dmksioux Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 SFI has chimed in with a brief entry on the nickname issue... http://siouxfb.areavoices.com/2011/06/13/big-sky-situation/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almostheavenin2011 Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I must of missed that caller, I heard a caller (Kent I believe was his name) state the opposite, that changing the name isn't going to stop students from wearing Sioux gear or using "Sioux" chants at events. So far nothing new or earthshattering to report. Faison will be on in a couple of minutes, if I'm able to listen, I will try to give some updates... Remember though that the students that have gear now will be gone in a few years and the new ones will not be able to buy new stuff so it will go away on its own then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted June 14, 2011 Author Share Posted June 14, 2011 I agree with your assessment except I certainly hope it doesn't go to court. At this point, I do not think the people of ND (along with its leadership) would agree to spend taxpayer $ to defend the name in court when it appears that it will only harm UND's athletic teams. There at the very least needs to be a legal decision rendered. The legislature took control of an issue that constitutionally belonged to the SBoHE. Somehow that needs to be remedied. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
108498 Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 First I want to say that I am will be sad when the Fighting Sioux name is goine. My dad played BB for UND, I have been a Fighting Sioux fan since the '60's. As a fan of the University of North Dakota, I don't want the athletic department and for that matter the entire university dragged through the mud and slime for years to come. The Big Sky has threatened to not allow membership, Minnesota and Wisconsin will not play UND, and others will follow. UND would likely be an independent and stuck on an island in the arctic. Sica use of the word pariah, will be pretty accurate. There is an SBoHE this meeting this Thursday in Minot. Action needs to be taken. Jon Backes (current Board president) and Grant Shaft (Board president July 1st) are both UND law school graduates and I'm sure will get this moving, with all that has transpired in the past few days. The SBoHE needs to take control of the nickname issue back from the legislature. Constitutionally, it IS theirs to control. They need to advise Dalrymple and Stenehjem of their intent, so they are not blindsided (I doubt that they would be, but courtesy would dictate advising). The SBoHE then directs UND to retire the name. UND will follow direction as stipulated by the SBoHE, as UND is under their authority. Yes, this likely head to court, but better sooner than later. What won't happen?? The NCAA is not going to change their mind. They are not going to allow a law passed after a settlement agreement was made to force them to change their mind. It won't stand up legally, so they have no reason to back down. They will continue to point to the settlement and say they are done with the issue and impose sanctions, should UND maintain use of the Fighting Sioux name. I am a fan of the University of North Dakota and will always be, no matter what the nickname is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
108498 Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 I too am a huge Sioux fan; however, I feel as though it has been the sioux that have kept me going not the university. I am now going off to college and after 15 years of attending sioux potato bowls with bond fires and football games out doors, I feel nothing could really ever be the same when the sioux are shut down. The athletic director has talked about takeing a year to fit in a new mascot; however, the wait will only keep the fans more. I believe the sioux must return to the Flicker Tails in order to save all traditans in Dfand Forks and beyond. It is not the Sioux howevr After seeing and hearing about the pink Flicker Tails Days it only feels right. Lets keep the team alive. Its not the college that makes it what it is, but the people and the tradition of the fighting sioux. I would rather move back to division 2 than loss the fighting sioux and Flicker Tails. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted June 14, 2011 Author Share Posted June 14, 2011 I too am a huge Sioux fan; however, I feel as though it has been the sioux that have kept me going not the university. I am now going off to college and after 15 years of attending sioux potato bowls with bond fires and football games out doors, I feel nothing could really ever be the same when the sioux are shut down. The athletic director has talked about takeing a year to fit in a new mascot; however, the wait will only keep the fans more. I believe the sioux must return to the Flicker Tails in order to save all traditans in Dfand Forks and beyond. It is not the Sioux howevr After seeing and hearing about the pink Flicker Tails Days it only feels right. Lets keep the team alive. Its not the college that makes it what it is, but the people and the tradition of the fighting sioux. I would rather move back to division 2 than loss the fighting sioux and Flicker Tails. Now I know how the debate moderator felt after Billy Madison gave his answer in the academic decathlon. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petey23 Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 I too am a huge Sioux fan; however, I feel as though it has been the sioux that have kept me going not the university. I am now going off to college and after 15 years of attending sioux potato bowls with bond fires and football games out doors, I feel nothing could really ever be the same when the sioux are shut down. The athletic director has talked about takeing a year to fit in a new mascot; however, the wait will only keep the fans more. I believe the sioux must return to the Flicker Tails in order to save all traditans in Dfand Forks and beyond. It is not the Sioux howevr After seeing and hearing about the pink Flicker Tails Days it only feels right. Lets keep the team alive. Its not the college that makes it what it is, but the people and the tradition of the fighting sioux. I would rather move back to division 2 than loss the fighting sioux and Flicker Tails. Are you a troll or a moron? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejm Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Are you a troll or a moron? College admission standards have apparently fallen... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Are you a troll or a moron? I figure he's off to 'su. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAS4127 Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 They did send out a letter early this year when the bill was going through legislature saying that they would be watching and were concerned about the outcome. THey probably waited for the Big Sky meeting to talk about it officially and I'm sure Kelly did little to justify the continuos use of the sioux logo. There are even rumors circulating that the new men's and women's hockey jersey will be void of the logo and will simply say North Dakota on the front. Doing so may be in violation of the bill, which states neither UND/SBoHE can take any action to discontinue the use of the logo/nickname in use as of Jan, 1, 2011. Didntt both teams play after that date? Now, think about this, if UND can't change their Uni's from what it used in PO's this year, then they can't play in the NCAA tourney, cuz the NCAA won't allow use of the sioux logo in NCAA tourneys. Something to think about!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmksioux Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Doing so may be in violation of the bill, which states neither UND/SBoHE can take any action to discontinue the use of the logo/nickname in use as of Jan, 1, 2011. Didntt both teams play after that date? Now, think about this, if UND can't change their Uni's from what it used in PO's this year, then they can't play in the NCAA tourney, cuz the NCAA won't allow use of the sioux logo in NCAA tourneys. Something to think about!! Why would that be a violation of the bill? The bill says that UND can't change it's nickname. It doesn't say anything about what types of jerseys their athletic teams have to wear. Most of the UND teams do not have the logo on them anywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND Fan Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Are you a troll or a moron? I am quite sure the answer to your question is "both"!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted June 15, 2011 Author Share Posted June 15, 2011 This thread began with what the SBoHE needs to do. I said that the SBoHE needs to take control of the nickname issue, as it is constitutionally theirs to control. In his interview with Scott Hennan he said that the SBoHE wasn't going to challenge the Fighting Sioux law. Grant is a pretty sharp person. I know that he doesn't want to rumble with the legislature on this, as funding would be severely cut next session, so what is next? What needs to happen for the law to be declared unconstitutional? Who has standing and can bring the case forward? How long would it take? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 This thread began with what the SBoHE needs to do. I said that the SBoHE needs to take control of the nickname issue, as it is constitutionally theirs to control. In his interview with Scott Hennan he said that the SBoHE wasn't going to challenge the Fighting Sioux law. Grant is a pretty sharp person. I know that he doesn't want to rumble with the legislature on this, as funding would be severely cut next session, so what is next? What needs to happen for the law to be declared unconstitutional? Who has standing and can bring the case forward? How long would it take? I would suspect only the Board has standing to move against the law since its powers are enumerated in the NoDak constitution. Arguably, the AG could do the same on his own by going to court and getting a declaratory judgment against the law on constitutional grounds. I really think Shaft, Stenjhem et al. need to pull some of the top legislators, including those who supported the law like Carlson, into an "informal" meeting at some bar or restaurant and tell them they need to repeal the law in the next session or a special sesssion for the reasons that are becoming abdudantly clear from the NC$$, and the BSC. Timing and certainty are becoming critical. While some may see this as "cut and run", so is giving over the destiny of your school's name/logo to unpredictable, and unreliable, tribal politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UNDvince97-01 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I am a supporter and have been a supporter of the nickname and logo my entire life up to this day. The proponents of fighting this battle to the end (myself included) have always stated that we should not concede to speculative "worst-case what-ifs" when they haven't ever happened. I have agreed. Well, we now have the "worst-case what-if" occurring with the Big Sky's "concern" with us. It kills me to say this, but it's time. The potential repercussions to the University and its athletic department are too much. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not choose a different, contrived, cheapened nickname and logo that can't hold the jockstrap of a Fighting Sioux name and logo that has so much pride and tradition over the years. We are the University of North Dakota and the flagship of the great state of ND. We will ALWAYS be the Fighting Sioux. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I figure he's off to 'su. I was going to say he is either an NDSU student or goes to the UofMN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawkster Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I would suspect only the Board has standing to move against the law since its powers are enumerated in the NoDak constitution. Arguably, the AG could do the same on his own by going to court and getting a declaratory judgment against the law on constitutional grounds. I really think Shaft, Stenjhem et al. need to pull some of the top legislators, including those who supported the law like Carlson, into an "informal" meeting at some bar or restaurant and tell them they need to repeal the law in the next session or a special sesssion for the reasons that are becoming abdudantly clear from the NC$$, and the BSC. Timing and certainty are becoming critical. While some may see this as "cut and run", so is giving over the destiny of your school's name/logo to unpredictable, and unreliable, tribal politics. I would think the University itself would also have standing to challenge the law. Letting the law go into effect in August and waiting for the special session in mid November is too late. The BSC will hang us out to dry long before then. I honestly am worried about the BSC deciding to give us the heave ho, and we won't have this chance again if they do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bison Dan Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 If BSC's motive is to get rid of you then they'll sit back and wait for it to become law and at their Oct. meeting dump you. If you have to wait until Nov for the special session then you're screwed. If it's truly the name they're concerned about then they'll wait for the special session, but are you sure the legislature will change their minds? After all Both Kelly and Faison told them the first time this could happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darell1976 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 If BSC's motive is to get rid of you then they'll sit back and wait for it to become law and at their Oct. meeting dump you. If you have to wait until Nov for the special session then you're screwed. If it's truly the name they're concerned about then they'll wait for the special session, but are you sure the legislature will change their minds? After all Both Kelly and Faison told them the first time this could happen. This is why Grant Shaft and Al Carlson is trying to get a meeting ASAP with the NCAA that way they know their options and see what cards if any UND has. The Big Sky won't do anything until at least August 15th, thats when UND goes back onto the list. However if a deal with the NCAA can get that date pushed back towards the end of the year or maybe after a special session, BSC won't boot us before football season starts. IMO the NCAA would do this if they know that ND is working to get rid of this bill. Anything that goes the NCAA way they will oblidge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted June 15, 2011 Author Share Posted June 15, 2011 If BSC's motive is to get rid of you then they'll sit back and wait for it to become law and at their Oct. meeting dump you. If you have to wait until Nov for the special session then you're screwed. If it's truly the name they're concerned about then they'll wait for the special session, but are you sure the legislature will change their minds? After all Both Kelly and Faison told them the first time this could happen. I truly think it is the name issue. Naive? Maybe. I also believe that it doesn't matter if miraculously a deal is worked out with the NCAA, the Big Sky could still say "no, you have too much baggage with that". I don't want to have to wait for a special session to repeal it. The legislature power grabbed on this issue and made a decision that wasn't theirs to make. This law needs to deemed unconstitutional and go away. Give the power back to the SBoHE and UND. Change the name and move on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VMeister Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I truly think it is the name issue. Naive? Maybe. I also believe that it doesn't matter if miraculously a deal is worked out with the NCAA, the Big Sky could still say "no, you have too much baggage with that". I don't want to have to wait for a special session to repeal it. The legislature power grabbed on this issue and made a decision that wasn't theirs to make. This law needs to deemed unconstitutional and go away. Give the power back to the SBoHE and UND. Change the name and move on. Dear Mr. Shaft, Please ask the SBoHE to direct UND to resume the retirement of the Fighting Sioux nickname tomorrow. The lawyers can figure out the rest later. Anything else screws up the Big Sky and/or a year of recruiting. Sincerely, Common Sense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedi Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Dear Mr. Shaft, Please ask the SBoHE to direct UND to resume the retirement of the Fighting Sioux nickname tomorrow. The lawyers can figure out the rest later. Anything else screws up the Big Sky and/or a year of recruiting. Sincerely, Common Sense This is exactly what needs to happen. I e-mailed the members of the state board on Monday asking them to do just this. I was really disappointed to hear that Shaft didn't seem to want to do anything until there is a face-to-face with the NCAA and half the State of North Dakota (based on his comments with Scott Hennen). The SBHE/Legislature/Governor/REA have no leverage to use if such a meeting takes place except a poorly drafted law that is arguably unconstitutional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I have acquired secret video from "Al Carlson Meets the NCAA": Note: The last guy to speak in the video is Grant Shaft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmksioux Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Mac Schneider has sent a letter to Fullerton asking for some more time so the legislature can sort the mess out... http://www.grandforksherald.com/event/article/id/206808/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted June 15, 2011 Author Share Posted June 15, 2011 Link to Schneider's Letter Thanks Mac. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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