darell1976 Posted March 21, 2014 Author Posted March 21, 2014 Two Fire Muss threads, a Fire Jones thread and a Next Coach of UND Football thread that you started before conference play had even started this fall (Search feature is really easy to use). And like I said, I have no problem with you having an opinion, but if you are going to be that vocal, don't be offended or surprised when someone asks you to back it up. The first one I admit to, the second one you linked..did you read it? http://forum.siouxsp.../page__hl__fire After last nights loss I would definately be in favor of firing Mussman...but the only thing that stops me from saying it is how did Roger Thomas do when he took over UND from Pat Behrns in 1986 he did nothing but build the team from the cellar to the top even beating the all mighty Bison in 1993. I wasn't saying fire him, it was more of a hot seat statement. http://forum.siouxsp...page__hl__coach To steer clear of the Craig Bohl thread, and to take Shawn-O's post to the next level, lets discuss; The next coach after Muss will be.... Muss being replaced was again clogging up a thread (game thread probably) so I just started a new thread, just like I did with this one. Here is some advice from fightingsioux4life's post (after yours)... If you don't like the discussion.....don't read it! Quote
UND-FB-FAN Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 I fault both Brian Jones and Brian Faison for the mess that UND athletics, with the exception being hockey, has been in for the past decade. Until pressure was actually put on Faison to fire Mussman, he didn't even consider it. Now that Bubba has been hired, the program is finally moving in the right direction. As far as basketball, stop waiting for the 'right' moment and just fire Jones and get someone in here that can get the job done. I can GUARANTEE you Jones will never win a Big Sky championship, so all were doing is allowing for more wasted seasons. Brewster is a good basketball coach and the success can be seen. In the areas of football and men's basketball though, the coaching as been unorganized and sporadic at best. Thankfully Bubba is now helping out the football side of things and cleaning up Mussman's mess. Faison isn't as aggressive as I'd like him to be; nevertheless, he'll eventually be forced into firing Jones. Quote
ibleedgreen Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 I guess UND gets what they paid for. I think I saw where Jones makes around $86,000/year? Didn't Saul just sign a 5 year extension for $175,000/year? Quote
fightingsioux4life Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 I guess UND gets what they paid for. I think I saw where Jones makes around $86,000/year? Didn't Saul just sign a 5 year extension for $175,000/year? And now we are back to the 800 pound gorilla in the room when it comes to getting the best coaches for our teams. The gorilla some people don't ever want to talk about. Quote
jdub27 Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 Here is some advice from fightingsioux4life's post (after yours)... I want to discuss it, in depth actually. That's why I keep asking you to explain and validate your very strong opinion. Quote
darell1976 Posted March 21, 2014 Author Posted March 21, 2014 I'm not a coach either, but I laid out what I thought the problems were with this team. And I have no relation to Jones. Have met him maybe once in passing and heard him talk multiple times, which is part of what I've used to form my opinion on him and the team. You're more than welcome to yours, but if you are going to be so vocal with it, be prepared to back it up. And I'm not a fan of "Fire xxx" threads, Muss included. You sure seem to be though, I think you've started the majority of them on this board. I understand voicing frustrations and discussing them but titling a thread like that just isn't something I agree with, to each their own though. These are posts before I started the Fire Jones thread: http://forum.siouxsp...16/page__st__20 Posted 16 January 2014 - 10:44 PM Our basketball team just sucks, that is all there is to it. --Bincitysioux Posted 16 January 2014 - 11:09 PM Yep, and considering our returning starters and preseason expectations, it's infuriating. Not happy with this season because there's no excuse for it other than poor execution/poor coaching. ---UND-FB-Fan Posted 17 January 2014 - 12:08 AM Jones is by far the worst Coach in the Big Sky! Period!!! --UNDsportsFanatic Posted 17 January 2014 - 12:36 AM So who is gonna start the "Fire Jones" thread??!! --Siouxperfan7 The first line of this thread: I added this thread so it doesn't clog up game threads. Quote
