North Dakota Roughriders?

[bigskyvikes]

Haha, I beg to differ.

I couldn't agree more with this! Mafia?

[Sioux>Bison]

Why did the sodbusters or the homesteaders get turned down? They seem unique to me

[The Sicatoka]

Why did the sodbusters or the homesteaders get turned down? They seem unique to me

Because the consultant had no idea what they are, or what a Nokota is, because they couldn't be found on Urban Dictionary.

[fightingsioux4life]

Haha, I beg to differ.

Really?  You don't think that this whole nickname soap opera doesn't distract from the overall mission of UND (and not just athletics either)?  Instead of focusing on making our programs more competitive, we are fighting this battle and have been for almost 10 years now.  The bad press we get from this story cannot be helpful with recruiting and our overall image in the region.  Thanks to Kelley's mismanagement of this whole nickname selection process, we look like a bunch of bumbling fools.  The sooner we resolve this issue, the better.  And going with "North Dakota" will not do that.

[fightingsioux4life]

If UND chooses "no nickname," goes undefeated against NDSU, USD, and SDSU in all sports applicable over the next five years, and brings home a couple of NCAA football championships, will you think the school lags behind because it isn't called "Green Hawks" or "Sundogs"?

Thank you for totally missing the point.  And we are a long, long ways away from accomplishing what you described.  I wish that wasn't so, but it is.

[Hayduke]

Really? You don't think that this whole nickname soap opera doesn't distract from the overall mission of UND (and not just athletics either)? Instead of focusing on making our programs more competitive, we are fighting this battle and have been for almost 10 years now. The bad press we get from this story cannot be helpful with recruiting and our overall image in the region. Thanks to Kelley's mismanagement of this whole nickname selection process, we look like a bunch of bumbling fools. The sooner we resolve this issue, the better. And going with "North Dakota" will not do that.

It goes beyond athletics. How can a university president be 100% effective with this bizzare distraction hanging over their head?

I actually believe Kelley has done a fairly good job under difficult circumstances. I think he would like to give his successor a chance to manage the school without this distraction. Can't blame him for that.

[fightingsioux4life]

It goes beyond athletics. How can a university president be 100% effective with this bizzare distraction hanging over their head?

I actually believe Kelley has done a fairly good job under difficult circumstances. I think he would like to give his successor a chance to manage the school without this distraction. Can't blame him for that.

I was only criticizing Kelley's handling of the nickname selection process.  A committee to come up with a process for another committee to use to find an acceptable name while having to sift through a bunch of asinine ideas from our long-time enemies (FU and UMTC) to find something half-way decent?   I really think a more streamlined process could have been employed that still gave people some ownership of the issue.

 

You are right about Kelley being thrown to the wolves on this whole nickname issue; he inherited the mess and has spent way too much time on it.  This is another reason why picking a new name and logo is important, so that Kelley's successor can govern the school without this millstone around his or her neck.

[Hayduke]

I was only criticizing Kelley's handling of the nickname selection process. A committee to come up with a process for another committee to use to find an acceptable name while having to sift through a bunch of asinine ideas from our long-time enemies (FU and UMTC) to find something half-way decent? I really think a more streamlined process could have been employed that still gave people some ownership of the issue.

You are right about Kelley being thrown to the wolves on this whole nickname issue; he inherited the mess and has spent way too much time on it. This is another reason why picking a new name and logo is important, so that Kelley's successor can govern the school without this millstone around his or her neck.

In hindsight, things could have done much more effectively by Kelley. But, what a mess! I hope we can transition to a new name soon and start dealing with real problems. Like kicking Moo U's a $$ in the football!

[Nodak78]

I agree!!! Time for Riders to shoot some mangy bison!!!!!

[Siouxphan27]

TR died in 1919.

 

If when UND dumped "Flickertails" (in the 1930s) and put in "Roughriders" (to remember TR and his time in ND) would it be an issue? 

