ND High School Hockey 2018-19

[UND92,96]

1 hour ago, scpa0305 said:

How many South end kids play for Central?

I was told all but three or four kids reside in the RR district. 

For those outside of Grand Forks who don't know the policy, basically anybody in town can petition to go to Central, and with very few exceptions it will be approved. But you have to reside in the RR district to go to RR, with a few exceptions for cases where a family moves into the Central district and an older sibling is already at RR.

It tends to be a mixed blessing for Central. Obviously it works great for boys hockey, and some of the sports hockey players tend to play, such as tennis, golf and soccer. But what doesn't get talked about as much is the fact that the traditional Central parts of town simply don't produce many athletes anymore, which in my opinion is a direct result of the privatization of youth sports pricing out a lot of families. If the policy were to all of a sudden change and kids from the RR district weren't allowed to go to Central anymore, or even if an unpopular coach were to take over at Central, they would go from being the biggest hockey power in the state, to struggling to even field a team.

Girls sports at Central tend to really struggle relative to RR, because very few girls from the RR district are choosing to go to Central, in some cases even if their older hockey-playing brother is already at Central. There pretty much couldn't be a bigger disparity between girls basketball at Central and RR right now, and Central hasn't beaten RR in volleyball since about 1997. 

In my opinion, things would be more or less equal between Central and RR across the board if Grand Forks would alter the boundaries so that South Middle School stays entirely in the RR district, Schroeder becomes entirely within the Central district, and Valley is split, with the westerly half of the Valley district going to RR. Since most of the athletes in town at present are coming from South and the southerly portion Schroeder, i.e. the RR portion of the Schroeder district,  RR is at a major advantage in most respects, other than boys hockey and the two or three fall and spring sports those kids tend to play.

[fightingsioux4life]

Maybe it is time for KnightRiders boys hockey?

[UND92,96]

4 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said:

Maybe it is time for KnightRiders boys hockey?

In girls hockey, there is currently one girl from Central on the team, and another 8th-grader who I believe will be going there next year. That's it. And as mentioned, there are only three or four boys on Central's team who actually reside in the GFC district. The so-called open enrollment policy is probably about the only thing preventing a forced combination of the two boys programs, assuming no significant boundary changes.

Despite many studies over the past decade or so on the issue, I guess there just isn't the political will to make any significant boundary changes in Grand Forks. They'll change it just enough to keep enrollments from getting too far apart, but the basic concept is the same now as it was in 1967--the north half of Grand Forks goes to Central, and the south half goes to RR. Between the flood, downsizing of the base and probably 90% of new home construction since the 1980's being in the south half of town, that stopped being fair a long, long time ago.

[scpa0305]

20 minutes ago, UND92,96 said:

I was told all but three or four kids reside in the RR district. 

For those outside of Grand Forks who don't know the policy, basically anybody in town can petition to go to Central, and with very few exceptions it will be approved. But you have to reside in the RR district to go to RR, with a few exceptions for cases where a family moves into the Central district and an older sibling is already at RR.

It tends to be a mixed blessing for Central. Obviously it works great for boys hockey, and some of the sports hockey players tend to play, such as tennis, golf and soccer. But what doesn't get talked about as much is the fact that the traditional Central parts of town simply don't produce many athletes anymore, which in my opinion is a direct result of the privatization of youth sports pricing out a lot of families. If the policy were to all of a sudden change and kids from the RR district weren't allowed to go to Central anymore, or even if an unpopular coach were to take over at Central, they would go from being the biggest hockey power in the state, to struggling to even field a team.

Girls sports at Central tend to really struggle relative to RR, because very few girls from the RR district are choosing to go to Central, in some cases even if their older hockey-playing brother is already at Central. There pretty much couldn't be a bigger disparity between girls basketball at Central and RR right now, and Central hasn't beaten RR in volleyball since about 1997. 

In my opinion, things would be more or less equal between Central and RR across the board if Grand Forks would alter the boundaries so that South Middle School stays entirely in the RR district, Schroeder becomes entirely within the Central district, and Valley is split, with the westerly half of the Valley district going to RR. Since most of the athletes in town at present are coming from South and the southerly portion Schroeder, i.e. the RR portion of the Schroeder district,  RR is at a major advantage in most respects, other than boys hockey and the two or three fall and spring sports those kids tend to play.

I know, it's funny listening to folks talk about Central this and Central that.  They're mostly all South end kids.  I really don't care where they go to school and I would rather have my kids play for Parinica over Chase any day.  But....they technically are south end kids.  Let's not forget.

[MoSiouxFan]

1 hour ago, Yote 53 said:

I attribute the rise in level of play to the internet.  Player development is dependent on having good coaching from the youngest ages on up.  Years ago, the traditional hockey playing states, the 3 M's, had the coaching because dad and grandpa knew the game and knew what to teach their kids.  In non-traditional hockey markets there were dad coaches who didn't know how to skate and had no clue how to run a practice.  I grew up in Iowa and was fortunate that we had a semi-pro USHL team and the kids I grew up playing with were the kids of those players who were originally from Toronto.  They knew hockey and knew how to teach us to play.  Other areas didn't have that.  Today you can go online and pull up a thousand different lesson plans or videos.  There is so much information available.  That sharing of information has elevated the level of play in no-traditional markets.

