bincitysioux Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 Remember when this guy applied to be the Head Coach at UND but we hired Brian Jones instead? From Stephen, Minn., to the Big Dance, Craig Smith is a small-town success story 3 Quote
Siouxphan27 Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 1 hour ago, bincitysioux said: Remember when this guy applied to be the Head Coach at UND but we hired Brian Jones instead? From Stephen, Minn., to the Big Dance, Craig Smith is a small-town success story I ‘member... 1 Quote
SWSiouxMN Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 1 hour ago, bincitysioux said: Remember when this guy applied to be the Head Coach at UND but we hired Brian Jones instead? From Stephen, Minn., to the Big Dance, Craig Smith is a small-town success story This was before my time a little, what were the circumstances again? Just another branch of the Tim Miles coaching tree. Can we snag a branch off that tree sometime? Quote
bincitysioux Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 17 minutes ago, SWSiouxMN said: This was before my time a little, what were the circumstances again? Just another branch of the Tim Miles coaching tree. Can we snag a branch off that tree sometime? Smith submitted his resume when the job was open after Rich Glas left. He didn't make it to the interview stage, because he didn't have DI coaching experience. Tom Buning pulled the trigger on Jones (who at the time was an assistant at Iowa), and here we are....................... Full disclosure: I actually supported the hiring of Jones at the time, in large part due to his experience at the DI level. The lesson I learned from that is that just because you have experience, doesn't mean you have "it". Some people don't have "it". Jones does not. 1 Quote
UND1983 Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 16 minutes ago, bincitysioux said: Smith submitted his resume when the job was open after Rich Glas left. He didn't make it to the interview stage, because he didn't have DI coaching experience. Tom Buning pulled the trigger on Jones (who at the time was an assistant at Iowa), and here we are....................... Full disclosure: I actually supported the hiring of Jones at the time, in large part due to his experience at the DI level. The lesson I learned from that is that just because you have experience, doesn't mean you have "it". Some people don't have "it". Jones does not. He was like the director of ops or something wasn't he? Not like Jones was one of the top assistants. Quote
bincitysioux Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 53 minutes ago, UND1983 said: He was like the director of ops or something wasn't he? Not like Jones was one of the top assistants. Correct. He was a bench assistant for most of his time at Iowa, but was Director of BB Ops his last season there...... Quote
cberkas Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 I thought they fired Jones because of this thread. Quote
BarnWinterSportsEngelstad Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 Jones is most likely going to hang around for another coaching year just like other coaches being talked about on here that should to be fired. Maybe Chaves finds a way to let one at most go. Now if this was 5 years ago when the State was funding HE at a much higher level, I could see more leaving. Being the season is over for our top sports, and no pink slips - seems like the same old gang is recruiting. Quote
SWSiouxMN Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 So is in win the Summit or else for the 19-20 season? Quote
fightingsioux4life Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 14 hours ago, bincitysioux said: Remember when this guy applied to be the Head Coach at UND but we hired Brian Jones instead? From Stephen, Minn., to the Big Dance, Craig Smith is a small-town success story We can call it Buning's Blunder. 1 Quote
jdub27 Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 4 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said: We can call it Buning's Blunder. Or Hindsight is 20/20 3 2 Quote
fightingsioux4life Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 25 minutes ago, jdub27 said: Or Hindsight is 20/20 Please get over yourself. The "Father Knows Best" routine stopped being funny a long time ago (on second thought, it never was funny). 1 1 Quote
jdub27 Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 23 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said: Please get over yourself. The "Father Knows Best" routine stopped being funny a long time ago (on second thought, it never was funny). Just pointing out how ridiculous it is to criticize a decision made 13 years ago based on today's information like you knew it was the wrong decision all along. I don't know the details of why Smith wasn't even a finalist, but hiring Jones, at least at the time, wasn't considered a bad hire let alone a blunder . 2 2 Quote
fightingsioux4life Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 2 hours ago, jdub27 said: Just pointing out how ridiculous it is to criticize a decision made 13 years ago based on today's information like you knew it was the wrong decision all along. I don't know the details of why Smith wasn't even a finalist, but hiring Jones, at least at the time, wasn't considered a bad hire let alone a blunder . Yes we do. He didn't meet Buning's long list of must-haves. Which shows you that being rigid in hiring criteria can backfire big-time. Smith was a rising star in college basketball coaching at the time; that is not up for debate. He is one that got away. Buning was a disaster as AD in general, not just this one decision. But this is one decision of his that we are still paying for. Finally, "Hindsight is 20/20" is not an all-purpose shield against criticism of a bad decision. 1 2 Quote
ND-fan Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 I agree that a decision 13 years later was wrong just because he is successful now doesn't mean he would have been successful here then. Look at his resume he has gone through whole bunch of career stops to get to where he is now. I would expect he applied to other institutions for head coaching jobs and wasn't accepted until this last position. Also for current coach not many coaches have gone from division II era transitioning to division I and also changing conferences three times in program and has gone through budget restricted athletic program where we were not even able to keep assistants for any given period of time until lately because of lack of money to pay the going rate. Basketball has been the third rail here at UND since the 1990's and to have even success we have had is remarkable. I believe that is why the Athletic Directors we have made little change in the basketball programs is because they know this and making change may not result in any improvement or more likely result in us going the other way. I am sure I get all kind of rebuttals about finding right person that can be here a few years turn us into winning program but nobody here on this sight wants to think what if it fails with each failure it gets harder to find person that can produce winner. Pretty soon in that scenario we had 10 years of loosing and tell me how you turn it around. If I am athletic director and my third rail of sports in the school I am at I want program that is consistent at about 500 and every couple of years puts together team that wins conference and makes the tournament. It may not reach excellence a lot of you talk about but its consistent winning enough to keep fans in the seats and doesn't put athletic budget at distress if whole thing fails reaching for that excellence. Example of this now is NDSU women's basketball program they have been reaching for that next Tim Miles on women's side but look at where that program is at and how long does it takes to rebuild the program and how much additional money will it need to get it done. Just some thoughts from different point of view everyone has this idea changing coaching is going to be automatically successful but I would like see the success rate on changing coaching it seems to many of the schools that are changing coaching a lot never see long term improvement. that's my opinion which may be wrong but what I have seen over the years. 1 3 Quote