 

 

< Beware, blasphemy to follow >

 

Could the folks, in that 1930s vote, have made a mistake by selecting what they did (for us to have to deal with 80 years later)? 

 

People in 1930 knew the Roughriders were a Cavalry that originated in Texas, Oklahoma, Arizona, and New Mexico.   They also knew that an attempt to raise a Roughriders division in World War I, failed.  Roughriders would have never been considered by those folks as being something related to North Dakota.

 

Fast forward just 80 years, and  after a couple decades of people "learning" their ND "history" from "Legendary" ND Tourism commercials, and suddenly we're all "Bully" for Roughriders.   it would be funny if it wasn't so sad. 

[Sodbuster]

Why did the sodbusters or the homesteaders get turned down? They seem unique to me

I agree.

[tnt]

People in 1930 knew the Roughriders were a Cavalry that originated in Texas, Oklahoma, Arizona, and New Mexico.   They also knew that an attempt to raise a Roughriders division in World War I, failed.  Roughriders would have never been considered by those folks as being something related to North Dakota.

 

Fast forward just 80 years, and  after a couple decades of people "learning" their ND "history" from "Legendary" ND Tourism commercials, and suddenly we're all "Bully" for Roughriders.   it would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

Where do you think he learned to become a Rough Rider. No North Dakota, no Rough Riders.

Cowboys meeting Roosevelt for the first time at roundup took him for a weakling. “You could have spanned his waist with your two thumbs and fingers,” one rider recalled. Roosevelt didn’t help matters with his fussy gear: toothbrush, razor, bedroll and spectacles. No self-respecting cowboy wore eyeglasses. “When I went among strangers, I always had to spend 24 hours in living down the fact that I wore spectacles,” he wrote, “remaining as long as I could judiciously deaf to any side remarks about ‘four eyes,’ unless it became evident that my being quiet was misconstrued and that it was better to bring matters to a head at once.” At the roundup, he told one Texan who called him “Storm Windows” to “put up or shut up,” either fight or be friends. The Texan opted for friendship.

When the cowboys learned Roosevelt could ride 100 miles a day after a full night in the saddle and spend 40 hours on horseback while wearing out five horses, they came to respect him. Roosevelt explained years later, “As with all other forms of work, so on the roundup a man of ordinary power, who nevertheless does not shirk things merely because they are disagreeable or irksome, soon earns his place.”

After 32 days and a thousand miles on the trail, the other Badlands cowboys accepted Roosevelt as one of their own. One tough ranch foreman’s assessment: “That four-eyed maverick has sand in his craw a-plenty.” Roosevelt even received public acclaim in the Sioux Falls Daily Press, which wrote of him, “When he first went on the range, the cowboys took him for a dude, but soon they realized the stuff of which the youngster was built, and there is no man now who inspires such enthusiastic regard among them as he.”

[scpa0305]

Really? You don't think that this whole nickname soap opera doesn't distract from the overall mission of UND (and not just athletics either)? Instead of focusing on making our programs more competitive, we are fighting this battle and have been for almost 10 years now. The bad press we get from this story cannot be helpful with recruiting and our overall image in the region. Thanks to Kelley's mismanagement of this whole nickname selection process, we look like a bunch of bumbling fools. The sooner we resolve this issue, the better. And going with "North Dakota" will not do that.

No I really don't, the only thing that matters is winning. Get good coaches who can recruit good players. Then they'll start winning. Kids don't come to the school because of a nickname.

[scpa0305]

Where do you think he learned to become a Rough Rider. No North Dakota, no Rough Riders.

