NCAA To Sanction UND if School Does Not Adopt New Nickname

[darell1976]

I think we are all pro-UND, we just totally disagree on which direction this should go.  

 

the way he quoted it, it sounded like you are either pro UND with no nickname or against UND with a nickname change.

[Hayduke]

the way he quoted it, it sounded like you are either pro UND with no nickname or against UND with a nickname change.

I will give the benefit of the doubt on that for now.  

[fightingsioux4life]

Assuming we wanted to move to a new nickname, and assuming the only reason we wouldn't in the short term wouldn't is because they all suck, one way to handle it would be the following: Throw all 5 remaining options out for a vote. An absolute majority must be established for adoption as the new nickname. The absence of a majority decision would default to continuing without a nickname. 

How about this:

1) Have a vote with all 5 remaining options. If one of the options gets a majority (50+1), then the voting is over.

2) However, if no option gets a majority, then there will be a run-off between the first and second place finishers. That should produce an overall winner.

 

[ericpnelson]

How about this:

1) Have a vote with all 5 remaining options. If one of the options gets a majority (50+1), then the voting is over.

2) However, if no option gets a majority, then there will be a run-off between the first and second place finishers. That should produce an overall winner.

 

I was just trying to declare a consensus winner

[Chewey]

Very much looking forward to this after a 6 hour drive:

Commenting on an earlier post, I never would have thought that I'd agree with Tom Denis on anything pertaining to the nickname issue but he's dead on about the effects of not allowing "North Dakota" as one of the options and trying to squelch free speech.  Do what the committee and the process was, in part, charged to do:  Gauge public sentiment from the various "stakeholders". 

[homer]

Very much looking forward to this after a 6 hour drive:

 

Commenting on an earlier post, I never would have thought that I'd agree with Tom Denis on anything pertaining to the nickname issue but he's dead on about the effects of not allowing "North Dakota" as one of the options and trying to squelch free speech.  Do what the committee and the process was, in part, charged to do:  Gauge public sentiment from the various "stakeholders". 

Unless what the stakeholders want could ultimately harm the university. 

[KSSioux]

I would like to point out something regarding the statement that the NCAA made (taking it as the truth based on two sources, for what that is worth) regarding remaining just "North Dakota" without a nickname meeting the settlement agreement.  While I agree the NCAA is a despicable association and not to be trusted, folks have to understand that the settlement agreement was not from the NCAA, but a legal agreement between the NCAA and UND that BOTH have to abide under as law.  That the NCAA stated that remaining North Dakota meets the settlement agreement means just that, it fulfills the requirement.  If the NCAA did state that it would look at complaints of people wearing Sioux gear or yelling Sioux cheers, that is just sheer idiocy that is not backed up by anything within the agreement.  The NCAA stating that remaining North Dakota meets the requirement, means it does just that.  Anyone stating that they could come back with, "They could have done more, so we are putting them on sanctions" is just totally fear mongering.  If North Dakota meets the requirement, it meets the requirement, Period.  The NCAA would have to come up with another avenue to sanction the university other than the settlement agreement, because that was met according to their own statement.  I personally do not think they would do that because they would have to sanction the fans free speech and not anything the university had done wrong according to the settlement agreement, which they said they had met.  I would remind folks that the NCAA in the agreement had to state that they had found nothing "hostile or abusive" with the way UND had used the name or logo.  They also have the intellectual property protection section, which requires UND to protect the name Fighting Sioux and the logo.  Based on these last two points, I doubt they could now say they are offensive based on others complaints, because they would have their own words to fight in the legal aspect of the settlement agreement that they must also follow.

