CMSioux Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 He has already publicly stated that will never happen - of course if you have issues with Kelly you don't believe that anyway. Quote
jdub27 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 How long do you think it will be before Kelly tries to publicly discourage the wearing of Sioux Jerseys to games? He won't and has publicly stated so multiple times. Terrible strawman argument. The reason a new nickname needs to be chosen is because the majority of those that want no nickname prefer that so they can continue using Fighting Sioux unofficially. If that's not a direct violation of the settlement agreement (debatable) it is certainly against the spirit of it. Quote
tnt Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 Personally, I haven't bought any UND merchandise without the logo, not out of protest, but because everything else looks so generic and lame. I'm sure they could come up with something I would buy, but the ND logo inside a circle doesn't do anything for me. So many more possibilities with an actual logo. 1 Quote
The Sicatoka Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 The reason a new nickname needs to be chosen is because the majority of those that want no nickname prefer that so they can continue using Fighting Sioux unofficially. If that's not a direct violation of the settlement agreement (debatable) it is certainly against the spirit of it. Yup. And that's not the way North Dakotans (other than "try to renege on the settlement agreement" Al Carlson) do business. Personally, I haven't bought any UND merchandise without the logo, not out of protest, but because everything else looks so generic and lame. I'm sure they could come up with something I would buy, but the ND logo inside a circle doesn't do anything for me. So many more possibilities with an actual logo. Yup. 1 Quote
SWSiouxMN Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 Personally, I haven't bought any UND merchandise without the logo, not out of protest, but because everything else looks so generic and lame. I'm sure they could come up with something I would buy, but the ND logo inside a circle doesn't do anything for me. So many more possibilities with an actual logo. I really, really do not like our hockey jerseys. That plain text North Dakota in the middle does nothing for me too. The women's green jersey with the script writing on it on the other hand I like a lot and really wish the men had adopted that instead. I would have been more willing to throw down the money to get a green jersey. Quote
siouxfan512 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 He has already publicly stated that will never happen - of course if you have issues with Kelly you don't believe that anyway. I wasn't being serious on that one, but obviously the tone was lost through my typing. Just not a fan of the guy at all. I know he would not do that, nor do I think he could do it, even if he wanted to. Quote
siouxfan512 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 He won't and has publicly stated so multiple times. Terrible strawman argument. The reason a new nickname needs to be chosen is because the majority of those that want no nickname prefer that so they can continue using Fighting Sioux unofficially. If that's not a direct violation of the settlement agreement (debatable) it is certainly against the spirit of it. You do realize that regardless of what the school does, those same fans will still cheer for, refer to the team as, and we apparel of The Fighting Sioux. What do you think the coaching staff call them? They won't start saying play Roughrider Hockey, or Oiler Hockey. They will continue referring to it as Fighting Sioux Hockey. End of the Anthem, everyone will still yell SIOUX. If you think leaving it as University of North Dakota is the only way UND fans unofficially keep Fighting Sioux, your're crazy. That will stay regardless. So why force something upon people that most (not all) do not want? If the consencus is that the current logo and jerseys are lame, UND could spend alot less money and redesign them. I'm not nuts about the Jersey's either, but they are probably better that whatever is going to come out of all of this. Quote
Nodaker Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 If we don't pick something, something will happen and someone (probably without UND's best interests in mind) will find a less than completely complimentary tag to stick on us. (See: the Brooklyn Trolley Dodgers) I'm sure our wonderfully helpful neighbors to the south are working feverishly to fill the void that'd be open in a "no nickname" world. New nickname or no nickname, this will happen. Quote
jdub27 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 You do realize that regardless of what the school does, those same fans will still cheer for, refer to the team as, and we apparel of The Fighting Sioux. What do you think the coaching staff call them? They won't start saying play Roughrider Hockey, or Oiler Hockey. They will continue referring to it as Fighting Sioux Hockey. End of the Anthem, everyone will still yell SIOUX. If you think leaving it as University of North Dakota is the only way UND fans unofficially keep Fighting Sioux, your're crazy. That will stay regardless. So why force something upon people that most (not all) do not want? If the consencus is that the current logo and jerseys are lame, UND could spend alot less money and redesign them. I'm not nuts about the Jersey's either, but they are probably better that whatever is going to come out of all of this.At this point there is no alternative so it is the easy thing to do. Once there is one, I feel pretty confident the majority will be able to move on. History has shown that to be the case at numerous other schools. It may take a little time, but I don't really UND being different. That doesn't mean you still won't see Sioux gear (myself included) but there will be a noticeable change in the tide. Quote
