UND (3-2) vs Montana (5-0)

[jdub27]

I won't argue that some of his antics are over the top. I've been critical of it in the past and will be in the future when it is called for, however I really don't think yesterday was one of those times. He shook DeCuire's hand and kept going. DeCuire said something to him and expected Jones to stop and he didn't. I rewatched it multiple times because I was confused what the UM coach was talking to Dirden about.

[UNDvince97-01]

6 minutes ago, Teeder11 said:

The problem with the whole lack of supposed professionalism critique that is aimed at Jones is that it  seems so relative. If he's winning, everyone loves it and celebrates it as if it's a badge of honor. But when there's blood in the water, it's called an embarrassment. I think it's really much ado about nothing, really, coming from folks with ulterior concerns, such as getting BJ out of here. I could agree with them, but I just want to see how the season plays out first before I start calling for someone's head. 

But it isn't 'supposed'....it's been there, always has.

Your point on winning certainly makes sense, I agree.  It would be more tolerable, not celebrated.

Why is there blood in the water?  It's self-inflicted, no?

[Teeder11]

20 minutes ago, UNDvince97-01 said:

But it isn't 'supposed'....it's been there, always has.

Your point on winning certainly makes sense, I agree.  It would be more tolerable, not celebrated.

Why is there blood in the water?  It's self-inflicted, no?

Well, I tend too think it's more team inflicted, coaching staff included, than self inflicted by any one individual to this point in the season. There is still time to keep inproving so theyre peaking in Reno. I think you're right about "celebrating " being too strong of a word but it is amazing how many things that people deem embarrassing when things are rough that they overlook when times are good. It's like this whole Jones thing is analogous or maybe a macrocosm of a given night on a SS hockey game thread. When UND is behind, it's all doom and gloom, but the moment we score to tie it up and then tack on another to go ahead, the bandwagon nearly breaks an axle for all the fans jumping back on for the trip to No. 8. 

[Teeder11]

29 minutes ago, UND-1 said:

I can't recall anybody bragging about his fly-by handshakes and poopy pant face on the sidelines, even during/after wins.  He is just much worse when they lose.

No, you are correct. It would take a consistent trend of wins before that kind of thing would start playing out. Kind of like what you see down at AC right now. That fan base defends its program to the hilt no matter how classless something is. We do it to with certain successful programs with a tradition of winning. 

[SWSiouxMN]

We are on to Northern Arizona

I expect 2 road wins

 

[Teeder11]

20 minutes ago, SWSiouxMN said:

We are on to Northern Arizona

I expect 2 road wins

 

The road to Reno should smooth out for a while, just need to keep improving and execute. 

[bincitysioux]

Well I thought they played pretty well throughout.  Yes, frustrating that they couldn't close it out at home (similar to NDSU).  Cant really pick on anything about Jones from yesterday from what I saw.  I'm sure he was disappointed too that they didn't close it out when they should have, so I am not concerned about his expedited trip through the hand shake line.

Crowd was great yesterday, very nice atmosphere.  This community and school really wants to support a winner.  Was hoping they would pull it off and give the fans more incentive to come back in a few weeks.  Love the support that Bubba and his team provide.

Where does the Big Sky find their officials?  They are terrible for he most part.  A Montana player grabbed the rim TWICE while we had a shot in the air in the second half and it wasn't called either time.  The first time it was Bernstine shooting it but it went in anyways.  Still should have been whistle for goaltending.  The second one on Crandall's shot was far more egregious and impactful.  I that should have been an and 1.  

I would like to see a list of what the budgets are for every NCAA conference for salaries for officials.  My bet is that the Big Sky is dead last.  There have been some doozies on the football side as well over the years.....

[bincitysioux]

Well I thought they played pretty well throughout.  Yes, frustrating that they couldn't close it out at home (similar to NDSU).  Cant really pick on anything about Jones from yesterday from what I saw.  I'm sure he was disappointed too that they didn't close it out when they should have, so I am not concerned about his expedited trip through the hand shake line.

Crowd was great yesterday, very nice atmosphere.  This community and school really wants to support a winner.  Was hoping they would pull it off and give the fans more incentive to come back in a few weeks.  Love the support that Bubba and his team provide.

Where does the Big Sky find their officials?  They are terrible for he most part.  A Montana player grabbed the rim TWICE while we had a shot in the air in the second half and it wasn't called either time.  The first time it was Bernstine shooting it but it went in anyways.  Still should have been whistle for goaltending.  The second one on Crandall's shot was far more egregious and impactful.  I that should have been an and 1.  

I would like to see a list of what the budgets are for every NCAA conference for salaries for officials.  My bet is that the Big Sky is dead last.  There have been some doozies on the football side as well over the years.....

