yzerman19 Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 too many on this sight use flawed logic. Post Hoc Ergo Proctor Hoc...economic speak for after this therefore because of this. You cannot make an airtight assertion based on history without significant understanding of all of the influencers. Nothing happens in isolation. There is no basis to assume that a similar track record for 10 years as a coach will result in the same outcome in year 11 or the like.
Irish Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 too many on this sight use flawed logic. Post Hoc Ergo Proctor Hoc...economic speak for after this therefore because of this. You cannot make an airtight assertion based on history without significant understanding of all of the influencers. Nothing happens in isolation. There is no basis to assume that a similar track record for 10 years as a coach will result in the same outcome in year 11 or the like. Airtight assertions are always difficult to make, Poindexter. However what is fairly obvious to everyone who is watching Sioux hockey is that Hak will stubbornly stick with the same dump chase and cycle. Many who are complaining here don't want him fired immediately, but really wish he would loosen up a bit. Lucia had a rough 4 years but shook up his staff and was willing to change. We want Hak to make some changes too. After watching the power play this weekend, I think some changes should be in order.
brianvf Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 That's my point. No way Hakstol survives a four-year stretch like that. SiouxSports.com would be in total meltdown by year two. Hakstol hasn't had one losing season yet and SS.com is already in near total meltdown. 1
UND1983 Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Hakstol hasn't had one losing season yet and SS.com is already in near total meltdown. Should he ever have a losing season?
yzerman19 Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Airtight assertions are always difficult to make, Poindexter. However what is fairly obvious to everyone who is watching Sioux hockey is that Hak will stubbornly stick with the same dump chase and cycle. Many who are complaining here don't want him fired immediately, but really wish he would loosen up a bit. Lucia had a rough 4 years but shook up his staff and was willing to change. We want Hak to make some changes too. After watching the power play this weekend, I think some changes should be in order. "Poindexter, you want to F or what?" name the film. I don't think I've ever been called anything like that in my life...funny. I'll take it though As a note, I wasn't referring to you. I think your logic on the Don Lucia turn-around is sound and applicable- you have to make changes, and you have to play to the strengths of your team. Also, as stated, having won 2 natty's cuts a guy a lot of slack! WIthout
scpa0305 Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Good God, UND could have won a natty for the last 13 years straight and some of you would bitch because we didn't win every regular season game. Unbelievable. Doubt it.
scpa0305 Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Eades won 2 as a player... I think Eades fired up the boys. This thread is funny. I am a realist. Neither a Hak apologist nor a pitchfork and torcher. Hak has not won the big one, despite having awesome talent. We all get that you don't always win when you should, but we haven't been in a drought like this since the 70's. My confidence in Hak has waned, and that is what is more important than stats. I do not have confidence that he is the coach to take us to our next banner. I dont fire people at work based on historical performances, I make those decisions based on confidence in their ability to go forward, some of which is based on the past, but more of it is based on their ability to perform in the evolving environment. This is the first year that I have stopped watching every single game- I used to watch via internet in the old DOT and Parise days too, so it isn't just the TV deal. Hak has failed to win the big one- twice with overwhelming teams. I get that he doesn't have the horses this year, but that is an excuse. Our # of draft picks is a bit of a joke, as we are loaded with late rounders... Would we be a different team with Miller and Matteau? Maybe, but we'll never know. Bottom line: we've been an elite program under Hak, but it is difficult to know his influence on that. We haven't won a title in 14 years, 10 of which are on his watch. I am concerned about the pipeline coming in. I have zero confidence in Hak as a big game coach. He gets paid too much not to win. We have the history and the facilities and the environment to breed champions. We haven't done so in too long. I agree 100% with your post. However I truly believe no one is leaving besides seniors so our team next year should be very competitive. We simply need some goals and consistency.
MafiaMan Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 "Poindexter, you want to F or what?" name the film. I don't think I've ever been called anything like that in my life...funny. I'll take it though As a note, I wasn't referring to you. I think your logic on the Don Lucia turn-around is sound and applicable- you have to make changes, and you have to play to the strengths of your team. Also, as stated, having won 2 natty's cuts a guy a lot of slack! WIthout That's gotta be Revenge of the Nerds. I think it's obvious to everyone here what needs to happen: Brad Berry needs to be fired...and replaced by John Hill.
MafiaMan Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Okay Captain Thin Skin, I'll bite. With 2002 and 2003 NCAA titles in the trophy case, I would not have pulled the plug on Lucia after that four year stretch. However, if Lucia hadn't made the changes he made to turn it around and was content with staying the course, I probably would have started making my list of potential replacements. Not making any changes would have told me that Lucia had lost perspective and that a change was needed for the good of the program. Captain Thin Skin...that's funny given that you fly off the handle anytime someone makes a comment you don't particularly care for and take personal offense to...but I digress... Let's imagine Hakstol coached that WCHA 5th place Sioux team of 2005 all the way to the NCAA title. You're telling me your opinions of the past year or so wouldnt change at all from what they are now because of that win almost 9 years ago? I'm saying that if those Gopher records were Hakstol's, your opinions would be EXACTLY the same as they are now. In fact, I can already hear the "yea, but those were all Blais' recruits" comments about the lone title year... 1
fightingsioux4life Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Captain Thin Skin...that's funny given that you fly off the handle anytime someone makes a comment you don't particularly care for and take personal offense to...but I digress... Let's imagine Hakstol coached that WCHA 5th place Sioux team of 2005 all the way to the NCAA title. You're telling me your opinions of the past year or so wouldnt change at all from what they are now because of that win almost 9 years ago? I'm saying that if those Gopher records were Hakstol's, your opinions would be EXACTLY the same as they are now. In fact, I can already hear the "yea, but those were all Blais' recruits" comments about the lone title year... What makes me "fly off the handle" are B.S. excuses for things and the tendency for some on this forum to defend the establishment and the decision-makers no matter what the facts are. I guess I get sick and tired of some of the Kool-Aid drinkers on this forum and simply want to offer a different perspective. I do not have anything personal against anyone on this forum; life is much too short for that crap. As for the topic at hand, there is a difference between being four years removed from back to back NCAA titles and being nine years removed from one NCAA title. I also think it is possible that if we had won the 2005 title, more would have followed. Kind of like "what if" Scott Norwood had made the last-second field goal against the Giants in the Super Bowl in 1991. Would that have changed the course of history for the Bills? We'll never know, unless we figure out how to travel to parallel universes "Sliders" style.
