2024 Non-UND FCS Thread

[UND08]

I think it's safe to assume that NDSU will reload where they have to in order to be the odds-on favorite for next year.

If Lance leaves...it'll be because the money is stupid.  The G&G collective will do 400% more than any other FCS collective can do in order to keep him around another year.  Polacek will likely be targeted for FBS jobs (and deservedly so).  If that happens who's the heir apparent?  If it were based on performance this year I'd argue it would be Landry...which would be awfully tough to swallow as a UND guy!

The portal departures for us are now with schools like Mayville State and SJU.  Not that there's anything wrong with that...but that's indicative of the talent disparity between us and the powers that be.  It appears that Coach Schmidt recognizes this through his portal work...if he can coach them up we can close that gap quicker than you used to be able to (think USD the last couple years).

We have a lot of work to do...and not a lot of time to do it.  There will likely be another window of FBS re-alignment in a year or two...and NDSU absolutely should get a shot to go.  They've won 10 of the last 14 titles.  That's actually bad for the division...a rising tide should lift all ships but it hasn't, because the best ships have moved on.  We need to position ourselves accordingly to be at the table of a western re-alignment.

We've done great work on the facilities aspect...

We've invested in the program.

We have a collective...

Now we need to win...and win at a high level!  No excuses anymore...

[siouxweet]

24 minutes ago, tnt said:

Wow, after your ludicrous prediction earlier this year, I would cut your losses.  You obviously haven't a clue.

Did I go overboard? Yes.  Was I outlandish?   Yep.   Do I still think their defense is no good?  Yes.  I will also give them all the credit in the world for winning #10.  This was the worst Bison team to win it of the 10 and MSU had their best team ever and the Walter Payton award winner at QB and still lost.  UND has a lot of work to do.

[fightingsioux4life]

1 hour ago, UND08 said:

We have a lot of work to do...and not a lot of time to do it.  There will likely be another window of FBS re-alignment in a year or two...and NDSU absolutely should get a shot to go.  They've won 10 of the last 14 titles.  That's actually bad for the division...a rising tide should lift all ships but it hasn't, because the best ships have moved on.  We need to position ourselves accordingly to be at the table of a western re-alignment.

This has more to do with television market size and travel costs.

Two areas that are not in NDSU's favor.

Same issue for the other 3 Dakota schools.

Only way FBS happens is if the 4 Dakota schools and the 2 Montana schools team up.

[Wilbur]

30 minutes ago, UND08 said:

I think it's safe to assume that NDSU will reload where they have to in order to be the odds-on favorite for next year.

If Lance leaves...it'll be because the money is stupid.  The G&G collective will do 400% more than any other FCS collective can do in order to keep him around another year.  Polacek will likely be targeted for FBS jobs (and deservedly so).  If that happens who's the heir apparent?  If it were based on performance this year I'd argue it would be Landry...which would be awfully tough to swallow as a UND guy!

The portal departures for us are now with schools like Mayville State and SJU.  Not that there's anything wrong with that...but that's indicative of the talent disparity between us and the powers that be.  It appears that Coach Schmidt recognizes this through his portal work...if he can coach them up we can close that gap quicker than you used to be able to (think USD the last couple years).

We have a lot of work to do...and not a lot of time to do it.  There will likely be another window of FBS re-alignment in a year or two...and NDSU absolutely should get a shot to go.  They've won 10 of the last 14 titles.  That's actually bad for the division...a rising tide should lift all ships but it hasn't, because the best ships have moved on.  We need to position ourselves accordingly to be at the table of a western re-alignment.

We've done great work on the facilities aspect...

We've invested in the program.

We have a collective...

Now we need to win...and win at a high level!  No excuses anymore...

Completely agree.  A fair amount of those "ships" that could compete with the mother ship that is the NDSU championship wagon have moved out of the harbor.  

