Conference Realignments - Take 2

[bison73]

53 minutes ago, SiouxVolley said:

The MAC, MWC, and SunBelt just laugh hysterically at NDSU’s inquiries.

NDSU has to get the Montanas, Idaho, EWU and Weber St and aboard the Summit, have the Summit start Fb, and go FBS.

What inquiries?????  Link????

[bison73]

7 hours ago, fightingsioux4life said:

Wall to wall juggernaut? Their MBB and WBB programs are in the toilet right now. Their other non-FB programs aren't much better.

If you really think people like myself are going to accept UND becoming a low-level Division I school forever, you are kidding yourself. UND alumni will not tolerate the current level of mediocrity in the athletic department forever. I think Bill Chaves will clean this mess up and get us back to winning.

[SiouxVolley]

2 hours ago, bison73 said:

What inquiries?????  Link????

They routinely happen at any level.

SO you’re saying that Larsen and Bresciani don’t want to see NDSU advance athletically?

[bison73]

1 hour ago, SiouxVolley said:

They routinely happen at any level.

SO you’re saying that Larsen and Bresciani don’t want to see NDSU advance athletically?

 

1 hour ago, SiouxVolley said:

They routinely happen at any level.

SO you’re saying that Larsen and Bresciani don’t want to see NDSU advance athletically?

I didnt say anything.

 

But you said--- """The MAC, MWC, and SunBelt just laugh hysterically at NDSU’s inquiries. """ Proof or youre just lying again.

[fightingsioux4life]

14 hours ago, bison73 said:

Okay, tell me where I am wrong. I honestly don't follow NDSU athletics like UND athletics, so please educate me.

[Milo]

There will never be an FBS UND.  UND can’t afford the current D1 sports model. NDSU has an athletic budget of about 27 mill, UND 28 mill. UND has an extra million to run the hockey program?  

Mankato, Mn Duluth & St. Cloud are all D1 hockey D2 other sports  and they are all competitive, especially in hockey.

UNDs profile is about the same as those schools except UND is trying to fund a full, but shrinking, slate of D1 sports.  Over the past 10 years the success of UND has not kept pace because UND can’t afford their business model  

Because of the obvious funding shortfalls I think UNDs football future is continued mediocrity, non scholarship or simply dropping it like Omaha  They recognized the futility of the failed business model and dropped football.

 

[choyt3]

Throw in a reference to the “boarder marker” next time and that should cement it. 

[UND1983]

23 hours ago, fightingsioux4life said:

Okay, tell me where I am wrong. I honestly don't follow NDSU athletics like UND athletics, so please educate me.

Track and Softball - they are extremely proud of their success in those sports.

[Yote 53]

On ‎2‎/‎2‎/‎2019 at 6:52 AM, Milo said:

I don’t think there is going to be any huge changes. It’s looking more and more like NDSU will get an FBS invite of some kind. The rest of us might rearrange the deck chairs a bit. 

Their success on the field is the result of that entire athletic department transforming itself into a wall-to-wall juggernaut.  Their success is huge financially, with the fans and on the field.  They have been building it for a generation or more and it’s really growing into something very impressive and primed for growth.  

Some people are starting to wonder if UND will even keep football.  The Omaha model for athletic budgets this size is more workable if you want D1 basketball.  otherwise a full slate of sports using the UMD model of D1 hockey  D2 football and other sports is successful for the schools using it.  We just don’t have the money to compete at this level in all sports.  By trying to do it, all sports are suffering.

 

The entire athletic department?  You sure about that?  NDSU is still very good in track and field and softball  but outside of that, not so much.  I would say their athletic department is a bit out of balance.

[nodak651]

5 hours ago, Milo said:

There will never be an FBS UND.  UND can’t afford the current D1 sports model. NDSU has an athletic budget of about 27 mill, UND 28 mill. UND has an extra million to run the hockey program?  