 

 

 

[Blackheart]

I would like to point out something regarding the statement that the NCAA made (taking it as the truth based on two sources, for what that is worth) regarding remaining just "North Dakota" without a nickname meeting the settlement agreement.  While I agree the NCAA is a despicable association and not to be trusted, folks have to understand that the settlement agreement was not from the NCAA, but a legal agreement between the NCAA and UND that BOTH have to abide under as law.  That the NCAA stated that remaining North Dakota meets the settlement agreement means just that, it fulfills the requirement.  If the NCAA did state that it would look at complaints of people wearing Sioux gear or yelling Sioux cheers, that is just sheer idiocy that is not backed up by anything within the agreement.  The NCAA stating that remaining North Dakota meets the requirement, means it does just that.  Anyone stating that they could come back with, "They could have done more, so we are putting them on sanctions" is just totally fear mongering.  If North Dakota meets the requirement, it meets the requirement, Period.  The NCAA would have to come up with another avenue to sanction the university other than the settlement agreement, because that was met according to their own statement.  I personally do not think they would do that because they would have to sanction the fans free speech and not anything the university had done wrong according to the settlement agreement, which they said they had met.  I would remind folks that the NCAA in the agreement had to state that they had found nothing "hostile or abusive" with the way UND had used the name or logo.  They also have the intellectual property protection section, which requires UND to protect the name Fighting Sioux and the logo.  Based on these last two points, I doubt they could now say they are offensive based on others complaints, because they would have their own words to fight in the legal aspect of the settlement agreement that they must also follow.

 

 

 

Wow!  A well thought-out and intelligent post...must be a first for this thread.

[rochsioux]

How about this:

1) Have a vote with all 5 remaining options. If one of the options gets a majority (50+1), then the voting is over.

2) However, if no option gets a majority, then there will be a run-off between the first and second place finishers. That should produce an overall winner.

 

How about we also add the option to go without a nickname.  

If anyone gets 50%+ then we go with that option.  Otherwise we have a runoff between the top two. 

 

[Siouxphan27]

OK, so we need a native born son done good to use the name of his followers ... roger that ... I see the future ... 

< arena lights drop > 

< bubble machine fires up full bore > 

"Here comes your University of North Dakota ... ORCHESTRA!"

< lights come up full and Lawrence Welk mascot carrying interlocked ND flag comes onto playing surface > 

< team comes out of the tunnel through a maze of bubbles onto the surface > 

< and the fans all cheer >

"An' a one! An' a two!" 

yes-Either natives of the state, or if it's a name representing a group, at least more than two of them having stepped foot in the state.  

The "orchestra"would not be the most fierce name, but it would fit nicely in this current group of five we have.  If honoring Welk i would go with the UND Super Conductors!

and then have Myron Floren lead the we will rock you cheers on his accordion.   :-)

 

[bigskyvikes]

NO, you are pro no-nickname, we are all pro UND.

Yep, all four of you....what a joke!

[petey23]

How about this:

1) Have a vote with all 5 remaining options. If one of the options gets a majority (50+1), then the voting is over.

2) However, if no option gets a majority, then there will be a run-off between the first and second place finishers. That should produce an overall winner.

 

How about we rewind, bring back about 7-8 names that were discarded back to the mix of crap that is left.

Bring in some people and companies that deal with promoting and creating logos and brand marketing.

Have them and the committee again narrow it down to 5 or 6.(include just North Dakota as an option.....I think after the next few steps it would fall out of the running)

Have these marketing companies go back to their offices and have their teams put together some logo ideas and marketing concepts and create image branding campaigns.

Put these best ideas together and then present these logos and concepts to the public.(the idea to pick just a name and then worry about the important stuff has to be one of the most incompetent plans ever put together by someone with more than a 9th grade education.)

I think when people see the marketing plans and logos created that 'North Dakota" would likely fall in popularity. I know many on here like to group all those who are currently in favor of continuing to use "North Dakota" as "Sioux Forever" people. I and many others that favor using North Dakota as a name for now are doing so because it is the best choice of what is left at this point.

This is where a Leader has to say we had a flawed and failed process and make the corrections vs. the awe, &#33;@#&#036; it lets just ram it though.

 

[UND1983]

How about we rewind, bring back about 7-8 names that were discarded back to the mix of crap that is left.

Bring in some people and companies that deal with promoting and creating logos and brand marketing.

Have them and the committee again narrow it down to 5 or 6.(include just North Dakota as an option.....I think after the next few steps it would fall out of the running)

Have these marketing companies go back to their offices and have their teams put together some logo ideas and marketing concepts and create image branding campaigns.