siouxfan512 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 At this point there is no alternative so it is the easy thing to do. Once there is one, I feel pretty confident the majority will be able to move on. History has shown that to be the case at numerous other schools. It may take a little time, but I don't really UND being different. That doesn't mean you still won't see Sioux gear (myself included) but there will be a noticeable change in the tide. True, you may get some people that shift, but I think it would be mostly new people coming to the school with no connection to it. Even there, I don't see the majority switching. Big time hockey school in a fairly small town community. I just think the name means too much to too many people. I for one would never refer to going to a game as anything other that watching Sioux Hockey, I just see alot of people being the same way. I certainly wouldn't put on anything other than a Sioux Jersey, and have no intentions of buying my kids apparel that says anything other than Fighting Sioux or North Dakota. Just can bring myself to referring to the team as anything else. I guess only time will tell as to what will happen, but I do think that if a good chunk of people want no nickname, it should at least be included in the voting options. Quote
nodakhoops Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 True, you may get some people that shift, but I think it would be mostly new people coming to the school with no connection to it. Even there, I don't see the majority switching. Big time hockey school in a fairly small town community. I just think the name means too much to too many people. I for one would never refer to going to a game as anything other that watching Sioux Hockey, I just see alot of people being the same way. I certainly wouldn't put on anything other than a Sioux Jersey, and have no intentions of buying my kids apparel that says anything other than Fighting Sioux or North Dakota. Just can bring myself to referring to the team as anything else. I guess only time will tell as to what will happen, but I do think that if a good chunk of people want no nickname, it should at least be included in the voting options. Here is a list of schools (most bigger and bigger followings) than UND that have changed their nickname for this very reason. Stanford University – Indians to Cardinal (1972) Eastern Michigan – Hurons to Eagles (1991) St. John's (N.Y.) – Redman to Red Storm (1994) Marquette – Warriors to Golden Eagles (1994 Miami (Ohio) – Redskins to RedHawks (1997) Louisiana-Monroe – Indiana to Warhawks (2006) Arkansas State – Indians to Red Wolves (2008) If some of these schools can do it UND will be just fine. I would prefer UND go nameless as well, but long term that isn't what is best for the school. People move on, and so will UND fans. 50 years from now the only people who will remember Fighting Sioux are the people 20 and older and they'll be in their 70s or older. Let's not drag this out anymore, get a good nickname with a cool logo design and start moving on. Quote
The Sicatoka Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 Eastern Michigan – Hurons to Eagles (1991) I always thought they blew it going to Eagles. Their answer was obvious: The Eastern Michigan University Emus. Yes, the EMU Emus! Logo. Quote
siouxfan512 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 Here is a list of schools (most bigger and bigger followings) than UND that have changed their nickname for this very reason. Stanford University – Indians to Cardinal (1972) Eastern Michigan – Hurons to Eagles (1991) St. John's (N.Y.) – Redman to Red Storm (1994) Marquette – Warriors to Golden Eagles (1994 Miami (Ohio) – Redskins to RedHawks (1997) Louisiana-Monroe – Indiana to Warhawks (2006) Arkansas State – Indians to Red Wolves (2008) If some of these schools can do it UND will be just fine. I would prefer UND go nameless as well, but long term that isn't what is best for the school. People move on, and so will UND fans. 50 years from now the only people who will remember Fighting Sioux are the people 20 and older and they'll be in their 70s or older. Let's not drag this out anymore, get a good nickname with a cool logo design and start moving on. I really hate this ... but I do wonder, why does it really matter if they have a nickname or not? I mean, how does not having a nickname harm the school? Apparel Revenue? I don't really see that. I only ask because, they have been operating just fine as UND, what is the issue with leaving it alone? Quote
Siouxperfan7 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 No nickmame supporters = Fighting Sioux Forever crowd = hockey only fans. In my opinion, The majority of people in each one of these groups can be lumped in to one group. And that group are the ones that are holding back this University from moving forward. My question is are you a fan of the Fighting Sioux name, or a fan of the University of North Dakota. If you truly are a fan of the University of North Dakota, you will cheer your team on no matter what name they are called. If you are just a fan of the name and logo, you will contiue to wear your Sioux clothing at games and stubornly cheer for the old name even after a new one has been adopted. I understand the feeling that you have for the Fighting Sioux name. I have lived in Grand Forks for my entire life. Grew up cheering for the Sioux at a very young age. There is a deep sense of pride that goes with the Sioux name and the teams that played to represent it. But the time has come to accept the reality that the name is gone and it is time to move on to the next chapter of UND athletics. No one said you have to burn all your Fighting Sioux apparel and erase the momory of the Fighting Sioux name forever. All I ask is for those people to stop holding the University back and handcuffing the rest of us UND fans and join us and unite under a new name. 3 Quote