[fightingsioux4life]

18 hours ago, Teeder11 said:

I was thinking that too but on a bit of a more limited contract to see if it's a flash in the pan. The players we have now are talented. They too will have vote in how this team fares moving forward. Jones can have the greatest plans in the world on paper but if Q and company don't execute, then it's all for naught. 

Wasn't this the main case to keep Mussman?

[fightingsioux4life]

Just now, bincitysioux said:

Well I thought they played pretty well throughout.  Yes, frustrating that they couldn't close it out at home (similar to NDSU).  Cant really pick on anything about Jones from yesterday from what I saw.  I'm sure he was disappointed too that they didn't close it out when they should have, so I am not concerned about his expedited trip through the hand shake line.

Crowd was great yesterday, very nice atmosphere.  This community and school really wants to support a winner.  Was hoping they would pull it off and give the fans more incentive to come back in a few weeks.  Love the support that Bubba and his team provide.

Where does the Big Sky find their officials?  They are terrible for he most part.  A Montana player grabbed the rim TWICE while we had a shot in the air in the second half and it wasn't called either time.  The first time it was Bernstine shooting it but it went in anyways.  Still should have been whistle for goaltending.  The second one on Crandall's shot was far more egregious and impactful.  I that should have been an and 1.  

I would like to see a list of what the budgets are for every NCAA conference for salaries for officials.  My bet is that the Big Sky is dead last.  There have been some doozies on the football side as well over the years.....

I was joking with my buddy at the game yesterday that I think the MBB refs are using the FB refs as role models.

[sioux24/7]

1 minute ago, bincitysioux said:

Where does the Big Sky find their officials?  They are terrible for he most part.  A Montana player grabbed the rim TWICE while we had a shot in the air in the second half and it wasn't called either time.  The first time it was Bernstine shooting it but it went in anyways.  Still should have been whistle for goaltending.  The second one on Crandall's shot was far more egregious and impactful.  I that should have been an and 1.  

I would like to see a list of what the budgets are for every NCAA conference for salaries for officials.  My bet is that the Big Sky is dead last.  There have been some doozies on the football side as well over the years.....

When Bernstine's happened I figured we would have got a whistle if it would not have gone in but then seeing Geno's I am not so sure that would have been the case. Pretty pathetic. For any that watched the game on tv was Geno's block that they called goaltending actually? I could not tell if the ball hit the backboard before he hit the ball. Either way quite the athletic play by him. After watching him Thursday, I think he may be our most athletic player with Collins being a close second.

[sioux24/7]

Also, I was just thinking about Q this year and I think he needs to understand he does not need to be the guy this year. He took a bad 3 at the end of the game and I am not a fan of his fading away deep 2s. His vision is still fantastic and he's a really good scorer but I just hope he knows he doesn't need to do it all this year like he did last.

[UND-FB-FAN]

10 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said:

Wasn't this the main case to keep Mussman?

Yes, and it is entirely incorrect. Head coaches "head" their respective programs; they hire their staff, recruit their players, and institute their schemes and systems. If a PROGRAM is underperforming, then it falls on the head coach, not the student-athletes that the head coach decided upon and brought into the program. Look at the entire body of work for North Dakota men's basketball over the past 10 years - it's not good enough, and that is due to poor leadership from Brian Jones.

[UND-1]

6 minutes ago, sioux24/7 said:

When Bernstine's happened I figured we would have got a whistle if it would not have gone in but then seeing Geno's I am not so sure that would have been the case. Pretty pathetic. For any that watched the game on tv was Geno's block that they called goaltending actually? I could not tell if the ball hit the backboard before he hit the ball. Either way quite the athletic play by him. After watching him Thursday, I think he may be our most athletic player with Collins being a close second.

Yes it hit the backboard first.  Close but it did.

[Teeder11]

20 minutes ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

Yes, and it is entirely incorrect. Head coaches "head" their respective programs; they hire their staff, recruit their players, and institute their schemes and systems. If a PROGRAM is underperforming, then it falls on the head coach, not the student-athletes that the head coach decided upon and brought into the program. Look at the entire body of work for North Dakota men's basketball over the past 10 years - it's not good enough, and that is due to poor leadership from Brian Jones.

I don't nrcessarily disagree. I just want to wait for the end of the season to make these  important decisions.  A lot of basketball to be played. 

I never opposed Muss's canning nor did I lead the torch and pitchfork brigade to make it happen. I fancy myself a cool head when it comes to these moves, somewhere in the middle of the Fire Now crowd and the defend at all costs crowd  

i think it's important to take a step back when the time is right, assess the situation when the heat of the season is over and make a careful calculated and pragmatic decision for the good of the program and its student athletes. That said,  I think the powers that be would be wise to have a short list of replacement candidates in mind , just in case .