Put these best ideas together and then present these logos and concepts to the public.(the idea to pick just a name and then worry about the important stuff has to be one of the most incompetent plans ever put together by someone with more than a 9th grade education.)

I think when people see the marketing plans and logos created that 'North Dakota" would likely fall in popularity. I know many on here like to group all those who are currently in favor of continuing to use "North Dakota" as "Sioux Forever" people. I and many others that favor using North Dakota as a name for now are doing so because it is the best choice of what is left at this point.

This is where a Leader has to say we had a flawed and failed process and make the corrections vs. the awe, &#33;@#&#036; it lets just ram it though.

 

They are working up marketing campaigns and logos for the remaining 5 right now.  Just because you and others don't like the remaining 5 doesn't mean they need to hit reset.  

[petey23]

They are working up marketing campaigns and logos for the remaining 5 right now.  Just because you and others don't like the remaining 5 doesn't mean they need to hit reset.  

Didn't say they needed to hit reset. Said they should hit reset.

 

If you push through a name that over half the people with a vested interest are against it will be a disaster.

[Siouxperfan7]

Didn't say they needed to hit reset. Said they should hit reset.

 

If you push through a name that over half the people with a vested interest are against it will be a disaster.

I think we are way past the point of this being a disaster!

[darell1976]

How about we rewind, bring back about 7-8 names that were discarded back to the mix of crap that is left.

Bring in some people and companies that deal with promoting and creating logos and brand marketing.

Have them and the committee again narrow it down to 5 or 6.(include just North Dakota as an option.....I think after the next few steps it would fall out of the running)

Have these marketing companies go back to their offices and have their teams put together some logo ideas and marketing concepts and create image branding campaigns.

Put these best ideas together and then present these logos and concepts to the public.(the idea to pick just a name and then worry about the important stuff has to be one of the most incompetent plans ever put together by someone with more than a 9th grade education.)

I think when people see the marketing plans and logos created that 'North Dakota" would likely fall in popularity. I know many on here like to group all those who are currently in favor of continuing to use "North Dakota" as "Sioux Forever" people. I and many others that favor using North Dakota as a name for now are doing so because it is the best choice of what is left at this point.

This is where a Leader has to say we had a flawed and failed process and make the corrections vs. the awe, &#33;@#&#036; it lets just ram it though.

 

I am surprised when my Jets name was booted so early, and the other aviation type names too. UND is a well known flight school and the name should reflect on that. 

[WiSioux]

Pretty sure we are only voting once and whatever has the most votes wins. Besides, then the President picks anyway. I highly doubt there will be a majority.

[bigskyvikes]

First off the "we are ND" was an FSN thing. We are no longer on there so that's why it seems like the ad is gone. "We are FSN, we are NORTH DAKOTA "

If the four of you weren't so afraid of no nickname being on the ballot, this over and over BS wouldn't be happening on here. 

We all know the outcome if it is on the ballot, and that's why the four of you brand everyone a person that can't let go, and by the way you are WRONG! Also you are obviously scared to death, it shows in every post you write over and over and over and over! 

News flash, if you keep saying it is wrong, will not make it wrong! It will not change the higher ups decision either! Let's just see what they decide to do, shall we?

[UND1983]

First off the "we are ND" was an FSN thing. We are no longer on there so that's why it seems like the ad is gone. "We are FSN, we are NORTH DAKOTA "

If the four of you weren't so afraid of no nickname being on the ballot, this over and over BS wouldn't be happening on here. 

We all know the outcome if it is on the ballot, and that's why the four of you brand everyone a person that can't let go, and by the way you are WRONG! Also you are obviously scared to death, it shows in every post you write over and over and over and over! 

News flash, if you keep saying it is wrong, will not make it wrong! It will not change the higher ups decision either! Let's just see what they decide to do, shall we?

Wow.  

The reason I don't want it even being left to vote is because nobody will ever let go of the Sioux nickname if a new one isn't chosen.  Then, we will continually hear stupid stuff about it forever.  And the NA office on campus will never shutup either.  Sick of hearing them tell everyone how hostile the campus is even after it getting voted the #1 campus in country for NA's.