Mankato, Mn Duluth & St. Cloud are all D1 hockey D2 other sports  and they are all competitive, especially in hockey.

UNDs profile is about the same as those schools except UND is trying to fund a full, but shrinking, slate of D1 sports.  Over the past 10 years the success of UND has not kept pace because UND can’t afford their business model  

Because of the obvious funding shortfalls I think UNDs football future is continued mediocrity, non scholarship or simply dropping it like Omaha  They recognized the futility of the failed business model and dropped football.

 

Appropriately named yourself Milo because you know you're a troll...  UND isn't cutting football so cut your shtick.  The budget is plenty big to be competitive in multiple sports.

RK	School	Confrence	Total Rev	Total Exp	Total Allocated	% Allocated
112	North Dakota	Big Sky	$28,201,349	$26,727,343	$13,107,939	46.48
113	Illinois State	Mo. Valley	$27,852,407	$25,144,172	$19,096,462	68.56
114	Wichita State	Mo. Valley	$27,791,259	$26,182,954	$7,879,317	28.35
115	North Dakota State	Summit	$27,267,507	$28,124,505	$7,880,233	28.9
116	Montana	Big Sky	$27,192,240	$21,206,839	$7,452,313	27.41
117	Towson	CAA	$26,989,399	$26,972,945	$23,576,513	87.35
118	Missouri State	Mo. Valley	$26,374,654	$26,374,654	$16,521,641	62.64
119	New Mexico State	WAC	$26,114,479	$23,507,513	$16,833,783	64.46
120	Ball State	MAC	$26,098,565	$27,410,745	$19,402,097	74.34
121	Northern Illinois	MAC	$25,795,597	$25,661,395	$16,816,199	65.19
122	Kennesaw State	Atl Sun	$25,326,240	$24,193,201	$19,449,114	76.79
123	Bowling Green	MAC	$25,303,291	$23,753,571	$15,882,246	62.77
124	Alabama at Birmingham	C-USA	$24,795,218	$23,803,547	$15,480,428	62.43
125	Louisiana Tech	C-USA	$24,722,695	$23,828,481	$10,687,030	43.23
126	Southern Mississippi	C-USA	$23,984,639	$25,251,618	$8,832,604	36.83
127	Idaho	Big Sky	$23,825,002	$22,817,285	$13,339,039	55.99
128	Albany	Am East	$23,502,958	$24,361,609	$18,174,536	77.33
129	Nebraska-Omaha	Summit	$22,956,239	$20,261,523	$12,063,520	52.55
130	Southern Illinois	Mo. Valley	$22,722,740	$26,785,157	$14,346,273	63.14
131	South Dakota State	Summit	$22,075,310	$20,880,295	$8,012,013	36.29
132	Montana State	Big Sky	$21,927,521	$20,768,973	$10,190,334	46.47
133	Vermont	Am East	$21,889,573	$22,060,888	$16,174,319	73.89
134	Maine	Am East	$20,941,860	$20,961,302	$14,181,546	67.72
135	California-Santa Barbara	Big West	$20,484,071	$22,293,939	$15,689,376	76.59
136	College of Charleston	CAA	$20,450,663	$19,931,472	$15,668,254	76.61
137	Long Beach State	Big West	$20,258,440	$20,214,762	$13,455,529	66.42
138	California-Irvine	Big West	$19,978,266	$20,562,643	$15,351,089	76.84
139	Massachusetts-Lowell	Am East	$19,931,925	$19,656,525	$16,926,691	84.92
140	Binghamton	Am East	$19,753,526	$19,139,662	$13,758,566	69.65
141	Northern Iowa	Mo. Valley	$19,497,119	$18,375,024	$9,284,499	47.62
142	California-Riverside	Big West	$19,362,719	$19,100,994	$17,034,255	87.97
143	South Dakota	Summit	$19,256,962	$18,904,718	$11,958,142	62.1
