Shawn-O Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Nothing would surprise me at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Have there been any theories floating around that the SBoHE set the Oct 1 deadline to light some fires under the tribes to get something done? Just curious. Earlier in this thread I had the same thought. I don't know if the SBoHE did it on purpose or not, but it looks like the deadline may have spurred some action. It is just like what happens during a lot of labor negotiations. Very little happens until it gets close to the deadline. When everyone realizes that they are running out of time they can sit down and work out differences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Nothing would surprise me at this point. I agree with you I don't know what the heck is going to happen and I guess only time will tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mksioux Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 If the Board wants their decision to have any legitimacy, they need to let the issue play out on Standing Rock. Extend their self-imposed deadline, see what happens with the elections, and see if nickname supporters at Standing Rock can get something going with the new council. The self-imposed 30 year agreement should be changed from a requirement to an aspiration. I agree with the Board that the nickname cannot be sustained in the long term without a long term contract that establishes tangible benefits to the tribes. However, the lack of such an agreement is not a legitimate reason to prematurely drop the nickname if you have everything the NCAA requires to keep using the nickname. If Standing Rock ends up supporting the nickname like Spirit Lake has, then, in a gesture of goodwill, approach the tribes about adding tangible benefits to the support they've already given. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn-O Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Do we all agree that if Ron McNeil retains his chairmanship that this thing is over? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Do we all agree that if Ron McNeil retains his chairmanship that this thing is over? If McNeil wins you just play this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Time Hockey Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 What day is the SR election? If Charlie Murphy wins (looks like he will), doesn't there need to be some turnover in the tribal council to get a tribal vote on the nickname issue? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmksioux Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 WDAZ 10:00 news reported that the SBoHE is going to hold a conference call to decide if they want to extend the deadline until October 15th. They also stated that the deadline could be extended longer than October 15th if it appears as though an election on Standing Rock seemed likely. There is still a glimmer of hope... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackheart Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 Two things...Eades is a goon......at least that's what my Wisonsin buddies tell me...the other thing is from Senator John Blutarsky...some know him as Brother Bluto of the Delta House..."Nothing is over until we say it is"..."was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?" "Germans?" "Forget it, he's rolling" If the SBoHE does not move the date; burn'em at the stake....christ, we're halfway home on this deal and they want to quit now? Their self imposed deadline is artificial; some BS they put in to appease the Summit League...(I can't fricken believe it; I mean come on, it's not the Big 10!) Don't we have another 6 months per the original agreement to get this done? Screw the SBoHE and their short sightedness...they failed to realize that EVERYONE has a stake in this...Spirit Lake has spoken and if we don't give this our best shot then we deserve to come up short...end of rant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 Two things...Eades is a goon......at least that's what my Wisonsin buddies tell me...the other thing is from Senator John Blutarsky...some know him as Brother Bluto of the Delta House..."Nothing is over until we say it is"..."was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?" "Germans?" "Forget it, he's rolling" If the SBoHE does not move the date; burn'em at the stake....christ, we're halfway home on this deal and they want to quit now? Their self imposed deadline is artificial; some BS they put in to appease the Summit League...(I can't fricken believe it; I mean come on, it's not the Big 10!) Don't we have another 6 months per the original agreement to get this done? Screw the SBoHE and their short sightedness...they failed to realize that EVERYONE has a stake in this...Spirit Lake has spoken and if we don't give this our best shot then we deserve to come up short...end of rant. If you listen to the Bison fans though they think the Summit league is very awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mksioux Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 If you listen to the Bison fans though they think the Summit league is very awesome. The Summit League is UND's only legimitate shot at an auto-bid conference for the foreseeable future. Even recognizing the importance of the Summit, it would be crazy not to give ourselves some more time to work with a new council on Standing Rock. And an extra fifteen days isn't going to cut it. It'll take at least another six months if Standing Rock chooses to go down the same route as Spirit Lake; namely, a referendum followed by a resolution adopting the results of the referendum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 The Summit League is UND's only legimitate shot at an auto-bid conference for the foreseeable future. Even recognizing the importance of the Summit, it would be crazy not to give ourselves some more time to work with a new council on Standing Rock. And an extra fifteen days isn't going to cut it. It'll take at least another six months if Standing Rock chooses to go down the same route as Spirit Lake; namely, a referendum followed by a resolution adopting the results of the referendum. You're right we don't need to rush let the SR vote play out and go from there. We won't qualify for an auto bid till when 2012 or something like that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 You're right we don't need to rush let the SR vote play out and go from there. We won't qualify for an auto bid till when 2012 or something like that? UND may not qualify for an auto bid until 2012, but there are very limited opportunities to get into auto bid conferences. The Summit is the only legitimate opportunity on the horizon at this time. That could change, but there is no guarantee. Life for an athletic department is very difficult without an auto bid conference. That is why a chance to get into the Summit is so important right now. If you only care about football and hockey, then the Summit isn't important. If you are interested in the rest of the athletic department then the Summit is very important. I have been saying for months that the deadline could be extended if there was a chance to save the nickname. 