MafiaMan Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 What makes me "fly off the handle" are B.S. excuses for things and the tendency for some on this forum to defend the establishment and the decision-makers no matter what the facts are. I guess I get sick and tired of some of the Kool-Aid drinkers on this forum and simply want to offer a different perspective. I do not have anything personal against anyone on this forum; life is much too short for that crap. As for the topic at hand, there is a difference between being four years removed from back to back NCAA titles and being nine years removed from one NCAA title. I also think it is possible that if we had won the 2005 title, more would have followed. Kind of like "what if" Scott Norwood had made the last-second field goal against the Giants in the Super Bowl in 1991. Would that have changed the course of history for the Bills? We'll never know, unless we figure out how to travel to parallel universes "Sliders" style. I hardly think of myself as a Kool-Aid drinker. And that's the second Scott Norwood post on this thread in recent days. Why not Florida State and Wide Right? You and I both wish we could go back in time and change things. I'd start with that '98 regional game at Yost... 1
fightingsioux4life Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 I hardly think of myself as a Kool-Aid drinker. And that's the second Scott Norwood post on this thread in recent days. Why not Florida State and Wide Right? You and I both wish we could go back in time and change things. I'd start with that '98 regional game at Yost... No, you aren't a Kool-Aid drinker. I was simply explaining the rationale for my rants, which are usually a response to an attack from someone else. I am a hopeless alternate history buff; I love asking "what if" when studying historical events.
MafiaMan Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 No, you aren't a Kool-Aid drinker. I was simply explaining the rationale for my rants, which are usually a response to an attack from someone else. I am a hopeless alternate history buff; I love asking "what if" when studying historical events. If if's and but's were candy and nuts there would be plenty of treats for all the kids at Christmas. 2
Oxbow6 Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Hakstol hasn't had one losing season yet and SS.com is already in near total meltdown. And he hasn't won at NC either. Are we as a program and fan base becoming St. Cloud St.? Smile and be happy...not a losing season and a NCAA appearance. Are NCAA participation banners going to start hanging from Ralph's rafters? Hak wins one...just one Natty so far and this thread doesn't even exist. But he hasn't. 3
MafiaMan Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 And he hasn't won at NC either. Are we as a program and fan base becoming St. Cloud St.? Smile and be happy...not a losing season and a NCAA appearance. Are NCAA participation banners going to start hanging from Ralph's rafters? Hak wins one...just one Natty so far and this thread doesn't even exist. But he hasn't. Hey, I'd better text my buddy Oxbow6. I think gfhockey stole his SiouxSports.com account password!
brianvf Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 And he hasn't won at NC either. He sure hasn't. I guess I needed more smiley things in my post. Is it Friday yet?
Oxbow6 Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Hey, I'd better text my buddy Oxbow6. I think gfhockey stole his SiouxSports.com account password! sory maffia didnt meam to ruffl any featjers jsut wamt a winnner in hak we trudt I kid, I kid......................
MafiaMan Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 sory maffia didnt meam to ruffl any featjers jsut wamt a winnner in hak we trudt I kid, I kid...................... Did you just make a comment about my dad?
gfhockey Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Do you guys feel cool bullying me? We are becoming greg brady Scsu is jan brady Mankato is the the maid Umd can be the youngest girl
gfhockey Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Its nnot my fault u guys dont want/demand nattys
fightingsioux4life Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Do you guys feel cool bullying me? We are becoming greg brady Scsu is jan brady Mankato is the the maid Umd can be the youngest girl That's pretty good, gfhockey.
Oxbow6 Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 Do you guys feel cool bullying me? We are becoming greg brady Scsu is jan brady Mankato is the the maid Umd can be the youngest girl Just poking a little fun at your spelling. Totally with you here. UND makes the NCAA this year and gets bounced before the F4 and that does what for this fan base? Not much...............but at least we made the tournament.
MafiaMan Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 We are becoming greg brady Scsu is jan brady Mankato is the the maid Umd can be the youngest girl That's a pretty poor analogy. I think St Cloud is more like Chris Griffin. Mankato would be Lois Griffin. That makes UMD Peter Griffin. And UND is Brian the dog. That makes much more sense. 1
fightingsioux4life Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 That's a pretty poor analogy. I think St Cloud is more like Chris Griffin. Mankato would be Lois Griffin. That makes UMD Peter Griffin. And UND is Brian the dog. That makes much more sense.
Shawn-O Posted February 12, 2014 Posted February 12, 2014 I know you've all got a lot of spirit on this thread, right? And we're gonna destroy Miami this weekend, ALL RIGHT?
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