University of North Dakota Hockey 2019-20 Season

[tnt]

24 minutes ago, jodcon said:

You know, there's a lot of truth to that, there's a certain amount of fans who really lay in the weeds until the wheels come off and then jump on board indicating this coach/player/administration/scheme/facility/(insert anything else debatable) was a bad decision from day 1, even though they said nothing in the beginning. Seen it quite a few times during our football regression, humans love to say "I told you so".

Never mind the fact it is the same ones that ripped on a coach who had us relevant late in the year every year.  Gotta suck to go through life as an eternal pessimist.  I guarantee you that we will hear some say we were lucky to win that game next year if we get outshot badly.

[stoneySIOUX]

47 minutes ago, siouxforce19 said:

I really hope people  are not basing anything off post game comments, interviews, radio show appearances, because that’s ridiculous. No one knows what goes on in that locker room when no one is around, in the off season when no one is around, etc. We only see what they choose to show us. Yeah Berry is a master of Coach Speak. That’s media training. Yeah he uses the same phrases over and over again and the fans hate it. None of that has anything to do with the culture of this program. Oh look, I said that taboo word 

But they are. That's the problem. I'm not sure what the expectation is. Are the players supposed to throw teammates under the bus? Are the coaches supposed to do the same? Sure seems that's what some on here want.

[stoneySIOUX]

39 minutes ago, SiouxFan100 said:

High school freshman 

recruiting is a crap shoot

I am sure he is going to be great - well to tell the truth I have no idea but the coaches need to know

so young 

Really impressive year as a freshman for a top flight HS hockey program. Definitely a good start for this kid. 

[yzerman19]

1 hour ago, stoneySIOUX said:

Really impressive year as a freshman for a top flight HS hockey program. Definitely a good start for this kid. 

he could go ntdp like his bro before arriving here...lots of potential

[stoneySIOUX]

8 hours ago, yzerman19 said:

he could go ntdp like his bro before arriving here...lots of potential

100% agree

[Wilbur]

8 hours ago, yzerman19 said:

he could go ntdp like his bro before arriving here...lots of potential

In a perfect situation this is the way for him.  Try out for U17 this year or the next and then go from there.  

[SJHovey]

10 hours ago, tnt said:

Never mind the fact it is the same ones that ripped on a coach who had us relevant late in the year every year.  Gotta suck to go through life as an eternal pessimist.  I guarantee you that we will hear some say we were lucky to win that game next year if we get outshot badly.

I don't think it's this so much as our fan base is simply spoiled.  I say that in a nice way, but it's absolutely true and the sooner people realize it, the sooner they'll get back to enjoying UND hockey.

We had a 20 year run that candidly won't be repeated again.  As I was finishing up school in the early 80's, the WCHA was coming off a stretch where the NCAA champion came out of our league something like 29 of 36 years.  That won't be repeated again either.

From '97 to '00, we had the best team, hands down, in college hockey.  It wasn't even close.  We won two titles, then were an overtime goal away from sneaking out a third in '01.  We then went to what, seven Frozen Fours in eleven years.

Nobody is going to do that again.  Back in one of the old "fire Hak" threads I posted something to the effect that even though we weren't winning titles, people needed to sit back and enjoy the success we were having because it was really outside of the ordinary.

10 Frozen Fours in a twenty year span.  You're not going to see that again people, I don't care how many coaches you want to fire.

[OgieOgilthorpe]

 I was frustrated in 2017 when they struggled all year long and got embarrassed by Michigan State at home. It was extremely frustrating seeing Boeser struggle through injuries and to score. It was also hard to watch Jost be frustrated having little to no help when Boeser was out. If you wonder why Jost left after 1 season, did you even watch the games? His body language said it all, and he may as well have been the only forward on the ice a lot of the time. I'd bet a lot of money his decision was just as much about his concern about development with that group and coaching staff as much as it was about the Avs desperately needing new blood at the time.

At least in 2017, it eased the pain knowing that the season was mainly tough because of all the early departures following a championship season. It also helped that they fought through all that adversity and snuck into the NCAA tourney where they actually displayed their peak execution in all 3 zones. They grew as a team throughout that season and turned into a ND hockey club by the time it mattered. They deserved to move on, but got caught in a bad review and I thought that would be the perfect fuel for the 17-18 season and boy oh boy was I wrong.

