JohnboyND7 Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 I'm not upset, just trying to set things straight with bison fans. Remember, you are on a Sioux Fan message board. Don't like what you read, go back to bville. Back to the rankings...If UND wins this weekend, they deserve to be ranked and will most likely stay in the polls. If they lose, they will drop out of the polls...and hopefully some of the Bison trolls will drop out of our message board. Just wanted to make it clear I wasn't trying to piss anyone off. I think you caught what I was trying to say in the right light. If UND wins, and continues to beat D1 teams(not many on the schedule!) then I will definitely say that they deserve a ranking...not that rankings are overly important. I wish everyone would just stop and see it how it is. When you compare programs, NDSU has obviously had more success. 8 National Championships and more recently 4 wins against FBS teams. Yes UND has had success as well. Many conference titles as well as 1 Championship. So yes, I will conceed that up today NDSU has been more sucessful. But that does not mean that UND will not succeed or eventually be better than NDSU on a year to year basis. Past performances are not neccesarily indicitive of future results. Will UND football ever exceed the tradition, the fan support that NDSU has.....could be tough. But will they will eventually challenge NDSU year in and year out in the polls and maybe even the playoffs and National Championships.....you better believe it. UND could definitely get back to where they can challenge NDSU, but it could be a long tough road. NDSU was fortunate enough to have at the very least, a solid coach in Bohl. UND lost Lennon and well, all I can say is Mussman. A time will eventually come where UND can at least put a team on the field that is at the very least capable of playing with NDSU, and could even beat NDSU. But I semi-anticipate an NDSU dominance returning to the upper Mid-west for the first time since the 80's-early 90's. http://www.usatoday....garin/fbt11.htm In the Sagarin Ratings, there are 18 FCS schools above Minnesota, so NDSU beating Minnesota is equivalent to NDSU beating the 19th ranked FCS team (which is a good victory). Of Minnesota's previous opponents, Miami is ranked #154 (UM barely won), N Mex St is #151 (UM lost), and USC is #23. If Minnesota hadn't gone toe-to-toe with USC, Minnesota's rating would have been much much worse. BTW, NDSU's rating is #83 (second highest in FCS) and UND's is # 161. Five FBS teams are lower than UND: Memphis, UAB, New Mexico, Akron, and Western Kentucky. Im not going to argue with you, while I think you are wrong to an extent, like every poll, the Sagarin Ratings will be more accurate in a few more weeks. At that point in time, I think it might make a bit more sense to look at them. If only football fans were patient and judged teams at the end of seasons.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siouxperfan7 Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 A long tough road??? Come on. Teams can turn around very quickly. If NDSU was able to turn around a 3-8 season in 2009 to a playoff run in 2010 and now an undefeated record, beating an FBS school, and #5 ranking this year, then certainly other schools can do the same...including UND. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 ... NDSU was able to turn around a 3-8 season in 2009 to a playoff run in 2010 ... That's what gets me: NDSU fans forget that, or just assume only NDSU can make a turn like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 UND could definitely get back to where they can challenge NDSU, but it could be a long tough road. NDSU was fortunate enough to have at the very least, a solid coach in Bohl. UND lost Lennon and well, all I can say is Mussman. A time will eventually come where UND can at least put a team on the field that is at the very least capable of playing with NDSU, and could even beat NDSU. But I semi-anticipate an NDSU dominance returning to the upper Mid-west for the first time since the 80's-early 90's. And there is that Bison egotism that everyone talks about. This is why Bison fans were known as the most obnoxious fanbase at the DII level and are quickly getting that label at the FCS level. I sure hope that someday lowly little ol' UND can maybe put a team on the field that is at the very least capable of playing with NDSU. But I won't hold my breath, as many a Bison fan has told me that it will likely never happen. Maybe someday in the distant future we will get where we can challenge NDSU in a game. If UND and NDSU were playing this year, I would put my money on NDSU winning the game. But seriously, this attitude from bison fans is getting old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darell1976 Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 As for UND turning things around. Remember the 80's? 1985 UND went 3-8 in Pat Behrns' last year at UND. 1986 RT's first year..2-9!! Then watch and learn. 1987: 6-4 1988: 7-4 1989: 3-7-1 (a bump in the road) Since that season in 1989 UND has had 2 losing seasons...2002, and 2010. 1990: 7-3; 1991: 7-2; 1992: 6-4-1; 1993: 10-3 (goodbye losing streak to NDSU!) Now look how we can go from 2-9 in 1986 and 7 years later...on top of the NCC and beating NDSU. Just give it time. We are not known to be down in the cellar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jheria Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 Thanks for your interest in UND football. Another fan who doesn't care, but still reads and posts. Where do you come up with he doesn't care??? BOTH sides have people who only see things through their own colored glasses (many on this site) and of course each side thinks that the other has the more dillusional idiots posting about why their school is the best. Why can't a fan who supports one school have interest in the other school without it being because of penis envy (by the way from what I read both sides have it, bad)? I find it humerous that both sides/sites *BV/SS) have people telling "trolls" to go back to their own site if you don't care about us. Then in their next post they talk about what's going on over at the other site. Pot/Kettle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jheria Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 I wish everyone would just stop and see it how it is. When you compare programs, NDSU has obviously had more success. 