144	East Tennessee State	Southern	$18,870,608	$18,005,312	$13,550,570	71.81
145	Sam Houston State	Southland	$18,742,450	$18,315,142	$13,511,652	72.09
146	California State-Fullerton	Big West	$18,374,475	$18,374,475	$15,137,138	82.38
147	Northern Arizona	Big Sky	$18,353,486	$18,511,105	$13,878,065	75.62
148	Illinois-Chicago	Horizon	$18,197,670	$18,153,694	$13,557,842	74.5
149	California State-Northridge	Big West	$17,987,771	$16,714,774	$14,714,419	81.8
150	Prairie View A&M	SWAC	$17,851,213	$17,852,014	$13,128,636	73.54
151	Tennessee-Chattanooga	Southern	$17,804,067	$17,804,067	$12,374,312	69.5
152	Lamar	Southland	$17,746,157	$17,663,047	$14,516,935	81.8
153	Central Connecticut	Northeast	$17,616,876	$17,159,124	$14,353,603	81.48
154	Citadel	Southern	$17,610,176	$17,488,828	$10,793,876	61.29
155	Northern Colorado	Big Sky	$17,289,706	$15,905,651	$11,819,303	68.36
156	Maryland-Baltimore Cty	Am East	$17,217,652	$16,837,354	$13,938,512	80.95
157	Eastern Kentucky	Ohio Valley	$17,024,583	$17,024,584	$13,105,268	76.98
158	North Carolina Greensboro	Southern	$16,832,309	$16,697,946	$13,883,810	82.48
159	Jacksonville State	Ohio Valley	$16,761,667	$16,761,667	$12,506,361	74.61
160	Stephen F. Austin	Southland	$16,747,580	$16,866,267	$13,744,600	82.07
161	North Carolina Wilmington	CAA	$16,443,174	$14,877,642	$10,790,947	65.63
162	New Jersey Tech	Atl Sun	$16,323,383	$15,460,526	$14,334,140	87.81
163	Oakland	Horizon	$16,262,483	$15,839,499	$12,639,095	77.72
164	Louisiana-Monroe	Sun Belt	$16,132,421	$15,481,778	$7,213,515	44.71
165	Indiana State	Mo. Valley	$16,098,113	$15,262,080	$12,703,992	78.92
166	Florida Gulf Coast	Atl Sun	$15,954,757	$15,076,855	$10,294,846	64.53
167	California State-Bakersfield	WAC	$15,953,381	$16,134,125	$10,972,061	68.78
168	Austin Peay	Ohio Valley	$15,726,585	$15,122,198	$10,043,962	63.87
169	Murray State	Ohio Valley	$15,629,362	$16,006,494	$11,176,904	71.51
170	Youngstown State	Horizon	$15,410,657	$15,410,657	$10,401,241	67.49
171	Tennessee Tech	Ohio Valley	$15,051,335	$14,253,073	$11,177,822	74.26
172	Southeastern Louisiana	Southland	$15,027,967	$13,460,167	$9,231,824	61.43
173	Utah Valley	WAC	$15,010,051	$13,846,291	$11,558,640	77.01
174	Missouri-Kansas City	WAC	$14,807,781	$15,094,616	$11,457,416	77.37
175	Eastern Washington	Big Sky	$14,797,340	$15,753,819	$9,753,372	65.91
176	Texas-Rio Grande Valley	WAC	$14,638,376	$13,570,987	$12,428,726	84.91
177	Wisconsin-Milwaukee	Horizon	$14,382,462	$12,696,879	$11,014,524	76.58
178	Alabama State	SWAC	$14,374,967	$14,374,967	$10,463,940	72.79
179	Northern Kentucky	Horizon	$14,213,168	$14,634,532	$12,439,551	87.52
180	Texas-Arlington	Sun Belt	$14,054,524	$14,145,916	$10,583,191	75.3
181	Weber State	Big Sky	$13,855,419	$13,776,392	$9,098,743	65.67
182	Western Carolina	Southern	$13,723,606	$13,421,220	$8,683,872	63.28
183	Portland State	Big Sky	$13,684,434	$13,670,695	$10,207,232	74.59
184	Norfolk State	MEAC	$13,656,202	$13,656,202	$10,404,021	76.19
185	Northwestern State La	Southland	$13,607,151	$12,556,828	$8,159,894	59.97
186	Central Arkansas	Southland	$13,562,018	$12,840,593	$9,423,866	69.49