Cowboys meeting Roosevelt for the first time at roundup took him for a weakling. “You could have spanned his waist with your two thumbs and fingers,” one rider recalled. Roosevelt didn’t help matters with his fussy gear: toothbrush, razor, bedroll and spectacles. No self-respecting cowboy wore eyeglasses. “When I went among strangers, I always had to spend 24 hours in living down the fact that I wore spectacles,” he wrote, “remaining as long as I could judiciously deaf to any side remarks about ‘four eyes,’ unless it became evident that my being quiet was misconstrued and that it was better to bring matters to a head at once.” At the roundup, he told one Texan who called him “Storm Windows” to “put up or shut up,” either fight or be friends. The Texan opted for friendship.

When the cowboys learned Roosevelt could ride 100 miles a day after a full night in the saddle and spend 40 hours on horseback while wearing out five horses, they came to respect him. Roosevelt explained years later, “As with all other forms of work, so on the roundup a man of ordinary power, who nevertheless does not shirk things merely because they are disagreeable or irksome, soon earns his place.”

After 32 days and a thousand miles on the trail, the other Badlands cowboys accepted Roosevelt as one of their own. One tough ranch foreman’s assessment: “That four-eyed maverick has sand in his craw a-plenty.” Roosevelt even received public acclaim in the Sioux Falls Daily Press, which wrote of him, “When he first went on the range, the cowboys took him for a dude, but soon they realized the stuff of which the youngster was built, and there is no man now who inspires such enthusiastic regard among them as he.”

New Yorkers should be proud

[tnt]

People in 1930 knew the Roughriders were a Cavalry that originated in Texas, Oklahoma, Arizona, and New Mexico. They also knew that an attempt to raise a Roughriders division in World War I, failed. Roughriders would have never been considered by those folks as being something related to North Dakota.

Fast forward just 80 years, and after a couple decades of people "learning" their ND "history" from "Legendary" ND Tourism commercials, and suddenly we're all "Bully" for Roughriders. it would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

So people that spend time at UND that credit it with becoming who they are isn't relevant. Guess we shouldn't have Engelstad Arena or claim Matt Greene, Ed Belfour, etc. as something related to UND since they only spent a little time here, regardless if they might not have achieved what they did without their time here. Why are so many alumni that aren't from here even concerned about a new nickname, they shouldn't be if they only spent a small part of their lives here. Maybe the only people that should get to vote on the new nickname are people who have lived in North Dakota their entire life and have ties to UND.

[homer]

No I really don't, the only thing that matters is winning. Get good coaches who can recruit good players. Then they'll start winning. Kids don't come to the school because of a nickname.

Well, than it shouldn't matter to you what is chosen.

[scpa0305]

Well, than it shouldn't matter to you what is chosen.

I'm not a player....I'm a fan. The nickname is important to me. You missed the point.

[tnt]

Where do you think he learned to become a Rough Rider. No North Dakota, no Rough Riders.

Cowboys meeting Roosevelt for the first time at roundup took him for a weakling. “You could have spanned his waist with your two thumbs and fingers,” one rider recalled. Roosevelt didn’t help matters with his fussy gear: toothbrush, razor, bedroll and spectacles. No self-respecting cowboy wore eyeglasses. “When I went among strangers, I always had to spend 24 hours in living down the fact that I wore spectacles,” he wrote, “remaining as long as I could judiciously deaf to any side remarks about ‘four eyes,’ unless it became evident that my being quiet was misconstrued and that it was better to bring matters to a head at once.” At the roundup, he told one Texan who called him “Storm Windows” to “put up or shut up,” either fight or be friends. The Texan opted for friendship.

When the cowboys learned Roosevelt could ride 100 miles a day after a full night in the saddle and spend 40 hours on horseback while wearing out five horses, they came to respect him. Roosevelt explained years later, “As with all other forms of work, so on the roundup a man of ordinary power, who nevertheless does not shirk things merely because they are disagreeable or irksome, soon earns his place.”

After 32 days and a thousand miles on the trail, the other Badlands cowboys accepted Roosevelt as one of their own. One tough ranch foreman’s assessment: “That four-eyed maverick has sand in his craw a-plenty.” Roosevelt even received public acclaim in the Sioux Falls Daily Press, which wrote of him, “When he first went on the range, the cowboys took him for a dude, but soon they realized the stuff of which the youngster was built, and there is no man now who inspires such enthusiastic regard among them as he.”