If it was UND winning 10 of the last 14 I'd be happy as heck, but at the same time I'd understand that there isn't a ton out there left to prove at the lower level, and most times they take the field it's like a Fargo vs. Valley City type matchup in regards to resources at their disposal.

 

[Bison06]

1 hour ago, siouxweet said:

Did I go overboard? Yes.  Was I outlandish?   Yep.   Do I still think their defense is no good?  Yes.  I will also give them all the credit in the world for winning #10.  This was the worst Bison team to win it of the 10 and MSU had their best team ever and the Walter Payton award winner at QB and still lost.  UND has a lot of work to do.

At the beginning of the year, I may have somewhat agreed with you. But this years NDSU team grew more than any I can think of in recent memory and the team that took the field on Monday night was damn good. To call a defense no good that held MSU to 3 first half points and made them completely change their game plan to move the ball is a little silly.

[GoodGood]

Just now, Bison06 said:

At the beginning of the year, I may have somewhat agreed with you. But this years NDSU team grew more than any I can think of in recent memory and the team that took the field on Monday night was damn good. To call a defense no good that held MSU to 3 first half points and made them completely change their game plan to move the ball is a little silly.

Held MSU to 29 in the 2nd half so that’s pretty good too!

[Bison06]

Just now, GoodGood said:

Held MSU to 29 in the 2nd half so that’s pretty good 

Great, how exciting that made the game! And without the amazing first half defensively, 29 second half points would’ve been good enough to win. Good thing they play all four quarters of a football game to decide a winner.

 

[UND08]

1 hour ago, fightingsioux4life said:

This has more to do with television market size and travel costs.

Two areas that are not in NDSU's favor.

Same issue for the other 3 Dakota schools.

Only way FBS happens is if the 4 Dakota schools and the 2 Montana schools team up.

3 million people watched the game Monday night.

How many will watch a Wyo/NIU PAC-12 (or whatever they call it) game now?

Football only mitigates the travel costs.

There will come a time when either the MW or the PAC throw NDSU a bone in the name of stability.  Now that the MW stretches to Illinois it might make sense to backfill in the central time zone.  NIU might have been first...but I doubt they are last...

[jdub27]

2 hours ago, UND08 said:

The portal departures for us are now with schools like Mayville State and SJU.  Not that there's anything wrong with that...but that's indicative of the talent disparity between us and the powers that be.  It appears that Coach Schmidt recognizes this through his portal work...if he can coach them up we can close that gap quicker than you used to be able to (think USD the last couple years).

Last year UND lost plenty of talent to higher level schools.
This year, it appears UND has been able to retain most of who they wanted to (1883 Collective is playing a nice part in that). Every program is going to lose players to lower level schools. Kids want playing time and realize they aren't getting it at the level they are at. 

 

2 hours ago, UND08 said:

We have a lot of work to do...and not a lot of time to do it.  There will likely be another window of FBS re-alignment in a year or two...and NDSU absolutely should get a shot to go.  They've won 10 of the last 14 titles.  That's actually bad for the division...a rising tide should lift all ships but it hasn't, because the best ships have moved on.  We need to position ourselves accordingly to be at the table of a western re-alignment.

Not sure at what point it becomes painfully obvious that on the field success doesn't even crack the top 5 of what is being looked at for FCS to FBS move-ups. The reality is what it is though. A larger shift that seems inevitable (even though people have been saying that for years now), will likely create an opportunity for the 4 Dakota schools. 

 

17 minutes ago, UND08 said:

3 million people watched the game Monday night.

How many will watch a Wyo/NIU PAC-12 (or whatever they call it) game now?

Football only mitigates the travel costs.

There will come a time when either the MW or the PAC throw NDSU a bone in the name of stability.  Now that the MW stretches to Illinois it might make sense to backfill in the central time zone.  NIU might have been first...but I doubt they are last...

You can almost predict what the viewership for a game will be based on what channel, timeslot and other viewing competition is on at the same time.
Number for the FCS championship game were great. But that's literally because it got a prime time slot, on the mothership, against no other viewing competition (finally away from the NFL playoffs).