187	North Carolina Central	MEAC	$13,561,933	$13,029,240	$8,307,124	61.25
188	Southern	SWAC	$13,360,450	$13,538,874	$9,788,125	73.26
189	VMI	Southern	$13,359,816	$13,221,773	$6,157,119	46.09
190	Winthrop	Big South	$13,287,467	$13,878,823	$10,498,583	79.01
191	Idaho State	Big Sky	$13,228,486	$13,245,509	$8,870,960	67.06
192	Southern Utah	Big Sky	$13,143,866	$13,080,062	$8,907,617	67.77
193	Cleveland State	Horizon	$13,083,041	$13,083,041	$11,076,183	84.66
194	North Carolina A&T	MEAC	$13,075,494	$13,047,786	$9,387,605	71.8
195	Arkansas-Little Rock	Sun Belt	$13,004,365	$11,893,708	$8,418,178	64.73
196	Radford	Big South	$12,954,767	$12,910,385	$10,863,276	83.86
197	Texas A&M-Corpus Christi	Southland	$12,761,032	$11,910,883	$10,228,536	80.15
198	Delaware State	MEAC	$12,674,589	$13,663,806	$9,624,922	75.94
199	Tennessee State	Ohio Valley	$12,481,256	$12,481,256	$9,834,643	78.8
200	Morehead State	Ohio Valley	$12,147,957	$12,147,957	$10,346,029	85.17
201	Southeast Missouri State	Ohio Valley	$12,072,270	$12,470,732	$8,213,912	68.04
202	North Florida	Atl Sun	$12,051,332	$11,709,392	$8,541,251	70.87
203	Western Illinois	Summit	$11,944,035	$13,027,183	$8,925,255	74.73
204	Longwood	Big South	$11,876,406	$11,709,364	$9,985,131	84.08
205	McNeese State	Southland	$11,654,790	$11,653,016	$6,388,738	54.82
206	Eastern Illinois	Ohio Valley	$11,329,430	$12,087,294	$8,123,217	71.7
207	Tennessee-Martin	Ohio Valley	$11,308,729	$11,308,729	$8,179,059	72.33
208	Morgan State	MEAC	$11,023,152	$12,577,055	$8,934,865	81.06
209	Wright State	Horizon	$10,922,076	$12,756,674	$8,577,655	78.54
210	Texas Southern	SWAC	$10,899,527	$10,899,527	$8,961,264	82.22
211	Florida A&M	MEAC	$10,741,985	$10,741,985	$4,605,221	42.87
212	Indiana-Purdue Fort Wayne	Summit	$10,607,866	$10,379,794	$8,286,274	78.11
213	Indiana-Purdue Indianapolis	Summit	$10,143,238	$9,663,859	$8,473,586	83.54
214	Southern Illinois Edwardsville	Ohio Valley	$9,524,882	$9,039,224	$6,911,526	72.56
215	Jackson State	SWAC	$9,466,619	$10,236,424	$4,731,558	49.98
216	Wisconsin-Green Bay	Horizon	$9,390,830	$8,982,031	$4,948,008	52.69
217	Nicholls State	Southland	$8,463,641	$8,326,628	$5,243,798	61.96
218	North Carolina Asheville	Big South	$8,395,210	$8,343,404	$6,008,119	71.57
219	Arkansas-Pine Bluff	SWAC	$7,904,735	$7,770,869	$5,665,044	71.67
220	Grambling State	SWAC	$7,853,609	$10,019,059	$3,887,444	49.5
221	South Carolina Upstate	Atl Sun	$7,591,880	$7,575,272	$6,382,175	84.07
222	South Carolina State	MEAC	$7,232,850	$8,195,579	$3,441,735	47.58
223	Alcorn State	SWAC	$6,321,380	$6,280,710	$3,864,109	61.13
224	Maryland-Eastern Shore	MEAC	$5,916,647	$5,916,647	$4,456,455	75.32
225	New Orleans	Southland	$5,819,807	$5,819,807	$3,972,948	68.27
226	Chicago State	WAC	$5,249,433	$5,057,856	$4,248,483	80.93
227	Savannah State	MEAC	$4,508,343	$6,150,265	$2,852,372	63.27
228	Mississippi Valley State	SWAC	$4,332,784	$4,335,851	$2,146,526	49.54
229	Coppin State	MEAC	$3,452,610	$4,360,469	$2,472,427	71.61
230	Alabama A&M	SWAC	$3,293,950	$9,466,448	$342,723	10.4

