Students Spearhead Effort for Fighting Hawks Mascot

[cberkas]

4 minutes ago, ArchyAlum11 said:

Then it can be the 5th member of the Furry Force.

That is so wrong.

[ArchyAlum11]

1 minute ago, cberkas said:

That is so wrong.

Lol, the cartoon is basically one big, "furries are gross" joke.

 

 

[Frozen4sioux]

8 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Fundraising for golf is still ongoing. Sounds like they are optimistic but I haven't heard or seen any numbers that actually back that up. 

Funding for the mascot is coming from private funding. 

 

Funding is coming from the Alumni Association and Foundation, which does provide scholorships to students including student athletes correct??....

So my point is correct, instead of supporting a student academically.....

funds are being used to buy a $35,000 halloween costume.  

[jdub27]

31 minutes ago, Frozen4sioux said:

Funding is coming from the Alumni Association and Foundation, which does provide scholorships to students including student athletes correct??....

So my point is correct, instead of supporting a student academically.....

funds are being used to buy a $35,000 halloween costume.  

The Alumni Association and UND Foundation help provide funding for a lot of projects. Some people don't have specifics where their money goes, some people do. They identified people who wanted their donations to go towards a new mascot. Shame on someone for donating their own money for an idea that was pushed by some students and that they feel will add something extra to the gameday atmosphere. You make it sound like having a mascot is a some sort of controversial position to take. 

[Frozen4sioux]

I find it disingenuous to say this is being "pushed" by students.

I don't believe for a second that the idea originated from the students. This is something concocted by marketing or some department and the committee they put together, which consists of and is chaired by a students, is being used to justify a process.

As far as being controversial..... come on .... in what perversion of reality do you not realize that this process and a F'nHawks mascot is NOT a controversial issue.  

There has been almost zero positive public response to the pr stuff put out so far on social media.

The simple fact that there is a preprepared FAQ that attempts to addresse the controversial aspects of this is evidence of that. 

Please dont plead blissfull ignorance about the nature of the many questioning the fact this is happening or pretend to be baffled as to why "I" am making it sound like the pushback exists.

Thats just trying to tell people thats its raining while pissing on their face.

The fact that the UAAF went out and found specific people to fund this is, if true, a valid piece of new information that HAS NOT been put out before.

HOWEVER having an announced silly unnecessary expenditure...NO MATTER HOW FUNDED.... at the same time as another round of announced budget cuts does not sit well with many many people. Fair or not, thats the case.

And the fact that the info put out in the releases today has strategicly considered information to address some of the issues raised is pure evidence that they fully understand that this is an unpopular position but are pushing it anyway. 

Those are facts that are not debatable.

The possition of the University as I see it is... "Yeah, well F you, we're going to do this, so screw your opinion and make your check out to UNDAA&F.

My position is.....  NO.  

[darell1976]

57 minutes ago, Frozen4sioux said:

I find it disingenuous to say this is being "pushed" by students.

I don't believe for a second that the idea originated from the students. This is something concocted by marketing or some department and the committee they put together, which consists of and is chaired by a students, is being used to justify a process.

As far as being controversial..... come on .... in what perversion of reality do you not realize that this process and a F'nHawks mascot is NOT a controversial issue.  

There has been almost zero positive public response to the pr stuff put out so far on social media.

The simple fact that there is a preprepared FAQ that attempts to addresse the controversial aspects of this is evidence of that. 

Please dont plead blissfull ignorance about the nature of the many questioning the fact this is happening or pretend to be baffled as to why "I" am making it sound like the pushback exists.

Thats just trying to tell people thats its raining while pissing on their face.

The fact that the UAAF went out and found specific people to fund this is, if true, a valid piece of new information that HAS NOT been put out before.

HOWEVER having an announced silly unnecessary expenditure...NO MATTER HOW FUNDED.... at the same time as another round of announced budget cuts does not sit well with many many people. Fair or not, thats the case.

And the fact that the info put out in the releases today has strategicly considered information to address some of the issues raised is pure evidence that they fully understand that this is an unpopular position but are pushing it anyway. 

Those are facts that are not debatable.

The possition of the University as I see it is... "Yeah, well F you, we're going to do this, so screw your opinion and make your check out to UNDAA&F.

My position is.....  NO.  

