Media Stories on the Sioux Name

[Chewey]

The first paragraph of the settlement says all native american references and images cannot be displayed at championship events. So no Spirit Lake Sioux or anything about NA and even if we did get their permission, we could have to get at least 30+ year contract on that or else their tribal council could vote against the name, and the board and the school is NOT going to go through this crap every year their is a tribal change.

Yes but, presuming a nickname of "Spirit Lake Sioux" or some such other version, we would already satisfy the asinine "policy." The NCAA "objects" to NA imagery at sporting events but allows it as long as the "policy"/namesake tribal approval is observed. The 30 year agreement stuff is just baloney and is not even in line with the "settlement agreement" because the settlement agreement provides that the name must be changed if the tribe revokes namesake approval. The SBoHE is two-faced (not a big surprise at all, to be sure) in that it agreed to one thing and then demanded and continues to demand another. One of the purposes of the agreement was to give the tribes ongoing authority concerning the nickname. To agree to that and then say FU to the tribes by saying that a 30 year agreement should be rammed down their throats is nothing short of duplicitous and idiotic. Like Steve Fool Bear said, "let democracy run its course." Even as a fervent nickname supporter, it is not consistent to say that the tribes should vote on the issue and then, in the next breath, say that a 30 year agreement is mandatory. The SBoHE really have looked like fools throughout the last year or so with all of their silly deadlines and 30 year agreements and the like, especially in light of what they agreed to.

Change the name to "Spirit Lake Sioux" and the agreement is nothing more than nasty wallpaper. We've already gotten permission from them. I suppose, technically speaking, we'd have to ask them for permission to be the "Spirit Lake Sioux" but one would think they'd be ok with that. Voila.....we have permission, we have observance of the "policy" we have continued use of the imagery and no November 30th deadline. November 30th comes and goes and we'll retire the "Fighting Sioux" nickname and transition to the "Spirit Lake Sioux" nickname.

[larsensa]

We should just be the University of North Dakota and just keep the logo without any nickname. Why didn't we just do that? No tribe name. Just the logo...... Have the Sioux logo without the sioux name and just have the logo to respect the history of North Dakota and native americans..... Yeah right, like any liberals would let this pass. They would say that the beautiful logo is hostile and abusive to native americans. LIberals suck. They are ruining America.

[82SiouxGuy]

We should just be the University of North Dakota and just keep the logo without any nickname. Why didn't we just do that? No tribe name. Just the logo...... Have the Sioux logo without the sioux name and just have the logo to respect the history of North Dakota and native americans..... Yeah right, like any liberals would let this pass. They would say that the beautiful logo is hostile and abusive to native americans. LIberals suck. They are ruining America.

UND can't use the logo without approval of the tribes. The NCAA policy and the settlement say no Native American names OR IMAGERY without approval of the relevant tribes. One school had to stop using a single feather as part of their logo, the full UND logo wouldn't come close to being approved.

[darell1976]

Yes but, presuming a nickname of "Spirit Lake Sioux" or some such other version, we would already satisfy the asinine "policy." The NCAA "objects" to NA imagery at sporting events but allows it as long as the "policy"/namesake tribal approval is observed. The 30 year agreement stuff is just baloney and is not even in line with the "settlement agreement" because the settlement agreement provides that the name must be changed if the tribe revokes namesake approval. The SBoHE is two-faced (not a big surprise at all, to be sure) in that it agreed to one thing and then demanded and continues to demand another. One of the purposes of the agreement was to give the tribes ongoing authority concerning the nickname. To agree to that and then say FU to the tribes by saying that a 30 year agreement should be rammed down their throats is nothing short of duplicitous and idiotic. Like Steve Fool Bear said, "let democracy run its course." Even as a fervent nickname supporter, it is not consistent to say that the tribes should vote on the issue and then, in the next breath, say that a 30 year agreement is mandatory. The SBoHE really have looked like fools throughout the last year or so with all of their silly deadlines and 30 year agreements and the like, especially in light of what they agreed to.