IMO the 17-18 season was the red flag season where we all should've been frustrated and ready for change. All the bad loses and other uncharacteristic problems aside, UND got WORSE as the season went on and did not perform the way they should have after a rebuilding season.  17-18 was the season I was ready to "see how it plays out". I was ready to see how Berry would get his group to bounce back and come back fighting after a rebuilding season. It was glaringly clear that they only took steps backward in pretty much every aspect of a hockey team on and off the ice. Spring 2018 I was asking myself if Berry was able to keep his job mainly because of his contract, or because of the long term thought of letting him play out his shot. At that point I was wondering if it was more so letting him play out his shot, rather than doing what was actually best for the program long term. He's a great coach and a great hockey mind, but it's glaringly obvious that he's just not a HC

So, then came 18-19 and they somehow yet again took even more steps back. Did that really come as a surprise to anyone? The uncreative, slow robot style of zone entry style offense that creates few to zero scoring opportunities is going to create low scoring numbers for every single recruit they bring in no matter how awesome they are. No surprise the season was a slump, and I was so past frustrated that I even stopped watching the games toward the end of the season because knowing they'd score 2 or less goals was as obvious as could be after 2.5 seasons of seeing nothing change to fix it. 

To the folks saying they're ready to see how this next season plays out, I admire your resiliency. 

[OgieOgilthorpe]

11 hours ago, Oxbow6 said:

Trey is a really good get for Berry.

Yeah that was a pretty tough nab! Born and raised across the river, grew up loving UND, watched his older brother captain a national championship team...  Can't believe UND pulled that one off. 

[stoneySIOUX]

43 minutes ago, OgieOgilthorpe said:

 I was frustrated in 2017 when they struggled all year long and got embarrassed by Michigan State at home. It was extremely frustrating seeing Boeser struggle through injuries and to score. It was also hard to watch Jost be frustrated having little to no help when Boeser was out. If you wonder why Jost left after 1 season, did you even watch the games? His body language said it all, and he may as well have been the only forward on the ice a lot of the time. I'd bet a lot of money his decision was just as much about his concern about development with that group and coaching staff as much as it was about the Avs desperately needing new blood at the time.

At least in 2017, it eased the pain knowing that the season was mainly tough because of all the early departures following a championship season. It also helped that they fought through all that adversity and snuck into the NCAA tourney where they actually displayed their peak execution in all 3 zones. They grew as a team throughout that season and turned into a ND hockey club by the time it mattered. They deserved to move on, but got caught in a bad review and I thought that would be the perfect fuel for the 17-18 season and boy oh boy was I wrong.

IMO the 17-18 season was the red flag season where we all should've been frustrated and ready for change. All the bad loses and other uncharacteristic problems aside, UND got WORSE as the season went on and did not perform the way they should have after a rebuilding season.  17-18 was the season I was ready to "see how it plays out". I was ready to see how Berry would get his group to bounce back and come back fighting after a rebuilding season. It was glaringly clear that they only took steps backward in pretty much every aspect of a hockey team on and off the ice. Spring 2018 I was asking myself if Berry was able to keep his job mainly because of his contract, or because of the long term thought of letting him play out his shot. At that point I was wondering if it was more so letting him play out his shot, rather than doing what was actually best for the program long term. He's a great coach and a great hockey mind, but it's glaringly obvious that he's just not a HC

So, then came 18-19 and they somehow yet again took even more steps back. Did that really come as a surprise to anyone? The uncreative, slow robot style of zone entry style offense that creates few to zero scoring opportunities is going to create low scoring numbers for every single recruit they bring in no matter how awesome they are. No surprise the season was a slump, and I was so past frustrated that I even stopped watching the games toward the end of the season because knowing they'd score 2 or less goals was as obvious as could be after 2.5 seasons of seeing nothing change to fix it. 

To the folks saying they're ready to see how this next season plays out, I admire your resiliency. 

Resiliency??? To watch hockey? C'mon, man. 

None of us like losing, but the lack of perspective just 3 years removed from a national championship after a 20 year run of hockey that's all but unprecedented, is absolutely mind blowing to me. 

Also, you're flat wrong insinuating Jost left for concern over his development. Just flat out wrong.

[stoneySIOUX]

17 minutes ago, OgieOgilthorpe said:

Yeah that was a pretty tough nab! Born and raised across the river, grew up loving UND, watched his older brother captain a national championship team...  

Dude, you apparently need a new hobby. Seems like this program is causing you too much stress. Goodness.