I should add, that this is exactly the kind of personality we should want to replicate with our athletic programs, that of having nothing handed to us, but earning the respect of others through our actions and diligence.

[homer]

I'm not a player....I'm a fan. The nickname is important to me. You missed the point.

You said the only thing that matters is winning.

So winning, tradition and identity are important. Really no different than a player.

[Siouxphan27]

Where do you think he learned to become a Rough Rider. No North Dakota, no Rough Riders.

Cowboys meeting Roosevelt for the first time at roundup took him for a weakling. “You could have spanned his waist with your two thumbs and fingers,” one rider recalled. Roosevelt didn’t help matters with his fussy gear: toothbrush, razor, bedroll and spectacles. No self-respecting cowboy wore eyeglasses. “When I went among strangers, I always had to spend 24 hours in living down the fact that I wore spectacles,” he wrote, “remaining as long as I could judiciously deaf to any side remarks about ‘four eyes,’ unless it became evident that my being quiet was misconstrued and that it was better to bring matters to a head at once.” At the roundup, he told one Texan who called him “Storm Windows” to “put up or shut up,” either fight or be friends. The Texan opted for friendship.

When the cowboys learned Roosevelt could ride 100 miles a day after a full night in the saddle and spend 40 hours on horseback while wearing out five horses, they came to respect him. Roosevelt explained years later, “As with all other forms of work, so on the roundup a man of ordinary power, who nevertheless does not shirk things merely because they are disagreeable or irksome, soon earns his place.”

After 32 days and a thousand miles on the trail, the other Badlands cowboys accepted Roosevelt as one of their own. One tough ranch foreman’s assessment: “That four-eyed maverick has sand in his craw a-plenty.” Roosevelt even received public acclaim in the Sioux Falls Daily Press, which wrote of him, “When he first went on the range, the cowboys took him for a dude, but soon they realized the stuff of which the youngster was built, and there is no man now who inspires such enthusiastic regard among them as he.”

As I've said before, if people like the name roughrider, that's just fine, we all have opinions. 

People always mention stories about Teddy Roosevelt; why not mention a few stories about the Roughriders themselves?  I think I know the answer...  

 

The nickname committee had an opportunity to advance a few names that referred to the actual people that settled our state.  As part of their criteria from the beginning, I thought a few of those names like Sodbusters or Settlers would've had a chance of advancing.  But instead, the only name that attempts to honor ND heritage that is left on the list, is in fact a name that honors Teddy Roosevelt; not North Dakota.   I didn't attend the University of Teddy Roosevelt.     

[Siouxphan27]

So people that spend time at UND that credit it with becoming who they are isn't relevant. Guess we shouldn't have Engelstad Arena or claim Matt Greene, Ed Belfour, etc. as something related to UND since they only spent a little time here, regardless if they might not have achieved what they did without their time here. Why are so many alumni that aren't from here even concerned about a new nickname, they shouldn't be if they only spent a small part of their lives here. Maybe the only people that should get to vote on the new nickname are people who have lived in North Dakota their entire life and have ties to UND.

 

Engelstad Arena....  100 million I believe?  If Matt Greene is willing to donate $100million as well, I would have no problem being the UND Fighting Greene.

 

Your comparison isn't the same.   If you compared my opinion of Roughriders to UND choosing "Imperials" for a nickname, the comparisons would be the same.  We could all  pay homage to Imperial Palace; something Ralph Engelstad did in another part of his life, in another part of the country.   

[SIOUXFAN97]

for those that say we can't have the Rough Rider nickname because it would be too confusing with a small high school in eastern north dakota having the same nickname?

