College Hockey Expansion

[cberkas]

8 minutes ago, Blackheart said:

So it's in Ohio?

Yes.

[ArchyAlum11]

Minnesota State's Hockey program has really come a long way since Hastings took over. they went from a team with only 1 NCAA appearance to a team with 4 of them, and the first one was in the last year of the old WCHA, They have made some very substantial upgrades to the arena and player's facilities, also they have reinvigorated the Maverick fans and they arena that was mostly empty is now one that is mostly full, and I blame the empty seats that do exist primarily on the "U" shaped seating Arrangement. I do think MNSU would be a good add for the NCHC, especially if they are adding ASU.

However in spite of this I will say that MNSU needs the NCHC more than the NCHC needs MNSU. I suspect that MNSU want to compete in NCHC to improve the programs standing (and that of the School) further, they also want to attract more top tier players, one of the best ways to do that is to be in a more competitive league. Additionally to improve your standing in the national polls and improve your chance of getting into the NCAA tournament regardless of winning your conference tournament its better to compete in a tougher conference. I would guess that the reason that MNSU is doing this now is because AZ State is going to be added to the NCHC and its much better to have an even number of teams in your conference than an odd number.

If Minnesota State leaves the WCHA it could trigger more realignment. I know some have talked about the BIG10 adding Tech as an affiliate member. I also don't know if WMU is still unhappy with the cost of the NCHC but if it was could that eventually trigger some sort of swap situation with WMU leaving for the WCHA and another WCHA team joining the NCHC, maybe Bemidji State or Bowling Green?

[Cratter]

Minnesota State Mankato needs to stay and help anchor, stabalize, and build a strong WCHA.

The NCHC needs to keep spots open for future hockey programs.

[bale31]

1 hour ago, Cratter said:

Minnesota State Mankato needs to stay and help anchor, stabalize, and build a strong WCHA.

The NCHC needs to keep spots open for future hockey programs.

I've always found that sentiment strangely self serving. Why should kato not have the same goal as everyone else? Why should kato take a step back and "stabalize the WCHA"? No one,  including UND, gave a damn about stabilizing anything when they had their respective chances. Why should kato have that expectation now?

This would be a positive move for MSU. it would decrease expenses and increase revenues. Apathy is starting to set in I'm Mankato due to not playing anyone that fans care about. Our program is and will continue to suffer if a change isn't made.

[Big Green]

Tell ASU we're not interested.  Add Bemidji and Mankato.  6 Teams within driving distance of NCHC Tourney.  I believe Hockey would be the main sport at all 8 teams.  I don't like FBS Schools Miami, W. Michigan and ASU in the conference. 

[Goon]

18 minutes ago, bale31 said:

I've always found that sentiment strangely self serving. Why should kato not have the same goal as everyone else? Why should kato take a step back and "stabalize the WCHA"? No one,  including UND, gave a damn about stabilizing anything when they had their respective chances. Why should kato have that expectation now?

This would be a positive move for MSU. it would decrease expenses and increase revenues. Apathy is starting to set in I'm Mankato due to not playing anyone that fans care about. Our program is and will continue to suffer if a change isn't made.

 

 

One thing I haven't seen mention here is, UMD, UND, SCSU, MSUM, UNO were all members of the now defunct NCC. We have a storied history with all of these schools. I find it puzzling when I read people's comments about those schools.

IMHO, they're all core schools int he NCHC and they've been awesome league members. I am not sure why some are banging on SCSU and MSUM? Since it's inception, SCSU, DU and UND have had the most success with the NCHC. The MAC Schools, not so much. The Mavericks would be a better fit for the league than BGSU. 

[#MACtion]

2 minutes ago, Goon said:

One thing I haven't seen mention here is, UMD, UND, SCSU, MSUM, Omaha were all members of the now defunct NCC. We have a history with all of these schools. I am not sure why some are banging on SCSU and MSUM? Since it's inception, SCSU, DU and UND have had the most success with the NCHC. The MAC Schools, not so much. 

Miami won the Frozen Faceoff.  Hard to get mad at that.

[Benny Baker]

No reason to water down the league.  8 is fine.  Otherwise, it's increasingly clear that the WCHA should have just invited Miami and Western Michigan to replace Minnesota and Wisconsin.  Instead, the NCHC will become the de facto old WCHA without any of the history and tradition.

