mksioux Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 It's pretty simple: Good nickname > no nickname Bad nickname < no nickname. It all depends on how much confidence one has in the process, the people, and the ultimate result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 They tend not to use the "devil in the D logo" on small presentations (like on that hat) because it's difficult to manufacture and recognize at that size. (The same could be said of the old Ben Brien logo.) Which is why logos like the Wisconsin W, the Michigan M, the Boston Red Sox B, the Yankees' NY, etc. are so popular to this day. The only place the Brien logo looked good was on the hockey jerseys. It was practically non-existent on the football and basketball jerseys, even in my day. I think the interlocking ND is fine - but a nice logo for the hockey jerseys would be better. Obviously wordmarks or letters are best on the basketball, baseball, and football jerseys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Which is why logos like the Wisconsin W, the Michigan M, the Boston Red Sox B, the Yankees' NY, etc. are so popular to this day. The only place the Brien logo looked good was on the hockey jerseys. It was practically non-existent on the football and basketball jerseys, even in my day. I think the interlocking ND is fine - but a nice logo for the hockey jerseys would be better. Obviously wordmarks or letters are best on the basketball, baseball, and football jerseys. A good logo looks better on t-shirts and sweatshirts. It can also look better on other merchandise like clocks, posters, signs, golf bags, etc where the logo is large enough to be seen properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND1983 Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 So let me see if I have this straight.... The people wanting to remain nickname - less are chastised for the effects it will have on merchandising.... because the people that want a new nickname will then refuse to continue to support UND merchandise sales? Got it . Pot, meet kettle. What? I think you are off a bit on this one. The new name will drive merchandise sales from the supporters. The old name supporters will not buy new merchandise, but will be in the vast minority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoiseInsideMyHead Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Do you think anyone who claimed to have sworn of generic North Dakota stuff, is going to go for a new name and logo? Maybe, maybe not. But look at it this way, those who embrace the new name and logo will buy that stuff, and those who don't will then have to decide between buying generic and nothing at all. Either way, there is a huge potential up-side for licensing revenue that does not currently exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Which is why logos like the Wisconsin W, the Michigan M, the Boston Red Sox B, the Yankees' NY, etc. are so popular to this day. The only place the Brien logo looked good was on the hockey jerseys. It was practically non-existent on the football and basketball jerseys, even in my day. I think the interlocking ND is fine - but a nice logo for the hockey jerseys would be better. Obviously wordmarks or letters are best on the basketball, baseball, and football jerseys. Something like this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 A good logo looks better on t-shirts and sweatshirts. It can also look better on other merchandise like clocks, posters, signs, golf bags, etc where the logo is large enough to be seen properly. By my count, 1/2 of the top 20 schools in terms of merchandise sales for 2013-2014 had primary logos that consisted of only letters - West Virginia, Nebraska, Wisconsin, Michigan, Alabama, Oklahoma, Tennessee, Texas A&M, and Georgia being among them. Yes, Texas is a biggie at #1 with their burnt orange Longhorn logo, but even Notre Dame relies on the interlocking ND as much as the fighting-stance leprechaun logo. Some sort of logo other than an ND isn't an absolute must-have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigGame Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Here is a prime example of the fan you reference. Complete moron......If Lowell Schweigert isn't good enough for the nickname committee you have no clue. I would agree fans that think like this are holding UND back and that is why doing what is best for UND is the right thing to do and that is choosing a new nickname. I think no nickname would win in a vote by a landslide, but that is not what is right for UND and that is who I cheer for not the Fighting Sioux. http://www.grandforksherald.com/opinion/letters/3714076-letter-nickname-committee-doesnt-impress-longtime-fan Yep, to Bob UND is Hockey and Hockey only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Some sort of logo other than an ND isn't an absolute must-have. But it sure would be nice to have something that isn't confused for "Our Lady of South Bend" all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn-O Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Here is a prime example of the fan you reference. Complete moron......If Lowell Schweigert isn't good enough for the nickname committee you have no clue. I would agree fans that think like this are holding UND back and that is why doing what is best for UND is the right thing to do and that is choosing a new nickname. I think no nickname would win in a vote by a landslide, but that is not what is right for UND and that is who I cheer for not the Fighting Sioux. http://www.grandforksherald.com/opinion/letters/3714076-letter-nickname-committee-doesnt-impress-longtime-fan Bigger moron: The author, or Steve Wagner for publishing that submission? Simple question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigGame Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Nope, I watch football and basketball on the Big Sky website. And while other sports certainly matter, there is not denying UND is a hockey first school. If so much of this argument is about money (merchandising and marketing) as was stated earlier, it would be wise to not piss off the largest fan base at the school either. That being said, I think football really is moving in the right direction with Bubba. Start winning some games, and filling some seats. Any they don't get the ESPN attention without winning first. Win and you will get that attention regardless of what you are or are not called. People will eventually get over it and move on or they will not and continue to cry about it. UND got hosed by the NCAA but what is done is done and we need to move forward. I am sure Hak will remind players of the Fighting Sioux history but outside of some fans the that name will no longer be used publically except when referencing the history of it. This will take a little time because people are slow to change but it will not stop it from happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigGame Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Who got us into this mess I dont think Sioux Hockey was ever that hostile & abusive with