2024 UND Football

[nodak651]

11 minutes ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

And why are they a step higher? That is the major question/concern. Because they ultimately are both FCS programs just like UND is. The reason why Montana and NDSU are perceived to be a step higher needs to be addressed if we want UND football to someday be a national champion, or do we not desire that? 

Thank you.  That was the point I was trying to make.  UND being viewed as a second class athletic department doesn't bode well for the future...  Gonna get left behind.

[SIOUXFAN97]

31 minutes ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

This isn’t entirely factual. UND’s counter offer was supposedly higher than SDSU’s offer. Rumor is Freund left anyway; hence, the signifiant concern that staff is leaving because the inevitable is near. Bubba has lost the program and there’s no championship future with him as head coach. 

if this counter offer of more is true its like telling your insurance agent your taking your business to kelly howe and they say well what if i can save you 1000k bucks......then you say why did it take me threatening to take my buiness elsewhere after 20 years for you to NOW save me 1k bucks.....sayanara mfer

[petey23]

4 hours ago, SooToo said:

How many coaches have left? Still looking for an answer.

Interesting that numerous posters here advocating to hire young up-and-coming coaches who move on after a few years for greener pastures.

Pawlak -- by all accounts a young talent -- moves on from und after 5 years and the sky is falling.

They aren't moving on or up to greener pastures......just moving to a different part of the pasture.

[gundy1124]

2 hours ago, Goon said:

Joe is gone. Kelly is in the know. 

 

I pretty much announced this a week ago.........(on the 24th)

[NDRA]

16 minutes ago, petey23 said:

They aren't moving on or up to greener pastures......just moving to a different part of the pasture.

So it's rotational grazing?

[The Sicatoka]

1. KEM is neither "baba yaga" nor running the department. 

2. As Kelly Howe has pointed out, a lame duck coach (2024 and 2025 left on deal and likely no extension) does not scream 'stability'. A number of different people could make moves to resolve this but none have. Is it due to myopia (they don't see the lack of stability and issues it brings) or  just stubborness. 

[UND-FB-FAN]

7 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

1. KEM is neither "baba yaga" nor running the department. 

2. As Kelly Howe has pointed out, a lame duck coach (2024 and 2025 left on deal and likely no extension) does not scream 'stability'. A number of different people could make moves to resolve this but none have. Is it due to myopia (they don't see the lack of stability and issues it brings) or  just stubborness. 

Agreed. Poor management strategy at this point, and it’s likely a combination of nearsightedness and stubbornness. 

[SooToo]

1 hour ago, petey23 said:

They aren't moving on or up to greener pastures......just moving to a different part of the pasture.

...but with thicker gra$$, no?

[Sioux94]

So if you had the choice.......would you choose to have Bubba resign now, or at the end of the 2024 season. If he resigned in the next few weeks let's say, man it would really feel like and be perceived as a true dumpster fire across the landscape. So is it better to try and do what we can with this season, or have him resign now and clean house and start this now. 

Not saying he is going to resign or anything, just curious as to people's thoughts if we would be better salvaging half a decent season, or just doing this restart now......it you could choose. 

[UND08]

42 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

1. KEM is neither "baba yaga" nor running the department. 

2. As Kelly Howe has pointed out, a lame duck coach (2024 and 2025 left on deal and likely no extension) does not scream 'stability'. A number of different people could make moves to resolve this but none have. Is it due to myopia (they don't see the lack of stability and issues it brings) or  just stubborness. 

If there is one thing I've learned in all of this...if you don't have the stones to extend a coach when they have two years or less left on their contract...then you better just buy them out and move on!

I'd have been ticked had we extended Bubba last fall...but now I'm arguably more pissed...and it's with Chaves not Bubba on this.  I'd argue the only two coaches we had that anyone else wants are now gone (could argue RB coach also but from past experience we don't pay RB coaches squat so they likely will always come and go)...we'll likely see players on their side of the ball (our strength) hit the portal when it opens...and we'll likely limp to something like 4-8 with a house cleaning a year later.  Saved $265k or so in buyout costs...but what's it cost the University to have 5-6k at football games when the team isn't successful?  Also what's the lost momentum cost us in future years?

Maybe I'm overly pessimistic...but all the hits have come on the strong side of the ball for us.  Defense is our liability and I haven't seen much to make me think we've addressed it.

Also...$71k max to be an FCS OL coach?!?  I'll never blame a guy for moving on to make more in this day and age.  This might not be a popular thing to say...but it's not hard for a college educated capable young person to make $71k in this day and age.  And they'd have to put in a whole lot less hours than a college OL coach at the D1 level.

[LDL]

has anyone heard if this coaching cr@p show going to affect NLI signings in a week or so?

[SooToo]

28 minutes ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

Agreed. Poor management strategy at this point, and it’s likely a combination of nearsightedness and stubbornness. 

Never checked any numbers, but how often are coaches extended at UND with more than 2 years remaining on their existing contract? If Bubba's likely to retire after this coming season -- nothing but speculation at this point -- should his contract have been extended last year to avoid a "lame duck" situation? I shudder to think of the SS reaction.

[Class_of_98]

Get him out now. It’s already a dumpster fire.

