Coach Jones?

[MafiaMan]

Guess what folks NDSU is a football school thats it everything else is an after thought. NDSU has no money for a great HC they have very little in state talent. It is damn cold place to be . And recruits love 20 below weather and playing for a school where football is the king sport and basketball is just another pawn sport.

Changed UND to NDSU and hockey to basketball in your post and did nothing else.

NDSU...beating Wisconsin in Madison...almost taking down Kansas in the NCAA tournament...beating Notre Dame...beating Oklahoma in the NCAA tournament.

UND...trying to keep a game with NDSU closer than a 30 point deficit...a 6-55 out of conference road record...and hoping for a "gut-check" performance against Dickinson State.

What the hell is wrong with this picture?

[Oxbow6]

Changed UND to NDSU and hockey to basketball in your post and did nothing else.

NDSU...beating Wisconsin in Madison...almost taking down Kansas in the NCAA tournament...beating Notre Dame...beating Oklahoma in the NCAA tournament.

UND...trying to keep a game with NDSU closer than a 30 point deficit...a 6-55 out of conference road record...and hoping for a "gut-check" performance against Dickinson State.

What the hell is wrong with this picture?

To your last question.........according to "hoopster" UND is stuck with Jones which he/she sees as a positive!

Where is the bar set?

Simple question

[darell1976]

Changed UND to NDSU and hockey to basketball in your post and did nothing else.

NDSU...beating Wisconsin in Madison...almost taking down Kansas in the NCAA tournament...beating Notre Dame...beating Oklahoma in the NCAA tournament.

UND...trying to keep a game with NDSU closer than a 30 point deficit...a 6-55 out of conference road record...and hoping for a "gut-check" performance against Dickinson State.

What the hell is wrong with this picture?

^^^^^ this!!!

[sioux24/7]

I think anybody who has watched any games coached by Jones has realized from the beginning that he is not necessarily head coaching material. He has never seemed to "outcoach" the opposing coach. Very rarely do we see him make adjustments. I appreciate some of the recruiting he has done but he just doesn't seem to have that head coaching material like I said. 

[jdub27]

For the most part you are correct.  The one big difference NDSU has over UND is they are in Fargo and not GF.  Fargo is a progressive town with lots of business and lots of people investing money into businesses there.  GF simply is not.  blame it on the%GOBC if you want or blame on the demographics of being a blue collar town.  I just hope GF and UND don't fall too far behind otherwise it could become a situation similar to U Idaho and Boise St.  

 

Also, NDSU understands how important a role that athletics can play promoting and growing their university.  UND on the other hand seems to not care too much...

Just want add on a few tidbits on this.  As of this past spring, NDSU still still had almost $2 million left to raise/pay for on their locker room/coach's office renovation that was completed in 2006.  The NDSU Foundation has been covering the payments on the revenue bonds issued by Cass County on their behalf.  On top of that, they still haven't raised all of the funds for the SHAC, a project that was first requested in 2002 and then put more into its current form in 2006.  Last I heard, they were still about $6 million short but they were able to start as the NDSU Foundation guaranteed the project.

[hoopster]

Despite the extreme cold, Lack of money...team has to play a bunch of road games to afford trip to Italy next summer, cannot afford a video board that some high schools teams have, lack of In state talent , Hockey School, NDSU is a more attractive in state program higher RPI  conference, bigger metropolitan area, And Basketball not an after thought to other sports.  Do not be stupid enough to compare NDSU football to UND hockey NDSU football is a 2nd tier Sport at NCAA level UND Hockey plays at the TOP NCAA level. The fact that UND has been one of the TOP 3 big sky teams since joining is amazing!!!  Since Joining the Big Sky 2 years ago UND has finished 2nd and 3rd.  I guess there are 9 other coaches doing worse that need to be fired!  Heck 80% of the College basketball coaches in the USA have done worse in their  conference the last 2 years....Might as well fire 80% of all the coaches out there!   The 20 % of the coaches who do not deserve to be fired yet  UND can offer them a 1.5 Million a year to coach the team.  Amazing

[GeauxSioux]

I was more on the Fire Jones wagon a couple years ago then I am now.   With what we pay, we won't get anyone any better, and firing him just disrupts the team.   How many years does he have left on his contract?   It's sad to see how far we've come since the Dave Gunther days, but let's face it, the money isn't there.   It really isn't there for football either like is should be, and basketball is a lot lower on the pecking order.

 

I'll be the first to admit, outside of hockey, we basically suck at everything.    I watched the NDSU CC game on ESPN and wished we were at that level, then I saw the broadcast of the BB game against a mediocre NDSU team and was sick.    It all comes down to massive amounts of money, and until we commit a whole lot more, nothing will change.   Basketball team will be an embarrassment and the football team will miss the playoffs again next year.   That's just the way it is.   Yuck.

Why then and not now?  Seems quite odd.  Firing him disrupts the team??  Perhaps that is what needs to happen.  Obviously the status quo is not good.

