Drop Fighting Hawks name

[Cratter]

36 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Imagine that, Schlossman had to immediately correct him on his post being incorrect. He literally couldn't copy the WDAZ article he cited. 

Schlossman response isn't guaranteed to be accurate either...unless someone is counting the number of former and current "Fighting Hawks" announced....Which apparently Brad is doing?

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They are still using it the same number of times as before, they just changed when they use it.

 

WDAZ

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So for now, it's been removed from parts of the game, But the university still has the name scripted into pregame ceremonies and in other places during the production. So it's almost certain that fans should get used to their new name.

Who knows UND could decide they think it might have the "opposite effect" where they replaced it and could decide to remove it completely.

Here comes your "Fighting Hawks" (during intros...and BOOOOOO the whole team?) doesn't seem to be any better (if not worse overall). 

But yes Rob, and his headlines always seem to be very "misleading." The point remains: The new nickname is so unpopular UND has changed the way they use it at UND athletic events because of booos.

[darell1976]

17 minutes ago, UND1983 said:

I love the "11,000 people booing" part.  More like 1,000.

11k sounds better for print. Those 1k booing will decrease. Not saying Fighting Hawks could land Looker out of a job if the new president doesn't like that omission. Don't people realize changes that could happen to the REA when UND gains control of the building? If you see a Hawk next to a Sioux logo, reality will really set in. 

[Cratter]

11 minutes ago, darell1976 said:

 Don't people realize changes that could happen to the REA when UND gains control of the building?

Don't hold you're breathe. 

[darell1976]

17 minutes ago, Cratter said:

Don't hold you're breathe. 

At least the Sioux logos will stay, Ralph made sure of that.

[hrkac]

2 hours ago, darell1976 said:

11k sounds better for print. Those 1k booing will decrease. Not saying Fighting Hawks could land Looker out of a job if the new president doesn't like that omission. Don't people realize changes that could happen to the REA when UND gains control of the building? If you see a Hawk next to a Sioux logo, reality will really set in. 

Why would the hell would the Engelstad's give control to UND? 

[82SiouxGuy]

1 hour ago, hrkac said:

Why would the hell would the Engelstad's give control to UND? 

Because UND owns the land, the lease on the land is for a limited time, and there is supposed to be a contract to turn the building over to UND after a specific time (I believe it was 30 years from the time it opened). And the donation was made for the benefit of the University of North Dakota.

[The Sicatoka]

Here's what hurts me the worst:

If Ralph had lived we'd have come through this much better. Ralph had vision and was a businessman. He probably wouldn't like or agree with it, but he could change as the business environment changed around him. And he was pragmatic. He would've led a move to a new name and it would've had de facto fan base wide support. 

How dare I say that?

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However, Ralph Engelstad was apparently aware the winds of political correctness were already changing. (Former UND Alumni CEO, and Engelstad friend, and member of the REA Board, Earl) Strinden revealed today that during a meeting in the late 1990’s with then President Kupchella and Engelstad in Las Vegas, that Engelstad suggested the Fighting Sioux nickname and logo be kept for 5 years and then changed.

That's from a November 12, 2015, KVLY news story. Ralph saw change coming already in the late 1990s.

Think about this: Ralph said "five years" in the late 1990s. Gee, about five years later what opened? REA. Imagine if Ralph's idea had passed muster and the arena would've been rolled out with a new nickname as well, with Ralph's imprimatur. 

Source: http://www.valleynewslive.com/home/headlines/UND-Nickname-Ralph-Engelstads-possible-response-to-controversy-may-surprise-you-346958212.html

 

[Trunk Monkey]

The world we live in....my vehicle has a Fighting Sioux Forever sticker on it and I have a Fighting Sioux trailer hitch cover.  Someone tried to take the sticker off the car and ripped it in half and the trailer hitch cover is gone.  I suppose some would feel this is ok as it probably offended someone and it should be removed.  I think it is a bunch of crap that it has come to this....for those that don't know better, that would be call vandalism and stealing. 

[Oxbow6]

6 minutes ago, Trunk Monkey said:

The world we live in....my vehicle has a Fighting Sioux Forever sticker on it and I have a Fighting Sioux trailer hitch cover.  Someone tried to take the sticker off the car and ripped it in half and the trailer hitch cover is gone.  I suppose some would feel this is ok as it probably offended someone and it should be removed.  I think it is a bunch of crap that it has come to this....for those that don't know better, that would be call vandalism and stealing. 

But Monkey if one is offended they have rights too.........................and their actions, regardless if illegal or immoral, are justified by many.

[82SiouxGuy]

1 hour ago, The Sicatoka said:

Here's what hurts me the worst:

If Ralph had lived we'd have come through this much better. Ralph had vision and was a businessman. He probably wouldn't like or agree with it, but he could change as the business environment changed around him. And he was pragmatic. He would've led a move to a new name and it would've had de facto fan base wide support. 

How dare I say that?

That's from a November 12, 2015, KVLY news story. Ralph saw change coming already in the late 1990s.

Think about this: Ralph said "five years" in the late 1990s. Gee, about five years later what opened? REA. Imagine if Ralph's idea had passed muster and the arena would've been rolled out with a new nickname as well, with Ralph's imprimatur. 

