Facilities Master Plan

[The Sicatoka]

Hyslop has more asbestos than a WWII battleship engine room. And the pool is leaking. 

Walsh was in rough shape in the late 1980s. (I was an RA there for more than a day we'll say; I saw parts or Walsh that still give me nightmares.) Bek and Hancock were outdated. Squires was vintage between the east and west halves of Walsh. It was showing age in the late 1980s also. West and McVey needed placing. About all of housing, kids today do not want stucco walls and asbestos tile floors. 

Memorial Stadium should've been condemned and thankfully has come down for MVI, which ushers in MVII and Albrecht Field. 

And pick your other eyesore: married housing west of West; Strinden Center; Conference Center. All needed a date with a D9 and got it. 

I'm sure some of the decisions are based on compressions, footings, and water table. Many building that have come down were vintage 1960s and early 1970s when construction technique was lacking and energy efficiency was unheard of. 

I'm not sure what to say about the CF Auditorium beyond replace the (dated) red velvet or replace the facility. 

Merrifield and Twamley are getting renovated. 

UND had half a billion, yes, $500,000,000.00, in deferred maintenance on the books when Ed Schafer arrived. He went with reality and not nostalgia. Kennedy finished the task. 

University Ave looks different today to me.

Different but better. 

 

[Nodak78]

2 hours ago, The Sicatoka said:

Hyslop has more asbestos than a WWII battleship engine room. And the pool is leaking. 

Walsh was in rough shape in the late 1980s. (I was an RA there for more than a day we'll say; I saw parts or Walsh that still give me nightmares.) Bek and Hancock were outdated. Squires was vintage between the east and west halves of Walsh. It was showing age in the late 1980s also. West and McVey needed placing. About all of housing, kids today do not want stucco walls and asbestos tile floors. 

Memorial Stadium should've been condemned and thankfully has come down for MVI, which ushers in MVII and Albrecht Field. 

And pick your other eyesore: married housing west of West; Strinden Center; Conference Center. All needed a date with a D9 and got it. 

I'm sure some of the decisions are based on compressions, footings, and water table. Many building that have come down were vintage 1960s and early 1970s when construction technique was lacking and energy efficiency was unheard of. 

I'm not sure what to say about the CF Auditorium beyond replace the (dated) red velvet or replace the facility. 

Merrifield and Twamley are getting renovated. 

UND had half a billion, yes, $500,000,000.00, in deferred maintenance on the books when Ed Schafer arrived. He went with reality and not nostalgia. Kennedy finished the task. 

University Ave looks different today to me.

Different but better. 

 

And the present day students live the changes.

[UND1983]

On 10/7/2023 at 10:23 AM, 61hawk said:

That's probably because you have little history with the building.  Are you saying that the structure couldn't be repurposed?

That building is worthless at this point.  

[The Sicatoka]

On 10/7/2023 at 9:38 AM, UND1983 said:

There is very little reason to keep Hyslop standing.  Now to renovate Chester Fritz that would be pretty cool.  I like the look of that building

 

On 10/7/2023 at 10:23 AM, 61hawk said:

That's probably because you have little history with the building.  Are you saying that the structure couldn't be repurposed?

They seriously looked at Hyslop as a retrofit and repurpose a while back (how I learned of asbestos issues). If the decision was made to brownfield the site there's a reason. 

[SIOUXFAN97]

13 hours ago, nodak651 said:

I agree and think they should have kept the venue portion.  How much would it cost in todays dollars to build the shell of that building and the cement seating? 

Had they decided to keep it, money that will soon need to be spent on building additional practice courts at the betty could have instead have been spent on a renovation (and an addition at the Betty wouldn't be needed.

A smaller version of something like this would have been perfect, long term.

those pics are awesome.........i've always referenced cameron but these are actually more like what hyslop was like...minus the open walkway and modern tv screens haha......

[gfhockey]

As a guy who still attracts college girls, I can tell you this the students like new, not remodeled

[The Sicatoka]

1 minute ago, gfhockey said:

As a guy who still attracts college girls, I can tell you this the students like new, not remodeled

Those two statements are contradictory. 

[gfhockey]

Just now, The Sicatoka said:

Those two statements are contradictory. 

I’m new to them

[The Sicatoka]

Just now, gfhockey said:

I’m new to them

New like a 1975 Pacer to someone used to driving a 2004 Impala ... 