This year the Celebration Bowl has 2.1M total/2.6M peak vs. 2.4M total/3.1M peak for the FCS Championship.
Last year the Celebration Bowl went against NFL games and drew 1.51M.
2022, no viewing competition and it drew 2.4M/3M, the same as this years FCS Championship game.

You can look at bowl games and see the same trend. It is what it is.

As for MWC: There aren't much for schools that are going to add more to the pie than they would take from it. Until someone can show that they are going to bring significant dollars to the media contract, the MWC may be done (for the near future). They now stretch across 4 time zones, which is great for their media partners.
 

[UND08]

1 hour ago, jdub27 said:

Last year UND lost plenty of talent to higher level schools.
This year, it appears UND has been able to retain most of who they wanted to (1883 Collective is playing a nice part in that). Every program is going to lose players to lower level schools. Kids want playing time and realize they aren't getting it at the level they are at. 

You're correct...and that was a playoff team.  This year we were not...and you know why?  We weren't good enough.  It was plainly evident watching the games...too slow...not strong enough up front on D.  A noodle arm QB.  A spade is a spade at some point...

1 hour ago, jdub27 said:

Not sure at what point it becomes painfully obvious that on the field success doesn't even crack the top 5 of what is being looked at for FCS to FBS move-ups. The reality is what it is though. A larger shift that seems inevitable (even though people have been saying that for years now), will likely create an opportunity for the 4 Dakota schools. 

You can almost predict what the viewership for a game will be based on what channel, timeslot and other viewing competition is on at the same time.
Number for the FCS championship game were great. But that's literally because it got a prime time slot, on the mothership, against no other viewing competition (finally away from the NFL playoffs).

This year the Celebration Bowl has 2.1M total/2.6M peak vs. 2.4M total/3.1M peak for the FCS Championship.
Last year the Celebration Bowl went against NFL games and drew 1.51M.
2022, no viewing competition and it drew 2.4M/3M, the same as this years FCS Championship game.

You can look at bowl games and see the same trend. It is what it is.

As for MWC: There aren't much for schools that are going to add more to the pie than they would take from it. Until someone can show that they are going to bring significant dollars to the media contract, the MWC may be done (for the near future). They now stretch across 4 time zones, which is great for their media partners.
 

I mean...we are at that point now...to the point that something is going to happen that will make it less obvious...i.e. there are no other options that make sense or the conference needs teams.  If NDSU is willing to take a reduced share to facilitate an FBS move up (which my guess is they would do)...they'll get a shot in my opinion.

And on another level...FCS as it stands now is 5-6 teams and a whole lot of "meh"...unfortunately I think we are squarely in the "meh" column.  We need to do everything possible to elevate.  Let's face it...last time we screwed this up it was our arrogance and lack of vision that attributed to the mistake.  Next time...we won't have the opportunity to make the mistake in the first place (because we won't get invited).

And if nothing ever comes of it and we are all truly stuck in FCS...and we do all of this and all of a sudden we aren't a mediocre program anymore...then I guess I'll live with it...

[jdub27]

1 hour ago, UND08 said:

We need to do everything possible to elevate.  Let's face it...last time we screwed this up it was our arrogance and lack of vision that attributed to the mistake. 

Agree with the first part.
The second part, UND didn't have its finances in a position it was feasible. And they were still not great when the move was made years later, which attributed to some initial struggles. At this point, at least in the last few decades, I am not sure UND has been in a strong financial position. Things are sitting very nice, went through all the pain a few years back. Not having to ask the state for 7-8 figure bailouts just for operations is a good spot to be in.

[Shawn-O]

52 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Agree with the first part.
The second part, UND didn't have its finances in a position it was feasible. And they were still not great when the move was made years later, which attributed to some initial struggles. At this point, at least in the last few decades, I am not sure UND has been in a strong financial position. Things are sitting very nice, went through all the pain a few years back. Not having to ask the state for 7-8 figure bailouts just for operations is a good spot to be in.