I firmly believe that the issue and bickering/media grandstanding will never go away if a new name isn't chosen.  That is my opinion.

[jdub27]

We all know the outcome if it is on the ballot, and that's why the four of you brand everyone a person that can't let go, and by the way you are WRONG! Also you are obviously scared to death, it shows in every post you write over and over and over and over! 

Yet it managed to have the lowest score twice among remaining nicknames and was eventually cut by the committee selected to represent stakeholders.  But keep telling yourself its only 4 people that see it for what it is.  If the "no nickname" crowd could get over their obsession with an inanimate object, we wouldn't be having this discussion.  No one is saying to forget about it and pretend it never existed, just take it off the pedestal and look at the big picture.

[Siouxperfan7]

Can Kelly or someone at UND please just relase a letter to all UND stakeholders and the Herald and just tell everyone their resoning for wanting to choose a new nickname and not just go as North Dakota?  This should have been done days after it was initially cut.  But I feel it would be beneficial to do it before the public vote hapens.  There is information that Kelley and others have, conversations with NCA officials, conversations with Big Sky officials, other AD's, that the general pulic is not privy to.  There is a lot of information labeled as "scare tactics" that proboably does carry some weight and is legit.  This administration needs to get control of this situation.  This process has been overly transparent, except on this issue.  It needs to be addresed but Kelley.

[SiouxForever]

Yet it managed to have the lowest score twice among remaining nicknames and was eventually cut by the committee selected to represent stakeholders.  But keep telling yourself its only 4 people that see it for what it is.  If the "no nickname" crowd could get over their obsession with an inanimate object, we wouldn't be having this discussion.  No one is saying to forget about it and pretend it never existed, just take it off the pedestal and look at the big picture.

Funny how you keep coming back to the "big picture" and referencing that. The big picture is the hostility and abusiveness of not honoring a "sacred" 1969 pipe ceremony. To me, that is the most disrespected angle that no one talks about. PC libtards continuing to ruin and remove history. Shocking... 

Edited August 21, 2015 by SiouxForever

[homer]

Funny how you keep coming back to the "big picture" and referencing that. The big picture is the hostility and abusiveness of not honoring a "sacred" 1969 pipe ceremony. To me, that is the most disrespected angle that no one talks about. PC libtards continuing to ruin and remove history. Shocking... 

Could the tribal leaders have said that the pipe ceremony was "sacred" and therefore given their written approval without hesitation?

 

[jdub27]

Funny how you keep coming back to the "big picture" and referencing that. The big picture is the hostility and abusiveness of not honoring a "sacred" 1969 pipe ceremony. To me, that is the most disrespected angle that no one talks about. PC libtards continuing to ruin and remove history. Shocking... 

I'm focused on what's best for the University of North Dakota going forward, developing that stance from talks with people with UND and the athletic department.  Others continue to be focused on a nickname that is not coming back officially or unofficially, end of story regardless of how much I disagree with it and think that it sucks.  At this point, even though ridiculous and unfair, the reasons are irrelevant.  And to homer's point, Standing Rock Tribal Council had the chance to reaffirm it and chose not to.  That isn't UND's fault.

[82SiouxGuy]

Funny how you keep coming back to the "big picture" and referencing that. The big picture is the hostility and abusiveness of not honoring a "sacred" 1969 pipe ceremony. To me, that is the most disrespected angle that no one talks about. PC libtards continuing to ruin and remove history. Shocking... 

A ceremony that the Standing Rock Tribal Council has ignored since about 1992. I believe that was the first year they came out against UND using the Sioux nickname. That group included someone that was part of the ceremony. I would guess that the Standing Rock Tribal Council knows much more about that pipe ceremony than you do. It must not have been as "sacred" as you and others believe. Do those Standing Rock Tribal Council members fit in your PC group?

And how about the tribal members from both Spirit Lake and Standing Rock that voted to get rid of the nickname in 2012. It passed in all counties, including the counties where the reservations are located. And it passed in the precincts on the reservation. I guess those tribal members must also be PC and abusing a "sacred" ceremony.