 

[UND1983]

The #2-4 sports on NDSU's campus suck.

[zonadub]

This is the norm in D-I athletics. How much do you hear about Clemson or Alabama basketball or Duke or Kansas football. Most schools have a sport they use to fund the rest of their athletic department.

[Milo]

Hi Nodak 651.  My figures must be a bit older than yours because you show UND and NDSU around 28 each and NDSU doesn’t have hockey.  I’m not sure what hockey costs but after that’s paid for what’s left might be approaching Augies projected 12 million which is an average D2 budget and low D1 FCS budget. Mankato, Mn Duluth and St Cloud knew this.

Women’s hockey was sacred too.  Baseball is gone.  Golf was saved by private donations.  I don’t know what will happen to the UND football program but my point is there is not going to be any FBS UND  I believe it’s more likely UND goes non scholarship or drops it completely.  Otherwise budget wise, after hockey is paid for, UND is near, but not at,  the bottom of the expenditures budget in the MVFC with some left over for the other sports.  

 

[Nodak78]

Don't feed the troll.

[nodak651]

 

4 minutes ago, Nodak78 said:

Don't feed the troll.

TIL hockey costs 16 million dollars a year.  LOL

[Milo]

A sensible and realistic discussion of budgets appropriately proceeds any serious discussion of what form the FBS move will take. Hardly trolling.  Augie is worried about the move to D1 with only 12 million.  Most think they can’t afford to be successful in the MVFC.

YSU is an average program with average success since NDSU joined the MVFC.  The Penguins in an Augie like fashion have even been able to beat the Bison a few times in those 10 years or so. Youngstown is at about 15 mill. They are competing against 8 time FCS National Champions NDSU at 27 million.  Neither school has hockey but NDSU has 12 million more to help the football program.

UND has about the same 12 million in excess over YSU but has to fund hockey.  With only about 15 mill for all programs other than hockey, funding will be at a mediocre FCS level..  At the same time the demands of hockey will not get any cheaper.   

it looks like a move to non-scholarship, dropping football all together or simply returning to the more affordable Mankato model is more likely than some far fetched FBS move requiring huge shifts in budget and conference landscape.  it’s just not realistic until there is money to fund it.  

UND will compete in the MVFC with funding for football in the bottom half of the conference  NDSU will compete with the highest funding for football as they do now.  The Bison have 8 national championships since making the move  UND has 1 playoff loss at home.  That is a reflection of funding unless there is going to be a discussion on which school is getting the most bang for the buck.  Could there be that much difference in the efficiency NDSU has shown in spending their money or are they simply enjoying the extras of a bigger budget for football?  

To me NDSU has far more to spend on football and dollar for dollar their skill at spending it is near the top of college football making their FBS chances more likely which is why NDSU is often mentioned in national discussions as a possible candidate for the Mountain West or MAC.