 

 

 

 

 

[Oxbow6]

20 hours ago, Teeder11 said:

Jones was appropriate today given the scenario. 

That assessment is as embarrassing as Jones own behavior.

[Teeder11]

However, I think the Jones' antics critique is a bit overblown and somewhat disengenuous. One team's embarrassment is another team's brash and passionate wild man with a give-a-crap attitude toward the self-annoited elite of the league.  

Yesterday's "incident," as an isolated case, was definitely a contrived controversy on the part of Montana's coach, IMHO. I would go so far as to contend Deciure wants to use it as fuel for the fire that he'll want his team to play with when they meet again in Missoula to end the regular season.  The Missoula paper alluded to as much this morning. 

I think UND put that much of a scare into them, they know they'll have a lot handle in the rematch. 

[Teeder11]

12 minutes ago, Oxbow6 said:

That assessment is as embarrassing as Jones own behavior.

I respectfully disagree. 

[Oxbow6]

I'll admit I probably don't attend as many MBB games as some giving opinions here but there has never been a time at a game that I thought Jones antics and behavior was anything less than childish and unprofessional. Yesterday's moment when addressing the Griz head coach post game was just who Jones is and once again highlighted his character and the poor example he sets for the young men he is supposed to lead.

[UNDvince97-01]

2 hours ago, Teeder11 said:

However, I think the Jones' antics critique is a bit overblown and somewhat disengenuous. One team's embarrassment is another team's brash and passionate wild man with a give-a-crap attitude toward the self-annoited elite of the league.  

Yesterday's "incident," as an isolated case, was definitely a contrived controversy on the part of Montana's coach, IMHO. I would go so far as to contend Deciure wants to use it as fuel for the fire that he'll want his team to play with when they meet again in Missoula to end the regular season.  The Missoula paper alluded to as much this morning. 

I think UND put that much of a scare into them, they know they'll have a lot handle in the rematch. 

Disengenuous?  Cmon...

Nobody is making this stuff up out of thin air.  When a coach stops to talk to another coach at the handshake to say a few words, you give them that courtesy, Deciure, Jacobson or otherwise.  If you dont like what they are saying, then by all means move along.  He never even game him a chance.

Again, this is not a one-time occurrence.  Ask Ben Jacobson, the UND alum who was coaching Brian Jones' alma mater and was kind enough to schedule UND at the Betty.  This is not isolated.  Just an example.

Some believe this behavior is acceptable.  Others do not.

For what it's worth, I went back and watched it again to make sure I wasn't making stuff up in my imagination.

We havent even begun to talk about the on the court stuff.  Montana finished the game on a 10-0 run.  We all know how the 2nd half of the ndsu game went.

I respect your difference of opinion, but disengenuous?

I'll give you the last word on this debate, if you want it.

[CMSioux]

1 hour ago, Teeder11 said:

I don't nrcessarily disagree. I just want to wait for the end of the season to make these  important decisions.  A lot of basketball to be played. 

I never opposed Muss's canning nor did I lead the torch and pitchfork brigade to make it happen. I fancy myself a cool head when it comes to these moves, somewhere in the middle of the Fire Now crowd and the defend at all costs crowd  

i think it's important to take a step back when the time is right, assess the situation when the heat of the season is over and make a careful calculated and pragmatic decision for the good of the program and its student athletes. That said,  I think the powers that be would be wise to have a short list of replacement candidates in mind , just in case .

 

 

 

 

 

I dont remember anyone being a defend at all costs if you weren't in the "fire him now" camp you were labeled a defend at all cost.

 

[F'n Hawks]

The Jacobson handshake was worse

[dakotadan]

3 hours ago, Teeder11 said:

...but I just want to see how the season plays out first before I start calling for someone's head. 

 

1 hour ago, Teeder11 said:

I just want to wait for the end of the season to make these  important decisions.  A lot of basketball to be played.  

I'm sorry but I don't understand this. Isn't a decade a large enough sample size? What do you need to see in the next month and a half that will help you decide if Jones should continue on as the head coach or not? 

[Teeder11]

35 minutes ago, CMSioux said:

I dont remember anyone being a defend at all costs if you weren't in the "fire him now" camp you were labeled a defend at all cost.

 

That's a good point. 

[Teeder11]

7 minutes ago, dakotadan said:

 

I'm sorry but I don't understand this. Isn't a decade a large enough sample size? What do you need to see in the next month and a half that will help you decide if Jones should continue on as the head coach or not? 

I'm just saying if UND wins the tourney and gets the autobid, then how do you fire someone like that? Not saying this is likely, but what if ...  Just a little premature to know for sure that you will fire a guy without knowing how the season ends.  I don't think that's too much to ask.