Media Stories on the Sioux Name

[larsensa]

We should just become the Blackhawks? There aren't any Blackhawk tribes in ND that would need to approve the name are there? :-)

[redwing77]

We should just become the Blackhawks? There aren't any Blackhawk tribes in ND that would need to approve the name are there? :-)

Copyright?

I say Fighting Cavalry.

[82SiouxGuy]

We should just become the Blackhawks? There aren't any Blackhawk tribes in ND that would need to approve the name are there? :-)

Native American nicknames are now an opt-in process, not an opt-out process. You don't need a tribe to be against it and complain to get rid of one, you need a tribe to say yes before you can have it. So if there are no Blackhawk tribes to approve then there is no way to have a Blackhawk nickname.

[dlsiouxfan]

Clearly "programs or actions designed to help those who are less fortunate" are based in good intentions.

Our intentions were good when we put American Indians on reservations and gave them sovereign nation status. How has that worked out? What is it about about high crime rates, massive unemployment, rampant poverty and widespread mental and physical health problems that make some folks defend this system and keep it in place?

Our intentions were good when we attempted to assimilate American Indians into our culture by outlawing their religion, banning their languages and forcing their children to attend schools that taught them the "white" way. We now know that was too extreme and probably a mistake.

Our intentions were good when we created the Indian Health Service to provide the reservations with government health care. Can anyone claim with a straight face that this has been good for Native Americans? By any objective standard, health care on the reservations is a disaster.

We've gone from one extreme to the other, all with the best of intentions. Rather than forcing American Indians to assimilate into our society and contribute to it (while retaining their unique cultural values), we've decided that it's best to pretend that they can live in the past and retain their old ways. By pretending that they are independent entities when they are not, we've created a group of perpetual victims. But, hey, our intentions were good when we did it.

You'll probably disregard this because of where it comes from, but, Sean Hannity's former call screener who was a huge animal rights activist. He once made her tell the story of how she bought a live lobster to save it from a restaurant's boiling pot. She didn't know it was a sea creature when she released it in a freshwater lake. Plus, she was so afraid of it biting her that she left the rubber bands on its claws when she let it go.

When Hannity told her that she's condemned the lobster to a long, slow death because it couldn't survive in freshwater and couldn't feed itself without its claws, she gave the classic reply: "But my intentions were good!"

The rubber of good intentions tends to skid into the ditch when faced with the asphalt of the real world.

Were our intentions really good when we confined Native Americans to reservations? i would argue by no stretch of the imagination were they good. As far as your other point about the call screener, I would argue that's just another idiot Hannity hired to further his agenda. The stupid leading the stupid and and there isn't any more you can say about that.

[SiouxMeNow]

Yes - it is time to move on.

BIG THANKS to Archie and Steve for carrying the sincere cause to the end. Every UND Fighting Sioux fan appreciates your work against what must have been a really frustrating effort with the SR tribal council. We all know it wasn't for a lack of trying....thanks again! If you guys have any suggestion for a new unique name - we're all ears?

[Ranger]

Were our intentions really good when we confined Native Americans to reservations? i would argue by no stretch of the imagination were they good. As far as your other point about the call screener, I would argue that's just another idiot Hannity hired to further his agenda. The stupid leading the stupid and and there isn't any more you can say about that.

Our...We? I wasn't consulted in the matter.

[Ranger]

Copyright?

I say Fighting Cavalry.

Right on!

[CMSioux]

It will take some time to heal and accept this, Stay classy, Sioux Forever.

[sioux7>5]

Copyright?

I say Fighting Cavalry.

I agree with you, Fighting Cavalry would be a great nickname. I have said it for a long time. But with all the PC zealots in charge at colleges. UND will probably end up the Rainbows or some intangible object nickname. It is truly sad to see the Fighting Siux nickname come to an end. But I cheer for the program not the name( I love the name and wish it would stay)but most of us on here just wanted this put to a vote.

What I still do not understand and never will is why is it ok for other schools to only get the approval of one school and UND had to get two schools approval. I think that alone is something that should have never happened. The tribe closest to UND overwhelmingly approves of the name, why is that not enough for the NCAA.

[ScottM]

"Fighting Cavalry"? Really? Are you guys high?

We all know any replacement is going to be something watered down, pussified like the tribes and Board, and "market ready". Hell, they may even bring back "Thunder the Bleacher Creature" to really amp it up.

[darell1976]

Copyright?

I say Fighting Cavalry.

I am for that!!!