 

 

[ND-fan]

The above figures show UND about average with other FCS schools on what they spend on sports .  This is what I have been saying in other thread here is getting more people attending UND sports other than Hockey is critical to helping keep UND sports more competitive for the future. NDSU has more costly sports to cover than UND with SU having wrestling and baseball compared to UND other sports of tennis, golf, track for the men and on the women's side they are comparably the same. But getting back to getting attendance to the games is key to funding the sports programs for the school. If football could get place close to full would mean at least another couple thousand people or total of another 10000 people at $15.00 we would have another 150000 of revenue from football and I would guess it would even be more than that. same thing for Basketball programs extra 1000 in attendance would another 300,000. These improvements would add half million to the programs. Also football has gone to playing FCS program here again that can add up to million dollars to the program. These may not seem like big changes but revenue increases for the sports. I would think with added attendance other streams of revenue would also increase because of the exposure this provides for suppliers and advertisers for the sports programs. I would also think our traveling expenses for our sports programs should be coming down as we get transitioned to new conferences in next year or so. Where we are not paying for airline travel were back to traveling on buses. I also think the conferences should be working on combining of traveling expenses to reduce costs for all teams traveling and working system where they can get two dates done with one travel time. Because looking at other schools in conference they are experiencing same problems with budgets. I look at above figures it shows that anyone thinks smaller division I schools are going to compete with large division schools in sports on major sports is just fooling themselves. It is possible on lesser sports to compete because major colleges may just not invest time or money in those sports. But major universities are going invest big money in football, basketball, baseball, hockey, volleyball, Lacrosse, softball and maybe track the majority of sports we sponsor here in north Dakota.  

[Milo]

If the claim is average funding at UND with 27 million and hockey, one comes to the conclusion schools like NDSU & SDSU with similar budgets and no hockey are funding at a rate much above average.  That is of course my point:  those programs are already close to FBS spending and so are their results. UND May have the smallest D1 athletic budget in the country among schools funding hockey along with a full slate of D1 sports. 

Money is tight. The move out of the Big Sky was a survival move. A move to FBS will be a return to big travel and huge additional expenses in scholarships, coaches salaries etc.  All of these dollars will have to be found and hoping for higher attendance won’t do it. 

When the mighty land grants announced their plans I think UND was correct when they said the division 1 move made no financial sense. It didn’t for UND.  Mankato, Omaha, UMD and St Cloud knew this too.  Without concrete solutions to these financial problems FBS is a pipe dream for UND.  In fact, the move up  has been a disaster for athletics at UND while St Cloud and the others have enjoyed ongoing success. 

[SiouxVolley]

Bowling Green offers hockey and FBS at a budget less than UND has.

Any talk of NDSU and SDSU getting into the MWC or MAC is total nonsense.  Those conferences only get 10 shares of the CFP and they have more than 10 members.

Before the CFP, the MAC invited Temple, UCF and U Mass as associate fb members because they are in enormous media markets, but those schools refused full memberships..m

The MWC took SJSU because it thought it needed a Bay Area presence for TV.  SJSU was taken over NMSU just based on media.

 

 

[The Sicatoka]

29 minutes ago, Milo said:

When the mighty land grants ... 

"Land grant" is an anachronism that allow some to believe a university should be judged by a title. It's a hand-hold for the weak. It's straight out of the 1800s, literally. 

[southpaw]

28 minutes ago, Milo said:

If the claim is average funding at UND with 27 million and hockey, one comes to the conclusion schools like NDSU & SDSU with similar budgets and no hockey are funding at a rate much above average.  That is of course my point:  those programs are already close to FBS spending and so are their results. UND May have the smallest D1 athletic budget in the country among schools funding hockey along with a full slate of D1 sports. 