ericpnelson Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 I always thought they blew it going to Eagles. Their answer was obvious: The Eastern Michigan University Emus. Yes, the EMU Emus! Logo. I think someone probably suggested it, but once challenged, no one was willing to stick their neck out for it +1. Quote
UND-1 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 No nickmame supporters = Fighting Sioux Forever crowd = hockey only fans. This ^^^^^. The only reason they want "no nickname" is there would then be a shred of hope the old name would come back. 2 Quote
siouxfan512 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 This ^^^^^. The only reason they want "no nickname" is there would then be a shred of hope the old name would come back. Not really, I don't ever expect the name to come back. They is beyond improbable, and would be really ignorant; the name is gone. What I don't understand is how going be "University of North Dakota" vs any other nickname is "Holding the University Back"? Keeping Fighting Sioux as the official name and logo would have been holding the University back, as we could not participate in NC$$ events, or host post season events. But how is going by "University of North Dakota" holding the school back? That particular argument just doesn't make sense to me. 1 Quote
siouxfan512 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 No nickmame supporters = Fighting Sioux Forever crowd = hockey only fans. In my opinion, The majority of people in each one of these groups can be lumped in to one group. And that group are the ones that are holding back this University from moving forward. My question is are you a fan of the Fighting Sioux name, or a fan of the University of North Dakota. If you truly are a fan of the University of North Dakota, you will cheer your team on no matter what name they are called. If you are just a fan of the name and logo, you will contiue to wear your Sioux clothing at games and stubornly cheer for the old name even after a new one has been adopted. I understand the feeling that you have for the Fighting Sioux name. I have lived in Grand Forks for my entire life. Grew up cheering for the Sioux at a very young age. There is a deep sense of pride that goes with the Sioux name and the teams that played to represent it. But the time has come to accept the reality that the name is gone and it is time to move on to the next chapter of UND athletics. No one said you have to burn all your Fighting Sioux apparel and erase the momory of the Fighting Sioux name forever. All I ask is for those people to stop holding the University back and handcuffing the rest of us UND fans and join us and unite under a new name. You are lumping too many groups of people together. First, I am obviously a big supporter of the Fighting Sioux, and hate that society has to try to be PC about everything. I will always refer to them as the Fighting Sioux, regardless; But I am a big fan of more than hockey. The question nobody is answering is how does the school referring to themselves as the "University of North Dakota" hold the school back? Keeping the logo would have held them back, and NC$$ sanctions would have prevented us from hosting or competing in events. No nickname, does nothing detrimental to the program. So I don't understand that particular argument. Quote
The Sicatoka Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 The question nobody is answering is how does the school referring to themselves as the "University of North Dakota" hold the school back? Keeping the logo would have held them back, and NC$$ sanctions would have prevented us from hosting or competing in events. No nickname, does nothing detrimental to the program. So I don't understand that particular argument. Last night Duke played basketball. Everyone knows Duke. The announcers say Duke. Fans say Duke. Yet, they have the "Blue Devils" nickname and logo. They could run as just "Duke", but they don't. Now why is that? Marketing and Merchandising. Quote
nodakhoops Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 No nickmame supporters = Fighting Sioux Forever crowd = hockey only fans. In my opinion, The majority of people in each one of these groups can be lumped in to one group. And that group are the ones that are holding back this University from moving forward. My question is are you a fan of the Fighting Sioux name, or a fan of the University of North Dakota. If you truly are a fan of the University of North Dakota, you will cheer your team on no matter what name they are called. If you are just a fan of the name and logo, you will contiue to wear your Sioux clothing at games and stubornly cheer for the old name even after a new one has been adopted. I understand the feeling that you have for the Fighting Sioux name. I have lived in Grand Forks for my entire life. Grew up cheering for the Sioux at a very young age. There is a deep sense of pride that goes with the Sioux name and the teams that played to represent it. But the time has come to accept the reality that the name is gone and it is time to move on to the next chapter of UND athletics. No one said you have to burn all your Fighting Sioux apparel and erase the momory of the Fighting Sioux name forever. All I ask is for those people to stop holding the University back and handcuffing the rest of us UND fans and join us and unite under a new name. Here is a prime example of the fan you reference. Complete moron......If Lowell Schweigert isn't good enough for the nickname committee you have no clue. I would agree fans that think like this are holding UND back and that is why doing what is best for UND is the right thing to do and that is choosing a new nickname. I think no nickname would win in a vote by a landslide, but that is not what is right for UND and that is who I cheer for not the Fighting Sioux. http://www.grandforksherald.com/opinion/letters/3714076-letter-nickname-committee-doesnt-impress-longtime-fan Quote