By the way, Gage originally committed to Denver and only came to UND after Gwoz left. So, how about giving Bubbs a bit of credit nabbing Trey?

[petey23]

11 hours ago, Oxbow6 said:

"Talk is cheap......money buys the whiskey and lap dances." ~ gfhockey

FYP

[jdub27]

15 hours ago, fightingsioux4life said:

The current trend for this program is down, down and down some more. If we were a stock, I wouldn't buy it. And if I owned it, I would sell as quickly as possible.

Apropos of nothing, you'd be a terrible investor. 

[Oxbow6]

30 minutes ago, OgieOgilthorpe said:

Yeah that was a pretty tough nab! Born and raised across the river, grew up loving UND, watched his older brother captain a national championship team...  Can't believe UND pulled that one off. 

Yup considering all the former UND player's kids UND has missed on and couldn't get to commit to UND this was a slam dunk..............................

[OgieOgilthorpe]

51 minutes ago, Oxbow6 said:

Yup considering all the former UND player's kids UND has missed on and couldn't get to commit to UND this was a slam dunk..............................

Just poking fun. This kid was a shoe-in recruit, but yes it's still good to see they didn't screw it up. 

[fightingsioux4life]

23 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Apropos of nothing, you'd be a terrible investor. 

The facts are what they are. Look at the won-loss records, league finishes and lack of NCAA appearances and you see a downward trend for this program. Will it be better next year? That is very possible, but until we see it that is pure wishful thinking.

And for the record, I am not an investor. The stock market is basically legalized gambling; very risky when you don't have a real-life crystal ball.

[The Sicatoka]

1 hour ago, SJHovey said:

I don't think it's this so much as our fan base is simply spoiled.  I say that in a nice way, but it's absolutely true and the sooner people realize it, the sooner they'll get back to enjoying UND hockey.

We had a 20 year run that candidly won't be repeated again.  As I was finishing up school in the early 80's, the WCHA was coming off a stretch where the NCAA champion came out of our league something like 29 of 36 years.  That won't be repeated again either.

From '97 to '00, we had the best team, hands down, in college hockey.  It wasn't even close.  We won two titles, then were an overtime goal away from sneaking out a third in '01.  We then went to what, seven Frozen Fours in eleven years.

Nobody is going to do that again.  Back in one of the old "fire Hak" threads I posted something to the effect that even though we weren't winning titles, people needed to sit back and enjoy the success we were having because it was really outside of the ordinary.

10 Frozen Fours in a twenty year span.  You're not going to see that again people, I don't care how many coaches you want to fire.

Mentioning runs ... 

How many early departures did we suffer after the 2016, 2017, and 2018 seasons? Wasn't that another "probably won't ever see that again" item? 

[OgieOgilthorpe]

34 minutes ago, stoneySIOUX said:

Resiliency??? To watch hockey? C'mon, man. 

None of us like losing, but the lack of perspective just 3 years removed from a national championship after a 20 year run of hockey that's all but unprecedented, is absolutely mind blowing to me. 

Also, you're flat wrong insinuating Jost left for concern over his development. Just flat out wrong.

I'm just stating my opinion so please stop trying to start an argument. You seem to do that far too often on here.

And a lack of perspective in my eyes is you not realizing that the program is currently taking a hard dip below the 20 year trend of success and of being held at a high standard. Forgive me for not having a loser mentality and for wanting to see changes to break this new streak. Seeing absolutely nothing tweaked or shuffled after 3 straight seasons of taking significant steps backward is a very viable reason for fans to be upset. 

I didn't say Jost left solely over concerns for his development, but rather that it definitely played a big role. 

[The Sicatoka]

1 hour ago, stoneySIOUX said:

Also, you're flat wrong insinuating Jost left for concern over his development. Just flat out wrong.

Jost would've been well served to stay for a sophomore year. He's bouncing up and down with the Avs. 

[Goon]

1 hour ago, stoneySIOUX said:

Resiliency??? To watch hockey? C'mon, man. 

None of us like losing, but the lack of perspective just 3 years removed from a national championship after a 20 year run of hockey that's all but unprecedented, is absolutely mind blowing to me. 

Also, you're flat wrong insinuating Jost left for concern over his development. Just flat out wrong.

Jost left because he was offered a nice contract and he was able to help his family. 

[Goon]

2 minutes ago, OgieOgilthorpe said:

I didn't say Jost left solely over concerns for his development, but rather that it definitely played a big role. 

