North Dakota at Canisius January 4-5, 2019

[stoneySIOUX]

Just now, tnt said:

You stress that we work hard.  Do you think the most talented guy on our roster, Grant Mismash, works hard consistently?

Consistently, sure. Certainly not always. What's your point? 

[tnt]

1 minute ago, stoneySIOUX said:

I'm an analytics guy, so I'd disagree. I promise I'm not just being contrarian haha. 

In this particular Corsi piece, it supports my premise with most of the Top 20 teams in Corsi being pretty successful -- 

So you're saying Corsi is more important than goals?  You're arguing just for the sake of arguing. 

[stoneySIOUX]

Just now, tnt said:

So you're saying Corsi is more important than goals?  You're arguing just for the sake of arguing. 

How did you get that out of what I said? 

I literally just said USUALLY possession leads to goals and we're a part of the outlier.

[tnt]

9 minutes ago, brianvf said:

That's the problem with the last two seasons...woulda, coulda, shoulda.

Berry isn't going anywhere after this season, but something needs to change.  If that means bringing in a different assistant to run the abysmal PP, then so be it.
Hoping that some of our recruits that are doing so well right now can come in and score some goals.  And that's asking a lot to pin the hopes of next year's team on a freshman class.

That's my concern, that next year we will hear that you can't count on freshmen to lead you, then the next year, well we lost JBD or someone else, and so on...    The fact is Denver isn't missing a beat with a rookie coach who lost all of his elite players.  Could Denver come back down to earth a bit, sure, but don't see them slipping out of the tournament at this point.  

[tnt]

7 minutes ago, stoneySIOUX said:

How did you get that out of what I said? 

I literally just said USUALLY possession leads to goals and we're a part of the outlier.

I said the only analytic that matters is scoring more than you give up, and you said you disagreed.  

[stoneySIOUX]

4 minutes ago, tnt said:

I said the only analytic that matters is scoring more than you give up, and you said you disagreed.  

Lol alright, man. I was disagreeing with the idea that you brought up that analytics are a problem as to why UND isn't winning games this year, but ok. Your view is simplistic and that's fine. 

I said that possession USUALLY leads to goals. We're an outlier. 

[scpa0305]

14 minutes ago, tnt said:

So you're saying Corsi is more important than goals?  You're arguing just for the sake of arguing. 

No he isn't, corsi is actually a great statistic.  It shows who (typically) has the best players....as they are able to possess the puck throughout the game.  The worst situation to be in during a game is puck chasing.  Once a team starts chasing for long stretches of the game they typically lose.  Our issue is that our special teams (PK & PP) are terrible and our ozone strategy is about as bland as it gets.  So while we have the horses to play keep away, other metrics currently weigh us down.  So while we can talking about top 3 corsi, which is great and all, we should probably be focusing on the poor metrics.

[stoneySIOUX]

2 minutes ago, scpa0305 said:

No he isn't, corsi is actually a great statistic.  It shows who (typically) has the best players....as they are able to possess the puck throughout the game.  The worst situation to be in during a game is puck chasing.  Once a team starts chasing for long stretches of the game they typically lose.  Our issue is that our special teams (PK & PP) are terrible and our ozone strategy is about as bland as it gets.  So while we have the horses to play keep away, other metrics currently weigh us down.  So while we can talking about top 3 corsi, which is great and all, we should probably be focusing on the poor metrics.

Shooting percentage is glaring. Awful, awful stuff.

Creativity is huge with this, but maybe we start just piling in front, at this point, and keep firing since we have possession. We have no one that is picking corners, at this point. 

[90siouxfan]

2 hours ago, The Sicatoka said:

Where in this lineup is the guy that strikes fear into opposing defenses? 

That's the problem. 

While this is true, who in the Canisius line up is such a person?  We are playing below the level of our abilities, why?

[tnt]

6 minutes ago, scpa0305 said:

No he isn't, corsi is actually a great statistic.  It shows who (typically) has the best players....as they are able to possess the puck throughout the game.  The worst situation to be in during a game is puck chasing.  Once a team starts chasing for long stretches of the game they typically lose.  Our issue is that our special teams (PK & PP) are terrible and our ozone strategy is about as bland as it gets.  So while we have the horses to play keep away, other metrics currently weigh us down.  So while we can talking about top 3 corsi, which is great and all, we should probably be focusing on the poor metrics.

I know, but that was his direct response to my point that goals are the most important analytic.  

[Oxbow6]

The "poor metric" that I'd like to see less of is in the loss column. Less checks in that metric would help. 

[tnt]

Shouldn't we also be concerned then that our coach that is out recruiting says that this is the most talented team since the Championship team?   

[stoneySIOUX]

8 minutes ago, tnt said:

I know, but that was his direct response to my point that goals are the most important analytic.  

No, it actually wasn't. But, ok. 