[Cratter]

30 minutes ago, Goon said:

One thing I haven't seen mention here is, UMD, UND, SCSU, MSUM, UNO were all members of the now defunct NCC. We have a storied history with all of these schools. 

Another league UND wanted to get out of to align more with like minded schools.

[tnt]

32 minutes ago, Big Green said:

Tell ASU we're not interested.  Add Bemidji and Mankato.  6 Teams within driving distance of NCHC Tourney.  I believe Hockey would be the main sport at all 8 teams.  I don't like FBS Schools Miami, W. Michigan and ASU in the conference. 

Then the reasoning for leaving the WCHA was a farce.  UND said they were worried that the voting block in the old WCHA was such that many of the smaller schools wouldn't be all in and would always be on the lookout to cut costs, reduce scholarships, etc.   If you are adding those same teams back in, you defeated the purpose for bolting in the first place. 

[UNDBIZ]

36 minutes ago, Goon said:

One thing I haven't seen mention here is, UMD, UND, SCSU, MSUM, UNO were all members of the now defunct NCC. We have a storied history with all of these schools. I find it puzzling when I read people's comments about those schools.

IMHO, they're all core schools int he NCHC and they've been awesome league members. I am not sure why some are banging on SCSU and MSUM? Since it's inception, SCSU, DU and UND have had the most success with the NCHC. The MAC Schools, not so much. The Mavericks would be a better fit for the league than BGSU. 

On 9/19/2011 at 9:14 AM, Goon said:

I just hope that the NCHC doesn't feel like they have to add Stearns County Community College. them. If they get in they lower the quality of the NCHC... They are not a like minded school.

[siouxfan512]

2 hours ago, Cratter said:

Minnesota State Mankato needs to stay and help anchor, stabalize, and build a strong WCHA.

The NCHC needs to keep spots open for future hockey programs.

Not sure we can tell another school they need to stay and anchor the WCHA when we didn't. If they want to join, more power to them. I'd rather play Mankato than ASU, W Mich, probably even over Miami or Notre Dame. I just don't get much appeal from those games.

[Siouxperfan7]

Can't blame Mankato for showing interest in the NCHC.  Look at the teams they would be playing.  SCSU, UMD, and UND are much better rivals than Bemdji, Ferris State, and Alabama Huntsville.  They have history with DU, CC, and Omaha as well. But of course it's all wishful thinking right now.  And you know what they say:  "You can wish in one and and crap in the other and see which gets filled first!!"

 

[UNDColorado]

My personal preference is to add Bowling Green with the assumption that they are fully funding hockey.

[UNDBIZ]

Just now, UNDColorado said:

My personal preference is to add Bowling Green with the assumption that they are fully funding hockey.

Agreed.  And if they aren't (somewhat likely, I think), then just stick with 9 for a while.

[sprig]

1 hour ago, tnt said:

Then the reasoning for leaving the WCHA was a farce.  UND said they were worried that the voting block in the old WCHA was such that many of the smaller schools wouldn't be all in and would always be on the lookout to cut costs, reduce scholarships, etc.   If you are adding those same teams back in, you defeated the purpose for bolting in the first place. 

I don't think the nchc would add anyone that favors cost cuts.  Not sure what side of the fence Kato was on,  but I suspect it was cost cutting. Not sure about st cloud.  At any rate losing wis and mn tipped the majority to cost cutting schools in the wcha. Someone else can do the math. There may be a couple cost cutting schools in the nchc, don't know.  If that's the case, maybe more could be added,  as long as the scales aren't tipped

[Goon]

1 hour ago, Cratter said:

Another league UND wanted to get out of to align more with like minded schools.

You have historical matchups though. 

[Goon]

1 hour ago, UNDBIZ said:

 

 

Ahem, can't a guy evolve over a 5 year-period?

[Cratter]

1 hour ago, siouxfan512 said:

Not sure we can tell another school they need to stay and anchor the WCHA when we didn't. If they want to join, more power to them. I'd rather play Mankato than ASU, W Mich, probably even over Miami or Notre Dame. I just don't get much appeal from those games.

....just because you know them from before.

Hard to say you'd rather play a team that has never played ones favorite team.

ASU will help increase the exposure for the NCHC 10x than Mankato would.

[Cratter]

48 minutes ago, Goon said:

You have historical matchups though. 