[SooToo]

4 minutes ago, LDL said:

has anyone heard if this coaching cr@p show going to affect NLI signings in a week or so?

Here's hoping potential signees aren't getting their "facts" from SS.

[Longtime fan]

2 hours ago, fightingsioux4life said:

I don't see us going back to Mussman levels of incompetence. But I also don't think we are going to get to the next level with Bubba.

So I did a little research on both mussman and bubba.  Mussman was 31-34 at und. Bubba is 61-50 at und.   Mussmans best year was 8-3 while be named coach of the year bubbas best is 9-3 while being named coach of the year.  All the rest of the seasons were average to bad for both.  I would say bubbas best team was the 2015 seasons. The roster was filled with mussmans recuits.  
 

If you look at what both had to start with ….Bubba had much more.  Again.  Mussman took over day 1 for the D1 era.  He worked namely with D2 guys.  He had to recruit hard to get  some talent here.  And as we know it takes football recruits  usually more than a couple months to get D1 ready.  Bubba has much better facilities.  Bubba had the big sky and mvfc to sell recruits to.  Much more stable and prestige.   FCS was also much stronger back then. So many schools have moved up that we’re competing for top dog. Now there’s a handful of decent teams.  
 

To be clear …I’m not advocating that mussman was better than bubba.  I’m advocating both were/are horrible head coaches.  Bubbas firsr 4 years were a plus but now it’s like und is right back to 2012 but more frustrating because they have resources and knowledge that they didn’t have at the beginning of the D1 era.  Bubbas sell to und is light years ahead of what mussman had to work with.  
 

Beyond frustrating 

[nodak651]

7 minutes ago, SooToo said:

Never checked any numbers, but how often are coaches extended at UND with more than 2 years remaining on their existing contract? If Bubba's likely to retire after this coming season -- nothing but speculation at this point -- should his contract have been extended last year to avoid a "lame duck" situation? I shudder to think of the SS reaction.

I thought that's what the last extension was.  Could also see that being the reason Freund left.  100% guessing.

[Oxbow6]

5 minutes ago, SooToo said:

Here's hoping potential signees aren't getting their "facts" from SS.

10 years

61-50

1 playoff win

[NDRA]

5 minutes ago, Oxbow6 said:

10 years

61-50

1 playoff win

The Monopoly is over!!    Sorry couldn't help it.  Little humor in tough times.

[UND-FB-FAN]

6 minutes ago, Oxbow6 said:

10 years

61-50

1 playoff win

Ouch.

[fightingsioux4life]

8 minutes ago, Oxbow6 said:

10 years

61-50

1 playoff win

But the student-athletes are learning so many valuable life lessons.  #justlikehighschool

[LH Golfer]

26 minutes ago, Sioux94 said:

So if you had the choice.......would you choose to have Bubba resign now, or at the end of the 2024 season. If he resigned in the next few weeks let's say, man it would really feel like and be perceived as a true dumpster fire across the landscape. So is it better to try and do what we can with this season, or have him resign now and clean house and start this now. 

Not saying he is going to resign or anything, just curious as to people's thoughts if we would be better salvaging half a decent season, or just doing this restart now......it you could choose. 

Should announce now his retirement after the 2024 season.

[SiouxHawkGuy]

Fruend as HC and Pawlak as OC. Yeah that would have been nice.

[UND-FB-FAN]

3 minutes ago, SiouxHawkGuy said:

Fruend as HC and Pawlak as OC. Yeah that would have been nice.

Much better than current situation. Bubba has imploded this program. He couldn’t see the writing on the wall. Stubborn, incompetent man towards the end … but he gets another year worth of payout. Always comes down to $. Would UND AD like more $ from football games, including playoffs? If so, get a better coach. 

[jdub27]

17 minutes ago, Longtime fan said:

To be clear …I’m not advocating that mussman was better than bubba.  I’m advocating both were/are horrible head coaches.  Bubbas firsr 4 years were a plus but now it’s like und is right back to 2012 but more frustrating because they have resources and knowledge that they didn’t have at the beginning of the D1 era.  Bubbas sell to und is light years ahead of what mussman had to work with.  

Year-End Massey Ratings
2008       28
2009       40
2010       48
2011       36
2012       35
2013       68
2014       64
2015       32
2016       21
2017       43
2018       27
2019       21
2020       6*
2021       14
2022       14
2023       15

The continuous repeating that things are a disaster isn't reflected by any hard data. And Mussman vs. Bubba is a hilarious comparison despite the different challenges both had to work with.
It's clear the next step is to continuously win playoff games and get the rankings into the single digits but the program as a whole has continued to take steps forward. Easy to be jaded when the two closest schools to you happen to be in your conference and also easily two of the top programs in the country over the last 15 years.
No one is arguing this isn't an important year for a whole bunch of reasons. But some of the suggestions are so far from being based in reality, starting to think half this board is made up of ndsu accounts just having fun at UND's expense.

[Longtime fan]

14 minutes ago, LH Golfer said:

Should announce now his retirement after the 2024 season.

Should have never been hired

Bubble 22-21 pre und in D2

Kalen 67-3 three champions one runner up in NAIA - young guy with “spark” and connection to the generation

 

Easy call right ?