There's no evidence to back up that statement. The minute Jost's season was over he was under pressure from the AV's to sign. 

IRC his agent was outside the UND locker room right after the game encouraging him to sign. 

[SJHovey]

1 minute ago, The Sicatoka said:

Mentioning runs ... 

How many early departures did we suffer after the 2016, 2017, and 2018 seasons? Wasn't that another "probably won't ever see that again" item? 

Yeah, I'm not sure.  I thought I saw that Brad posted that we lost a record number of people during that period, but I don't have the numbers.

I get why people are frustrated.  We've basically been the best program in college hockey for 40 years.  That covers the college hockey lifespan of a great many of our fans.  When you look back and see how many Frozen Fours, how many tournaments, how many championship game appearances, how many championships we've all had the privilege of witnessing these past 40 years (no other program comes close to us in all of those categories), you start to view it as a right instead of an extremely fortunate experience.

[OgieOgilthorpe]

1 hour ago, stoneySIOUX said:

Dude, you apparently need a new hobby. Seems like this program is causing you too much stress. Goodness.

By the way, Gage originally committed to Denver and only came to UND after Gwoz left. So, how about giving Bubbs a bit of credit nabbing Trey?

Yes, it's great news and yes he's a great recruit...but don't be silly and try to argue he wasn't a shoe-in. That would've been an absolute joke if someone else picked him up. Your argument is that Gage ALMOST went to a different school? But he didn't, he came to UND, and he played there for 4 seasons and captained for 2. All the while his little bro got to grow up watching play in probably every single home game and even bring home a ring that I'm sure he's held on his finger. He may as well of had a UND logo tattooed on his face. 

[OgieOgilthorpe]

23 minutes ago, Goon said:

There's no evidence to back up that statement. The minute Jost's season was over he was under pressure from the AV's to sign. 

IRC his agent was outside the UND locker room right after the game encouraging him to sign. 

There's no evidence to back up a statement on either side, Goon. Just like 100% of your stories and tweets. 

How was his locker room tunnel situation different than any other 1st rounder's after their last game of the college season? You saying he got pressured to sign like it's unheard of made me laugh. 

How do you know his agent wasn't encouraging him to sign because he saw the writing on the wall at UND with Brad at the helm? 

Obviously the situation was right for him and the Av's who were struggling at the time, so that was a big reason. All I'm saying is that he didn't have much to look forward to development-wise if he decided to stay, especially with Boeser leaving. You're all saying he gave no thought to what his next season at UND would be like? Or that if there were 3-4 blue-chippers and a really good shot at a national title that he still wouldn't have stayed?

I think there's a really good chance he got a good nudge to take the jump to the NHL knowing he wasn't going to be missing much. 

I personally agree that he could've used another season to bulk up and learn to lead. Even if he would've been doing a lot of one man island offense instead of actually leading. 

[stoneySIOUX]

34 minutes ago, OgieOgilthorpe said:

I'm just stating my opinion so please stop trying to start an argument. You seem to do that far too often on here.

And a lack of perspective in my eyes is you not realizing that the program is currently taking a hard dip below the 20 year trend of success and of being held at a high standard. Forgive me for not having a loser mentality and for wanting to see changes to break this new streak. Seeing absolutely nothing tweaked or shuffled after 3 straight seasons of taking significant steps backward is a very viable reason for fans to be upset. 

I didn't say Jost left solely over concerns for his development, but rather that it definitely played a big role. 

Not trying to start an argument, just disagreeing with your opinion. I said it's mind blowing, "to me". When did I say that I don't see a dip from the 20 year trend of success? Of course it's a dip. We haven't made the playoffs. It's not a loser mentality to take a deep breath and realize it's not really that bad. We're close and our recruiting can absolutely help us get back to where we need to be. The perspective I'm asking for is the perception that we are so far off. We're not, IMO that's why I replied. If you want to have the opinion that we are, that's fine. I disagree.

I don't know what needs to be tweaked, but I'd like your opinion on it. If we have actual things to discuss rather than "we've gotta fire this guy" or "we've gotta cut this kid", etc, I think I'd be less frustrated with the conversation. All of this roundabout for a bunch of guys on a message board who don't actually coach college hockey, haven't coached in the pros and didn't play in the NHL. Not that these are all prerequisites to criticize, but these things all get so overblown. 

I'll mightily argue against Jost leaving for his concerns over his development because it's just simply not true.