If Big Ten Offers UND Should They Join?

[82SiouxGuy]

1 hour ago, chicofelipe said:

It is a bit of a stretch to include everybody in those two counties as part of the Grand Forks Metro area.  

 

 

2 minutes ago, chicofelipe said:

McVille is not Metro Grand Forks. Grafton is not Metro Grand Forks.

McVille is in Nelson County. Grafton is in Walsh County. The definition of Metropolitan area includes the entire county of the city or cities included. So Larimore and Crookston would be included in the Grand Forks Metro area.

[The Sicatoka]

1 hour ago, chicofelipe said:

It is a bit of a stretch to include everybody in those two counties as part of the Grand Forks Metro area.  

 

Fargo counts all of Clay County, MN, in its metro number. It's how it's done. 

[siouxkid12]

22 minutes ago, 82SiouxGuy said:

Sorry, but no one knows whether the Big 10 would offer money from the network or not. UND wouldn't get a full share, because they wouldn't be a full member. But until a negotiation was started it isn't possible to say what they would offer UND. Even a hockey only share of the network funds might be significant to UND, and wouldn't be missed by the rest of the conference. It could add up to more than the Midco contract.

http://www.nj.com/rutgersfootball/index.ssf/2015/10/is_there_anything_the_big_ten_can_do_to_help_rutge.html

I read somewhere (I'll have to dig back and see if I can find the article) that non affiliated schools do not receive any money from the B10 network, they would share tournaments dollars but that's about it. I have included another link on how the B10 pays the new membership schools a small percentage until they are fully transitioned into the new conference (6 full years).

In all reality, UND should take their production in-house and sell the rights to a broad spectrum of cable providers.

[82SiouxGuy]

8 minutes ago, siouxkid12 said:

http://www.nj.com/rutgersfootball/index.ssf/2015/10/is_there_anything_the_big_ten_can_do_to_help_rutge.html

I read somewhere (I'll have to dig back and see if I can find the article) that non affiliated schools do not receive any money from the B10 network, they would share tournaments dollars but that's about it. I have included another link on how the B10 pays the new membership schools a small percentage until they are fully transitioned into the new conference (6 full years).

In all reality, UND should take their production in-house and sell the rights to a broad spectrum of cable providers.

Just because that is the way they have done things doesn't mean they couldn't do something different in this case. Adding UND would definitely add revenue in at least some of the Big 10 markets. The same probably can't be said about adding a school for track, or a school like Johns Hopkins for lacrosse (I'm pretty sure that Johns Hopkins is currently the only affiliate member and lacrosse isn't a huge TV money maker in most Big 10 markets). If a school is going to add to the bottom line they deserve to participate in some way.

I'm sure that they will look at going in house when the current contract is up, but with the current financial conditions I don't see it happening. There would be a lot of start up expense buying equipment, and they would have to add at least a few full time employees plus a bunch of part time employees to handle the game broadcasts. They appear to be moving away from that model when they announce that Paul Ralston and Tim Hennessy will no longer be UND employees and that Learfield Sports will be handling the radio broadcasting. If UND were to join the Big 10, the network would only broadcast some of the games. UND would probably be free to find another outlet for the rest of the games, whether that was in house or a provider like Midco.

[siouxkid12]

1 hour ago, 82SiouxGuy said:

Just because that is the way they have done things doesn't mean they couldn't do something different in this case. Adding UND would definitely add revenue in at least some of the Big 10 markets. The same probably can't be said about adding a school for track, or a school like Johns Hopkins for lacrosse (I'm pretty sure that Johns Hopkins is currently the only affiliate member and lacrosse isn't a huge TV money maker in most Big 10 markets). If a school is going to add to the bottom line they deserve to participate in some way.

I'm sure that they will look at going in house when the current contract is up, but with the current financial conditions I don't see it happening. There would be a lot of start up expense buying equipment, and they would have to add at least a few full time employees plus a bunch of part time employees to handle the game broadcasts. They appear to be moving away from that model when they announce that Paul Ralston and Tim Hennessy will no longer be UND employees and that Learfield Sports will be handling the radio broadcasting. If UND were to join the Big 10, the network would only broadcast some of the games. UND would probably be free to find another outlet for the rest of the games, whether that was in house or a provider like Midco.

