star2city Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Assuming Notre Dame is gone, one has to assume that 8 is the number for the foreseeable future. No legitimate expansion options out there in my view. One school that would interest me as a new upgraded Program down the road would be St Thomas. They are in the metro, they have a large and loyal alumni base, the have the national academic rankings to keep IrishSiouxFan happy (USNews #115 National University) and they have lots and lots of money. I have no idea if they would ever consider it but they would be a nice addition to D-1. Back in the day when the NCC was looking for new schools to fill the voids left by NDSU and SDSU, St Thomas was approached by the NCC and strongly encourage by all NCC schools to move up. St Thomas was steadfast in its refusal, preferring the company of its DIII MIAC schools. Totally agree that St Thomas would have been an ideal NCHC candidate, much moreso than St Cloud St. But St Thomas would have to at least been DII so they could offer scholarships. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
star2city Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Several good articles on what is/has been taking place with Hockey realignment on CHN. http://www.collegehockeynews.com/ So Notre Dame is insisting on its own TV deal that no one else in the conference gets a part of. What two major conferences have similar deals? None other than the Big East and the Big 12: both of which are on the verge of falling apart. In the long term, as the Big 12 and Big East examples show, its probably best for the NCHC to reject the special deal that Notre Dame is demanding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
star2city Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 St Cloud St: Stabbing your buddies in the back? http://mankatofreepr...eave-MSU-behind — When St. Cloud State was left out of the original breakaway group that decided that it would be better to tear apart the country’s best college-hockey conference and start over, rather than improve it from the inside, it looked like Minnesota State had an ally with which it could work to rebuild the rickety, old league. But the Huskies were working as double agents. While they were meeting to reconstruct the damaged Western Collegiate Hockey Association this summer, they apparently were plotting behind the scenes — begging, pleading perhaps? — to get the popular kids to drag them along to the cool party. Even St. Cloud State appears to be a consolation prize for a conference that really wants (and would still take) Notre Dame. Facilities? The teams leaving the WCHA have some of the best the sport has to offer for both play and practice. But Duluth probably doesn’t get into the NCHC without its year-old, state-financed arena, and St. Cloud is in the midst of a $30 million arena expansion partially paid for by state tax money. Meanwhile, requests to build a new women’s rink/men’s practice facility near MSU’s campus and make much-needed upgrades to the locally financed Verizon Wireless Center downtown have been vetoed three times in recent years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiouxFanatic Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 So Notre Dame is insisting on its own TV deal that no one else in the conference gets a part of. What two major conferences have similar deals? None other than the Big East and the Big 12: both of which are on the verge of falling apart. In the long term, as the Big 12 and Big East examples show, its probably best for the NCHC to reject the special deal that Notre Dame is demanding. They are talking about Notre Dame getting a regional TV deal to televise all home games. Do we share our FSSN/Fox College Sports deal with other teams in the WCHA? I honestly don't see the big deal about this regional TV deal that Notre Dame wants? I know the NCHC is hoping a national TV deal for the conference will materialize but do the regional TV deals such as our FSSN, cease to exist because of it? I noticed one thing though, Adam Wodon re-worded his article a little: Things started to come together once Notre Dame finalized its television deal. It's not a "Notre Dame Network" that has been rumored — at least not yet (University of Texas starts its own network this fall) — but it's an agreement with a local network to televise all home games. Link: http://www.collegeho...ion_not_the.php No longer referencing to a regional sports network but as a deal with a local network. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmksioux Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Mike McMahon's latest tweet says ND and NCHC are still talking and not to count the NCHC out yet. As far as numbers go, one of the articles I linked earlier stated the NCHC wants to stay at 8. The only school they would consider a ninth member for is ND. If a new DI program is started, who knows. But for now they are happy with 8 or a 9th if it's ND. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmksioux Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 They are talking about Notre Dame getting a regional TV deal to televise all home games. Do we share our FSSN/Fox College Sports deal with other teams in the WCHA? I honestly don't see the big deal about this regional TV deal that Notre Dame wants? I know the NCHC is hoping a national TV deal for the conference will materialize but do the regional TV deals such as our FSSN, cease to exist because of it? I noticed one thing though, Adam Wodon re-worded his article a little: Link: http://www.collegeho...ion_not_the.php No longer referencing to a regional sports network but as a deal with a local network. This is one of the thoughts that I have as well. Not sure what the hang up is with ND "regional tv deal" but are things going to be changing with FSSN? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Notre Dame question just posed on Live Chat. http://www.grandforksherald.com/pages/undsportschat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Honestly, aside the from the "glow" tied to the "past its prime" football program, why the hell should ND get any special preference for any TV deal? If they had a Title or two, maybe. Good grief those golden domers are almost as self-absorbed with their hockey team's "success" as SCCC. It would be nice to have them, but don't sell the whole new conference to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishSiouxFan Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Honestly, aside the from the "glow" tied to the "past its prime" football program, why the hell should ND get any special preference for any TV deal? If they had a Title or two, maybe. Good grief those golden domers are almost as self-absorbed with their hockey team's "success" as SCCC. It would be nice to have them, but don't sell the whole new conference to them. I agree, the audacity that they should get the red carpet treatment just because once upon a time they were relevant in football. I would love to see ND in the NCHC but this is getting borderline insulting, We will be just fine without them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Because whether or not their FB program is doing well or not, Notre Dame will always be one of the most marketable and reconizable sports programs out there. They have a huge national fanbase that has no connection to the school other than they are Catholic or their parents are ND fans. Getting ND into the NCHC would be a great get from a marketing, television and recognition standpoint. If the NCHC is truely trying to put together a national TV contract, having ND in the league would make it much easier and profitable. Even if their hockey program was a doormat in the NCHC, it would still be a big draw in dealing with television stations on broadcast contracts. If the goal of the NCHC is to truely be a nationally recognizable conference, Notre Dame would be the prom queen that we should be willing to do almost anythin to get to go to the prom with us. And like others, I am scratching my head how a local TV deal could be the hold-up with Notre Dame as UND has had one of those for a long time. And DU and CC regularly have games on FSN (Root Sports) Rocky Mountain. Plus, they strengthen the eastern half of the conference and connect WMU and Miami to the rest of the schools. They bring in the Chicago, Illinois and Indiana markets (just as much as SCSU brings in the MPLS/SP market, if not way more). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mizzou/sioux Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 You forgot to mention SCSU in on that trade (must have been in the fine print). How on Earth does St. Cloud help us generate enough interest to get a major tv deal? It seems like we are now moving backwards rapidly, I kinda wish UND would have gone independent we are one of the few programs that could and make it profitable. I would guess perhaps one of the considerations might be that in some instances St. Cloud is considered part of the Twin Cities metropolitan area and as such might factor in as part of a television coverage that would include Denver, Colorado Springs and perhaps Grand Rapids insofar as Western Michigan is concerned. In some minds perhaps Western Michigan would be close enough to Chicago to warrant some interest in the Chicago market. Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mizzou/sioux Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 I personally wouldn't want Gino as commissioner. First, everyone would complain that he plays favorites to UND, and secondly, the probability that he had some sway getting SCSU into the NCHC shows that the good old boys network is alive and well. I was hoping that kind of thing would be left behind in the WCHA with Bruce Mcleod and Gregg Sheppard. The good old boys network in many respects is alive and well and has been for many years in many and varied instances in business as well as pleasure. Why should it be any different in sports settings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
star2city Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 They are talking about Notre Dame getting a regional TV deal to televise all home games. Do we share our FSSN/Fox College Sports deal with other teams in the WCHA? I honestly don't see the big deal about this regional TV deal that Notre Dame wants? I know the NCHC is hoping a national TV deal for the conference will materialize but do the regional TV deals such as our FSSN, cease to exist because of it? I noticed one thing though, Adam Wodon re-worded his article a little: Link: http://www.collegeho...ion_not_the.php No longer referencing to a regional sports network but as a deal with a local network. What is missing is the concept of different TV Tiers or rights by conferences. Tier 1: National network chooses games of its choice within conference (CBS College Sports, Versus) - limited to a certain number of each school's home games, generally produced by that network Tier 2: Regional networks chooses games of its choice within conference (Fox regional networks) - limited to a certain number of each school's home games, generally produced by that network Tier 3: All unassigned conference games and non-conference games are owned by host school. (i.e. FSSN / Fox College Sports, or Denver can assign rights to unassigned conference and non-conference games to Fox Sports Rocky Mountain - or whatever it is called now) The WCHA didn't have a contract for Tier 1 or Tier 2, mainly because Minnesota didn't want to turn over its rights to the WCHA, so all WCHA games are Tier 3 property (owned by the schools). McLeod always did what Minnesota wanted, as it was in Minnesota's best interest not to have a conference contract for the regular season (otherwise much of what FSN paid UMinn would have gone to the WCHA's pockets instead, where it would be divided). Fox Sports North paid Minnesota (and once in a while lower rates to other schools when FSN wanted Minnesota's games in Grand Forks or St Cloud, etc) If Notre Dame chooses to have it's own Tier 2 network and the NCHC has no rights to any Irish home games, essentially the NCHC would be back to a WCHA situation again - like with Minnesota and Fox Sports North, which is much more unfair than anything that Texas does to the Big 12 (and caused the Texas A&M to leave). For UND, Fox College Sports is not a money-maker (UND/WDAZ are providers that benefit from advertising nationally), so that comparison isn't valid. The NCHC is essentially requiring itself to work as a team in negotiating broadcasts, which Notre Dame (and Minnesota in the WCHA) wanted no part of. Denver can still have games on Fox Rocky Mountain. UND can still have games on FSSN. But some of those games will be moved to a national network. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mizzou/sioux Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 As I said before, it is most likely that the members of the National are aware of Notre Dame's intentions, and that is why we have this new development. Notre Dame likely slammed the door on the National, not the other way around. I hate the fact that it appears St Cloud is joining up, but you just made a pretty decent argument in their favor, when you consider that Notre Dame has apparently turned them down.................It is a contingency plan. Most on this site were claiming that the WCHA without Minnesota and Wisconsin would still be far superior to the Big 10 Hockey Conference. I fail to see how trading Alaska Anchorage, Mankato, Bemidji, Michigan Tech and Bruce McLeod for Miami and Western Michigan is a joke.................. Minnesota by far and away had the best TV deal in college hockey. Wisconsin and Michigan also had decent coverage from Fox. I'll reiterate that I hate the fact that St. Cloud is joining the National, but I do see the point IF Notre Dame has said no thanks as they likely have. Fox Sports North in 2013 will lose what, 35 Gopher broadcasts and 10-15 Badger games? Couple that with the Big 10 Network taking away the basketball and football broadcasts from Fox North the last few years, and they have a serious need for programming once the Twins baseball season is over. I would not be surprised to see Fox Sports North, Fox Sports Rocky Mountain, and Fox College Sports carry NCHC games every single Friday and Saturday during the season. Hell, the Fox Sports networks in Ohio and Detroit may jump on board as well with Miami and WMU in the fold. Again, I much rather would have seen Notre Dame join instead of St Cloud or either of the two that will be for that matter. But sometimes you gotta make lemonade out of lemons. I hate St. Cloud, but they are in Minnesota, and the state of Minnesota is pretty critical to college hockey. I wouldn't be surprised if that extended television coverage happens either. Formation of the Big Ten Hockey Conference was clearly out of almost anybody's control. But the Big Ten commissioner clearly wanted it. The way things are shuffling out I do fear there's a good chance that hockey overall will be weakened. I'd hate to see a number of schools drop hockey because of financial infeasibility, but I think there's a good chance it could happen. Initially I was against UND leaving the WCHA, feeling that just because Minny and Wisconsin were leaving that we should too. I have changed my mind. For our own interests we had to pursue other venues. And while the Big Ten Hockey Conference is virtually guaranteed to come out well financially in the television scheme of things, I do fear (as I indicated before) that in the long run it could be disastrous for college hockey overall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gfhockey Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 I see when we play Minnesota at UM we are on the Big ten network for one game and not FSN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sodbuster Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 Oh, great. So most of us don't get to see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewey Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 SCSU will be a drag on the whole conference. If they want ND, I'm sure the SCSU admission will really help that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burd Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 New programs, new conferences--it's all good. But one thing I hope I never see: FSU getting a hockey program and having to watch their uniforms circle the ice at one end of the ice during warmup while the University of North Dakota ??? circle the ice at the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 You are much more likely to see the Central Michigan Chippewas skating around the rink. And somehow that would be acceptable to the NCAA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
star2city Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 You are much more likely to see the Central Michigan Chippewas skating around the rink. And somehow that would be acceptable to the NCAA. Utah Utes just gained $20 mill more in revenue every year from the MWC to the Pac12, a number of hockey venues in the Salt Lake area from the Olympics, no NHL, and a decent number of hockey fans. IMHO, that would be the likeliest Indian nickname candidate, but still wouldn't bet on it.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnboyND7 Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 Honestly, aside the from the "glow" tied to the "past its prime" football program, why the hell should ND get any special preference for any TV deal? If they had a Title or two, maybe. Good grief those golden domers are almost as self-absorbed with their hockey team's "success" as SCCC. It would be nice to have them, but don't sell the whole new conference to them. Because Notre Dame has perhaps the biggest fan-base of any school in the country, as well as one of the biggest anti-fan bases in the country as well. There is a reason they are on TV every week, and a reason that they have articles on ESPN all the time. Because even if people think Notre Dame is irrelevant, they will watch them play and read articles about them. I would agree don't sell the whole conference to them, but without making some serious concessions to them, Notre Dame will find a different conference to bring their power to. Remember, for Notre Dame, hockey comes 3rd, they like revenue and success. They will be successful no matter what, but they will go where the money is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siouxweet Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 all this talk of ND having one of the largest fan bases is a little overrated as it doesn't really translate to hockey. I said this earlier in this thread the two frozen fours they have been a part in the last 4 fours they by far had the fewest fans of any team there, I didn't see them come to the ralph in droves last year either. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzie679 Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 SCSU will be a drag on the whole conference. Specifics please... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmksioux Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 all this talk of ND having one of the largest fan bases is a little overrated as it doesn't really translate to hockey. I said this earlier in this thread the two frozen fours they have been a part in the last 4 fours they by far had the fewest fans of any team there, I didn't see them come to the ralph in droves last year either. I would agree. However, when it comes to TV sets and TV deals, the networks love Notre Dame. If you want national exposure, ND is a good way to to about getting it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishSiouxFan Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 SCSU will be a drag on the whole conference. If they want ND, I'm sure the SCSU admission will really help that. But SCSU has a huge fan base and practically owns the Minneapolis/St. Paul media market Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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