That no doubt plays a part, but I think a bigger factor is that you have more and more well-trained college players/pro players graduating/retiring every year and continually increasing the ranks of former players that want to coach at the high school level or lower; ie, there is an increasing pool of qualified coaches that are supplanting the "mom and pop" coaches, so to speak.  JMO.

[TheFlop]

1 hour ago, UND92,96 said:

But what doesn't get talked about as much is the fact that the traditional Central parts of town simply don't produce many athletes anymore, which in my opinion is a direct result of the privatization of youth sports pricing out a lot of families. If the policy were to all of a sudden change and kids from the RR district weren't allowed to go to Central anymore, or even if an unpopular coach were to take over at Central, they would go from being the biggest hockey power in the state, to struggling to even field a team.

You nailed it especially the part about privatization pricing people out of sports.  Traditionally when the school boundaries were more equal (socio-economically) Central and RR would battle back and forth in most sports.  Personally I think that is healthy for a town.  The alternative is you can have a situation like in Fargo where Fargo North is basically dead.  

It's not like South end kids are genetically superior to everyone that lives north of Demers......well actually these days could almost say north of 17th Ave S.  However, they do tend to have the parents that prioritize sports AND have the means to provide them with the best opportunities to improve their skills (camps, elite teams, etc).  It's not the parents or kids fault that they have the resources to do this, it's just the way the town is growing. 

I think you are also spot on with your idea that Grand Forks needs to switch to more of an East/West mentality rather than the traditional North/South mentality unless people want to see Central wither away.

[UND1983]

18 minutes ago, TheFlop said:

You nailed it especially the part about privatization pricing people out of sports.  Traditionally when the school boundaries were more equal (socio-economically) Central and RR would battle back and forth in most sports.  Personally I think that is healthy for a town.  The alternative is you can have a situation like in Fargo where Fargo North is basically dead.  

It's not like South end kids are genetically superior to everyone that lives north of Demers......well actually these days could almost say north of 17th Ave S.  However, they do tend to have the parents that prioritize sports AND have the means to provide them with the best opportunities to improve their skills (camps, elite teams, etc).  It's not the parents or kids fault that they have the resources to do this, it's just the way the town is growing. 

I think you are also spot on with your idea that Grand Forks needs to switch to more of an East/West mentality rather than the traditional North/South mentality unless people want to see Central wither away.

Alot of truth there. For instance, kids growing up around Phoenix Elementary and such don't get presented with the same opportunities for sports based on their families priorities, history, financials, etc.  its too bad really cause these kids don't get to see how good they could be at something or another.

[fightingsioux4life]

1 hour ago, scpa0305 said:

I know, it's funny listening to folks talk about Central this and Central that.  They're mostly all South end kids.  I really don't care where they go to school and I would rather have my kids play for Parinica over Chase any day.  But....they technically are south end kids.  Let's not forget.

It is time to redraw the boundaries. It is beyond ridiculous right now. Or just have a combined KnightRiders team representing the entire city.

[tnt]

2 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said:

It is time to redraw the boundaries. It is beyond ridiculous right now. Or just have a combined KnightRiders team representing the entire city.

The question is, how do you do it to be fair, and not have people traveling crazy distances to school when you don't really care about the sporting end of it.  I'm sure the majority of students don't want to drive forever when they are closer to one school.  Also, do you allow for legacy exceptions or would it be cut and dried?  Tough questions to answer, but it probably is time to start tackling them.  

[The Sicatoka]

Same thing is happening in Fargo.

South's strong suits will go (have gone?) from football and hockey to BB and soccer with changing demographics. Davies (newest area, higher socioeconomic realm) will take over in football and hockey. 

Expect the same in West Fargo as in Grand Forks with the Packers being Central and WF Sheyenne being Red River, Or South is WF and Davies is Sheyenne. 

Bismarck (BHS, CHS, LHS) just doesn't seem to follow this pattern ... yet. 

[The Sicatoka]

GF HS boundaries: http://www.grandforksgov.com/home/showdocument?id=58 

Fargo HS boundaries: https://www.fargo.k12.nd.us/site/handlers/filedownload.ashx?moduleinstanceid=95&dataid=4670&FileName=Secondary Boundaries.pdf 
(I find the cutout in Fargo so Bluemont Lakes can go to Davies but "Little Bosnia" goes to South most interesting.) 

West Fargo HS boundaries: https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1WlGKfnZJn3DVbfvvyAwmOEPPTaA&ll=46.87647463073019%2C-96.93606550000004&z=11 

Bismarck HS boundaries: https://stafftracker.bismarckschools.org/uploads/resources/31303/attendance_ms_hs_36x36_new.pdf 

[andtheHomeoftheSIOUX!!]

2 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

Same thing is happening in Fargo.

South's strong suits will go (have gone?) from football and hockey to BB and soccer with changing demographics. Davies (newest area, higher socioeconomic realm) will take over in football and hockey. 

