FCS Football vs NCAA Hockey

[geaux_sioux]

I'm sorry you feel that way, and maybe the use of the word "sucks" is a little harsh, "undesirable" would have been a better choice. But the low showing in both attendance and tv ratings would suggest that there is a lack of interest in this level of play. That doesn't mean that I don't follow UND football, it just means that I would like to see UND find a way to go to FBS or invest more resources in building a solid basketball program. At the end of the day athletics is an investment and at UND hockey and basketball offers more bang for the buck.

How many people were there in person watching Yale win it all?

[IrishSiouxFan]

How many people were there in person watching Yale win it all?

No idea how many were there in person, the NCAA screws the pooch on poor tournament placement. But in terms of tv ratings North Dakota vs. BC in 2001 brought in more than 1.3 million, 2002Maine vs. Minn brought in 2.3 million, and the 2010 BC vs. Wis. got over 1.3 million. I looked but couldn't find the ratings for the 2013 Championship game.

[Herd]

Interesting topic, I think they are almost mirror images of each other. Both FCS Football and College Hockey are not followed on a national level, only regional. Heyduke seems to have a lot of Facts, so I'll throw some out.

29.4% of NHL Players came from the college ranks in 2012-13 and 20.1% of NFL Players came from FCS in 2012-13. Not a big difference on the top level talent in each sport...

Is ncaa hockey's relationship to the NHL the same a ncaa football is to the NFL? No, it's not. 99% of football players that feed the NFL come from the NCAA ranks, while 30% of NHL players come from the ncaa ranks. So are the greatest future NHL players in the 18-24 age group playing ncaa hockey? Probably a higher percentage of the Greatest NHL players are in Am/PRO leagues in Canada and Europe vs. the NCAA. Are the greatest football players in the world in the ncaa? Abolutely.

So comparisions:

NFL >>>>>>> NHL (10x)

NHL Feeders: Am/Pro Europe 33% = Am/Pro Canada 33% = ncaa hockey(Am) 30% > US Pro ranks 3%

NFL Feeders: FBS 75% FCS 20% Other NCAA/Other 5%

Mathematically: FCS Football equal to (or greater than) NCAA hockey in its importance for Professional sports leagues of NFL football and NHL hockey.

[Siouxperman8]

I honestly don't understand the appeal of college hockey to the fans on this board. I know we play Minnesota and Wisconsin in the sport but it's at best a third tier and probably more like fourth tier sport at both of those schools. Other than the occasional game against Notre Dame (who once again doesn't really care about the sport) or Ohio State (who obviously doesn't) it's a game mostly against schools who don't sponsor any sort of Division I athletics. Give me a football game against Montana any day over a hockey game against St. Cloud State, Merrimack?, or Colorado College.

Outside of Grand Forks, I'm pretty sure sports fans like myself are the majority. I live in Minneapolis and other than a few rubes who follow Gopher hockey and stop following college hockey immediately after the Gophers are eliminated, the sport takes a deep backseat to the big three at both the professional and collegiate level. This is in the so-called "State of Hockey" and college hockey isn't even close to the following of college basketball and college football. That doesn't really bode well for the sport's following nationally. It also doesn't bode well that every year it seems like the Final Four teams include, at best, one school that anyone has ever heard about and three other teams that no one would even be able to tell you what state they are in without searching the internet.

Reality is that UND hockey benefits from the fact that almost no other colleges play it in wide swaths of the country. If schools like Alabama, Texas, UCLA, and the like had hockey teams, UND would not be in the highest tier of Division I college hockey. They'd in a division very similar to where the football team is now.

I live in the Twin Cities also and am a much bigger Sioux hockey fan now than when I lived in Grand Forks. Like others have said, Sioux hockey is great but the 'hockey only' fans are hard to take, especially when they tell people that the rest of our sports don't matter. Once I moved to the Twin Cities I found that the Gopher 'hockey only' fans are just as bad or worse. That made it a lot easier to love Sioux hockey.

[Redneksioux]

Is ncaa hockey's relationship to the NHL the same a ncaa football is to the NFL? No, it's not. 99% of football players that feed the NFL come from the NCAA ranks, while 30% of NHL players come from the ncaa ranks. So are the greatest future NHL players in the 18-24 age group playing ncaa hockey? Probably a higher percentage of the Greatest NHL players are in Am/PRO leagues in Canada and Europe vs. the NCAA. Are the greatest football players in the world in the ncaa? Abolutely.

So comparisions:

NFL >>>>>>> NHL (10x)

NHL Feeders: Am/Pro Europe 33% = Am/Pro Canada 33% = ncaa hockey(Am) 30% > US Pro ranks 3%

NFL Feeders: FBS 75% FCS 20% Other NCAA/Other 5%

Mathematically: FCS Football equal to (or greater than) NCAA hockey in its importance for Professional sports leagues of NFL football and NHL hockey.