the name - even our biggest rival never really overly abused our name (in Hockey) but football & the rivalry with NDSU took it to the extreme that got the name taken away I would say that's incorrect! NCAA didn't come after UND because of Bison fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 By my count, 1/2 of the top 20 schools in terms of merchandise sales for 2013-2014 had primary logos that consisted of only letters - West Virginia, Nebraska, Wisconsin, Michigan, Alabama, Oklahoma, Tennessee, Texas A&M, and Georgia being among them. Yes, Texas is a biggie at #1 with their burnt orange Longhorn logo, but even Notre Dame relies on the interlocking ND as much as the fighting-stance leprechaun logo. Some sort of logo other than an ND isn't an absolute must-have. But it sure would be nice to have something that isn't confused for "Our Lady of South Bend" all the time. This is the problem with only having the interlockinig ND logo. Those top selling logos that you mention are well known and long established. The interlocking ND logo is well known and long established as the Notre Dame logo (even though UND used it first). It doesn't help sell merchandise for the University of North Dakota, unless they buy it by accident. UND merchandise really took off when the Brien logo was chosen. The geometric logo and earlier logos did OK, but sales jumped with the new logo. That is one of the reasons a new nickname and logo will be a benefit over just using North Dakota. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siouxfan512 Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Ok, not saying that I am for anything other than No Nickname, because that is obviously my first choice. You could still have a new logo, you could still have some form of mascot .... BUT, I remember someone floating the Nokota, which I believe is a horse or stallion? Could go by The Nokes for short. I'm sure you could put together a pretty cool logo there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 This is the problem with only having the interlockinig ND logo. Those top selling logos that you mention are well known and long established. The interlocking ND logo is well known and long established as the Notre Dame logo (even though UND used it first). It doesn't help sell merchandise for the University of North Dakota, unless they buy it by accident. UND merchandise really took off when the Brien logo was chosen. The geometric logo and earlier logos did OK, but sales jumped with the new logo. That is one of the reasons a new nickname and logo will be a benefit over just using North Dakota. I totally get the need to be different than Notre Dame...which is why I like this logo. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn-O Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 If the NC2A views no new name as compliant with the agreement, this is the way forward, IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigGame Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 I got it, the Hockey only crowd should be cool with a hockey related nickname like goons! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 I totally get the need to be different than Notre Dame...which is why I like this logo. That looks like a logo for the state of North Dakota, not for a school. I don't see a lot of casual sports fans buying merchandise with that logo on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn-O Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 That looks like a logo for the state of North Dakota, not for a school. I don't see a lot of casual sports fans buying merchandise with that logo on it. The marketing risk is greater than the reward at this point, with the way this process has been put together. I'm fine with University of North Dakota. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 That looks like a logo for the state of North Dakota, not for a school. I don't see a lot of casual sports fans buying merchandise with that logo on it. Alabama seems to do just fine with an "A" and Oregon's "O" has quickly become an easily-recognized logo. I also need to clarify that Notre Dame's primary logo actually IS the interlocking ND. The fighting leprechaun logo is a secondary mark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 The marketing risk is greater than the reward at this point, with the way this process has been put together. I'm fine with University of North Dakota. I see no benefit in going bland in this situation. What are we telling the students, athletes and everyone else by striving for "good enough"? UND needs to go for great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn-O Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 I see no benefit in going bland in this situation. What are we telling the students, athletes and everyone else by striving for "good enough"? UND needs to go for great. I don't think of it as bland. More like a "no confidence" vote to the people leading this process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Alabama seems to do just fine with an "A" and Oregon's "O" has quickly become an easily-recognized logo. I also need to clarify that Notre Dame's primary logo actually IS the interlocking ND. The fighting leprechaun logo is a secondary mark. Alabama and Oregon get huge amounts of publicity by competing in power conferences. Their logo doesn't have to stand out. UND doesn't have that luxury. UND needs a strong nickname and logo much more than the schools that you keep bringing up. Try finding a school at the same compete level as UND that benefits by having a letter for a logo. That would give your argument more strength. Otherwise UND's logo would be more on the same level as Alcorn State than Alabama. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 I don't think of it as bland. More like a "no confidence" vote to the people leading this process. North Dakota as a "nickname" and the interlocking ND as the logo are bland, no matter who is leading the process. I'm going for the stars while realizing that it is very difficult to get there. But going for the stars may result in at least flying rather than just sitting like a lump on a log. And I have a lot more faith in the committee, people like Karl Goehring and Lowell Schweigert and Dave St. Peter and Carla Christofferson, than you seem to have. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn-O Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 North Dakota as a "nickname" and the interlocking ND as the logo are bland, no matter who is leading the process. I'm going for the stars while realizing that it is very difficult to get there. But going for the stars may result in at least flying rather than just sitting like a lump on a log. And I have a lot more faith in the committee, people like Karl Goehring and Lowell Schweigert and Dave St. Peter and Carla Christofferson, than you seem to have. Good people. It is who they are reporting to that concerns me...but you likely knew that anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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