8 National Championships and more recently 4 wins against FBS teams. Yes UND has had success as well. Many conference titles as well as 1 Championship. So yes, I will conceed that up today NDSU has been more sucessful. But that does not mean that UND will not succeed or eventually be better than NDSU on a year to year basis. Past performances are not neccesarily indicitive of future results. Will UND football ever exceed the tradition, the fan support that NDSU has.....could be tough. But will they will eventually challenge NDSU year in and year out in the polls and maybe even the playoffs and National Championships.....you better believe it. Clear your cards, that's a good Bingo! This sums it up as well as anything I've read from either side. Nice post! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnboyND7 Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 And there is that Bison egotism that everyone talks about. This is why Bison fans were known as the most obnoxious fanbase at the DII level and are quickly getting that label at the FCS level. I sure hope that someday lowly little ol' UND can maybe put a team on the field that is at the very least capable of playing with NDSU. But I won't hold my breath, as many a Bison fan has told me that it will likely never happen. Maybe someday in the distant future we will get where we can challenge NDSU in a game. If UND and NDSU were playing this year, I would put my money on NDSU winning the game. But seriously, this attitude from bison fans is getting old. . If you guys got Muss coaching, UND isn't going anywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sultan Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 The coaching profession sure goes up and down in a hurry. I remember last year when the Bison got shutout their last game of the year, their fans were calling in on the postgame and wanted to get rid of Bohl. It is amazing how the same coach is brilliant one week and the next week they want him fired. Or at least that is what they are like in Fargo. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WYOBISONMAN Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 That's what gets me: NDSU fans forget that, or just assume only NDSU can make a turn like that. We are just better...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UNDColorado Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 We are just better...... Keep telling yourself that; whatever helps get you through the day I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WYOBISONMAN Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 Keep telling yourself that; whatever helps get you through the day I guess. It is Friday.......beer would help the most right about now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bison06 Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 It is Friday.......beer would help the most right about now. Honest question to Sioux fans, because I have said it and other Bison fans have said it, but I haven't really heard anyone who is a Sioux fan agree. Do you think UND can ever get back to being an elite team with the current head coach? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillySioux Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 Honest question to Sioux fans, because I have said it and other Bison fans have said it, but I haven't really heard anyone who is a Sioux fan agree. Do you think UND can ever get back to being an elite team with the current head coach? Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bison06 Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 Yes Ok...could you please elaborate slightly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Let'sGoHawks! Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 Honest question to Sioux fans, because I have said it and other Bison fans have said it, but I haven't really heard anyone who is a Sioux fan agree. Do you think UND can ever get back to being an elite team with the current head coach? For me, the jury is still out on Mussman. I like the recruits he has brought in, I question his decisions at times during games. I think the first year in the Big Sky will tell us a lot. One thing most Sioux fans can agree on now is that there isn't a lot of excitement around the program. Even a blowout win against Black Hills State was boring, as UND just handed the ball off all game. Now, that is boring for fans, BUT, was the prudent thing to do. Now, in a game against a team like Southern Utah, you haven't "shown your hand". I think when the games start meaning something, UND football will regain it's excitement. Of course, that is assuming the team is winning because Mussman turns out to be "the man". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darell1976 Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 Honest question to Sioux fans, because I have said it and other Bison fans have said it, but I haven't really heard anyone who is a Sioux fan agree. Do you think UND can ever get back to being an elite team with the current head coach? I say maybe. If UND loses to Montana Western or Sioux Falls. Fire him!! If we go 6-5 or 7-4 then I say we are on the right path. LetsGoSioux! is right our first year in the Big Sky is going to tell us if this team is headed in the right direction. So far 2008-2010 we were a DII team in a FCS league. We are slowly improving, plus our recruits are growing up. We are an extremely young team, so if we can win our conference games this team is going to look really good come 2012. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KBH2010 Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 Honest question to Sioux fans, because I have said it and other Bison fans have said it, but I haven't really heard anyone who is a Sioux fan agree. Do you think UND can ever get back to being an elite team with the current head coach? No, he lacks player support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 No, he lacks player support. Can you elaborate on this or where you heard it? Or you pulling this out of your backside? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