Change the name to "Spirit Lake Sioux" and the agreement is nothing more than nasty wallpaper. We've already gotten permission from them. I suppose, technically speaking, we'd have to ask them for permission to be the "Spirit Lake Sioux" but one would think they'd be ok with that. Voila.....we have permission, we have observance of the "policy" we have continued use of the imagery and no November 30th deadline. November 30th comes and goes and we'll retire the "Fighting Sioux" nickname and transition to the "Spirit Lake Sioux" nickname.

The problem with the SL Sioux is that if another tribal council comes along say in 5 or 6 years and vote to retire the name..its over according to the settlement.

[siouxforeverbaby]

I have a question regarding the logo and this may not be easily answered, but....say we were to change the nickname to the Fighting Objibwe or Chippewea (That is what they are..i think). If we change the logo or they give us permission to use it since one of them did design it...would that be ok with the NCAA? I realize this is a little far fetched since according to what I heard from the higher ups at UND while I was there, any new nickname proposed will not have anything to do with people...which leads us to animals or the dreaded colors.

[ticklethetwine]

I have a question regarding the logo and this may not be easily answered, but....say we were to change the nickname to the Fighting Objibwe or Chippewea (That is what they are..i think). If we change the logo or they give us permission to use it since one of them did design it...would that be ok with the NCAA? I realize this is a little far fetched since according to what I heard from the higher ups at UND while I was there, any new nickname proposed will not have anything to do with people...which leads us to animals or the dreaded colors.

You mean like The Fighting Green or The Fighting Green Machine

[yababy8]

You mean like The Fighting Green or The Fighting Green Machine

North Dakotan's - fighting Sioux fans- should not allow the NCAA to manipulate them into sacarificing the Sioux name.

You all need to realize how valuable your bond is with that and how UNIQUE and SPECIAL of a thing you all have there in the middle of nowhere.

And the fact that you choose to allow some dude (RHHT) 300 miles away from you to manipulate government a bit on some reservation with no damn relationship with your part of the world at all to tear the name from you and kick your passion into the earth is frankly- PATHETIC.

In the end it is the Sioux fans who will decide the future of the Sioux name. Will ya all roll over??

[Goon]

North Dakotan's - fighting Sioux fans- should not allow the NCAA to manipulate them into sacarificing the Sioux name.

You all need to realize how valuable your bond is with that and how UNIQUE and SPECIAL of a thing you all have there in the middle of nowhere.

And the fact that you choose to allow some dude (RHHT) 300 miles away from you to manipulate government a bit on some reservation with no damn relationship with your part of the world at all to tear the name from you and kick your passion into the earth is frankly- PATHETIC.

In the end it is the Sioux fans who will decide the future of the Sioux name. Will ya all roll over??

UND really has no choice, without settles the name getting approval or changing the name the other sports at UND would die and go away because they wouldn't have an easy time scheduling opponents. I have had a unnamed Sioux coach tell me this...

[Shawn-O]

North Dakotan's - fighting Sioux fans- should not allow the NCAA to manipulate them into sacarificing the Sioux name.

You all need to realize how valuable your bond is with that and how UNIQUE and SPECIAL of a thing you all have there in the middle of nowhere.

And the fact that you choose to allow some dude (RHHT) 300 miles away from you to manipulate government a bit on some reservation with no damn relationship with your part of the world at all to tear the name from you and kick your passion into the earth is frankly- PATHETIC.

In the end it is the Sioux fans who will decide the future of the Sioux name. Will ya all roll over??

It's time to deal with it and move ahead. Tough situation, but it's time to put our time and effort into more productive endeavors. No referendum in the world is going to be enough to turn a 10-4 vote. I guess by your definition I'm rolling over, so be it. I'm a proud alumnus of the University of North Dakota and a nickname change will not impact that.

[siouxforeverbaby]

You mean like The Fighting Green or The Fighting Green Machine

well...Fighting Green, yes.

The Fighting Green Machine? Would our logo be a John Deere Tractor?

[yababy8]

It's time to deal with it and move ahead. Tough situation, but it's time to put our time and effort into more productive endeavors. No referendum in the world is going to be enough to turn a 10-4 vote. I guess by your definition I'm rolling over, so be it. I'm a proud alumnus of the University of North Dakota and a nickname change will not impact that.