[stoneySIOUX]

9 minutes ago, Oxbow6 said:

The "poor metric" that I'd like to see less of is in the loss column. Less checks in that metric would help. 

Yeah, we all agree with that. 

[Siouxphan27]

22 minutes ago, scpa0305 said:

No he isn't, corsi is actually a great statistic.  It shows who (typically) has the best players....as they are able to possess the puck throughout the game.  The worst situation to be in during a game is puck chasing.  Once a team starts chasing for long stretches of the game they typically lose.  Our issue is that our special teams (PK & PP) are terrible and our ozone strategy is about as bland as it gets.  So while we have the horses to play keep away, other metrics currently weigh us down.  So while we can talking about top 3 corsi, which is great and all, we should probably be focusing on the poor metrics.

So then in a nut shell, the real problem is coaching.  

[stoneySIOUX]

11 minutes ago, Siouxphan27 said:

So then in a nut shell, the real problem is coaching.  

That, or guys who have put the puck in the net before aren't putting the put in the net. We have SOGs, but not a good scoring percentage. Probably a mix of both factors.

[Sodbuster]

On the bright side, we most likely will not have anyone sign early this year.........wait.....maybe that's not a bright side.

[The Sicatoka]

10 minutes ago, Sodbuster said:

On the bright side, we most likely will not have anyone sign early this year.........wait.....maybe that's not a bright side.

I see some housecleaning that need be done. 

[tnt]

We will win twice this weekend, and really if our talent is as bad as it appears at times  we shouldn't be able to sweep.   But I think you will see how they can play when they really put their mind to it and feel like they have something to prove.   I guess we'll see if I'm right about that. 

[Irish]

5 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

I see some housecleaning that need be done. 

Everyone keeps mentioning the Junior class as the reason for our woes.  Why are they still passengers on this bus - and will they get another free ticket next year and ruin that year too?

[siouxfan512]

16 hours ago, TravellingSiouxFan said:

It’s people like you that don’t understand hockey. They didn’t get their ass kicked....they did play their most complete game yet on Saturday. Get your head out of your ass

Maybe they want to come play a complete game against my men's league team, we could use a couple more wins too.

[ChrisUND1]

Regarding shots on goal and victories:  UND is a statistical outlier...but why?  Is it simply bad luck?  I don't think so.

Are guys not screening goalie?  Not getting the rebounds for the greasy goals?  Is the shot on target?  Is it a shot designed to rebound off the goalie pad so a guy can get the rebound and score?  Is it a hard shot?  Did the player hold on a split second too long so the goalie could get into better position?  Did a guy take a shot instead of passing to the open guy?  etc etc

 

[tnt]

1 hour ago, scpa0305 said:

No he isn't, corsi is actually a great statistic.  It shows who (typically) has the best players....as they are able to possess the puck throughout the game.  The worst situation to be in during a game is puck chasing.  Once a team starts chasing for long stretches of the game they typically lose.  Our issue is that our special teams (PK & PP) are terrible and our ozone strategy is about as bland as it gets.  So while we have the horses to play keep away, other metrics currently weigh us down.  So while we can talking about top 3 corsi, which is great and all, we should probably be focusing on the poor metrics.

 True, but those stats can lie as well.  The coaches talked a  blue streak last year about the puck possession numbers of Simonson and Olson, and even had them playing frequently when we needed a goal to catch up.   You absolutely need guys like that on your team, but not so sure the ice time down the stretch was warranted simply because they possessed the puck well.  Another thing that jumps out at me that points to lack of aggression is our shorthanded goals over the past two years.  It was nice that Senden got one the other night, but it would be interesting to see shorthanded goals for and against across college hockey the last few years.  

[stoneySIOUX]

8 minutes ago, Irish said:

Everyone keeps mentioning the Junior class as the reason for our woes.  Why are they still passengers on this bus - and will they get another free ticket next year and ruin that year too?

I've wrestled with this one before, too. It's such a hard line to balance. Say we yank a couple under performing schollies and a player or two leaves, what does that say to our recruits? Sure, it could mean that we don't accept under performance, but it's also a commentary that if you don't produce, you're gone. This could cause pause to good recruits. 

It sucks that a guy like Donavan is leaving because he knows he doesn't have a spot, next year. But, yanking schollies doesn't feel like the best for our program long term.

[scpa0305]

1 minute ago, stoneySIOUX said:

I've wrestled with this one before, too. It's such a hard line to balance. Say we yank a couple under performing schollies and a player or two leaves, what does that say to our recruits? Sure, it could mean that we don't accept under performance, but it's also a commentary that if you don't produce, you're gone. This could cause pause to good recruits. 

It sucks that a guy like Donavan is leaving because he knows he doesn't have a spot, next year. But, yanking schollies doesn't feel like the best for our program long term.

We have multiple current players and several commits that need a wake up call.