Darn budget cuts!

[Siouxperfan7]

http://www.startribune.com/big-ten-will-not-pursue-arizona-state-for-hockey/377175691/

 

"In March, Big Ten hockey Commissioner Brad Traviolia said the conference would give consideration to various opportunities to expand.  The Big Ten declined to comment Tuesday, citing its policy not to discuss specific details about future membership.  The source, however, said the conference is developing guidelines for affiliate membership built around three key factors: history of success, academic standards and geographic location."

So how does UND fit the Big 10's affiliate membership key factors:

1.  History of Success - Check

2.  Academic Standards - Debatable

3.  Geographic Location - Check

 

Not sure how other schools stack up against the Big 10's key factors, But UND makes a strong case.  We can debate academic standards, but no school comes even close in regards to history of success and geographic location.

 

[JohnboyND7]

6 minutes ago, Siouxperfan7 said:

http://www.startribune.com/big-ten-will-not-pursue-arizona-state-for-hockey/377175691/

 

"In March, Big Ten hockey Commissioner Brad Traviolia said the conference would give consideration to various opportunities to expand.  The Big Ten declined to comment Tuesday, citing its policy not to discuss specific details about future membership.  The source, however, said the conference is developing guidelines for affiliate membership built around three key factors: history of success, academic standards and geographic location."

So how does UND fit the Big 10's affiliate membership key factors:

1.  History of Success - Check

2.  Academic Standards - Debatable

3.  Geographic Location - Check

 

Not sure how other schools stack up against the Big 10's key factors, But UND makes a strong case.  We can debate academic standards, but no school comes even close in regards to history of success and geographic location.

 

I don't think you can debate academics.

[UNDBIZ]

26 minutes ago, Siouxperfan7 said:

http://www.startribune.com/big-ten-will-not-pursue-arizona-state-for-hockey/377175691/

 

"In March, Big Ten hockey Commissioner Brad Traviolia said the conference would give consideration to various opportunities to expand.  The Big Ten declined to comment Tuesday, citing its policy not to discuss specific details about future membership.  The source, however, said the conference is developing guidelines for affiliate membership built around three key factors: history of success, academic standards and geographic location."

So how does UND fit the Big 10's affiliate membership key factors:

1.  History of Success - Check

2.  Academic Standards - Debatable

3.  Geographic Location - Check

 

Not sure how other schools stack up against the Big 10's key factors, But UND makes a strong case.  We can debate academic standards, but no school comes even close in regards to history of success and geographic location.

 

Geographic location can be interpreted a lot of different ways.  With that said, University of Denver.  7 National Championships, #86 in USNews rankings, located in a large metropolitan area outside the traditional B1G footprint (potential expansion of B1G network to Denver).

[siouxkid12]

28 minutes ago, Siouxperfan7 said:

http://www.startribune.com/big-ten-will-not-pursue-arizona-state-for-hockey/377175691/

 

"In March, Big Ten hockey Commissioner Brad Traviolia said the conference would give consideration to various opportunities to expand.  The Big Ten declined to comment Tuesday, citing its policy not to discuss specific details about future membership.  The source, however, said the conference is developing guidelines for affiliate membership built around three key factors: history of success, academic standards and geographic location."

So how does UND fit the Big 10's affiliate membership key factors:

1.  History of Success - Check

2.  Academic Standards - Debatable

3.  Geographic Location - Check

 

Not sure how other schools stack up against the Big 10's key factors, But UND makes a strong case.  We can debate academic standards, but no school comes even close in regards to history of success and geographic location.

 

Miami of Ohio has History of Success, they have a bigger endowment then UND and their location is a lot better then UND's. 

[UNDBIZ]

2 minutes ago, siouxkid12 said:

Miami of Ohio has History of Success, they have a bigger endowment then UND and their location is a lot better then UND's. 