You might be surprised how many people outside the hockey program and the REA support the new logo, and now a mascot. People have moved on from the Fighting Sioux, and the interlocking ND period, or also known as the unofficial Fighting Sioux nickname. If you don’t like the mascot don’t interact with it at games, just sit there with your arms crossed waiting for the intermission to resume. 

[Frozen4sioux]

Keep dreaming sparky.

1 hour ago, darell1976 said:

now a mascot. A small minority of  pretentious people that keep screaming loud enough to make people think theres more of them have moved on from the Fighting Sioux, and the interlocking ND

FYP.

[darell1976]

39 minutes ago, Frozen4sioux said:

Keep dreaming sparky.

FYP.

It’s okay if you see a person wearing a Fighting Hawk cap or shirt. They cheer for the same school. And what’s funny is your reply to my comment in which you “fixed” can go for the Fighting Sioux Forever crowd as well. There are people who have moved on. Pretty fun sight seeing 10,000 Fighting Hawks fans waving their Hawkerchief during the Potato Bowl, but I’m sure after the game they ran home to hug their Fighting Sioux pillow apologizing to Ralph Engelstad for touching anything with the Hawk on it.

[Frozen4sioux]

24 minutes ago, darell1976 said:

It’s okay if you see a person wearing a Fighting Hawk cap or shirt. They cheer for the same school. And what’s funny is your reply to my comment in which you “fixed” can go for the Fighting Sioux Forever crowd as well. There are people who have moved on. Pretty fun sight seeing 10,000 Fighting Hawks fans waving their Hawkerchief during the Potato Bowl, but I’m sure after the game they ran home to hug their Fighting Sioux pillow apologizing to Ralph Engelstad for touching anything with the Hawk on it.

Your claiming people wiggling a free giveaway as a sign people are are moving on.....

that’s a new stretch of ignorance, even from you. 

 

 

[The Sicatoka]

Every day is a day further from the old moniker and logo. Go ask a freshman at GF Central what they were before the Knights. Same goes for Devils Lake or Wahpeton HSs. 

What I enjoy most about the new moniker and logo: 
No more listening to folks harangue a great university over what ultimately is a tertiary affect.
Put in layman's terms: We burned Leigh Jeanotte's and Lucy Ganje's soap boxes. 

[The Sicatoka]

You people scare me. 

[darell1976]

3 hours ago, Frozen4sioux said:

Your claiming people wiggling a free giveaway as a sign people are are moving on.....

that’s a new stretch of ignorance, even from you. 

 

 

Keep your head in the sand, cause reality is going to kick you in the @ss. There was an article on FB from WDAZ about the decline in Canadian shoppers, and in the pic was Target with 2 shoppers in front of the store what do you think was on one of shoppers’s shirt? I will give you a hint....it’s the current nickname of the school. More and more people are wearing it than this time last year and it will only increase as time goes on. 

[darell1976]

54 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

Every day is a day further from the old moniker and logo. Go ask a freshman at GF Central what they were before the Knights. Same goes for Devils Lake or Wahpeton HSs. 

 

I wonder how many Redskin forever people attended the hockey tournaments? And that is 24 years removed. 

[Blackheart]

So they are putting this to a vote?  Will the top vote getter be set aside in favor of a more “marketable” option?

[UNDBIZ]

$1 million + to sue the NCAA:  No complaints.

$35,000 to have what nearly every other college has:  What a waste of money!!!

[jdub27]

9 hours ago, Frozen4sioux said:

I find it disingenuous to say this is being "pushed" by students.

I don't believe for a second that the idea originated from the students. This is something concocted by marketing or some department and the committee they put together, which consists of and is chaired by a students, is being used to justify a process.

As far as being controversial..... come on .... in what perversion of reality do you not realize that this process and a F'nHawks mascot is NOT a controversial issue.  

There has been almost zero positive public response to the pr stuff put out so far on social media.

The simple fact that there is a preprepared FAQ that attempts to addresse the controversial aspects of this is evidence of that. 

Please dont plead blissfull ignorance about the nature of the many questioning the fact this is happening or pretend to be baffled as to why "I" am making it sound like the pushback exists.

Thats just trying to tell people thats its raining while pissing on their face.

The fact that the UAAF went out and found specific people to fund this is, if true, a valid piece of new information that HAS NOT been put out before.

HOWEVER having an announced silly unnecessary expenditure...NO MATTER HOW FUNDED.... at the same time as another round of announced budget cuts does not sit well with many many people. Fair or not, thats the case.