star2city Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 Can you elaborate on this or where you heard it? Or you pulling this out of your backside? Mussman's personality is more of being an administrator, not a leader, so I can understand where KBH2010 may be coming from. Lennon was a leader that knew he needed administrators (like Mussman and Bubba). Neilson at UMD is a leader and administrator, IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RD17 Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 Mussman's personality is more of being an administrator, not a leader, so I can understand where KBH2010 may be coming from. Lennon was a leader that knew he needed administrators (like Mussman and Bubba). Neilson at UMD is a leader and administrator, IMHO. Mussman will have the rest of this year and next year to prove he can do it. The situation he entered wasn't ideal because the program was declining in talent at the same time it moved up a level. I believe this had more to do with Buning's ineptitude than anything the coaches did, but certainly Lennon needs to accept some of that blame. I do believe that, considering the circumstances, the results of the first two transition years were acceptable while last season was obviously not. By next year Mussman needs to have this program humming or it will be time to go in another direction. We will know much more about whether the arrow is pointing up or down based on what happens the next two months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnt Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 I guess I am not making the connection with Buning and declining talent in the football program. I think we had some talent, but circumstances with Chappell, Murray, Bamba and Stroup doesn't help. You can't consistently lose your go-to players and not have it hurt the program. I think early on in the transition we were doing o.k., but not having a quarterback to even match what we had at the Division 2 level, certainly must fall on the coaching staff. Hopefully Mollberg will be in the fold and pans out to move us forward in that regard. That would add a level of excitement for the fans and make it easier to get some high-end recruits moving into the Big Sky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bincitysioux Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 Regarding Mussman, I think coaching wise, he does just fine. I don't have a problem with his "conservative" style, such as running the clock out in the 1st half with a lead against Idaho, or punting on 4th & 16 in the 4th quarter against Fresno. Mussman proved to be a helluva offensive coordinator for the better part of a decade. I can't recall a game situation since he took over where I thought "WHAT ARE YOU DOING?". Like any good coach, he adapts to the talent on the roster, at least offensively. When we have 3 quality running backs, a huge offensive line, and a green QB, we become a running team. We we had Danny Freund, Reed Manke, John Bowenkamp at QB, and Weston Dressler, Brady Trenbeath, and Dan Grossman at WR, we were a passing team. Good coaches adapt, and Mussman has done that in his time here both as OC and head coach. What I don't like about Mussman is how he sometimes carries himself on the sidelines and through the media. I don't like to hear how we'll be "going down to Southern Utah and see if we can get a win". I didn't like when he laughed in an interview about the Texas Tech game and said "it'll be nice experience for our players to see that atmosphere". I hate how in several interviews over the last couple years he's basically thrown the defense under the bus on occaision for not "getting off the field" when the offense hasn't been able to stay on the field. I hate how occaisonally he can be seen on the sideline bent over, head down, with his hands on his knees after a bad play by our team. Lastly, I sort of question his ability to make tough decisions as an administrator overseeing his assistants. I know he inherited the co-defensive coordinator situation which is a pet peeve of mine itself. IMO, despite some great athletes in the secondary, the pass defense has mostly been atrocious the past 4 years. At the same time the run defense is one of the best in the country for two years running I believe. One co-coordinator is in charge of the front seven, the other in charge of the defensive backfield. One are has continued to improve, while the other has not really improved at all in four years. Something needs to be done about that. Having said that, I do give him credit for abondoning Breitbach's pistol offense experiment. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WYOBISONMAN Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 Honest question to Sioux fans, because I have said it and other Bison fans have said it, but I haven't really heard anyone who is a Sioux fan agree. Do you think UND can ever get back to being an elite team with the current head coach? Mussman has not been in long enough to judge his recruiting classes. Remember that terminating a coaching staff creates a whole host of problems and sets a program back. I think you really nee to be sure the current coaching staff can't get it done before making such a decision. There is a lot of football still to be played this season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bincitysioux Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 Mussman has not been in long enough to judge his recruiting classes. Remember that terminating a coaching staff creates a whole host of problems and sets a program back. I think you really nee to be sure the current coaching staff can't get it done before making such a decision. There is a lot of football still to be played this season. Agreed. In most cases a head coaching change involves a period of transition that can set a program back. North Dakota's current coaching tree dates back to the mid-80's starting with Roger Thomas who was the last total break from his predecessor. Dale Lennon was a long time Thomas assistant, and Mussman was a long time Lennon assistant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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