We all flew over the cuckoo's rink

Yes we have all done so much, we must sleep now..

Our minds are exhausted and our feet are blistered.

We have lost our voices time and again.

We cannot protest another second as we have all given every moment possible to the endeavor.

Sooo soooo sooo tired... must sleep now...

Go to sleeep, tired activist..

You fought hard, your fought proud!

You did all you could and then you did more..

Must sleep solder!

let your dreams relieve you of the weight of your lost battle.

It's only a name.. Everything will be ok!

There are other things to care about.

There is nothing you could have done. No way for victory.

You made sure, you did everything you could. You and your fellow man- side by side- all fought the fight and lived the struggle.

Now it's time to sleep.

Good night.

[krangodance]

It's time to deal with it and move ahead. Tough situation, but it's time to put our time and effort into more productive endeavors. No referendum in the world is going to be enough to turn a 10-4 vote. I guess by your definition I'm rolling over, so be it. I'm a proud alumnus of the University of North Dakota and a nickname change will not impact that.

spot on. this is what i was talking about when the haters were accusing us all of only supporting the ncaa deadline because it buys more time and that we would just support another date in the future if nothing happened by the ncaa deadline (i'm sure we all remember those individuals referring to the date as aribtrary, as if the date was just pulled out of the air by members of this board and not agreed upon between the ncaa and und; hey, yababy, wasn't it mplsbison and yourself leading that smear campaign? i guess i forget now)

well, they can all eat crow now because the general sentiment i've seen on this message board since the standing rock council vote is that the fight is lost and it's time to move on.

i'm sure some very small minority will still try to fight against the change, but standing rock has spoken (or at least the few that are going to be allowed to speak) and they don't support keeping the nickname and/or logo. since that decision does not satisfy the ncaa requirement to get rid of the name, there's nothing more that can be done.

i'm okay with it though (as much as i can be anyways). sure, i'd rather have seen standing rock hold a tribe-wide vote, but i feel the same way about a lot of bills that are passed by the u.s. senate and house, but just as the u.s. constitution allows for elected officials to decide on such matters independent of what their constituents may want, so does the standing rock tribal constitution allow for the tribal leadership to make this decision without consulting the rest of the tribe. so be it.

[star2city]

spot on. this is what i was talking about when the haters were accusing us all of only supporting the ncaa deadline because it buys more time and that we would just support another date in the future if nothing happened by the ncaa deadline (i'm sure we all remember those individuals referring to the date as aribtrary, as if the date was just pulled out of the air by members of this board and not agreed upon between the ncaa and und; hey, yababy, wasn't it mplsbison and yourself leading that smear campaign? i guess i forget now)

well, they can all eat crow now because the general sentiment i've seen on this message board since the standing rock council vote is that the fight is lost and it's time to move on.

i'm sure some very small minority will still try to fight against the change, but standing rock has spoken (or at least the few that are going to be allowed to speak) and they don't support keeping the nickname and/or logo. since that decision does not satisfy the ncaa requirement to get rid of the name, there's nothing more that can be done.

i'm okay with it though (as much as i can be anyways). sure, i'd rather have seen standing rock hold a tribe-wide vote, but i feel the same way about a lot of bills that are passed by the u.s. senate and house, but just as the u.s. constitution allows for elected officials to decide on such matters independent of what their constituents may want, so does the standing rock tribal constitution allow for the tribal leadership to make this decision without consulting the rest of the tribe. so be it.

What's so sad is how this issue revealed the corruption and double standards of the Standing Rock leadership. The council questions and demands validation of the 1006 or so signatures for a referendum petition, but no one - not even the media - questioned the 1100 names on the petition supporting the earlier council decision against the Sioux name. And who were the people circulating the petition? Would members of the council themselves "highly suggest" that voters sign?