[redwing77]

"Fighting Cavalry"? Really? Are you guys high?

We all know any replacement is going to be something watered down, pussified like the tribes and Board, and "market ready". Hell, they may even bring back "Thunder the Bleacher Creature" to really amp it up.

I can't much argue with this.

I just hope the bleeding heart liberals that call themselves educators don't get too high of a say.

Now's the time students and alumni! Start flooding the administration with acceptable nickname suggestions! With "acceptable" being relative, surely.

UPDATE: I thought a little more about this and I think we should consider doing the following:

Make Spirit Lake an integral part of the nickname change process. Maybe they can come up with an idea that can help us keep something of the tradition?

[darell1976]

I can't much argue with this.

I just hope the bleeding heart liberals that call themselves educators don't get too high of a say.

Now's the time students and alumni! Start flooding the administration with acceptable nickname suggestions! With "acceptable" being relative, surely.

UPDATE: I thought a little more about this and I think we should consider doing the following:

Make Spirit Lake an integral part of the nickname change process. Maybe they can come up with an idea that can help us keep something of the tradition?

NO!! If we can't be the Fighting Sioux and keep the logo then no more Native American names or logo. I am going through this all the time.

[the green team]

I know I'm going to get in trouble for this, but these people fight- and are legendary in their resilency- I would like to honor these people because they continue to persevere despite having a number of enemies near the borders of their home country. People of the Jewish descent. I think "The Fighting Jews" sounds good and are a people who have a history of being determined...going back to biblicle times. Sorry if I offended jewish people, but I think it's a good name.

[The Sicatoka]

I know I'm going to get in trouble for this, but these people fight- and are legendary in their resilency- I would like to honor these people because they continue to persevere despite having a number of enemies near the borders of their home country. People of the Jewish descent. I think "The Fighting Jews" sounds good and are a people who have a history of being determined...going back to biblicle times. Sorry if I offended jewish people, but I think it's a good name.

It's been done:

Yeshiva University (in NY) calls itself the Maccabees.

[ticklethetwine]

Buy all the sioux gear you can. I am buying loads of it cause as far as I am concerned I will always be a Fighting Sioux.

[PartTime]

I can't much argue with this.

I just hope the bleeding heart liberals that call themselves educators don't get too high of a say.

Now's the time students and alumni! Start flooding the administration with acceptable nickname suggestions! With "acceptable" being relative, surely.

UPDATE: I thought a little more about this and I think we should consider doing the following:

Make Spirit Lake an integral part of the nickname change process. Maybe they can come up with an idea that can help us keep something of the tradition?

[/quote

Why?

[petey23]

"Fighting Cavalry"? Really? Are you guys high?

We all know any replacement is going to be something watered down, pussified like the tribes and Board, and "market ready". Hell, they may even bring back "Thunder the Bleacher Creature" to really amp it up.

I can proudly say that when I was a member of Student Senate that I had a big hand in stopping "Thunder the Bleacher Creature" from happening at least temporarily as I convinced our body not to give a nickel to that embarrassment of a whatever that was......unfortunately they obtained funds else elsewhere down the road.

As far as the Sioux name goes....you guys go ahead without me, I am going to stick with The Fighting Sioux at least until the people of Standing Rock are heard. I will be cheering for the Sioux next year and for many years to come.

[redwing77]

Why?

Why?

Because they have stood by us, or at least they allowed their residents to show their voice. Their support needs to be acknowledged.

That's one reason. the other is this:

Maybe they can suggest a name that we can use that would allow us to keep the logo or perhaps do something like UA Fairbanks did. They changed their name officially to the University of Alaska Fairbanks Alaska Nanooks (or something like that). Then they could be called "Alaska" instead of Alaska Fairbanks.

Maybe there's something we could add in front of Sioux and after Fighting that would allow us still to be the Fighting Sioux with an added word in between?

Just a thought.

Thirdly, if they help choose the nickname along this vein, they're not likely to oppose it (well, there will be opposition. Nothing is ever 100% supported).

It's worth a shot.

-------------------

Also, though this will be obviously historically antagonistic, UND could approach the Ojibwe tribes of North Dakota and Northern/North Central Minnesota to ask permission to change the name to the Fighting Ojibwe.

I say historically antagonistic because, before the "evil" white man came along, the Ojibwe were the greatest adversary to the Sioux. They actually pushed the Sioux almost out of North Dakota at one point.

Also, the logo was drawn by an Ojibwe (whose wife was Sioux but you know)..

This idea is the least likely to be even suggested officially, though.

