Eight Bison football players charged

[ericpnelson]

if people really need to compare the two schools on this, look no further back than the past few years. Ryan Chappell was the best offense player UND had at the time (or most talented), and he was especially needed when he got dismissed (suspended by NCAA rules, but not allowed back). Bobby Stroup, much more serious, was dealt with appropriately. When the freshman linebacker beat up a kid in the dorms in 08 (I believe), he was sent out of town. Ismael Bamba was not allowed to stay on the team with his personal shortcomings. Josh Murray was also dismissed by Mussman.

I have been critical of Mussman in the past, but in terms of dealing with trouble, Mussman has acted with the utmost appropriate actions. The names listed here are also evidence to not having favor towards star players. I'm not saying Craig Bohl is doing this, but it seems that NDSU people on here are saying UND would show that bias, so I'm just answering questions.

[Siouxperfan7]

I agree with your first part, but different cultures? Please. As I said in a previous post, Coach Bohl has also suspended players for missing class. Each situation is different and requires looking at separately.

So Coach Bohl thinks missing class is much more serious offence than a Class A Misdemeanor? His actions in both situations prove this. Wow!! GAURANTEE if this happened a UND, these players would not be playing this Saturday. Only reason why these guys are not suspended is they are playing a tough opponent and these guys are starters. If they were 3rd string guys, they would be sitting out. That is what the difference between the two programs are. Integrity v. win at all costs.

[Bison06]

Maybe. But if there was more to Jemison's issues than what was disclosed, how is it even possible to be sure?

And earlier, I shouldn't have lumped you in those who don't think it was a big deal, your post I was responding to just happened to trigger my response. Those who are saying they were being lazy/just college kids/etc are seriously downplaying how this can/will affect these guys in their future. Being lazy is not an excuse for committing fraud or forgery. Whether they knew it or not, it was their responsibility.

I agree with you, lazyness is not an excuse for committing a crime. But, in my eyes, and I have been known to buck the system from time to time, when you commit a crime that is non-violent intent plays a much larger role in the determination of the penalty. I very much doubt these kids sat in their rooms one night and hatched a scheme to commit fraud. This was stupidity plain and simple and I would actually be ok if this situation was punished "within the team". Ultimately a penalty will be handed down in the form of game suspensions, but from the information I have seen they did not intend to commit fraud and even though they signed the sheet, I doubt they were fully aware of the gravity of the position they had signed up for.

[Bison06]

if people really need to compare the two schools on this, look no further back than the past few years. Ryan Chappell was the best offense player UND had at the time (or most talented), and he was especially needed when he got dismissed (suspended by NCAA rules, but not allowed back). Bobby Stroup, much more serious, was dealt with appropriately. When the freshman linebacker beat up a kid in the dorms in 08 (I believe), he was sent out of town. Ismael Bamba was not allowed to stay on the team with his personal shortcomings. Josh Murray was also dismissed by Mussman.

I have been critical of Mussman in the past, but in terms of dealing with trouble, Mussman has acted with the utmost appropriate actions. The names listed here are also evidence to not having favor towards star players. I'm not saying Craig Bohl is doing this, but it seems that NDSU people on here are saying UND would show that bias, so I'm just answering questions.

Coach Bohl has a very similar history of handing out punishments. Chappell's situation was taken out of the hands of UND, that was an eligibility issue.

[watchmaker49]

The AG thinks eight current NDSU FB players are guilty based on an investigation by the ND Bureau of Criminal Investigation. Admittedly, the AG doesn't convict them, only a judge does that, but the AG generally doesn't spend his time filing cases he can't win.

One suit against the NCAA comes to mind. ScottM please look up how many cases the ND AG has filed and how many he has lost.

[andtheHomeoftheSIOUX!!]

Coach Bohl has a very similar history of handing out punishments. Chappell's situation was taken out of the hands of UND, that was an eligibility issue.

Bohl's history now includes these 8 guys.

[Bison06]

So Coach Bohl thinks missing class is much more serious offence than a Class A Misdemeanor? His actions in both situations prove this. Wow!! GAURANTEE if this happened a UND, these players would not be playing this Saturday. Only reason why thises guys are not suspended is they are playing a tough opponent and these guys are starters. If they were 3rd string guys, they would be sitting out. That is what the difference between the two programs are. Integrity v. win at all costs.

It doesn't say he thinks it is more serious. It shows that he is in a position to gather information and make an intelligent decision on whether or not a player's circumstances warrant a suspension. CSU isn't even the toughest game on our schedule and it may end up that putting this off will come back to bite the team in the ass. What if their punishment comes down during a conference game? Will you still be spouting off about lack of integrity? How about you let the situation play out before shouting from your high horse?

I am so glad that you personally GUARANTEE UND would handle this differently. Now we know exactly how UND would respond.

[Bison06]

Bohl's history now includes these 8 guys.

That's interesting logic. So if I have no history of speeding and I get one ticket, when coming up with my punishment does the officer say "well up until today you didn't have a ticket, but you got one today and technically that is now part of your history, so we are forced to count this as two, you now have a history of reckless driving and we will be suspending your license"?