It's clear the Spirit Lake's council was not supportive of the name, yet they chose to let the people decide. Clearly, the level of freedom is higher at Spirit Lake than at Standing Rock, as Spirit Lake actually understands the importance of a secret ballot. The future of Spirit Lake is much brighter than Standing Rock for that reason: economic freedom flows from political freedom.

[sioux7>5]

To me this is all about people on the council that think they are smarter then the average person and certainly more enlightened so they need to protect you from making a decision, they know what is best for you. They don't. It is the same mentality in Washington, DC a bunch of elitist that think they know what is best for you and do not care about your opinion, because to them it does not matter.

[ticklethetwine]

I guess as far as I am concerned we will always be the Sioux. I will still wear my fighting Sioux gear and chant let's go Sioux and i am sure people will still shout during the national anthem Home of the Sioux. So you see just because some group of people may have taken something away from us that doesn't make it right and good luck enforcing it. I sat a meeting in which President Kelley himself said "No one is going to tell you you can't wear your fighting sioux gear to games". I agree with that statement. So that is why I plan to load up on gear this year.

[SiouxFanatic]

I think a lot of people are going to be wearing Fighting Sioux apparel for years to come even after a new nickname is adopted. Eventually though, everyone will begin to buy into the new nickname and you'll begin to see less and less Fighting Sioux stuff as the years go by.

I'll continue to wear my Fighting Sioux stuff but I'm still a supporter of UND so if/when they adopt a new nickname, I'll buy new shirts, sweaters, and jerseys.

[the green team]

I will always find time to wear my Sioux gear, and yes I will be getting more throughout the summer and fall, but when there is a new nickname & logo---providing it's not entirely lame, i will get that and wear that too. I just want to support my school & my teams.

[petey23]

I will always find time to wear my Sioux gear, and yes I will be getting more throughout the summer and fall, but when there is a new nickname & logo---providing it's not entirely lame, i will get that and wear that too. I just want to support my school & my teams.

I will buy UND merchandise in the future as long as it says UND on it and nothing else. I have enough Sioux gear to last me for years and I will never buy any merchandise that has another name on it....just my choice.

Maybe we could change our name to the Green Eagles, similar to Marquette changing their name to the Golden Eagles 16 years ago and it still hasn't really taken hold for them as most fans at their games are decked out in Warrior gear.

[redwing77]

I will buy UND merchandise in the future as long as it says UND on it and nothing else. I have enough Sioux gear to last me for years and I will never buy any merchandise that has another name on it....just my choice.

Maybe we could change our name to the Green Eagles, similar to Marquette changing their name to the Golden Eagles 16 years ago and it still hasn't really taken hold for them as most fans at their games are decked out in Warrior gear.

sick birds don't fly well with me.

[lakeshoe]

sick birds don't fly well with me.

Time to introduce the UND Water Buffalo. It'll resonate well with all the flooding.

[Blackburn87]

Although some things at the Ralph won't change, what a tragedy as they slowly gut the place to make it fit the boring political correctness we've been force-fed by people with no sense of history or tradition.

[petey23]

sick birds don't fly well with me.

The point I was making is it doesn't matter to me what they change the name too.....I won't be participating.

[Blackheart]

I'll continue to wear my Fighting Sioux stuff but I'm still a supporter of UND so if/when they adopt a new nickname, I'll buy new shirts, sweaters, and jerseys.

Absolutely not! It's Sioux or nothing for me...I'm just one person but the 6-8 t-shirts and 3-4 pucks and throw in a couple caps every year will add up...take that times 20 thousand and you're looking at Marquette/Miami of Ohio impact...Just my opinion though...

[ScottM]

Absolutely not! It's Sioux or nothing for me...I'm just one person but the 6-8 t-shirts and 3-4 pucks and throw in a couple caps every year will add up...take that times 20 thousand and you're looking at Marquette/Miami of Ohio impact...Just my opinion though...

I'm in this camp too. I'll wear my Sioux gear until I die, or it literally falls apart. I do not see myself buying anything with a new name/logo in the near future.

[Goon]

I'm in this camp too. I'll wear my Sioux gear until I die, or it literally falls apart. I do not see myself buying anything with a new name/logo in the near future.

Yeah I am in the camp as well.