15 days is not enough, but if progress is being made it could be extended again. 6 months isn't going to happen. My best guess is that a deadline to apply to the Summit is probably between December and February. And I don't think an extension of 6 months needs to happen. The issue is well known throughout Standing Rock, it has been around for years. If the road block is removed and an election is allowed to happen the entire process can be done in less than 3 months. Hopefully, if the tribal council allows the election they will also commit to following the wishes expressed in that election. Setting a deadline will spur activity. If they set the deadline at 3 months, it can be decided in 3 months. If they stretched it to 6 months the same process would take the 6 months and get the same result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn-O Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 This thing needs to come to resolution by the end of the calendar year at the latest. A new council could get this done in ninety days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SooToo Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 UND may not qualify for an auto bid until 2012, but there are very limited opportunities to get into auto bid conferences. The Summit is the only legitimate opportunity on the horizon at this time. ... ... If they set the deadline at 3 months, it can be decided in 3 months. If they stretched it to 6 months the same process would take the 6 months and get the same result. Totally. And might I add, if a new council declines to offer support and refuses a tribal "referendum" vote, it's time to move on immedately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 Yeah, but consider the source. This is the same fanbase that thought it was a big deal to defeat a 1-11 Gopher team. The Summit League is not worth selling your soul over. Wow, I can actually say that I agree with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn-O Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 Totally. And might I add, if a new council declines to offer support and refuses a tribal "referendum" vote, it's time to move on immedately. That much could certainly be ascertained with an extension to October 15. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the green team Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 It's not selling ones soul to get into the Summit League- but believe it or not there are some other student athletes on this campus, and the Summit League would open up the door for many for possible competition in future National Tournaments. My question is why would you be willing to even flirt with the possibility of leaving about 85% of our athletics programs out to dry? Maybe there is a timetable to get into the Summit, and maybe there isn't, but is that the way to approach life- without a sense of urgency, do we want to take that chance? I do not want to be a Division 1 Independant, nor do I want to be stuck in the psuedo conference purgatory known as the Great West for much longer. Oh wait, I believe the tribes could have addressed this issue 25 years ago... Where's the sense of urgency there? Now there is a sense of urgency-just like getting into the Summit. There were people protesting then. But someone will say the NCAA didn't put this issue on us- then. Well I argue we haven't been out floating in the wind as a Division 1 transition school during that time either, but the urgency of getting into the Summit is imperative for the this school, because the Big Sky is not coming to our rescue neither is anyone else. As far as the genius comments such as, it's not like it's the Big 10...well if you honestly think that is an option to wait for, I would encourage you to walk right in on the next SBHoE meeting layout your reasoning and convince them that this is what we should wait for. That statement is a dig at nearly every other sport at this University as if to say... you are simply not important, so why even place any importance on this Summit League possibility. But the costs of operating a Division 1 Independant and honestly thats pretty much what we are currently, are only going to increase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rochsioux Posted September 22, 2009 Share Posted September 22, 2009 It's not selling ones soul to get into the Summit League- but believe it or not there are some other student athletes on this campus, and the Summit League would open up the door for many for possible competition in future National Tournaments. My question is why would you be willing to even flirt with the possibility of leaving about 85% of our athletics programs out to dry? Maybe there is a timetable to get into the Summit, and maybe there isn't, but is that the way to approach life- without a sense of urgency, do we want to take that chance? I do not want to be a Division 1 Independant, nor do I want to be stuck in the psuedo conference purgatory known as the Great West for much longer. Oh wait, I believe the tribes could have addressed this issue 25 years ago... Where's the sense of urgency there? Now there is a sense of urgency-just like getting into the Summit. There were people protesting then. But someone will say the NCAA didn't put this issue on us- then. Well I argue we haven't been out floating in the wind as a Division 1 transition school during that time either, but the urgency of getting into the Summit is imperative for the this school, because the Big Sky is not coming to our rescue neither is anyone else. As far as the genius comments such as, it's not like it's the Big 10...well if you honestly think that is an option to wait for, I would encourage you to walk right in on the next SBHoE meeting layout your reasoning and convince them that this is what we should wait for. That statement is a dig at nearly every other sport at this University as if to say... you are simply not important, so why even place any