fightingsioux4life Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 14 minutes ago, ND-fan said: I agree that a decision 13 years later was wrong just because he is successful now doesn't mean he would have been successful here then. Look at his resume he has gone through whole bunch of career stops to get to where he is now. I would expect he applied to other institutions for head coaching jobs and wasn't accepted until this last position. Also for current coach not many coaches have gone from division II era transitioning to division I and also changing conferences three times in program and has gone through budget restricted athletic program where we were not even able to keep assistants for any given period of time until lately because of lack of money to pay the going rate. Basketball has been the third rail here at UND since the 1990's and to have even success we have had is remarkable. I believe that is why the Athletic Directors we have made little change in the basketball programs is because they know this and making change may not result in any improvement or more likely result in us going the other way. I am sure I get all kind of rebuttals about finding right person that can be here a few years turn us into winning program but nobody here on this sight wants to think what if it fails with each failure it gets harder to find person that can produce winner. Pretty soon in that scenario we had 10 years of loosing and tell me how you turn it around. If I am athletic director and my third rail of sports in the school I am at I want program that is consistent at about 500 and every couple of years puts together team that wins conference and makes the tournament. It may not reach excellence a lot of you talk about but its consistent winning enough to keep fans in the seats and doesn't put athletic budget at distress if whole thing fails reaching for that excellence. Example of this now is NDSU women's basketball program they have been reaching for that next Tim Miles on women's side but look at where that program is at and how long does it takes to rebuild the program and how much additional money will it need to get it done. Just some thoughts from different point of view everyone has this idea changing coaching is going to be automatically successful but I would like see the success rate on changing coaching it seems to many of the schools that are changing coaching a lot never see long term improvement. that's my opinion which may be wrong but what I have seen over the years. #highschoolmentality #mediocrityrules #standpatwitheverything 1 Quote
MafiaMan Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said: #highschoolmentality #mediocrityrules #standpatwitheverything So were you in favor of or against Dean Blais' hiring at the time? Most everyone I heard from at the time viewed him as a former Gopher player and "just" a high school coach. 1 Quote
fightingsioux4life Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 Just now, MafiaMan said: So were you in favor of or against Dean Blais' hiring at the time? Most everyone I heard from at the time viewed him as a former Gopher player and "just" a high school coach. Actually, you are making my point for me. Blais, like Smith, was not a proven commodity. But look at what he did in three short years (11 wins in 1994; NCAA title in 1997). Quote
MafiaMan Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 Just now, fightingsioux4life said: Actually, you are making my point for me. Blais, like Smith, was not a proven commodity. But look at what he did in three short years (11 wins in 1994; NCAA title in 1997). Yes, I'm helping make your point for you. The search for someone with "D1" experience has turned out to be a disaster. Everyone has to get their start somewhere. Jones has hornswaggled North Dakota into thinking he's "the guy" for the future of this program. He clearly is not. 3 Quote
fightingsioux4life Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 Just now, MafiaMan said: Yes, I'm helping make your point for you. The search for someone with "D1" experience has turned out to be a disaster. Everyone has to get their start somewhere. Jones has hornswaggled North Dakota into thinking he's "the guy" for the future of this program. He clearly is not. What I meant by "high school mentality" is that some people don't care whether we win or lose ("all about the relationships" and "all about teaching life lessons"). That simply will not foster a winning mentality and attitude. Quote
MafiaMan Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 7 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said: What I meant by "high school mentality" is that some people don't care whether we win or lose ("all about the relationships" and "all about teaching life lessons"). That simply will not foster a winning mentality and attitude. Gotcha. I think we're on the same page. Like I stated earlier in the men's b-ball forums, UND's lone game against Arizona won't mean anything if NDSU and other local schools rack up 2, 4, or 5 NCAA tournament appearance over the next decade. 3 Quote
jdub27 Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 2 hours ago, fightingsioux4life said: Smith was a rising star in college basketball coaching at the time; that is not up for debate. He is one that got away. I think that's a bit of hyperbole and there is definitely room for debate. Yes, fresh off of two impressive years at Mayville considering where they were when he started but his only experience outside of NAIA at the time was at 3 years at NDSU as a director of basketball operations when they weren't exactly lighting the world on fire in the NCC. There was no guarantee that was going to translate, unless of course you get the advantage of hindsight. If he was a true "rising star" in 2006 like you claim, I feel like he would have gotten his first head coaching job outside of Mayville before 2014 when he left Tim Miles side. I'm not diminishing what he's accomplished at all, he's done a good job where he's been. Quote
UND1983 Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 49 minutes ago, MafiaMan said: So were you in favor of or against Dean Blais' hiring at the time? Most everyone I heard from at the time viewed him as a former Gopher player and "just" a high school coach. Uh, that was not the case. You are making that up or hanging out with some real idiots. I was living in Grand Forks at the time....fake news. Quote
UND1983 Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 Blais was a proven commodity at UND already having coached their for nine seasons. He should have been named the head coach long before he was. Quote
Cratter Posted March 21, 2019 Posted March 21, 2019 DeBoer was also a rising star that UND let slip away. 2 Quote
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