jdub27 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 Here is a prime example of the fan you reference. Complete moron......If Lowell Schweigert isn't good enough for the nickname committee you have no bleeping clue. I would agree fans that think like this are holding UND back and that is why doing what is best for UND is the right thing to do and that is choosing a new nickname. I think no nickname would win in a vote by a landslide, but that is not what is right for UND and that is who I cheer for not the Fighting Sioux. http://www.grandforksherald.com/opinion/letters/3714076-letter-nickname-committee-doesnt-impress-longtime-fan Big surprise that despite being a self-described lifelong fan, the author's name appears nowhere in the Champions Club member list. I'd be willing to make a wager that some of the loudest critics do not put their money where they claim their support is. And I agree 100%. LS bleeds more green than this guy could ever dream of. 2 Quote
IrishSiouxFan Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 You do realize that regardless of what the school does, those same fans will still cheer for, refer to the team as, and we apparel of The Fighting Sioux. What do you think the coaching staff call them? They won't start saying play Roughrider Hockey, or Oiler Hockey. They will continue referring to it as Fighting Sioux Hockey. End of the Anthem, everyone will still yell SIOUX. If you think leaving it as University of North Dakota is the only way UND fans unofficially keep Fighting Sioux, your're crazy. That will stay regardless. So why force something upon people that most (not all) do not want? If the consencus is that the current logo and jerseys are lame, UND could spend alot less money and redesign them. I'm not nuts about the Jersey's either, but they are probably better that whatever is going to come out of all of this. I agree with where you're coming from. But honestly, the amount of people yelling out Sioux at the end of the national anthem has gone down considerably. I honestly think that in ten years or so, newer generations will continue on the old traditions but with a new name. I may not like it, but I'd bet good money on it. Quote
siouxfan512 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 Last night Duke played basketball. Everyone knows Duke. The announcers say Duke. Fans say Duke. Yet, they have the "Blue Devils" nickname and logo. They could run as just "Duke", but they don't. Now why is that? Marketing and Merchandising. Right, but "No Nickname" doesn't mean No Marketing or Merchandising. Again, they have had plenty of Merchandising, Marketing, and Apparel sales over the past 2-3 year. How does that change "long term" with a new nickname? You may see a small spike in revenue form apparel sales with a new name and logo, though alot of people won't buy it. For a school like UND big time marketing for the school comes with winning. Start making the NCAA Football Playoff or make the NCAA Basketball Tourney; that gets your Athletic Dept. national attention, not locat or regional marketing. Look at NDSU, they haven't been getting national attention over the past few seasons because they are the Bison, its because they have had winning teams. People who want a new nickname, because they don't want nothing makes sense to me; though its not what I want or hope for. The argument that going by the "University of North Dakota" vs "The Roughriders, Freeze, Spirit or any other stupid name" would hold the school back just doesn't hold any merit. The on-field/ice/court success of our teams is not directly driven by our nickname or logo, its by the coaches and athletes. I hope to see University of North Dakota on their jerseys for years to come, and I will glady continue buying their apparel. That being said, I will continue to watch and support the teams regardless. I just think with all of the money and time that alumni and fans have invested into that school and the programs, we should have some say. I know they are open to suggestions, and their will be a vote, but how much weight does that actually carry. Point being, No Nickname has been a popular option, SO if it is not an option to vote on, then they entire notion of taking suggestions and hosting a vote is nothing more than a gimmick by the University. Quote
siouxfan512 Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 I agree with where you're coming from. But honestly, the amount of people yelling out Sioux at the end of the national anthem has gone down considerably. I honestly think that in ten years or so, newer generations will continue on the old traditions but with a new name. I may not like it, but I'd bet good money on it. Really? I haven't been able to get up to Grand Forks for a while. That is really disappointing. Sounds loud on TV though. Quote
NoiseInsideMyHead Posted April 7, 2015 Posted April 7, 2015 Again, they have had plenty of Merchandising, Marketing, and Apparel sales over the past 2-3 year. Any evidence to back that claim? What about the countless people on this board who have sworn off of "North Dakota" merchandise. I don't suspect they're going to race to the store with their wallets out absent change. Besides, is anyone really moved by any of the generic "North Dakota" stuff? Quote
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