President Kennedy Message on Athletics

[UND-1]

The article talks about how partisan the committee members are going to be based on what sport they support.

Ironically, it's very much like how the Herald reporters slant their articles based on what sport(s) they are obviously supporting.   In this case, Schlossman went out of his way to defend Women's Hockey.

[UNDColorado]

I found this to be interesting:

Mitch Wigness @MitchWigness

This is pretty awesome. North Dakota had 10th-highest attendance in all of NCAA DI last night. https://twitter.com/UNDvolleyball/status/769568451920703488 …

10:15 AM - 27 Aug 2016

Volleyball really does have some growth potential. Plus, I like the uniforms 

 

[SWSiouxMN]

1 hour ago, UNDBIZ said:

Yeah, I've always thought the people getting paid $250,000 per year were paid that much to make decisions and should take the heat/praise that goes with those decisions. 

Not like they are going to get the same criticism anyways

uses committee: Why can't you make the decision on your own, you are being paid $$$$ to do so

makes decision on own:  Why didn't you use a committee and not act like a dictator.

[SWSiouxMN]

1 hour ago, UNDBIZ said:

Yeah, I've always thought the people getting paid $250,000 per year were paid that much to make decisions and should take the heat/praise that goes with those decisions. 

Not like they are going to get the same criticism anyways

uses committee: Why can't you make the decision on your own, you are being paid $$$$ to do so

makes decision on own:  Why didn't you use a committee and not act like a dictator.

[bincitysioux]

The one thing that rubs me the wrong way about Schlossman is how he is so critical when the topic of dropping sports comes up.  When baseball was dropped, both he and Wayne Nelson acted like Ed Schafer himself shot their dogs.

As far as the argument that women's hockey has Olympians on the roster, well Olympic women's hockey is awful to watch too.

Getting back to the number of total sports sponsored by UND, before baseball and golf were dropped the number of sports offered by UND was closer to that of many Big Ten schools than it was to the number offered by a majority of Big Sky programs.  UND actually sponsored as many or more sports than 4 Big Ten schools.  Does anybody really think our budget, enrollment, and population can sustain that long term?

[southpaw]

3 hours ago, homer said:

I haven't read anyone say that all the resources from women's hockey should get dumped into football.  

You also must not have read the article because even Schlossman didn't say that.

Quote

 Lowell will certainly be hearing from the chorus of football fans ... because they feel women's hockey's big budget is what's holding the football and basketball programs back.

But look at this... I just had to go back a few pages and a few people were advocating moving the WH budget to the football or basketball programs:

On 8/25/2016 at 8:08 AM, UNDBIZ said:

Just cutting women's hockey would get us well past the $1.4 million.  We'd be able to properly invest in M&W BB then.

 

On 8/25/2016 at 11:25 AM, nodakhoops said:

Imagine what the remaining programs could do with that extra money.

 

On 8/25/2016 at 3:26 PM, nodakhoops said:

If this is the case drop Whcky, and give WBB a fat budget with good amenities.

 

On 8/25/2016 at 4:26 PM, geaux_sioux said:

Cut womens hockey. Boost both basketballs and volleyball. 

 

On 8/25/2016 at 9:46 PM, geaux_sioux said:

Cut them all and get legitimately serious about the remaining sports.

 

 

[UND-1]

Yes, the Basketball programs would receive a boost.  Which they need because they are worth it.

[geaux_sioux]

WHockey isn't holding football back. Football held itself back by hiring the wrong coach and letting him run the program into the ground. Whockey is holding the basketballs and volleyball back. 

[homer]

23 minutes ago, southpaw said:

You also must not have read the article because even Schlossman didn't say that.

But look at this... I just had to go back a few pages and a few people were advocating moving the WH budget to the football or basketball programs:

 

 

 

 

 

 

What exactly was he implying by "women's hockey holding football back"?

Certainly not by taking players, facilities or fans.  He could have only been implying $$$.   

[Cratter]

24 minutes ago, geaux_sioux said:

WHockey isn't holding football back. Football held itself back by hiring the wrong coach and letting him run the program into the ground. Whockey is holding the basketballs and volleyball back. 

If whockey is holding back volleyball and basketball.

Mhockey is holding back football and basketball.

[geaux_sioux]

Just now, Cratter said:

If whockey is holding back volleyball and basketball.

Mhockey is holding back football and basketball.

Mhockey draws fans to games so it holds nothing back.

[Blackheart]

What a fulching train wreck this thread has become....how about we drop all sports and just play intramurals?

[UND-1]

6 minutes ago, Blackheart said:

What a fulching train wreck this thread has become....how about we drop all sports and just play intramurals?

No.  How about just the one's we can't afford, that offer literally zero ROI, and aren't required by our conference?

[nodakhoops]

I don think any UND fan has a problem with WHockey and I think most would like to see it succeed assuming we sponsor it. The problem is how much money UND is spending on  a sport with no real upside.

Womens hockey has

- only what 35 schools that actually play it nationwide

- very little fan support at UND and nation wide as evident by attendance numbers and TV.

- UND has had countless Olympians and some of the best players in the world and no one goes. Can you imagine if WBB had Diana Tarasi and Lindsey Whalen how many people would go.

- National title game just got on TV this year and it's like 3 weeks tape delayed. WBB and VB tourneys are all on national TV. Even women's softball tourney is on ESPN.

All of that and UND spends 1.5 million on it. I think if the budget was 600k this is a different conversation but the overall budget is tight and you have a sport costing UND that much with no return and no real potential for great exposure moving forward.

i could list all the growth potential UND has with WBB and VB but I'll save the typing and assume most here get that.