importance on this Summit League possibility. But the costs of operating a Division 1 Independant and honestly thats pretty much what we are currently, are only going to increase. I just can't buy that there is any urgency in resolving the name so we can get in the Summit. The Summit league already knows that the nickname issue would be resolved prior to UND starting league play if they were admitted. Therefore, the name should be a none issue. If the Summit wants UND and UND wants the Summit, then it will happen regardless of whether the nickname is resolved on 10/1 or 11/1 or 12/1 or June, 2010. It is just another attempt to force the nickname to be abandoned before it can gain approval by the tribes. It appears that UND and the state board are fearful of that happening, otherwise they would let this play out. I think it was extremely important that Spirit Lake got the resolution for approval from the tribal council prior to 10/1. Without that there is no chance the state board would extend the deadline. Now UND and the state board have put themselves in a box...they want the name gone but didn't count on the tribal membership getting this far. What to do now ? If they don't extend the 10/1 deadline and give Standing Rock a chance to vote on this there will be a huge outcry not only from the fans but also from the tribal membership that has been working very hard to gain this approval. It would be worse than if they had just dropped the name a few years ago. If they extend the deadline and SR can put this to a vote it is very likely they will approve. If the SR tribal council then approves like SL what choice does UND and the state board have ? They would have to keep the nickname. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darell1976 Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 WDAZ 10:00 news reported that the SBoHE is going to hold a conference call to decide if they want to extend the deadline until October 15th. They also stated that the deadline could be extended longer than October 15th if it appears as though an election on Standing Rock seemed likely. There is still a glimmer of hope... Any update to this?? When is the call? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 I just can't buy that there is any urgency in resolving the name so we can get in the Summit. The Summit league already knows that the nickname issue would be resolved prior to UND starting league play if they were admitted. Therefore, the name should be a none issue. If the Summit wants UND and UND wants the Summit, then it will happen regardless of whether the nickname is resolved on 10/1 or 11/1 or 12/1 or June, 2010. It is just another attempt to force the nickname to be abandoned before it can gain approval by the tribes. It appears that UND and the state board are fearful of that happening, otherwise they would let this play out. I think it was extremely important that Spirit Lake got the resolution for approval from the tribal council prior to 10/1. Without that there is no chance the state board would extend the deadline. Now UND and the state board have put themselves in a box...they want the name gone but didn't count on the tribal membership getting this far. What to do now ? If they don't extend the 10/1 deadline and give Standing Rock a chance to vote on this there will be a huge outcry not only from the fans but also from the tribal membership that has been working very hard to gain this approval. It would be worse than if they had just dropped the name a few years ago. If they extend the deadline and SR can put this to a vote it is very likely they will approve. If the SR tribal council then approves like SL what choice does UND and the state board have ? They would have to keep the nickname. The Summit League can make an issue of the nickname because it's their league and they get to make the rules on getting in the league. They don't know that the issue will be resolved until it is actually resolved. People change their minds. UND could decide to keep the name without approval and accept the repercussions. It's not likely, but it could happen. The Summit wants a guarantee before they move ahead. This issue isn't going to be resolved unless there is a deadline to force people to make a decision. We have seen over the past couple of decades that people will bluster and make speeches, but they won't actually talk to each other unless they have to. The deadline forces them to talk. The SBoHE will extend the deadline. But they aren't going to give them an open checkbook. They will have a tight leash on the situation. The situation will probably be decided by the end of the year. That gives Standing Rock time to reach a decision, UND time to react to that decision and still have time to apply to the Summit League within their schedule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 Not always a fan of the guy, but he may have gotten it right this time: "Nothing is easier than blaming others for our troubles and absolving ourselves of responsibility for our choices and our actions." -- Barack Obama I sure hope Ron McNeil hears, and understands, this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackheart Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Yeah, but consider the source. This is the same fanbase that thought it was a big deal to defeat a 1-11 Gopher team. The Summit League is not worth selling your soul over. Attaboy Dave! you nailed it right on the head! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Not always a fan of the guy, but he may have gotten it right this time: I sure hope Ron McNeil hears, and understands, this. A broken clock is right twice a day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewey Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Methinks that the SBoHE will meet on 10/01 and summarily consider the issue and refuse to extend the deadline, regardless of what happens on SR. If the SBoHE were going to extend the deadline, it would have had its conference call or whatever by now and we would have heard of the extension. Anyone else see how all of the SBoHE double-speak these past few months is now coming to fruition? Any other predictions? Any other insights? I tend to agree with Sic that the fix is in. There is no way that the SBoHE did not realize that the SR elections were going to be held on 09/30. They have had their minds made up from day one and are going to drop the bomb soon and let the "process of reconciliation and healing" begin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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