 

Following their first Grey Cup loss, the club changed their name to the Regina Roughriders in 1924 while retaining the colours of red and black.^[6] Ottawa also had a team called the Ottawa Rough Riders, but the spelling was different and the two clubs played in different leagues

 

also kind of funny...the mascot for the saskatchewan roughriders is called "Gainer the Gopher"...Gainer is a richardson's ground squirrel also know as the FLICKERTAIL!

[ringneck28]

So people that spend time at UND that credit it with becoming who they are isn't relevant. Guess we shouldn't have Engelstad Arena or claim Matt Greene, Ed Belfour, etc. as something related to UND since they only spent a little time here, regardless if they might not have achieved what they did without their time here. Why are so many alumni that aren't from here even concerned about a new nickname, they shouldn't be if they only spent a small part of their lives here. Maybe the only people that should get to vote on the new nickname are people who have lived in North Dakota their entire life and have ties to UND.

I actually agree with parts of this.  I do not believe that it should just be UND ties.  I am a ND resident, pay my taxes to support UND and for that matter every state run school.  I believe that if you are not a ND resident, you should not be able to vote on this.  Yet is this realistic, no.  I now get off my Bully pulpit. 

[BigGame]

I should add, that this is exactly the kind of personality we should want to replicate with our athletic programs, that of having nothing handed to us, but earning the respect of others through our actions and diligence.

OK, then go with the Roosevelt or Teddy's!  At least then it would be unique and have a direct connection to the him because he clearly has some history in the state.    Rough Riders isn't original and he wasn't even the first commander of the Rough Riders.  The entire pissing contest here is stupid because the name didn't even meet one of the main criteria for selection.  Sadly, Roughriders is the best of what remains but that certainly doesn't make it a good option.

 

I really wish this whole thing could be tabled for about 5 more years.  I didn't feel that way before the selection process started but the entire thing has been a huge joke.  Hell, the committee eliminated all kinds of possible names from the start but kept several on the list for a while that couldn't even be a viable option such as Blackhawks. 

[SiouxVolley]

As I've said before, if people like the name roughrider, that's just fine, we all have opinions.

People always mention stories about Teddy Roosevelt; why not mention a few stories about the Roughriders themselves? I think I know the answer...

The nickname committee had an opportunity to advance a few names that referred to the actual people that settled our state. As part of their criteria from the beginning, I thought a few of those names like Sodbusters or Settlers would've had a chance of advancing. But instead, the only name that attempts to honor ND heritage that is left on the list, is in fact a name that honors Teddy Roosevelt; not North Dakota. I didn't attend the University of Teddy Roosevelt.

And I didnt attend the University of Robert Otis Kelley. I'd take Teddy Roosevelt well before most figures because he was forward thinking progressive, but still conservative and a conservationist before his time. A Bull Moose.

Where were you when the nickname was under attack? I sent out freedom of information requests to all the Slummit and Big Sky Presidents. There was no email discussion of the nickname at all, except by a few concerned fans. The whole Sioux nickname situation was rigged from top, beginning with Dalrymple and Stenehjam and carried out nefariously by Kelley. Kelley did not once implore the NCAA to change their stance and was effectively a double agent, while people assumed he would back the majority. The SBOHE was either total doofuses or were in on the ploy. Slummit League Commissioner Douple admitted that UND and ND wanted the name to go away, but he was slammed by the Herald, Forum, and Kelley for stating the truth. Bresciani attempted to get revenge on behalf of the SBoHE on him in retaliation. Bresciani had emails on the situations, but deleted them as the whole situation would cause the whole SBoHE and Stenehjem and Dalrymple to come crashing down as a blatant ruse with disregard for honesty. The state will have no part in retrieving those emails, and fired the women attorney who attempted to do so. But where were you when I stated these as issues? Mostly just got attacked here.

Kelley et al will eventually pay for their deceptions. So will Standing Rocks past leadership. Lord knows the people of Standing Rock have suffered enough. But in the meantime, UND is in a crisis and needs a new name and new leadership.