How many nattys they got?

[Cratter]

I heard Notre Dame fits the criteria. 

 

 

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

22 minutes ago, Cratter said:

I heard Notre Dame fits the criteria. 

 

 

Everything except the history of success

[The Sicatoka]

32 minutes ago, InHeavenThereIsNoBeer said:

Everything except the history of success

C'mon, they fit right in with OSU and PSU.

[GFG]

1 hour ago, UNDBIZ said:

Geographic location can be interpreted a lot of different ways.  With that said, University of Denver.  7 National Championships, #86 in USNews rankings, located in a large metropolitan area outside the traditional B1G footprint (potential expansion of B1G network to Denver).

Adding as a hockey only member would not expand the footprint. They need to be full members for that to happen. However, if you add a school like UND that's basically part of the footprint already and you know everybody will buy the B1G network to watch you can add a little more revenue there and have higher TV ratings than most of the games. Academics are literally the only thing UND can't compete with, but they can definitely make exceptions. The B1G always pulls a page out of Don Adams book and "makes s**t up" as they go.

1 hour ago, siouxkid12 said:

Miami of Ohio has History of Success, they have a bigger endowment then UND and their location is a lot better then UND's. 

Personally I wouldn't consider their history "success". They had like 4 or 5 good seasons and have an extremely small fan base. I'd personally view it as a failure to add Miami to the conference if the B1G is trying to improve. They need to go big, and IMO UND's history and success more than makes up for their academics. 

If I had to guess I'd say it's going to either be a western team or an eastern team because they have enough going for the conference in the center of the footprint with the addition of Notre Dame. Penn State is happy as is, so it would probably be in their best interest to try and please Minnesota's fan base that they've completely pissed off at this point. I truly think the B1G hockey conference would be absolutely phenomenal with UND as an addition. It allows the rivalry between UND-UM to continue and gives us conference games against Michigan, a re-surging Wisconsin, Notre Dame, etc. Personally I'd love it. 

 

[The Sicatoka]

I put this on USCHO in the Arizona State thread earlier today. It fits here also. 

Quote

If the B1G were to add another affiliate (beyond JHU M/W lax and now NDU hockey) to fill out B1G Hockey to 8 members, my guess it would be someone to appease the western wing of B1G Hockey.

Michigan, MSU, OSU, and PSU got their dream affiliate: Our Lady of South Bend (aka NDU).

Minnesota and Wisconsin need something to fill their barns if even for just one weekend. I know how my biases would answer that. 

I probably should have said "fill their barns if even for just one weekend" and re-engage their fan bases.

Now, let me repeat my other prior statement: I could only support this if UND was guaranteed its home conference games would always be Fri/Sat nights unless UND requested otherwise. 

[GFG]

5 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

I put this on USCHO in the Arizona State thread earlier today. It fits here also. 

I probably should have said "fill their barns if even for just one weekend" and re-engage their fan bases.

Now, let me repeat my other prior statement: I could only support this if UND was guaranteed its home conference games would always be Fri/Sat nights unless UND requested otherwise. 

I completely agree

[Mhockey]

7 hours ago, UNDvince97-01 said:

I don't think you nor I know that for sure...

However, if that were indeed the case, it's a non-starter. 

We would need to have some small revenue percentage - peanuts for them, compared to what they are taking in and what UND would bring in return.

I was wondering where siouxkid came up with that fact. It's all speculation on what the offer would/wouldn't include 

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

Sounds like the B1G doesn't feel a team from within will start B1G hockey in the near future. Also shows some want more than 7 teams in the hockey conference. So, therefore they maybe paving the way for an affiliate membership by developing guidelines as mentioned a few posts back from yesterday's Star Tribune.  That could start/continue discussions within the B1G and eventually a hockey program could be asked to join. This time knowing that they won't find a ND with it's own huge sports network contract, causing the B1G to realize they might have to give up a small part of the pie to get who they want?