Matt Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 I fault both Brian Jones and Brian Faison for the mess that UND athletics, with the exception being hockey, has been in for the past decade. Until pressure was actually put on Faison to fire Mussman, he didn't even consider it. Now that Bubba has been hired, the program is finally moving in the right direction. As far as basketball, stop waiting for the 'right' moment and just fire Jones and get someone in here that can get the job done. I can GUARANTEE you Jones will never win a Big Sky championship, so all were doing is allowing for more wasted seasons. Brewster is a good basketball coach and the success can be seen. In the areas of football and men's basketball though, the coaching as been unorganized and sporadic at best. Thankfully Bubba is now helping out the football side of things and cleaning up Mussman's mess. Faison isn't as aggressive as I'd like him to be; nevertheless, he'll eventually be forced into firing Jones. I share your optimisim, but it is worth noting Bubba has won exactly zero games here. Whether or not we think he's on the right track or not is a matter of pure speculation, and we afforded Muss and Jones that same same bit of rope prior to hanging himself with it. If Muss had taken 2nd place in the BSC, he would still have his job. I'm not sure I've seen anyone make the case why Jones should be fired for those results. Lots of style of play and intangible arguments, but bottom line it was a good season and a good group of players. Quote
darell1976 Posted March 21, 2014 Author Posted March 21, 2014 I share your optimisim, but it is worth noting Bubba has won exactly zero games here. Whether or not we think he's on the right track or not is a matter of pure speculation, and we afforded Muss and Jones that same same bit of rope prior to hanging himself with it. If Muss had taken 2nd place in the BSC, he would still have his job. I'm not sure I've seen anyone make the case why Jones should be fired for those results. Lots of style of play and intangible arguments, but bottom line it was a good season and a good group of players. If we would have finished second in the BSC in football we would've mde the FCS playoffs (the football version of the dance), haven't made the dance yet in basketball. Frustration is taking its toll on fans (me included) and Jones hasn't been impressing anyone in non-conference play or post season tournaments (CIT). Quote
UNDBIZ Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 I share your optimisim, but it is worth noting Bubba has won exactly zero games here. Whether or not we think he's on the right track or not is a matter of pure speculation, and we afforded Muss and Jones that same same bit of rope prior to hanging himself with it. If Muss had taken 2nd place in the BSC, he would still have his job. I'm not sure I've seen anyone make the case why Jones should be fired for those results. Lots of style of play and intangible arguments, but bottom line it was a good season and a good group of players. It was a solid conference season. The overall season left much to be desired. Non-conference was downright embarrassing for the most part. Quote
Hawkster Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 I fault both Brian Jones and Brian Faison for the mess that UND athletics, with the exception being hockey, has been in for the past decade. Until pressure was actually put on Faison to fire Mussman, he didn't even consider it. Now that Bubba has been hired, the program is finally moving in the right direction. As far as basketball, stop waiting for the 'right' moment and just fire Jones and get someone in here that can get the job done. I can GUARANTEE you Jones will never win a Big Sky championship, so all were doing is allowing for more wasted seasons. Brewster is a good basketball coach and the success can be seen. In the areas of football and men's basketball though, the coaching as been unorganized and sporadic at best. Thankfully Bubba is now helping out the football side of things and cleaning up Mussman's mess. Faison isn't as aggressive as I'd like him to be; nevertheless, he'll eventually be forced into firing Jones. That's the thing, why wait until things are so bad that it takes years to recover. The more I think about it the more convinced I am that Jones needs to go. It's like Muss, just do it and get it over with. When you think about next year, you know we are going to hit the skids for a few years and Jones probably won't survive a run of poor seasons. Just do it. 1 Quote
UND-FB-FAN Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 I share your optimisim, but it is worth noting Bubba has won exactly zero games here. Whether or not we think he's on the right track or not is a matter of pure speculation, and we afforded Muss and Jones that same same bit of rope prior to hanging himself with it. If Muss had taken 2nd place in the BSC, he would still have his job. I'm not sure I've seen anyone make the case why Jones should be fired for those results. Lots of style of play and intangible arguments, but bottom line it was a good season and a good group of players. With no games being played, the players are already supporting UND athletics better and are very optimistic. I'll take that as a good sign. Add in the recruiting class given the shortened recruiting period and the staff's experience and philosophy, and I believe were in better hands. Will it be good enough? We won't know until games are played. My issue with Jones is he can't win out of conference or on the road. If you can't win OOC games or road games, it will be difficult to win the Big Sky, especially if the tournament is on the road. UND's men basketball teams have been inconsistent and I directly attribute that to Jones' coaching. Quote