Good point with the stats. I know the thread title is fcs vs NCAA d1 hockey.....but really shouldn't we be comparing und hockey to ndsu football? Someone's gotta drop this stat......% of und hockey players that make the NHL vs % of ndsu football players that make the nfl. Or % of each current team that is drafted. These are fair comparisons if you want to compare what each team means to the highest level of their respective sport.

[geaux_sioux]

No idea how many were there in person, the NCAA screws the pooch on poor tournament placement. But in terms of tv ratings North Dakota vs. BC in 2001 brought in more than 1.3 million, 2002Maine vs. Minn brought in 2.3 million, and the 2010 BC vs. Wis. got over 1.3 million. I looked but couldn't find the ratings for the 2013 Championship game.

The three games of the Frozen Four drew a total of 35,612 in Pittsburg, a place that loves hockey. The FCS title game drew 21,411. The semifinal in Fargo drew 18,484 and the semi in Cheney drew 7,615. So the to the Frozen Four equivalent for FCS drew a total of 47,510. The capacity for the Consol Energy Center in Pitt is 18,387 and the average capacity for the three sites of the FCS 'Frozen Four' is 15,700. So what I'm getting at is the FCS 'Frozen Four' had a smaller average venue and out drew the Frozen Four by over 12,000. Also, one of those fan bases, NDSU, had to travel over 20 hours to the championship site. These numbers don't lie.

[geaux_sioux]

% of und hockey players that make the NHL vs % of ndsu football players that make the nfl.

Although I'm not a fan of NDSU that is not a valid comparison. A football team has 95 players on it. That would mean for every one pro UND churns out NDSU would have to churn out 3.

[Redneksioux]

Although I'm not a fan of NDSU that is not a valid comparison. A football team has 95 players on it. That would mean for every one pro UND churns out NDSU would have to churn out 3.

So you are saying that und hockey is more of a feeder to the NHL than ndsu football is to the nfl?

[Jheria]

There are twice as many teams in FCS football than there are playing at the highest level of college hockey. Also, there is a highest level of curling too but nobody cares about that outside of Canada either.

[darell1976]

I live in the Twin Cities also and am a much bigger Sioux hockey fan now than when I lived in Grand Forks. Like others have said, Sioux hockey is great but the 'hockey only' fans are hard to take, especially when they tell people that the rest of our sports don't matter. Once I moved to the Twin Cities I found that the Gopher 'hockey only' fans are just as bad or worse. That made it a lot easier to love Sioux hockey.

I hate that. I don't care for minor sports like tennis, and golf even UND baseball i couldn't name one player however now with the WAC and an autobid I may be paying more attention too. I am a fan of UND hockey, football, basketball and now recently volleyball. All sports matter, yes some rake in more money than others but its still important and fans of only one sport shouldn't put down fans of other sports.

[geaux_sioux]

So you are saying that und hockey is more of a feeder to the NHL than ndsu football is to the nfl?

Apples and oranges. I know the point you are trying to make but it just isn't valid. Think about it this way. How many teams are there for FCS football and D1 hockey and how many players are on each team? This means that the talent is more spread out in football. I'm not against UND hockey by any means, I just don't like some of the BS arguments some hockey only fans try.

[jdub27]

The three games of the Frozen Four drew a total of 35,612 in Pittsburg, a place that loves hockey. The FCS title game drew 21,411. The semifinal in Fargo drew 18,484 and the semi in Chetney drew 7,615. So the to the Frozen Four equivalent for FCS drew a total of 47,510. The capacity for the Consol Energy Center in Pitt is 18,387 and the average capacity for the three sites of the FCS 'Frozen Four' is 15,700. So what I'm getting at is the FCS 'Frozen Four' had a smaller average venue and out drew the Frozen Four by over 12,000. Also, one of those fan bases, NDSU, had to travel over 20 hours to the championship site. These numbers don't lie.

Don't really care either way, but all three of the hockey games were neutral sites vs one of the three football games. Also a longer layoff for planning travel for the football championship. Comparison isn't all that valid.

[Goon]

I did not play FCS football but did play at UND and we beat some good I-AA teams during my time. I do take it personal when you state that 'FCS football sucks' - even in a message board. I am sure others do too.

I do too because "most" of is would never have the ability to play Division I football. I was lucky to grace the sideline at BSU for a season.

[geaux_sioux]

Don't really care either way, but all three of the hockey games were neutral sites vs one of the three football games. Also a longer layoff for planning travel for the football championship. Comparison isn't all that valid.

I was using all three games because it makes the comparison more favorable to hockey. Compare just the championship games then. Also why are the only hockey games on ESPN/ESPN2 Frozen Four games? There are FCS quarterfinals on ESPN2. That alone shows that ESPN feels showing those football games is more advantageous than showing those hockey games. FCS football has a much larger following than D1 hockey.