Moving forward this will be included in Bohl's history, it has no bearing whatsoever when deciding in this case if Bohl has shown a pattern of inconsistent punishments.

[The Sicatoka]

How are situations like this supposed to be handled under the code of student conduct handbook at NDSU (or even UND for that matter)?

NDSU's: http://www.ndsu.edu/fileadmin/studentlife/PDF_Files/CodeofStudentBehavior.pdf

UND's: http://und.edu/student-affairs/code-of-student-life/_files/docs/code-of-student-life.pdf

[homer]

It doesn't say he thinks it is more serious. It shows that he is in a position to gather information and make an intelligent decision on whether or not a player's circumstances warrant a suspension. CSU isn't even the toughest game on our schedule and it may end up that putting this off will come back to bite the team in the ass. What if their punishment comes down during a conference game? Will you still be spouting off about lack of integrity? How about you let the situation play out before shouting from your high horse?

I am so glad that you personally GUARANTEE UND would handle this differently. Now we know exactly how UND would respond.

Bohl is letting 8 situations play out right now and didn't let one play out 2 weeks ago. Inconsistencies. And stop trying to drag UND into this. Coach Mussman does not have to decide how to handle this situation cause the name of 8 UND football players is not in the paper and all over the news. You are asking a hypothetical question and wanting an answer. We don't know how Mussman would handle this cause he didn't have to have a press conference yesterday to address the issues, Bohl and Taylor did.

[darell1976]

It is in very poor taste darell to use this situation in the same breath as those schools and their situations. Good lord people.

The point of using schools like USC, SMU etc is they got punished because the NCAA put a stop to putting football first. NDSU is putting football first by letting more and more incidents happen at the school. Pretty soon the hammer is going to fall on them, maybe a playoff ban will straighten out their program or a reduction in scholarships. Like Sic said 3 incidents in the past few months...whats next there are 3 more months left in the year (4 in the season if you include a trip to Frisco). Can NDSU actually go one full year without their players acting like juveniles?

[Bison06]

Bohl is letting 8 situations play out right now and didn't let one play out 2 weeks ago. Inconsistencies. And stop trying to drag UND into this. Coach Mussman does not have to decide how to handle this situation cause the name of 8 UND football players is not in the paper and all over the news. You are asking a hypothetical question and wanting an answer. We don't know how Mussman would handle this cause he didn't have to have a press conference yesterday to address the issues, Bohl and Taylor did.

I am not trying to drag UND into it at all. My intial question was, would you be as quick to judge if it happened to UND, a perfectly fair question as I feel the reason posters on this board are saying Bohl is running "rogue program" is because of personal bias and not based in fact.

[JohnboyND7]

Bohl is letting 8 situations play out right now and didn't let one play out 2 weeks ago. Inconsistencies. And stop trying to drag UND into this. Coach Mussman does not have to decide how to handle this situation cause the name of 8 UND football players is not in the paper and all over the news. You are asking a hypothetical question and wanting an answer. We don't know how Mussman would handle this cause he didn't have to have a press conference yesterday to address the issues, Bohl and Taylor did.

Once again, one situation is kids being dumb and lazy. One situation is a kid exposing himself in the friggin' mall. Don't lump them together because they are two completely seperate things.

To whomever said "integrity vs. winning," no program is perfect and you can get off your high horse anytime you'd like. All teams are going to have trouble with some kids doing some dumb things.

[Bison06]

The point of using schools like USC, SMU etc is they got punished because the NCAA put a stop to putting football first. NDSU is putting football first by letting more and more incidents happen at the school. Pretty soon the hammer is going to fall on them, maybe a playoff ban will straighten out their program or a reduction in scholarships. Like Sic said 3 incidents in the past few months...whats next there are 3 more months left in the year (4 in the season if you include a trip to Frisco). Can NDSU actually go one full year without their players acting like juveniles?

Are you being serious right now?

Talk about making mountains out of a mole hill. The hammer is going to fall on NDSU? Playoff Ban? How much more sensational can you make this sound today?

The NCAA won't even hear about this. Let your hatred for anything NDSU related go for just a split second and you will realize how ridiculous you sound talking this way.

[andtheHomeoftheSIOUX!!]

Are you being serious right now?

Talk about making mountains out of a mole hill. The hammer is going to fall on NDSU? Playoff Ban? How much more sensational can you make this sound today?

The NCAA won't even hear about this. Let your hatred for anything NDSU related go for just a split second and you will realize how ridiculous you sound talking this way.

Yeah its an AP story, but it still made it on their site. http://www.ncaa.com/news/football/article/2012-09-04/eight-ndsu-players-face-charges-forging-signatures-ballot-initiativ

[Bison06]

Yeah its an AP story, but it still made it on their site. http://www.ncaa.com/...allot-initiativ

Fine, it made the AP wire. To say the NCAA is going to start banning NDSU from the playoffs for this is ridiculous.

[CMSioux]

The worst part is the national media and coaches can't stop confusing them with us.