[Nodak78]

2 minutes ago, gfhockey said:

I’m new to them

They like your wallet.

[gfhockey]

Well, as I get older, they stay the same age

[nodak651]

3 hours ago, The Sicatoka said:

Hyslop has more asbestos than a WWII battleship engine room. And the pool is leaking. 

Walsh was in rough shape in the late 1980s. (I was an RA there for more than a day we'll say; I saw parts or Walsh that still give me nightmares.) Bek and Hancock were outdated. Squires was vintage between the east and west halves of Walsh. It was showing age in the late 1980s also. West and McVey needed placing. About all of housing, kids today do not want stucco walls and asbestos tile floors. 

Memorial Stadium should've been condemned and thankfully has come down for MVI, which ushers in MVII and Albrecht Field. 

And pick your other eyesore: married housing west of West; Strinden Center; Conference Center. All needed a date with a D9 and got it. 

I'm sure some of the decisions are based on compressions, footings, and water table. Many building that have come down were vintage 1960s and early 1970s when construction technique was lacking and energy efficiency was unheard of. 

I'm not sure what to say about the CF Auditorium beyond replace the (dated) red velvet or replace the facility. 

Merrifield and Twamley are getting renovated. 

UND had half a billion, yes, $500,000,000.00, in deferred maintenance on the books when Ed Schafer arrived. He went with reality and not nostalgia. Kennedy finished the task. 

University Ave looks different today to me.

Different but better. 

 

I'm talking the shell of the arena only, not the pool area or any other attached space.  I thought that was clear.  There isn't much of anything in there...

[SIOUXFAN97]

9 minutes ago, nodak651 said:

I'm talking the shell of the arena only, not the pool area or any other attached space.  I thought that was clear.  There isn't much of anything in there...

exactly...tear down the backside and totally gut the main arena and front entrance.....but it's too late

[Kab]

Not sure how that place ever held 6000

put seats in there and it would be less 

[SIOUXFAN97]

2 minutes ago, Kab said:

Not sure how that place ever held 6000

put seats in there and it would be less 

it's bigger than it looks (that's what she said)

[61hawk]

10 hours ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

exactly...tear down the backside and totally gut the main arena and front entrance.....but it's too late

That's exactly what I've been talking about the whole time.  Some of the buildings I've worked on were no better than Hyslop.  The latest the university gutted the building to the four exterior walls, they even pulled the roof and basement floor and renovated.  From the outside the building is 90% the same as it was when it was built back in the 1940's with the only difference being an addition of expanding the lobby with a board room on the 2nd floor. 

[61hawk]

10 hours ago, Kab said:

Not sure how that place ever held 6000

put seats in there and it would be less 

They put in bleachers on the ends of the gym floor for games like the NDSU basketball game.  Plus those game were usually standing room only.

[61hawk]

11 hours ago, UND1983 said:

That building is worthless at this point.  

So that's your professional, engineering/architectural opinion?

[61hawk]

14 hours ago, The Sicatoka said:

Hyslop has more asbestos than a WWII battleship engine room. And the pool is leaking. 

Walsh was in rough shape in the late 1980s. (I was an RA there for more than a day we'll say; I saw parts or Walsh that still give me nightmares.) Bek and Hancock were outdated. Squires was vintage between the east and west halves of Walsh. It was showing age in the late 1980s also. West and McVey needed placing. About all of housing, kids today do not want stucco walls and asbestos tile floors. 

Memorial Stadium should've been condemned and thankfully has come down for MVI, which ushers in MVII and Albrecht Field. 

And pick your other eyesore: married housing west of West; Strinden Center; Conference Center. All needed a date with a D9 and got it. 

I'm sure some of the decisions are based on compressions, footings, and water table. Many building that have come down were vintage 1960s and early 1970s when construction technique was lacking and energy efficiency was unheard of. 

I'm not sure what to say about the CF Auditorium beyond replace the (dated) red velvet or replace the facility. 

Merrifield and Twamley are getting renovated. 

UND had half a billion, yes, $500,000,000.00, in deferred maintenance on the books when Ed Schafer arrived. He went with reality and not nostalgia. Kennedy finished the task. 

University Ave looks different today to me.

Different but better. 

 

Wow, people actually approved of Schafer and Kennedy?  Ed Shafer was a nutjob when he was governor, I can only imagine he didn't change as President.  Kennedy wasn't qualified for the job when hired, just ask Colorado, they booted him after two years.  Half a billion, were they planning on tearing down 75% of the campus?

