what would be my preference if not just remaining North Dakota. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSSioux Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Just my humble opinion, but you should grow some thicker skin. Is this a problem right now at Red River High School games (I mean, the rivalry between Red River and Central is pretty toxic at times, i.e. the whole "Cake Eaters" vs. "White Trash" thing from a few years ago -- but nothing about condoms -- as I would imagine that is pretty unoriginal by today's standards)? I also have not heard much about this sort of thing at USC athletic contests, again, probably because it comes off as so cliche, as in, one could do a whole lot better. Lastly, it's not as if our rivals were playing nice with us when we were the Fighting Sioux with the stunts they pulled, but somehow we were able to sleep at night. Sorry, but I just stated my opinion on why NoDak's are my preference if it is not remaining North Dakota. One person on the nickname committee stated at the beginning of the process they were trying to get away from nicknames that would create these sorts of issues. I do have thick skin, and I just referenced a problem with another of the remaining nicknames. I would have had no issues if Rough Riders were the nickname from the beginning of the existence of UND. I agree that with any nickname chosen someone will come up with some offensive way to portray that nickname for some group of people. Just pointing out once again that the committee wanted to stay away from nicknames that could do that, which I thought from the beginning was impossible. Just stay North Dakota, and get rid of any problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hayduke Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Sorry, but I just stated my opinion on why NoDak's are my preference if it is not remaining North Dakota. One person on the nickname committee stated at the beginning of the process they were trying to get away from nicknames that would create these sorts of issues. I do have thick skin, and I just referenced a problem with another of the remaining nicknames. I would have had no issues if Rough Riders were the nickname from the beginning of the existence of UND. I agree that with any nickname chosen someone will come up with some offensive way to portray that nickname for some group of people. Just pointing out once again that the committee wanted to stay away from nicknames that could do that, which I thought from the beginning was impossible. Just stay North Dakota, and get rid of any problems. Are you kidding? Staying North Dakota will not eliminate problems with taunts. People are pretty darned clever, they'll find something. And by not having a nickname, that alone will induce ridicule. Plus, that bonus with reminaing just North Dakota is...you effectively remain...the de facto....Fighting Sioux. Here, I will admit it's a grey area. We don't know what the implications would be. Why take that chance? Go Ridas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cratter Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Lately the Herald has been publishing too many letters to the editor from people who support sundogs. For example, one of the letter was from a u of Minnesota alum who lives in Grafton. The fix is in. I hadn't read them. Until you wrote this. Those letters are pretty laughable. All one letter said was because UND is in sUNDogs. All one letter said from someone in warren Minnesota is it would help UND "connect" with the Big Sky conferences image. Not sure that makes any sense. Another Letter stated Google sundogs. I did and it took me to Urban Dictionary. (UD of roughriders is way more flattering). And he stated "Fans can play summoners of Sundogs by wearing blue (color of the sky) and/or bringing crystals to games." A big WHAT? I think they were smoking some good stuff. Also proposed we can name the rainbow colors of the Sundog. And also have a husky as a mascot. He did more harm than good with that letter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Why not the Emblem on the State Flag for ND or Nodaks ? http://www.citizenship-aei.org/wp-content/uploads/North-Dakota.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSSioux Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Are you kidding? Staying North Dakota will not eliminate problems with taunts. People are pretty darned clever, they'll find something. And by not having a nickname, that alone will induce ridicule. Plus, that bonus with reminaing just North Dakota is...you effectively remain...the de facto....Fighting Sioux. Here, I will admit it's a grey area. We don't know what the implications would be. Why take that chance? Go Ridas! Are you kidding with the continuing fear factor of remaining North Dakota. I just stated why my preference is NoDak's, if it is not remaining North Dakota. I stated nothing about "Fighting Sioux", as no matter the choice people will still wear what they want and say what they want. As far as the "fear factor" that some are portraying to remaining North Dakota, if President Kelley has not discussed this possibility with Emmert, he should have retired far before January 2016. I am going with the hope that he actually did his job and discussed this with the NCAA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UNDColorado Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 The fix is in. I hadn't read them. Until you wrote this. Those letters are pretty laughable. All one letter said was because UND is in sUNDogs. All one letter said from someone in warren Minnesota is it would help UND "connect" with the Big Sky conferences image. Not sure that makes any sense. Another Letter stated Google sundogs. I did and it took me to Urban Dictionary. (UD of roughriders is way more flattering). And he stated "Fans can play summoners of Sundogs by wearing blue (color of the sky) and/or bringing crystals to games." A big WHAT? I think they were smoking some good stuff. Also proposed we can name the rainbow colors of the Sundog. And also have a husky as a mascot. He did more harm than good with that letter. Yeah the number of sundogs letters recently published seemed a bit odd. The who blue color crystal argument made laugh. There is no cannabis strong enough to make a person that stupid. Trust me, I live in Colorado 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hayduke Posted June 26, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted June 26, 2015 Why not the Emblem on the State Flag for ND or Nodaks ?http://www.citizenship-aei.org/wp-content/uploads/North-Dakota.jpg Great idea! Oh, wait...I got the battle flag of the Roughriders confused with the North Dakota state flag here! My bad. Go Ridas! 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UNDColorado Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Great idea! Oh, wait...I got the battle flag of the Roughriders confused with the North Dakota state flag here! My bad. Go Ridas! +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cratter Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Dress up like cowboys\settlers\military Or a sun and rainbow. I can connect with a Roughrider a lot easier than I can a hawk. There is so much more marketing ($) opportunities with Roughriders than any other name. And I for one think it might not be a bad idea to have more than one logo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hayduke Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Dress up like cowboys\settlers\military Or a sun and rainbow. There is so much more marketing ($) opportunities with Roughriders than any other name. And I for one think it might not be a bad idea to have more than one logo. And their battle flag emblem is our state flag emblem. Yet, North Dakota has no official relationship with the Roughriders? (It's embarrassing to think some of these people arguing for North Dakota only and not the Roughriders because they supposedly have no affiliation to ND went to UND...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UNDBIZ Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I got ambitionz az a ridah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cratter Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 And their battle flag emblem is our state flag emblem. Yet, North Dakota has no official relationship with the Roughriders? (It's embarrassing to think some of these people arguing for North Dakota only and not the Roughriders because they supposedly have no affiliation to ND went to UND...) They look nothing alike. Zero connection between Roughriders and North Dakota. Zero. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hayduke Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 They look nothing alike. Zero connection between Roughriders and North Dakota. Zero. Well, with the exception that the insignia/logo or whatever looks exactly the same, you are correct, sir! Oh, denial ain't just a river in Egypt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Great idea! Oh, wait...I got the battle flag of the Roughriders confused with the North Dakota state flag here! My bad. Go Ridas! Which one came 1st ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoneySIOUX Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Why not the Emblem on the State Flag for ND or Nodaks ?http://www.citizenship-aei.org/wp-content/uploads/North-Dakota.jpg I think this is a great idea! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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