Means nothing.

Rather play Montana than Morningside. 

Rather play ASU over Mankato State. Kato state doesn't get extra points because they've played UND in the past.

Some of the reasons Minnesota was a big rivalry to UND applies to Arizona State.

[Siouxperfan7]

7 minutes ago, Cratter said:

Means nothing.

Rather play Montana than Morningside. 

Rather play ASU over Mankato State. Kato state doesn't get extra points because they've played UND in the past.

Some of the reasons Minnesota was a big rivalry to UND applies to Arizona State.

You could argue that Mankato feels the same way about UND.

[southpaw]

1 hour ago, sprig said:

I don't think the nchc would add anyone that favors cost cuts.  Not sure what side of the fence Kato was on,  but I suspect it was cost cutting. Not sure about st cloud.  At any rate losing wis and mn tipped the majority to cost cutting schools in the wcha. Someone else can do the math. There may be a couple cost cutting schools in the nchc, don't know.  If that's the case, maybe more could be added,  as long as the scales aren't tipped

Hockey Priority: UND, DU, CC, UNO, Duluth

Cost Cutting: Anchorage, Bemidji, Mankato, Tech, SCSU (at the time)

If the WCHA was going to add two more teams to replace Minnesota and Wisconsin, they both would have had to be hockey priority schools, or the best case scenario would have been a 6-6 split.  That's why the NCHC was formed.  They wanted a majority of schools that were making hockey a priority and they got that.  Does it mean there won't be some teams that can't spend like the other schools?  Absolutely and I think Western and SCSU were examples of that.  But you don't want to start a new conference with 6 schools because if one leaves for greener pastures then you're left scrambing.

[The Sicatoka]

Scenario 1: Add ASU and MSU-M. I see that almost assuredly driving WMU and Miami away. What happens after that? Would the NCHC stay at eight? Would they go after < Bemidji, Tech, Air Force > to get back to 10? That' could collapse the WCHA and surely further wreck hockey in Alaska (beyond the current fiscal mess in the Land of Seward's Folly). 

Scenario 2: Add ASU and Bowling Green. This would make WMU and Miami happier. And honestly, MSU-M should be the annual favorite to be the WCHA representative in the NCAAs. 

Scenario 3: Add MSU-M and Bowling Green. Dear ASU, call us when you have it figured out. 

Scenario 4: Just ASU and run at nine.

Scenario 5: Stay at eight and be done. 

Unfortunately, I see scenarios 1 and 2 are the most likely. I say "unfortunately" because those two damage the WCHA. 

[southpaw]

17 hours ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

i think this delay/announcement by the nchc is for unlv to get their stuff together...nchs is holding spot ten for unlv and has a side agreement with asu that they already have the ninth spot...or seventh and eighth if western and miami leave in a couple of years..

UNLV is not going D1 anytime soon.  This "delay" in announcement is because the athletic directors don't get together until August and the presidents don't get together until early September.  The NCHC, just like all of the other conferences can't unilaterally make decisions to add.  The membership gets together and discusses those options.  They talked about it in Florida but had made no decisions at the time.

[southpaw]

3 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

Scenario 1: Add ASU and MSU-M. I see that almost assuredly driving WMU and Miami away. What happens after that? Would the NCHC stay at eight? Would they go after < Bemidji, Tech, Air Force > to get back to 10? That' could collapse the WCHA and surely further wreck hockey in Alaska (beyond the current fiscal mess in the Land of Seward's Folly). 

Scenario 2: Add ASU and Bowling Green. This would make WMU and Miami happier. And honestly, MSU-M should be the annual favorite to be the WCHA representative in the NCAAs. 

Scenario 3: Add MSU-M and Bowling Green. Dear ASU, call us when you have it figured out. 

Scenario 4: Just ASU and run at nine.

Scenario 5: Stay at eight and be done. 

Unfortunately, I see scenarios 1 and 2 are the most likely. I say "unfortunately" because those two damage the WCHA. 

Plan on scenario 1 happening but if WMU and Miami are going to leave... that would be the end of the WCHA unless they join that conference.  They have to go with other teams, so it would be creating a new conference.  By the time they leave (it's not happening soon) there will be other teams in the west that the NCHC can pick up to replace them.  The NCHC won't add any of the other WCHA teams and Air Force won't leave AFA.