Money is tight. The move out of the Big Sky was a survival move. A move to FBS will be a return to big travel and huge additional expenses in scholarships, coaches salaries etc.  All of these dollars will have to be found and hoping for higher attendance won’t do it. 

When the mighty land grants announced their plans I think UND was correct when they said the division 1 move made no financial sense. It didn’t for UND.  Mankato, Omaha, UMD and St Cloud knew this too.  Without concrete solutions to these financial problems FBS is a pipe dream for UND.  In fact, the move up  has been a disaster for athletics at UND while St Cloud and the others have enjoyed ongoing success. 

How does your NDSU afford the move to FBS?  They can't increase attendance without building a new stadium and this time won't be able to do it with the city's help.  Sports 2-4 are floundering and have been a mess recently.  Attendance can only go up slightly, but you see that happening with a new schedule of MAC teams that nobody in Fargo cares about?  The savings from the Summit/MVFC are big for the Dakota schools and if NDSU goes FBS, they'll lose that in order to play games against exciting teams like Eastern Michigan,  Kent State and Buffalo.  Take a look at the average MAC home football schedule against FBS opponents:

-Syracuse (ACC) at Western Michigan, on Aug. 31 (CBS Sports Network);
-Cincinnati (American) at Miami on Sept. 8 (at Paul Brown Stadium);
-Kansas (Big-12) at Central Michigan on Sept. 8;
-Maryland (Big Ten) at Bowling Green on Sept. 8;
-Utah (Pac-12) at NIU on Sept. 8;
-Miami (Fla.) (ACC) at Toledo on Sept. 15;
-Western Kentucky (C-USA) at Ball State on Sept. 22;
-Army (Independent) at Buffalo on Sept. 29;
-UMass (Independent) at Ohio on Sept. 29;
-Army (Independent) at Eastern Michigan on Oct. 27.

I don't think moving up makes sense for any of the local schools because attendance can't grow with the cost of the move.  Even with new stadiums, you'll run out of people to go to games.  Throw in a few down years, the ability to not play for a national championship and games against teams people have never heard of and you're not generating the millions of dollars it's going to cost to move up.

[The Sicatoka]

Frankly, the only way FBS makes sense for any FCS school in the Great Continental Void (Superior WI, to Branson, MO, to St George, UT, to Spokane WA) is if a group of them band together and make it happen for themselves. 

Look at where G5 FBS works: geographically dense MAC, geographically dense Sun Belt. 

Yes, my Great Continental Void is not geographically dense, but it's as good as teams in there can hope for. And worse? Teams from outside that realm have better game options closer to home. They don't want to travel to the Void. There's no benefit to them. 

[jdub27]

Here are some actual numbers instead of rambling that makes no sense.

MVFC "Revenues"
UND - $28.2 million
ISU - $27.9 million
NDSU - $27.3 million
MSU - $26.4 million
UND w/o MIH - $23.0 million
SIU - $22.1 million
SDSU - $22.1 million
UNI - $19.5 million
USD - $19.3 million
ISU - $16.1 million
YSU - $15.4 million
WIU - $11.9 million

While those numbers don't actually tell anywhere near a full story, the ballpark of what men's hockey directly adds to it is $5.2 million. UND also just improved the expense side of their equation by about $3 million, which will start reflecting on the next report that is released. 

[Yote 53]

I am confused.  Is the Bison fan saying that UND's athletic budget is $27 million, but take out hockey and it's $15 million?  So hockey costs $12 million?  What about hockey revenues?  Hockey is cash flow positive, pays for itself and helps fund other sports.  How is that a problem exactly?

[The Sicatoka]

9 minutes ago, Yote 53 said:

I am confused.  Is the Bison fan saying that UND's athletic budget is $27 million, but take out hockey and it's $15 million?  So hockey costs $12 million?  What about hockey revenues?  Hockey is cash flow positive, pays for itself and helps fund other sports.  How is that a problem exactly?

You see through the fallacy of the argument given.