[Shawn-O]

"Fighting Cavalry"? Really? Are you guys high?

We all know any replacement is going to be something watered down, pussified like the tribes and Board, and "market ready". Hell, they may even bring back "Thunder the Bleacher Creature" to really amp it up.

So you're saying something positive could result from all of this!

[redwing77]

It's been done:

Yeshiva University (in NY) calls itself the Maccabees.

The Litigating Litvaks?

The Marauding Moses?

The Hebrew Hammers?

Here's our mascot:

[Chewey]

I know I'm going to get in trouble for this, but these people fight- and are legendary in their resilency- I would like to honor these people because they continue to persevere despite having a number of enemies near the borders of their home country. People of the Jewish descent. I think "The Fighting Jews" sounds good and are a people who have a history of being determined...going back to biblicle times. Sorry if I offended jewish people, but I think it's a good name.

Watch out with this one. With all of the anti-semitism expressed by all of those "enlightened" college professors and administrators at virtually every university in the country, the UND professorial yahoos (and for those who know Gulliver's Travels, you'll know how apropos that word is) would be complaining that we're honoriing all of those big bad Jewish people who, having been persecuted historically, hypocritically love to persecute others now. You might see some Molotov cocktails being thrown at games, if that happens. If you want to see a group of Jewish hating Helen Thomas clones, just go to the UND English Department. I surmise the anti-semitism among certain factions of the UND faculty is at least as high as at any other university.

[Chewey]

Why?

Why?

Because they have stood by us, or at least they allowed their residents to show their voice. Their support needs to be acknowledged.

That's one reason. the other is this:

Maybe they can suggest a name that we can use that would allow us to keep the logo or perhaps do something like UA Fairbanks did. They changed their name officially to the University of Alaska Fairbanks Alaska Nanooks (or something like that). Then they could be called "Alaska" instead of Alaska Fairbanks.

Maybe there's something we could add in front of Sioux and after Fighting that would allow us still to be the Fighting Sioux with an added word in between?

Just a thought.

Thirdly, if they help choose the nickname along this vein, they're not likely to oppose it (well, there will be opposition. Nothing is ever 100% supported).

It's worth a shot.

-------------------

Also, though this will be obviously historically antagonistic, UND could approach the Ojibwe tribes of North Dakota and Northern/North Central Minnesota to ask permission to change the name to the Fighting Ojibwe.

I say historically antagonistic because, before the "evil" white man came along, the Ojibwe were the greatest adversary to the Sioux. They actually pushed the Sioux almost out of North Dakota at one point.

Also, the logo was drawn by an Ojibwe (whose wife was Sioux but you know)..

This idea is the least likely to be even suggested officially, though.

Actually, I think the language of the "Settlement Agreement" would actually permit either option. The school only had to get the two tribes' permission to use "Fighting Sioux". If we're talking about Fighting Ojibwe or Fighting Spirit Lake Sioux, it's a new issue. I'll have to locate a copy of the agreement again to review it again but I don't seem to remember any language addressing anything other than the nickname "Fighting Sioux." Hell, even the November 30, 2010 deadline doesn't apply here. Why not suggest the North Dakota "Spirit Lake Fighting Sioux" or the North Dakota "Fighting Spirit Lake Sioux" or just the North Dakota "Spirit Lake Sioux"? Change the logo a bit and there it is; problem solved. I really am not high, as far as I can tell. I think Redwing is actually on to something here.

[GeauxSioux]

Actually, I think the language of the "Settlement Agreement" would actually permit either option. The school only had to get the two tribes' permission to use "Fighting Sioux". If we're talking about Fighting Ojibwe or Fighting Spirit Lake Sioux, it's a new issue. I'll have to locate a copy of the agreement again to review it again but I don't seem to remember any language addressing anything other than the nickname "Fighting Sioux." Hell, even the November 30, 2010 deadline doesn't apply here. Why not suggest the North Dakota "Spirit Lake Fighting Sioux" or the North Dakota "Fighting Spirit Lake Sioux" or just the North Dakota "Spirit Lake Sioux"? Change the logo a bit and there it is; problem solved. I really am not high, as far as I can tell. I think Redwing is actually on to something here.

Settlement.

[darell1976]

Settlement.

The first paragraph of the settlement says all native american references and images cannot be displayed at championship events. So no Spirit Lake Sioux or anything about NA and even if we did get their permission, we could have to get at least 30+ year contract on that or else their tribal council could vote against the name, and the board and the school is NOT going to go through this crap every year their is a tribal change.