jjensen Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 I don't know if this has been discussed here but I was wondering if Jones does get fired who should we be looking at to come in as a new head coach? Any thoughts? Quote
ArtVandalay Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 UND was 4-6 on road in Big Sky this year. Weber was 5-5. Quote
UND92,96 Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 The last two years, UND is 0-14 vs. non-conference opponents away from home (includes neutral court games). In that same stretch, UND is 13-12 vs. Big Sky opponents away from home. Does UND just play that much better away from home vs. Big Sky opponents, or is the Big Sky just not very good after the top team or two? Quote
SWSiouxMN Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 The last two years, UND is 0-14 vs. non-conference opponents away from home (includes neutral court games). In that same stretch, UND is 13-12 vs. Big Sky opponents away from home. Does UND just play that much better away from home vs. Big Sky opponents, or is the Big Sky just not very good after the top team or two? Record vs Montana on road/neutral 0-2 Record vs Weber State on road/neutral 0-4 Record vs Rest of Big Sky on road/neutral court: 13-6 the losses (SUU x2, UNC, Sac x2, PSU) Quote
Gus Chiggins Posted March 22, 2014 Posted March 22, 2014 As long as Brian Jones is the Head Coach at UND, we will be stagnant and average as a UND Mens Basketball Program. The large sample size shows that. His coaching leaves a lot to be desired. Good coaches get the best out of their players. It is my opinion that he does not get the best out of his players. In fact, I believe they have underachieved terribly during the years with him as head coach. 2 Quote
Shawn-O Posted March 22, 2014 Posted March 22, 2014 Fire Jones....Hire Craig Smith..... We'd need to double the salary slot to get him. Not sure Faison has the stomach for that just yet. Quote
Siouxphan27 Posted March 22, 2014 Posted March 22, 2014 As long as Brian Jones is the Head Coach at UND, we will be stagnant and average as a UND Mens Basketball Program. The large sample size shows that. His coaching leaves a lot to be desired. Good coaches get the best out of their players. It is my opinion that he does not get the best out of his players. In fact, I believe they have underachieved terribly during the years with him as head coach. Good post, I could not agree more. He gets NOTHING extra out of his players. They leave with the same level of talent they came here with. Next year is a lame duck season as far as i'm concerned. Quote
WeAreNorthDakota Posted March 22, 2014 Posted March 22, 2014 Next year will be huge in evaluating Jones as a coach. It will be his first year in the Big Sky without a very experienced roster. Quote
bincitysioux Posted March 23, 2014 Posted March 23, 2014 Winning percentage in first two years as head coach in Big Sky play: Wayne Tinkle: .563 (18-14) Brian Jones: .600 (24-16) Not making an argument either way, just pointing out a fact. Quote
UND92,96 Posted March 23, 2014 Posted March 23, 2014 Winning percentage in first two years as head coach in Big Sky play: Wayne Tinkle: .563 (18-14) Brian Jones: .600 (24-16) Not making an argument either way, just pointing out a fact. It's pretty interesting to compare UND's overall Great West winning percentage of 2010-11 and 2011-12, to its Big Sky record minus Weber St. and Montana. Excluding games against the two most successful Big Sky programs, UND has actually been more successful in the Big Sky than the Great West. I'd feel a lot better about it had UND had more success out of conference. Quote
gfhockey Posted March 23, 2014 Posted March 23, 2014 At the good ole boys meetings in Minneapolis we decided to give jones at least one more year But yes Craig smith is on our radar Quote
Prison_Mike Posted March 23, 2014 Posted March 23, 2014 At the good ole boys meetings in Minneapolis we decided to give jones at least one more year But yes Craig smith is on our radar Thanks for the update bro 1 Quote
choyt3 Posted March 23, 2014 Posted March 23, 2014 At the good ole boys meetings in Minneapolis we decided to give jones at least one more year But yes Craig smith is on our radar Did your radar pick up a blip from Vermillion? Quote
Siouxperfan7 Posted March 23, 2014 Posted March 23, 2014 3rd and 2nd in the Big Sky the past two seasons. If that was Muss in football, he'd be getting a raise!! Quote
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