[JohnboyND7]

The point of using schools like USC, SMU etc is they got punished because the NCAA put a stop to putting football first. NDSU is putting football first by letting more and more incidents happen at the school. Pretty soon the hammer is going to fall on them, maybe a playoff ban will straighten out their program or a reduction in scholarships. Like Sic said 3 incidents in the past few months...whats next there are 3 more months left in the year (4 in the season if you include a trip to Frisco). Can NDSU actually go one full year without their players acting like juveniles?

Tell me, can 100 exceptionally athletically gifted young men(many who feel entitled) go 3 months without one or more of them doing something stupid. Heck can 100 normal college guys go 3 months without any of them doing something illegal? The answer to that is no. Does that mean it should be tolerated? No.

Before you pretend UND is some perfect place where nothing bad happens and the athletes are all perfect citizens, talk to students around campus.

This is a serious issue but to insinuate playoff bans and/or scholarship reductions would be necessary, that is childish. It will be addressed and I imagine that suspensions will happen.

[jdub27]

Once again, one situation is kids being dumb and lazy. One situation is a kid exposing himself in the friggin' mall. Don't lump them together because they are two completely seperate things.

To whomever said "integrity vs. winning," no program is perfect and you can get off your high horse anytime you'd like. All teams are going to have trouble with some kids doing some dumb things.

Once again, if you think that lazy and dumb excuses it or will get them out of it, I think you are severely underestimating how the real world looks at fraud/forgery charges. That is before you bring into the equation that there was a lot of money behind gathering these signatures to get them on the ballot and then advertising purchased for election season that is no longer relevant since they are no longer on the ballot.

[JohnboyND7]

Once again, if you think that lazy and dumb excuses it or will get them out of it, I think you are severely underestimating how the real world looks at fraud/forgery charges. That is before you bring into the equation that there was a lot of money behind gathering these signatures to get them on the ballot and then advertising purchased for election season that is no longer relevant since they are no longer on the ballot.

I am not expecting them to get out of it. I do feel like the judge may take into an account that they were not trying to sabotage the effort to get it on the ballot. We'll see what he does. If he wants to make an example out of them, thats his perogative.

[homer]

I am not trying to drag UND into it at all. My intial question was, would you be as quick to judge if it happened to UND, a perfectly fair question as I feel the reason posters on this board are saying Bohl is running "rogue program" is because of personal bias and not based in fact.

I'm happy that the UND coaching staff has always been consistent with their punishments to players regardless if they are a starter, a backup, just coming off hip surgery, etc. Based on Mussman's past it wouldn't matter if lets say the starting qb, starting wr, backup de with potential or backup qb all committed the same offense, they would all be treated and punished the same.

[darell1976]

Are you being serious right now?

Talk about making mountains out of a mole hill. The hammer is going to fall on NDSU? Playoff Ban? How much more sensational can you make this sound today?

The NCAA won't even hear about this. Let your hatred for anything NDSU related go for just a split second and you will realize how ridiculous you sound talking this way.

I am sure the NCAA doesn't like a member of their organization getting press time for crimes. Since the NCAA doesn't know where Fargo is I guess they won't visit you guys and will call UND for directions.

[darell1976]

Tell me, can 100 exceptionally athletically gifted young men(many who feel entitled) go 3 months without one or more of them doing something stupid. Heck can 100 normal college guys go 3 months without any of them doing something illegal? The answer to that is no. Does that mean it should be tolerated? No.

Before you pretend UND is some perfect place where nothing bad happens and the athletes are all perfect citizens, talk to students around campus.

This is a serious issue but to insinuate playoff bans and/or scholarship reductions would be necessary, that is childish. It will be addressed and I imagine that suspensions will happen.

UND isn't perfect but I am saying the NCAA has rules related to off-campus conduct. Breaking laws isn't tolorated and NDSU breaking them almost every month is going to get old especially if comments like " these kids didn't know it was wrong, and its not like it was a DUI or a Sexual matter"--Gene Taylor gets to the NCAA and makes front page news. Maybe not a playoff ban or a scholarship reduction but I am sure the NCAA has watchdogs on NDSU.

[UNDvince97-01]

Given the NCAA's track record of 'righteousness' and political correctness, at what point might they step in and do something, a la the Twitter incident with the Towson WR in last year's playoff game?

This has to at least get their attention at minimum. I think ndsu should to take the lead on this rather than risk having the NCAA step in on their own because of the lack of action.

Again, UND is not perfect either. It's just unfortunate.

[Bison06]

UND isn't perfect but I am saying the NCAA has rules related to off-campus conduct. Breaking laws isn't tolorated and NDSU breaking them almost every month is going to get old especially if comments like " these kids didn't know it was wrong, and its not like it was a DUI or a Sexual matter"--Gene Taylor gets to the NCAA and makes front page news. Maybe not a playoff ban or a scholarship reduction but I am sure the NCAA has watchdogs on NDSU.

I think you are misunderstanding the reason the NCAA has intervened in the cases you mentioned. They didn't step in because of the kids or coaches or alumni doing anything wrong, they don't care about rules being broken. What they care about is when rules are broken and it is covered up. Since NDSU has held a press conference to address the issue and aren't trying to cover it up or sweep it under the rug, the NCAA has no reason to think that things aren't being handled well at NDSU.