Not arguing here, just curious on your take of why and how D1 was financially viable for the xDSU’s and not the UxD’s at that time.  Kupchella really screwed us on that one and frankly Roger didn’t help matters either.  

[Johnny Five]

https://medium.com/@Tannercastora/south-dakota-states-quinten-christensen-and-chase-mason-rallying-program-during-uncertain-times-a8335d4936a8

Long article but also some interesting insight - maybe cut throat - from a couple SDSU returning players regarding the portal, loyalty and the like.  It truly is a dog eat dog world out there.

[UND08]

15 hours ago, jdub27 said:

Agree with the first part.
The second part, UND didn't have its finances in a position it was feasible. And they were still not great when the move was made years later, which attributed to some initial struggles. At this point, at least in the last few decades, I am not sure UND has been in a strong financial position. Things are sitting very nice, went through all the pain a few years back. Not having to ask the state for 7-8 figure bailouts just for operations is a good spot to be in.

Lack of vision includes not having the foresight to manage your finances in such a way to make the move possible.

And before anyone says there was no possible way to do that...NDSU found a way...

[jdub27]

15 hours ago, Shawn-O said:

Not arguing here, just curious on your take of why and how D1 was financially viable for the xDSU’s and not the UxD’s at that time.  Kupchella really screwed us on that one and frankly Roger didn’t help matters either.  

Don't have a great answer for a handful of reasons. 

I think in Fargo, they just willed it into existence and hoped it would work out. Not uncommon for them and usually works out, though they are finally starting to see some effects of that with budget issues. Whether there is any real consequence to it is another story.
Not sure how they were able to sell it in Brookings.

[geaux_sioux]

3 hours ago, jdub27 said:

Don't have a great answer for a handful of reasons. 

I think in Fargo, they just willed it into existence and hoped it would work out. Not uncommon for them and usually works out, though they are finally starting to see some effects of that with budget issues. Whether there is any real consequence to it is another story.
Not sure how they were able to sell it in Brookings.

Whiskey Joe shot from the hip and never looked back or asked for permission. 

[FSSD]

19 minutes ago, geaux_sioux said:

Whiskey Joe shot from the hip and never looked back or asked for permission. 

SDSU has credit card money (Sanford) without it they are still in DII

[Nodak78]

4 hours ago, UND08 said:

Lack of vision includes not having the foresight to manage your finances in such a way to make the move possible.

And before anyone says there was no possible way to do that...NDSU found a way...

und was just starting women's hockey.  the dark hole for money.

[UND08]

59 minutes ago, Nodak78 said:

und was just starting women's hockey.  the dark hole for money.

Again...speaks to "Vision"...or more accurately the lack thereof...

[SiouxFan100]

Idk but I would like to look forward 

[CMSioux]

5 hours ago, UND08 said:

Lack of vision includes not having the foresight to manage your finances in such a way to make the move possible.

And before anyone says there was no possible way to do that...NDSU found a way...

I believe hockey finances had an affect at that time. It is not as simple a decision back then as some are making it now 

[UND08]

21 minutes ago, CMSioux said:

I believe hockey finances had an affect at that time. It is not as simple a decision back then as some are making it now 

No...it was not the priority back then that it should have been.

It was for NDSU and SDSU.

Seems to have worked out for them...

[SiouxFan100]

No matter what all happened I feel like enough time has past and we don’t have any excuses anymore to succeed

[SooToo]

Been trying to keep tabs on the Jackrabbit roster implosion but unable to access their fan board recently. (Transferred to WSU?) But according to our friends at NDAC:

-- NINE 2025 recruits flipped to WSU (including one-time UND commit wr Pabst).

-- TWO other 2025 recruits decommitted.

-- SIXTEEN current players transferred to WSU.

-- EIGHT current players transferring to other schools

-- TWO other players in the portal.

[sioux24/7]

Former friend Carter Pabst is headed to Wazzu.