Whether WHockey stays or not there is no doubt in my mind UND is better in the long run trying to make VB a top 25 program and WBB a national top 25-50 program. SDSU has done this in BBall no reason UND can't with its tradition and history. Those two sports should be 1-2 in the hierarchy of women's sport funding.

[homer]

32 minutes ago, Cratter said:

If whockey is holding back volleyball and basketball.

Mhockey is holding back football and basketball.

You believe that?  

[Cratter]

16 minutes ago, homer said:

You believe that?  

Just sort of pointing out the logic and how right schlossman was about his article. 

If it wasn't for this sport (football), this sport (basketball) would be bigger.

You'd be lying to yourself if you didnt think UND football would be way larger if UND didn't have hockey. (Just as NDSU basketball would be way larger if they didn't sponsor football).

Interesting watching people's justifications.

The National Championship for Womens Hockey is aired on CBS. Has a UND sport ever been televised nationally over the air?

[UND-1]

4 minutes ago, Cratter said:

Just sort of pointing out the logic and how right schlossman was about his article. 

If it wasn't for this sport (football), this sport (basketball) would be bigger.

You'd be lying to yourself if you didnt think UND football would be way larger if UND didn't have hockey. (Just as NDSU basketball would be way larger if they didn't sponsor football).

Interesting watching people's justifications to justify there opinions.

It's undeniable that on paper UND athletics should be stronger in the majority of the lower sports if they consolidated their effort/resources into 15-16 entities instead of 19.  

[Blackheart]

28 minutes ago, Cratter said:

Just sort of pointing out the logic and how right schlossman was about his article. 

If it wasn't for this sport (football), this sport (basketball) would be bigger.

You'd be lying to yourself if you didnt think UND football would be way larger if UND didn't have hockey.

So UND should cut either football or Men's Hockey?

[UNDvince97-01]

Brad's article was mostly on point regarding the committee makeup and biases.  But I too was disappointed in the rhetoric of that specific comment.

I'm a fan of UND.  So therefor I am a fan of all UND sports, yes, even including womens hockey.  In competition, I cheer for all UND teams. 

We have to drop sports, because the state and our president say so.  It's unfortunate.

Are "football fans" not "hockey" fans?  How about "volleyball"?  Or "basketball".

I am a "fan" of all things UND.  So under Brad's premise, the "hockey fans" and "volleyball fans" and "basketball fans" are also calling for womens hockey to be dropped.  So are "swimming and diving fans" and "soccer fans".

Overall Brad does an excellent job on pretty much all of his stuff.

Just think he had a lapse here specifically and maybe even showed his own bias after discussing the many biases of the committee he wrote the article about.

 

[southpaw]

1 hour ago, Blackheart said:

So UND should cut either football or Men's Hockey?

Think how good men's basketball would be if we cut both.  

[southpaw]

1 hour ago, UNDvince97-01 said:

Brad's article was mostly on point regarding the committee makeup and biases.  But I too was disappointed in the rhetoric of that specific comment.

I'm a fan of UND.  So therefor I am a fan of all UND sports, yes, even including womens hockey.  In competition, I cheer for all UND teams. 

We have to drop sports, because the state and our president say so.  It's unfortunate.

Are "football fans" not "hockey" fans?  How about "volleyball"?  Or "basketball".

I am a "fan" of all things UND.  So under Brad's premise, the "hockey fans" and "volleyball fans" and "basketball fans" are also calling for womens hockey to be dropped.  So are "swimming and diving fans" and "soccer fans".

Overall Brad does an excellent job on pretty much all of his stuff.

Just think he had a lapse here specifically and maybe even showed his own bias after discussing the many biases of the committee he wrote the article about.

 

I don't really see any bias in the article.  Yes, he supports hockey as that's what he covers the most.  However, are any of his statements untrue?  The big paragraph is actually pretty factual.  There's no doubt some of this will happen if it isn't already:

Quote

Lowell will certainly be hearing from the chorus of football fans who have been urging for the elimination of women's hockey because they feel women's hockey's big budget is what's holding the football and basketball programs back.

There already are people saying WHockey holds basketball and volleyball back.  There's probably more saying it's still holding football back too.

[UND-1]

According to Brad, UND is supposed to keep losing 1.5 million per year for the next 20 years or so until Women's hockey becomes popular.  They can then start charging money for tickets and only lose 1.4 million.  

All this during a time of a huge budget crisis.

[southpaw]

2 minutes ago, UND-1 said:

According to Brad, UND is supposed to keep losing 1.5 million per year for the next 20 years or so until Women's hockey becomes popular.  They can then start charging money for tickets and only lose 1.4 million.  

All this during a time of a huge budget crisis.

But UND football is allowed to lose even more until they bring in more than 10,000 fans a game?  Maybe at that point, season tickets will sell for more than $90.

[UND-1]

5 minutes ago, southpaw said:

But UND football is allowed to lose even more until they bring in more than 10,000 fans a game?  Maybe at that point, season tickets will sell for more than $90.

The problem is their budget is 1.5 million.  

[geaux_sioux]

15 minutes ago, southpaw said:

But UND football is allowed to lose even more until they bring in more than 10,000 fans a game?  Maybe at that point, season tickets will sell for more than $90.

Hmm how do I put this..... UND women's hockey as a top 5 program drew jack !@#$ while UND football in the worst stretch in 30 years with a lame duck coach still out drew the women's hockey team 8 fold at least. Oh, and the football tickets actually cost money, so there's that. Football will be in the black soon. Women's hockey will always be in the red.