Dave Berger Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 This is my fifth season writing for SiouxSports.com, and I would hazard a guess that I have used the phrase "Green and White" interchangeaby with the phrases University of North Dakota, North Dakota, UND, Sioux, or Fighting Sioux at least 200 times. I wouldn't read too much into it. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post stoneySIOUX Posted January 19, 2012 Popular Post Share Posted January 19, 2012 Has anyone noticed that Wayne Nelson of the Grand Forks Heraldo has been calling UND the "Green and White" since the nickname retirement took effect? I honestly wish he would knock it off. If he keeps calling us that, people will get the hairbrained idea to make that our new nickname. I can just picture opening up my Sunday Herald and turning to the Insight section and seeing Mike Jacob's mug next to the "Matters at Hand" column with the headline "Green and White Solid Choice for UND's New Name" or some other garbage like that. Any talk about a new name should wait until the cooling off period is over. I don't want to end up with "Green and White" or "Sundogs" or anything stupid like that. The only reason anyone uses the phrase "green and white" is simply to avoid repetition of UND when referring to the team throughout a story. Journalism 101 has been to avoid repetition and to flip flop between team name and location when writing. Since Fighting Sioux is no longer available, "North Dakota" and "green and white" are good and acceptable replacements for using UND over and over. When Wayne, Tom, Brad etc. write an article, they aren't thinking about the psyche of their readers and how this could affect their long-term thoughts about a particular nickname, they are simply trying to not sound poorly when writing on deadline. "Green and white" and "North Dakota" only give them flexibility. Period.... end of story. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teeder11 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 The only reason anyone uses the phrase "green and white" is simply to avoid repetition of UND when referring to the team throughout a story. Journalism 101 has been to avoid repetition and to flip flop between team name and location when writing. Since Fighting Sioux is no longer available, "North Dakota" and "green and white" are good and acceptable replacements for using UND over and over. When Wayne, Tom, Brad etc. write an article, they aren't thinking about the psyche of their readers and how this could affect their long-term thoughts about a particular nickname, they are simply trying to not sound poorly when writing on deadline. "Green and white" and "North Dakota" only give them flexibility. Period.... end of story. ^^^^^^^^^^This. Bingo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadScout03 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Considering "Pride of the North" is currently in use at UND as the name of the marching/pep bands, I would doubt it ends up being the nickname for the entire sports program. Exactly. I'm not sure how the name is "wide open". Although, the basketball band was named the Sioux Crew Basketball Band before the Sioux Crew (now NoDak Nation) ever existed, so you never know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yababy8 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 I wouldn't call those people "stakeholders". They only have a "stake" in the Sioux moniker, not the university itself. UND can't really control its own moniker as long as certain people insist on treating the issue as a political one. That goes for Clueless Al, and his equally clueless acolytes passing out petitions, etc. Wow, this from the guy that executes political attacks on a North Dakota congressional leader who held a position that was in concert with the OVERWHELMING majority of citizens of North Dakota, If anyone is to blame it is you and the North Dakota Democrats! As I have said before as a life long democrat, how is keeping the name not a democratic issue. It falls squarely in the realm of big money vs the wishes of the people. That is about as liberal as you get. Unfortunately, the people of North Dakota, especially more liberal minded, have been brainwashed into believing that this is a political issue. It's not, it is simply right vs wrong on the most fundamental level. I wonder how many people signing that petition about "a constitutional amendment" realize they mean the state constitution (how many realize there is a state constitution?) and that the state constitution has no power outside the borders of the state of North Dakota and as such the NCAA does not have to acknowledge it. You should go get a job with the NCAA. Ya know, since they are your god and all... Fear the NCAA, for they do not answer to your laws, they do unto you what they want so do as they say! huh?? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Wow, this from the guy that executes political attacks on a North Dakota congressional leader who held a position that was in concert with the OVERWHELMING majority of citizens of North Dakota, If anyone is to blame it is you and the North Dakota Democrats! As I have said before as a life long democrat, how is keeping the name not a democratic issue. It falls squarely in the realm of big money vs the wishes of the people. That is about as liberal as you get. Unfortunately, the people of North Dakota, especially more liberal minded, have been brainwashed into believing that this is a political issue. It's not, it is simply right vs wrong on the most fundamental level. Saved for my own amusement. Thanks for the laughs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yababy8 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Saved for my own amusement. Thanks for the laughs. I figured you would find that humerous, kind of like the way you surely chucle when you refer to the people, many of which are Sioux native Americans, who are handing out petitions as, "his [Al Carson's] equally clueless acolytes". Nice! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchmaker49 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Wow, this from the guy that executes political attacks on a North Dakota congressional leader who held a position that was in concert with the OVERWHELMING majority of citizens of North Dakota, If anyone is to blame it is you and the North Dakota Democrats! As I have said before as a life long democrat, how is keeping the name not a democratic issue. It falls squarely in the realm of big money vs the wishes of the people. That is about as liberal as you get. Unfortunately, the people of North Dakota, especially more liberal minded, have been brainwashed into believing that this is a political issue. It's not, it is simply right vs wrong on the most fundamental level. You should go get a job with the NCAA. Ya know, since they are your god and all... Fear the NCAA, for they do not answer to your laws, they do unto you what they want so do as they say! huh?? We are a republic not a democracy. A republic is where the minority are protected from the majority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 I figured you would find that humerous, kind of like the way you surely chucle when you refer to the people, many of which are Sioux native Americans, who are handing out petitions as, "his [Al Carson's] equally clueless acolytes". Nice! I'm guessing you had to "cut and paste" that little tidbit, since you're obviously too inept to spell it correctly. I'd also guess you had to look up "acolyte" in a dictionary, stared at the definiton for a few minutes, picked your nose ... and still didn't get it. I'm sure Cluess Al would be proud of you. And yes, you and the rest are "clueless". Cut and paste to your heart's content ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yababy8 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 I'm guessing you had to "cut and paste" that little tidbit, since you're obviously too inept to spell it correctly. I'd also guess you had to look up "acolyte" in a dictionary, stared at the definiton for a few minutes, picked your nose ... and still didn't get it. I'm sure Cluess Al would be proud of you. And yes, you and the rest are "clueless". Cut and paste to your heart's content ... At the heart of every good argument resides perfect spelling. Therefore it is understandable that you choose that as the focus of your rebuttal. Throw in a few pejoratives like you seem inclined to do and you are simply unbeatable! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fightingsioux4life Posted January 20, 2012 Author Share Posted January 20, 2012 The only reason anyone uses the phrase "green and white" is simply to avoid repetition of UND when referring to the team throughout a story. Journalism 101 has been to avoid repetition and to flip flop between team name and location when writing. Since Fighting Sioux is no longer available, "North Dakota" and "green and white" are good and acceptable replacements for using UND over and over. When Wayne, Tom, Brad etc. write an article, they aren't thinking about the psyche of their readers and how this could affect their long-term thoughts about a particular nickname, they are simply trying to not sound poorly when writing on deadline. "Green and white" and "North Dakota" only give them flexibility. Period.... end of story. Okay, you guys have convinced me that this isn't worth worrying about. But I (like a lot of other people) are concerned about what the replacement name will be and how it will be picked. I guess we have a couple of years to figure it out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yababy8 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Well except for one minor detail, your wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Well except for one minor detail, your wrong. Shouldn't it be you're wrong? At the heart of every good argument resides perfect spelling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 At the heart of every good argument resides perfect spelling. Therefore it is understandable that you choose that as the focus of your rebuttal. Throw in a few pejoratives like you seem inclined to do and you are simply unbeatable! Rebuttal? I didn't even know there was an argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post The Sicatoka Posted January 20, 2012 Popular Post Share Posted January 20, 2012 You should go get a job with the NCAA. Ya know, since they are your god and all... Fear the NCAA, for they do not answer to your laws, they do unto you what they want so do as they say! huh?? Before attacking me and claiming I should work for the NCAA, I think you need to answer one question: Where were you on August 5, 2005, when the NCAA started this mess? I was here. I was on USCHO. I was contacting UND officials (Kupchella, Harmeson). I was explaining simply, clearly, how this NCAA policy was not allowable by the NCAA by-laws (since changed by the NCAA assembly) because I took the time to read and understand them. I was all those places, and contacting folks in Bismarck, explaining how this policy is simply the camel's nose under the tents of operations of every NCAA school and why the NCAA needed to be challenged and stopped on this. But, alas, all my efforts failed. But I tried. And lost. Why? As a private body of free association, it's the NCAA's game. Their rules. Heck, I've left the only trump ace left on the table for someone else to try: Get the NCAA declared a "state actor" (meaning they are no longer a private body) in a Federal court. I don't have standing to accomplish that. That's why I keep cheering for Spirit Lake. That's why I keep pointing out publicly, and privately, how SL should be challenging the NCAA. They have a shot to knock down the monster. UND no longer does. So no, the NCAA isn't any sort of diety to me, closer to demon actually. And sometimes the devil does win. Me? I have a tick mark under the "L" on my record from this. I'm not happy with it, but I'm man enough to take it and move on. So again, rather than making gradiose philosophical statements and ad hominem attacks here, where were you, what did you do, on August 5, 2005 when something was still possible. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 One more "where were they" thought: Where was the Spirit Lake Sioux tribal council (in 2005 and 2006) when a single reaffirmation of its 2000 resolution would have given UND the namesake tribal exemption? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post iramurphy Posted January 20, 2012 Popular Post Share Posted January 20, 2012 Chewey you give no evidence that Faison, Kelly and Shaft lied to the legislature. Some folks on this blog have made accusations and changed rumors to "fact" about a number of things. In fact most of what Kelly and UND and SBoHE warned the legislature about has come to pass.So much of what I read here, and the other hundred blogs about this subject, seems to be unsubstantiated rhetoric. They stated they were told by Fullerton our admission to the Big Sky would be in jeopardy and Fullerton has stated the same to the media not too long ago. The "conspiracy theorists" claim that Kelly forced Fullerton and before that Douple to make this up to help them retire the name. If they are that weak they shouldn't be league commissioners. I certainly am not saying I fully trust Kelly or Faison, but Kelly and Faison didn't lose us the name. I did, Frank did, you did, Clifford did, Strinden did, and all of the rest of us who didn't do enough over the past 50 years to keep us from landing in this mess. To blame guys who showed up after the NCAA nailed us and the agreement was done isn't fair to those folks nor is it smart. We are where we are and we all should accept responsibility for where we are and quit blaming others. Those of us who have donated money in the past to try and keep the name should have organized and done so many years a go. We have no excuses. We may not like it, but we need to move forward and keep the Univeristy positioned as best we can for success. Believe it or not, that may be without the name. The tribes have no one to blame but themselves and we who wanted to keep the name have no one to blame but ourselves. This is not about human rights for our Native brethren. AIM and other activist Native groups are one of the reasons the NCAA got involved in the first place. The tribes and the vast majority of Natives who support the name had well over 40 years to petition the NCAA or solidify there support of the name. We all could have done more and that incluces Tom Clifford and Ralph Englestad. That doesn't mean I oppose their sainthood, but we are a lot more to blame than Kelly and Faison. Chewy, you think the Big Sky needs us more than we need them??? are you serious? They have prospered without us for years and we are going to struggle without a conference. Explain your line of thinking please. You don't think they have an eye on NDSU, SDSU and USD? You don't think those schools couldn't be courted successfully by the Big Sky? Anyone who thinks that couldn't happen hasn't watched the Big 10, WCHA, Pac !0, SEC, aCC etc. the past two years. We need the Big Sky unless you think there is a FBS league who would take us and we would have the funds to make the move. Fetch, you keep insinuating that those who disagree with you are cowards. Have you ever had to do anything that requires you risk everything you have and believe in for a cause? Can't you state you opinions without continued stupid inferences like that. You lose any credibility you may have. It doesn't take courage to name call from behind the anonimity of a blog. You can remain a man of your convictions without the continued insults. I can respect the passion for the name but one of the reasons we have failed is that we keep losing focus and start blaming someone for our own failings as a group of fans, as a University and the Fighting Sioux community both Native and non Native . We need to live to fight another day and the task is daunting. The solution may very well be a future strategy that no one is even discussing right now. If anyone thinks having our state government pass legislation about this name is a good idea then you have't paid attention to how screwed up things can get when the government is involved. Legislation will only limit our options just like the agreement with the NCAA limited our options. There is nothing wrong with holding off on selecting a name but legislation prohibiting UND from doing so decreases our flexibilit?. We who wanted the name didn't do enough to keep the name over the last 50 years. I haven't seen anything other than the movement by the tribes against the NCAA that will fix our many years of inactivity. I am as much to blame as anyone else but Faison and Kelly are not. They weren't here and probably weren't aware of the scope of the issue. Blame them for the things they are responsible for not for our failures. 19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND Fan Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Ira - once again, I fully agree with every point you made. The blame-game and whining must stop - there is no basis for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Ira - once again, I fully agree with every point you made. The blame-game and whining must stop - there is no basis for it! Nor does it serve any purpose. Sica and Ira are "right on" with their assessments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 baaa baaa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdub27 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 baaa baaa Actually more of a response than I figured you would give. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hambone Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Well done, Ira, well done. You've expressed exactly how I feel and couldn't find a good way to put into words. Wonderful response, as usual, Fetch...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 I see Fetch is scoping out the babes ... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.