[Redneksioux]

Apples and oranges. I know the point you are trying to make but it just isn't valid. Think about it this way. How many teams are there for FCS football and D1 hockey and how many players are on each team? This means that the talent is more spread out in football. I'm not against UND hockey by any means, I just don't like some of the BS arguments some hockey only fans try.

I'm far from a hockey only fan. Isnt my number one sport and neither is football. Though I do enjoy hockey at any level. So you are saying ndsu's football team is more watered down than und's hockey team?

[geaux_sioux]

I'm far from a hockey only fan. Isnt my number one sport and neither is football. Though I do enjoy hockey at any level. So you are saying ndsu's football team is more watered down than und's hockey team?

I'm not talking about NDSU. I'm talking FCS football and D1 hockey.

[Redneksioux]

I'm not talking about NDSU. I'm talking FCS football and D1 hockey.

Sorry didn't mean to divert this into another thread;)

[Goon]

Apples and oranges. I know the point you are trying to make but it just isn't valid. Think about it this way. How many teams are there for FCS football and D1 hockey and how many players are on each team? This means that the talent is more spread out in football. I'm not against UND hockey by any means, I just don't like some of the BS arguments some hockey only fans try.

What's wrong with hockey only fans? Some people only like basketball. I actually like football and hockey. Wouldn't walk across the street to watch an NBA game or watch basketball if it was playing in my basement. I am not trying to pick a fight, I am just wondering why some people get upset with fans that only like one sport. I know folks that only like baseball.

Edited August 8, 2013 by Goon

[NorthDakotaHockey]

I do too because "most" of is would never have the ability to play Division I football. I was lucky to grace the sideline at BSU for a season.

Wow. Did not know this Goon. Another feather in Goon's near fully feathered war bonnet. I'd be really great if you would show us a picture of you in full Beaver gear.

[jdub27]

What's wrong with hockey only fans? Some people only like basketball. I actually like football and hockey. Wouldn't walk across the street to watch an NBA game or watch basketball if it was playing in my basement. I am not trying to pick a fight, I am just wondering why some people get upset with fans that only like one sport. I know folks that only like baseball.

It isn't an issue with being a fan of hockey only, its the fans who put down every other sport as not being important and dismiss those student-athletes as second or third rate (not directing this at you). That's fine that you don't enjoy any basketball, there are sports UND participates in that I am not all that interested in either, but I still support those student-athletes and hope they excel both on and off the field (again not directing at you personally). There is definitely a subset that not only could care less about other sports outside of hockey, but are vocal that they are unimportant to the athletic department and university as a whole. The nickname issue showed a definite divide as some were all for keeping the nickname because it wouldn't effect the hockey team all that much but had the possibility of being devasting to the rest of the athletic department and because of that, were fine with keeping the nickname and sanctions that came with it.

[Blackheart]

I was using all three games because it makes the comparison more favorable to hockey. Compare just the championship games then. Also why are the only hockey games on ESPN/ESPN2 Frozen Four games?

That's an easy one...it's because ESPN hates hockey and does an incredibly crappy job on the games they do broadcast. Their best efforts in the Frozen Four games were when Tom Mees (R.I.P.) was in the booth.

[Goon]

Wow. Did not know this Goon. Another feather in Goon's near fully feathered war bonnet. I'd be really great if you would show us a picture of you in full Beaver gear.

I actually have a beaver tattooed to my leg.

[Goon]

It isn't an issue with being a fan of hockey only, its the fans who put down every other sport as not being important and dismiss those student-athletes as second or third rate (not directing this at you). That's fine that you don't enjoy any basketball, there are sports UND participates in that I am not all that interested in either, but I still support those student-athletes and hope they excel both on and off the field (again not directing at you personally). There is definitely a subset that not only could care less about other sports outside of hockey, but are vocal that they are unimportant to the athletic department and university as a whole. The nickname issue showed a definite divide as some were all for keeping the nickname because it wouldn't effect the hockey team all that much but had the possibility of being devasting to the rest of the athletic department and because of that, were fine with keeping the nickname and sanction that came with it.

Actually, I should preface this, I love listening to Travis Brewster the coach of the Woman’s team a press days, I think he’s an awesome guy and a good coach that has a great message to pass on. I should say that I would go to a “UND” basketball game, I haven’t since 1996. As far as the NBA, I would walk across the street to watch it.

[geaux_sioux]

That's an easy one...it's because ESPN hates hockey and does an incredibly crappy job on the games they do broadcast. Their best efforts in the Frozen Four games were when Tom Mees (R.I.P.) was in the booth.

Because the ratings aren't good. If they were those money grubbing whores at ESPN would be all over hockey.

[UNDColorado]

Because the ratings aren't good. If they were those money grubbing whores at ESPN would be all over hockey.

ESPN hates the NHL as well ...