I get it, you're all for raising the campus and building new.  Let's line up the bulldozers at the east end and not stop until we hit the interstate. When you talk about outdated, I suspect you're talking about the interior and not the exterior... hense the renovation instead of demolition.  In 50 years we can do it all again, because a modern building isn't going to look very well in 2073, look at how those 1973 built buildings look.  That areospace building has to be showing it's age by now, they built it when I was there 40 years ago.

Is that old Presidents house still in front of Gamble Hall?  Might as well knock that down and throw up something modern.

[nodak651]

1 hour ago, 61hawk said:

Wow, people actually approved of Schafer and Kennedy?  Ed Shafer was a nutjob when he was governor, I can only imagine he didn't change as President.  Kennedy wasn't qualified for the job when hired, just ask Colorado, they booted him after two years.  Half a billion, were they planning on tearing down 75% of the campus?

I get it, you're all for raising the campus and building new.  Let's line up the bulldozers at the east end and not stop until we hit the interstate. When you talk about outdated, I suspect you're talking about the interior and not the exterior... hense the renovation instead of demolition.  In 50 years we can do it all again, because a modern building isn't going to look very well in 2073, look at how those 1973 built buildings look.  That areospace building has to be showing it's age by now, they built it when I was there 40 years ago.

Is that old Presidents house still in front of Gamble Hall?  Might as well knock that down and throw up something modern.

 

It might please you to learn that the university gutted and completely renovated the old presidents house.

100% agree with your point about modern architecture.  Not a fan the look of the new dorms (or memorial village) have.  At all.  Also, if they were planning to tear down Walsh and Squires, etc. I really wish they would have located the new dorms there instead of adding on to the Wilki complex.  Locating students, especially freshman, as close as possible to central campus should be a no brainer.  That extra walking distance makes a big difference when it's negative 20 windchill in the winter.  Walks I took from Brannon took forever even on a good day.  Whole I'm ranting, I've got to add that the med school location is questionable given that it could have built on University directly to the west of the new dorms.

That said, I think overall th e school has done a great job and the former presidents did a great job in positioning the university for the future.  I think they did a great job with the designs of the new business school and memorial union, as well.  

[The Sicatoka]

I'll take Schafer and Kennedy and a half billion in deferred maintenance off the books and a cleaner, brighter looking campus, thank you.

One alternative is be in NDSU's position right now with budget struggles. One person I chat with (they're on the 'SU campus every day) is frankly jealous; quoting, "We need our Schafer and Kennedy," which they do.

However, I will admit some, mainly those with primarily academic world experience, didn't like Schafer and Kennedy. Why? Because they behaved like business owners and financial officers, not wistful thought-keepers of glorious by-gone days of some building that is due for condemnation. 

[The Sicatoka]

On 10/7/2023 at 5:40 PM, 61hawk said:

...  I will always be a Fighting Sioux fan, while you'll always be a fan of Mike Hawk.

And yet you chose a nom de plume with "hawk" in it ... curious. 

[GeauxSioux]

Wasn’t Vanderbilt one of the examples of schools that would just renovate and not demo to make way for the new? 
Vanderbilt announces demolition of final Carmichael Towers buildings to continue residential colleges progress

I must say that the new looks much better than the old in this case. 

[SiouxHawkGuy]

7 hours ago, nodak651 said:

 

It might please you to learn that the university gutted and completely renovated the old presidents house.

100% agree with your point about modern architecture.  Not a fan the look of the new dorms (or memorial village) have.  At all.  Also, if they were planning to tear down Walsh and Squires, etc. I really wish they would have located the new dorms there instead of adding on to the Wilki complex.  Locating students, especially freshman, as close as possible to central campus should be a no brainer.  That extra walking distance makes a big difference when it's negative 20 windchill in the winter.  Walks I took from Brannon took forever even on a good day.  Whole I'm ranting, I've got to add that the med school location is questionable given that it could have built on University directly to the west of the new dorms.

That said, I think overall th e school has done a great job and the former presidents did a great job in positioning the university for the future.  I think they did a great job with the designs of the new business school and memorial union, as well.  

Wilki complex with dorms south of university and east of the coulee woulda been nice

[The Sicatoka]

20 minutes ago, SiouxHawkGuy said:

Wilki complex with dorms south of university and east of the coulee woulda been nice

But oh-my that would require removal of JFS!