And the fact that the info put out in the releases today has strategicly considered information to address some of the issues raised is pure evidence that they fully understand that this is an unpopular position but are pushing it anyway. 

Those are facts that are not debatable.

The possition of the University as I see it is... "Yeah, well F you, we're going to do this, so screw your opinion and make your check out to UNDAA&F.

My position is.....  NO.  

That's a lot of assumptions about something you don't seem to have much first-hand knowledge about. Calling something "facts" doesn't make them so and if you truly have that much concern over the whole thing, I'm sure someone at the Alumni Association or Foundation would be happy to help explain some actual facts to you. 

 

38 minutes ago, UNDBIZ said:

$1 million + to sue the NCAA:  No complaints.

$35,000 to have what nearly every other college has:  What a waste of money!!!

That doesn't even include the time/resources indirectly dedicated to the "cause" but your comment really puts in perspective what people are actually upset about and it sure as hell isn't the money.

[stoneySIOUX]

This "argument" summed up here between :26 and :31

 

[Yote 53]

On ‎4‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 1:53 PM, jdub27 said:

Well, obviously 6 years isn't enough for some people to move on. UND should probably just halt everything for another decade and see if they'll come around and accept reality that it's just a nickname and logo, not a deity. Life is full of changes, it is what it is.

From an outsider's perspective, who comes here from time to time to read up on this never ending controversy, here are my observations.  The Sioux Forever people are never going to accept the Fighting Hawks nickname.  The Fighting Hawks nickname is the epitome of everything they opposed because it is such a bland, PC nickname.  The only thing worse would have been to make the nickname a color, instead you picked the second worse possible option, a variation of hawk.  It was like throwing a big F-U right in the faces of the Sioux Forever crowd.

You all want to move on?  The Sioux Forever people need to accept that the Sioux nickname and logo is never coming back.  In return, the Fighting Hawks nickname and logo needs to be killed and buried and a new, more appealing nickname chosen.  You will get much more acceptance in the long run. 

UND went from, basically, one of the most unique nicknames in college athletics to one of the most meh nicknames and one of the worst logos.  That's a hard fall.  The best part is if a totally awesome nickname and logo was chosen it also would not have been accepted.  The Fighting Hawks name and logo is actually the perfect sacrifice to transition from Sioux to a more permanent nickname.

You want to heal this gaping wound this is what you need to do.  Announce the Hawk as transitional, kill it, and come up with something else, something unique, historical, and North Dakotan.  Instead it looks like the administration is doubling down on force feeding the new nickname and logo with the addition of a mascot.  That isn't going to work, it's just another flashpoint of contention. 

[Siouxperfan7]

12 minutes ago, Yote 53 said:

From an outsider's perspective, who comes here from time to time to read up on this never ending controversy, here are my observations.  The Sioux Forever people are never going to accept the Fighting Hawks nickname.  The Fighting Hawks nickname is the epitome of everything they opposed because it is such a bland, PC nickname.  The only thing worse would have been to make the nickname a color, instead you picked the second worse possible option, a variation of hawk.  It was like throwing a big F-U right in the faces of the Sioux Forever crowd.

You all want to move on?  The Sioux Forever people need to accept that the Sioux nickname and logo is never coming back.  In return, the Fighting Hawks nickname and logo needs to be killed and buried and a new, more appealing nickname chosen.  You will get much more acceptance in the long run. 

UND went from, basically, one of the most unique nicknames in college athletics to one of the most meh nicknames and one of the worst logos.  That's a hard fall.  The best part is if a totally awesome nickname and logo was chosen it also would not have been accepted.  The Fighting Hawks name and logo is actually the perfect sacrifice to transition from Sioux to a more permanent nickname.

You want to heal this gaping wound this is what you need to do.  Announce the Hawk as transitional, kill it, and come up with something else, something unique, historical, and North Dakotan.  Instead it looks like the administration is doubling down on force feeding the new nickname and logo with the addition of a mascot.  That isn't going to work, it's just another flashpoint of contention. 

Spending time and money going through the long drawn out process again that will result in the same reaction from the anti new nickname fanbase is not something UND is willing to do.  It's not going to happen.  

[jdub27]

24 minutes ago, Yote 53 said:

From an outsider's perspective, who comes here from time to time to read up on this never ending controversy, here are my observations.  The Sioux Forever people are never going to accept the Fighting Hawks nickname.  The Fighting Hawks nickname is the epitome of everything they opposed because it is such a bland, PC nickname.  The only thing worse would have been to make the nickname a color, instead you picked the second worse possible option, a variation of hawk.  It was like throwing a big F-U right in the faces of the Sioux Forever crowd.