[AlphaMikeFoxtrot]

If we somehow get an offer and end up putting out the dumpster fire that is big ten hockey, who do we keep as regulars on the non conference tilt?

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

B1G started the college hockey shuffle 3 years ago, we and others started the NCHC. I'm sure some felt hurt by what happened then.  Some realized they got hurt as time passed. Some team movement is bound to happen in the near future.  We may not even be in the picture. If we are, we hear them out, think through all our concerns. Then walk or make a good deal. It's not that we haven't been in business with 5 of 7 of these hockey programs before.

[Blackheart]

14 hours ago, The Sicatoka said:

I put this on USCHO in the Arizona State thread earlier today. It fits here also. 

I probably should have said "fill their barns if even for just one weekend" and re-engage their fan bases.

Now, let me repeat my other prior statement: I could only support this if UND was guaranteed its home conference games would always be Fri/Sat nights unless UND requested otherwise. 

You see how the B10 treats the Gofers hockey team...what makes you think UND will get a better deal?  We'll be playing Penn St at 11pm on a frickin Tuesday!

[The Sicatoka]

6 hours ago, Blackheart said:

You see how the B10 treats the Gofers hockey team...what makes you think UND will get a better deal?  We'll be playing Penn St at 11pm on a frickin Tuesday!

I could only support this if UND was guaranteed its home conference games would always be Fri/Sat nights unless UND requested otherwise. 

Put another way, UND has it pretty good now; I'd only sign on to that good or better. If the B1G doesn't agree, neither does UND. < shrug > 

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

Despite any variables involved in a potential move to the Big10, I really believe our hockey team would be sold short.  We go from a conference that prepares us extremely well for the NCAAs every year to one where we play OSU, MSU, PSU, & WI(unless they get better) on a regular basis.  I truly believe a big reason for our newly found postseason success is playing UMD, UNO, SCSU, DU, & Miami on a regular basis. The NCHC has sent an average of 4.33 teams to the NCAAs every year. That's over 1/2 the conference! Also, we have sent 5 teams(out of a possible 12 chances) to the Frozen Four(UND 3 times), and have our 1st national championship since 2000.  I don't think it's a coincidence that we have made the FF every year we have been part of our new conference.

So to recap, since the NCHC has been formed we've had 27% of NCAA participants, 42% of Frozen Four teams, and 33% of the national champions. This, despite our conference making up 13% of all college hockey teams. Why change things?

[Goon]

1 minute ago, InHeavenThereIsNoBeer said:

Despite any variables involved in a potential move to the Big10, I really believe our hockey team would be sold short.  We go from a conference that prepares us extremely well for the NCAAs every year to one where we play OSU, MSU, PSU, & WI(unless they get better) on a regular basis.  I truly believe a big reason for our newly found postseason success is playing UMD, UNO, SCSU, DU, & Miami on a regular basis. The NCHC has sent an average of 4.33 teams to the NCAAs every year. That's over 1/2 the conference! Also, we have sent 5 teams(out of a possible 12 chances) to the Frozen Four(UND 3 times), and have our 1st national championship since 2000.  I don't think it's a coincidence that we have made the FF every year we have been part of our new conference.

So to recap, since the NCHC has been formed we've had 27% of NCAA participants, 42% of Frozen Four teams, and 33% of the national champions. This, despite our conference making up 13% of all college hockey teams. Why change things?

The coaches in the league, pretty much say the same thing. If my math is correct, in three seasons, the NCHC has had 5 teams in the Frozen Four. That's pretty impressive. I see no reason to move to another conference. I also see no reason to add any more teams. I like the current status quo.

[UNDvince97-01]

For all the people freaking out about the possibility of considering the B1G:  Nobody is saying dive in headfirst if an invite is extended.

We have a good fallback situation with the NCHC and have good leverage with the B1G if they want us. (I truly believe UND is their hockey fix)

Negotiate a small revenue deal and negotiate when the games are played.

If you don't like the negotiated options, then say no and stay NCHC.  It's simple, really.

We would never leave the NCHC unless it benefited us in the short term and long term.