Expect the same in West Fargo as in Grand Forks with the Packers being Central and WF Sheyenne being Red River, Or South is WF and Davies is Sheyenne. 

Bismarck (BHS, CHS, LHS) just doesn't seem to follow this pattern ... yet. 

Bismarck has had more even growth.  While the north end growth has been strongest, it is spread out east to west (northeast to northwest) pretty well.  And due to the valuable river property, there are lots of well-to-do people living and north and south of town along the river.  It also helps from a school perspective that the high schools have ended up in more of a squished triangle shape as opposed to a line (Fargo).  

[UND1983]

25 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

GF HS boundaries: http://www.grandforksgov.com/home/showdocument?id=58 

Fargo HS boundaries: https://www.fargo.k12.nd.us/site/handlers/filedownload.ashx?moduleinstanceid=95&dataid=4670&FileName=Secondary Boundaries.pdf 
(I find the cutout in Fargo so Bluemont Lakes can go to Davies but "Little Bosnia" goes to South most interesting.) 

West Fargo HS boundaries: https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1WlGKfnZJn3DVbfvvyAwmOEPPTaA&ll=46.87647463073019%2C-96.93606550000004&z=11 

Bismarck HS boundaries: https://stafftracker.bismarckschools.org/uploads/resources/31303/attendance_ms_hs_36x36_new.pdf 

WF is getting a third HS very soon.  That will change alot of things....again.

[sioux rube]

[The Sicatoka]

1 minute ago, UND1983 said:

WF is getting a third HS very soon.  That will change alot of things....again.

It'll be a mile north of Horace at County 17 and 76th Avenue, so, yes, they'll have to redraw the Sheyenne lines at minimum. 

[fightingsioux4life]

1 hour ago, tnt said:

The question is, how do you do it to be fair, and not have people traveling crazy distances to school when you don't really care about the sporting end of it.  I'm sure the majority of students don't want to drive forever when they are closer to one school.  Also, do you allow for legacy exceptions or would it be cut and dried?  Tough questions to answer, but it probably is time to start tackling them.  

I never said it will be easy or painless. But you cannot simply ignore problems that are difficult to solve. And you cannot be afraid to tick people off; that is inevitable when you make decisions like this.

[UND1983]

1 hour ago, The Sicatoka said:

GF HS boundaries: http://www.grandforksgov.com/home/showdocument?id=58 

Fargo HS boundaries: https://www.fargo.k12.nd.us/site/handlers/filedownload.ashx?moduleinstanceid=95&dataid=4670&FileName=Secondary Boundaries.pdf 
(I find the cutout in Fargo so Bluemont Lakes can go to Davies but "Little Bosnia" goes to South most interesting.) 

West Fargo HS boundaries: https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1WlGKfnZJn3DVbfvvyAwmOEPPTaA&ll=46.87647463073019%2C-96.93606550000004&z=11 

Bismarck HS boundaries: https://stafftracker.bismarckschools.org/uploads/resources/31303/attendance_ms_hs_36x36_new.pdf 

That cutout is south of Bluemont. It's alot of minorities that are actually being sent to Davies to even the ELL numbers out.  But I don't see that being a Davies area much longer.

[hky]

I think it's in everyone's best interest to have two equally strong high schools - academics, sports, arts, etc.   Would like to see the boundary be South Washington.  East of Washington and north of Demers goes to Central.  West of Washington and south of Demers goes to RR.  Already, there are students within walking distance of RR who are really in Central's attendance area because of having to move the boundary more and more to the South.  And east of Washington, the boundary already is 24th Ave. S.

1 hour ago, The Sicatoka said:

GF HS boundaries: http://www.grandforksgov.com/home/showdocument?id=58 

Fargo HS boundaries: https://www.fargo.k12.nd.us/site/handlers/filedownload.ashx?moduleinstanceid=95&dataid=4670&FileName=Secondary Boundaries.pdf 
(I find the cutout in Fargo so Bluemont Lakes can go to Davies but "Little Bosnia" goes to South most interesting.) 

West Fargo HS boundaries: https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1WlGKfnZJn3DVbfvvyAwmOEPPTaA&ll=46.87647463073019%2C-96.93606550000004&z=11 

Bismarck HS boundaries: https://stafftracker.bismarckschools.org/uploads/resources/31303/attendance_ms_hs_36x36_new.pdf 

This is the correct high school boundary map at this time: 

HighSchool_2018.pdf

[SiouxFan100]

I loved my four years at UND and Grand Forks. I wish I would have gone to a few high school games - particularly RR vs Central in hockey. I hear those games were fun.

[SiouxFan100]

Did RR open in the late 70’s

[sioux rube]

And the Bismarck all star girls team is once again in the finals beating Davies 4-2. They will take on South/North for the title 

[SiouxFan100]

Are all the games at scheels area as?

[bang]

1 hour ago, SiouxFan100 said:

Did RR open in the late 70’s

Late 60’s

[sioux rube]

36 minutes ago, SiouxFan100 said:

Are all the games at scheels area as?

Yes 

[SiouxFan100]

2 minutes ago, sioux rube said:

Yes 

Thanks 

dont imagine beer is being sold