You all want to move on?  The Sioux Forever people need to accept that the Sioux nickname and logo is never coming back.  In return, the Fighting Hawks nickname and logo needs to be killed and buried and a new, more appealing nickname chosen.  You will get much more acceptance in the long run. 

UND went from, basically, one of the most unique nicknames in college athletics to one of the most meh nicknames and one of the worst logos.  That's a hard fall.  The best part is if a totally awesome nickname and logo was chosen it also would not have been accepted.  The Fighting Hawks name and logo is actually the perfect sacrifice to transition from Sioux to a more permanent nickname.

You want to heal this gaping wound this is what you need to do.  Announce the Hawk as transitional, kill it, and come up with something else, something unique, historical, and North Dakotan.  Instead it looks like the administration is doubling down on force feeding the new nickname and logo with the addition of a mascot.  That isn't going to work, it's just another flashpoint of contention. 

I agree with most of this. UND ended up with a bland nickname because there was too many groups allowed to give input (I likened it to when a group tries to order pizza and they end up getting the most predictable result, pepperoni). The flip side is, we've seen first-hand the outcry that arises when people who feel like they are owed input, aren't given it. It was a no-win situation (similar to this whole process). 

Killing the new nickname is a decent idea in theory, but we're already seeing people with faux-outrage, under the guise of budget cuts, complaining about spending small amounts of money on things like a mascot and branding, which are normal expenditures. I can't imagine the backlash these newfound budget-hawks (since there was minimal concern over the spending to keep the Fighting Sioux nickname) would have if UND was to scrap everything they've done up to this point and start the whole process over. In the end, there is zero guarantee you'll have something much better and you're still going to end up with something that a vocal, small subsection of the fan base will not support because they have pledged their allegiance to the Fighting Sioux deity and that apparently won't change.

Frankly, it doesn't really matter. Look at the nicknames across college sports, the majority of them aren't real exciting, it is the teams and branding behind them that make them popular, not the actual name itself. I think the current logo is fine and they change and evolve as time goes on. At some point, they need to come up with a secondary logo and I think that will help matters.

[UND1983]

6 hours ago, Frozen4sioux said:

Your claiming people wiggling a free giveaway as a sign people are are moving on.....

that’s a new stretch of ignorance, even from you. 

 

Lighten up, Hillbilly.  It's a @W*()$& nickname of a college and your precious Indian version isn't coming back.  

 

Edited April 24, 2018 by UNDBIZ
language

[UND1983]

1 hour ago, UNDBIZ said:

$1 million + to sue the NCAA:  No complaints.

$35,000 to have what nearly every other college has:  What a waste of money!!!

Boom.

[stoneySIOUX]

10 minutes ago, UND1983 said:

Lighten up, Hillbilly.  It's a &*(% nickname of a college and your precious Indian version isn't coming back.  

 

Yeah, that approach will convince him. Smart move. 

Edited April 24, 2018 by UNDBIZ
language in quote

[Siouxperfan7]

McMurry University was also on the NCAA list in 2005 that eventually changed its nickname.  They went with a version of Hawks as well.  Honest question.  Is their logo so much better than the Fighting Hawks logo?  Had UND chosen a logo like this, would it have been widely accepted and virtually eliminate the #siouxforever crowd?  Would fans be demanding that it be on the front of the hockey jerseys? 

[stoneySIOUX]

8 minutes ago, Siouxperfan7 said:

McMurry University was also on the NCAA list in 2005 that eventually changed its nickname.  They went with a version of Hawks as well.  Honest question.  Is their logo so much better than the Fighting Hawks logo?  Had UND chosen a logo like this, would it have been widely accepted and virtually eliminate the #siouxforever crowd?  Would fans be demanding that it be on the front of the hockey jerseys? 

Absolutely not to all three of these questions. 1) That logo is as equally as bad/generic. 2) Why would another version of a generic Hawk get rid of the idea of Sioux Forever? "Sioux Forever" is not about the logo being bad, it's about having the Sioux logo taken away. Had the new logo and/or name been better, the transition may have been easier and not taken as long, but "Sioux Forever" would have still been there. 3) No Sioux Forever fans want the logo anywhere, regardless of the sport. No need to clump it all on hockey. See point 2 for the answer why.

All in all, what's your point?