Source: http://www.valleynewslive.com/home/headlines/UND-Nickname-Ralph-Engelstads-possible-response-to-controversy-may-surprise-you-346958212.html

 

There have been other reports that Ralph saw the name change coming. He spent time studying the issue, including looking at the relationship between Florida State and the Seminole tribes. That was reported years ago, including Ralph telling UND that they should work on their relationship with the tribes.

Kupchella started as president in 1999, so the conversation discussed in that story must have happened in 1999. 5 years from then would have been 2004, so Ralph missed predicting the NCAA mandate by 1 year.

[UNDBIZ]

1 hour ago, Trunk Monkey said:

The world we live in....my vehicle has a Fighting Sioux Forever sticker on it and I have a Fighting Sioux trailer hitch cover.  Someone tried to take the sticker off the car and ripped it in half and the trailer hitch cover is gone.  I suppose some would feel this is ok as it probably offended someone and it should be removed.  I think it is a bunch of crap that it has come to this....for those that don't know better, that would be call vandalism and stealing. 

I doubt it was someone who was offended.  More likely a fan of a rival school....

[Teeder11]

Just now, UNDBIZ said:

I doubt it was someone who was offended.  More likely a fan of a rival school....

Exactly.  Still sucks.

[Oxbow6]

17 minutes ago, UNDBIZ said:

I doubt it was someone who was offended.  More likely a fan of a rival school....

Problem with that theory is Monkey is Kelley's next door neighbor.................

[Trunk Monkey]

I agree...I am just upset that it is gone and not something I can go out and get ever again.  Could have been a Sioux hater, a Sioux fan or just a random act.....it is what it is and you move on.

[Trunk Monkey]

1 hour ago, Oxbow6 said:

But Monkey if one is offended they have rights too.........................and their actions, regardless if illegal or immoral, are justified by many.

And you called me "But Monkey" which kind of made me laugh (and did not offend me).  If you can't laugh at yourself, who can you laugh at?  Pretty witty!

[Oxbow6]

3 minutes ago, Trunk Monkey said:

And you called me "But Monkey" which kind of made me laugh (and did not offend me).  If you can't laugh at yourself, who can you laugh at?  Pretty witty!

Not exactly.... I said "but" not "butt".  

 

I'm UND educated............

[dlsiouxfan]

This whole thing is beginning to have me question the quality of my UND education.  We have fanbase that is so upset about a nickname they had a fairly strong voice in choosing that they are willing to boo their own teams.  Meanwhile, these exact same people will turn out in November to elect the guy with the most responsibility for the loss of the old nickname (Wayne Stenehjem) the next governor of ND.  It doesn't really get any more idiotic than that.

[Ray77]

12 minutes ago, dlsiouxfan said:

This whole thing is beginning to have me question the quality of my UND education.  We have fanbase that is so upset about a nickname they had a fairly strong voice in choosing that they are willing to boo their own teams.  Meanwhile, these exact same people will turn out in November to elect the guy with the most responsibility for the loss of the old nickname (Wayne Stenehjem) the next governor of ND.  It doesn't really get any more idiotic than that.

This...

[darell1976]

6 hours ago, Trunk Monkey said:

The world we live in....my vehicle has a Fighting Sioux Forever sticker on it and I have a Fighting Sioux trailer hitch cover.  Someone tried to take the sticker off the car and ripped it in half and the trailer hitch cover is gone.  I suppose some would feel this is ok as it probably offended someone and it should be removed.  I think it is a bunch of crap that it has come to this....for those that don't know better, that would be call vandalism and stealing. 

Vandalism and/or stealing ones property is wrong no matter what school it represents. 

[UND1981]

2 hours ago, dlsiouxfan said:

This whole thing is beginning to have me question the quality of my UND education.  We have fanbase that is so upset about a nickname they had a fairly strong voice in choosing that they are willing to boo their own teams.  Meanwhile, these exact same people will turn out in November to elect the guy with the most responsibility for the loss of the old nickname (Wayne Stenehjem) the next governor of ND.  It doesn't really get any more idiotic than that.

You may be right but I sure will not vote for him for this very reason!

[Fetch]

2 hours ago, dlsiouxfan said:

This whole thing is beginning to have me question the quality of my UND education.  We have fanbase that is so upset about a nickname they had a fairly strong voice in choosing that they are willing to boo their own teams.  Meanwhile, these exact same people will turn out in November to elect the guy with the most responsibility for the loss of the old nickname (Wayne Stenehjem) the next governor of ND.  It doesn't really get any more idiotic than that.

Well said & I agree & it has nothing to do with party politics 

[Fetch]

The problem is most don't get this & he has never had to explain what he did or didn't do & why

[dakotadan]

3 hours ago, dlsiouxfan said:

the guy with the most responsibility for the loss of the old nickname (Wayne Stenehjem) 

You obviously weren't paying very close attention for the last 40+ years while the nickname drama was playing out. There is plenty of blame to go around for the loss of the Sioux nickname. Wayne is hardly at the top of that list. 

[Fetch]

Umm the surrender agreement & letting the ncaa dictate the need for approval of 2 Tribes when Florida only had to get one - We got the one nearest to us - while Standing Rock was controlled by hostile leaders & most of the tribe is in SD 

?

[dakotadan]

So you were sitting in the negotiation meetings? Please tell us more about what the NCAA came into the meetings requiring and what UND was asking for.