With what "we" pay...?  Maybe the reason UND isn't paying Jones more is because he hasn't earned more.

 

"We" basically suck at everything.  Maybe you do, but UND does not.  The WBB and VB teams don't suck.  The S/D teams have been competing quite well.

 

You have already written off next season of football?  Man, you really are a debbie downer.

 

For those who think UND should cut different sports from the athletic department to redirect money, isn't this supposed to be about opportunities for the student/athlete?

[ArtVandalay]

Despite the extreme cold, Lack of money...team has to play a bunch of road games to afford trip to Italy next summer, cannot afford a video board that some high schools teams have, lack of In state talent , Hockey School, NDSU is a more attractive in state program higher RPI conference, bigger metropolitan area, And Basketball not an after thought to other sports. Do not be stupid enough to compare NDSU football to UND hockey NDSU football is a 2nd tier Sport at NCAA level UND Hockey plays at the TOP NCAA level. The fact that UND has been one of the TOP 3 big sky teams since joining is amazing!!! Since Joining the Big Sky 2 years ago UND has finished 2nd and 3rd. I guess there are 9 other coaches doing worse that need to be fired! Heck 80% of the College basketball coaches in the USA have done worse in their conference the last 2 years....Might as well fire 80% of all the coaches out there! The 20 % of the coaches who do not deserve to be fired yet UND can offer them a 1.5 Million a year to coach the team. Amazing

Great points. And here comes the "duckies and bunnies" onslaught. Wait for it, wait for it, wait for it. And go.

[UND1983]

Despite the extreme cold, Lack of money...team has to play a bunch of road games to afford trip to Italy next summer, cannot afford a video board that some high schools teams have, lack of In state talent , Hockey School, NDSU is a more attractive in state program higher RPI conference, bigger metropolitan area, And Basketball not an after thought to other sports. Do not be stupid enough to compare NDSU football to UND hockey NDSU football is a 2nd tier Sport at NCAA level UND Hockey plays at the TOP NCAA level. The fact that UND has been one of the TOP 3 big sky teams since joining is amazing!!! Since Joining the Big Sky 2 years ago UND has finished 2nd and 3rd. I guess there are 9 other coaches doing worse that need to be fired! Heck 80% of the College basketball coaches in the USA have done worse in their conference the last 2 years....Might as well fire 80% of all the coaches out there! The 20 % of the coaches who do not deserve to be fired yet UND can offer them a 1.5 Million a year to coach the team. Amazing

Sounds like their isn't a coach alive who could win at UND. I say let's take that challenge and find out.

The guy has had nine years to show he cannot overcome all of those insurmountable obstacles. He has a losing record and this isnt the 80s, coaches don't get 10 years to try and do something meaningful...anything.

[bincitysioux]

Despite the extreme cold, Lack of money...team has to play a bunch of road games to afford trip to Italy next summer, cannot afford a video board that some high schools teams have, lack of In state talent , Hockey School, NDSU is a more attractive in state program higher RPI  conference, bigger metropolitan area, And Basketball not an after thought to other sports.  Do not be stupid enough to compare NDSU football to UND hockey NDSU football is a 2nd tier Sport at NCAA level UND Hockey plays at the TOP NCAA level. The fact that UND has been one of the TOP 3 big sky teams since joining is amazing!!!  Since Joining the Big Sky 2 years ago UND has finished 2nd and 3rd.  I guess there are 9 other coaches doing worse that need to be fired!  Heck 80% of the College basketball coaches in the USA have done worse in their  conference the last 2 years....Might as well fire 80% of all the coaches out there!   The 20 % of the coaches who do not deserve to be fired yet  UND can offer them a 1.5 Million a year to coach the team.  Amazing

Not quite sure why your standards are so low for North Dakota basketball, buy you need to raise them. 

 

It shouldn't be viewed as an amazing accomplishment that UND has been a top 3 team in the Big Sky conference.  I am very pleased with how North Dakota has performed thus far in the Big Sky, they SHOULD be a top 3 team.  Every year.  The Big Sky is not the Big Ten or even the Missouri Valley.  It is a low major conference with just a handful of "peer" schools to UND that that we should be in contention for conference titles for in every sport, every year. 

 

Jones is the lowest paid coach in the Big Sky because that is what he has earned.  If he wants a raise he should start taking the entire season seriously rather than just the second half of it.  I'm not sure that I care for the fact that he is using the 1st half of the season as a fundraising campaign to take a European vacation next summer.  This is his 9th season here.  He has the 4th worst winning percentage in the history of the program.  We should all be past the "lets give him another year to show what he can do" phase.  We know what he is going to do.  He's going to win 47% of his games and maybe finish the season on a hot streak.

[MafiaMan]

How quickly would John Calipari get run out of Lexington with a 41-20 out of conference road record, nevermind a 6-55 one?

[UND1983]

How quickly would John Calipari get run out of Lexington with a 41-20 out of conference road record, nevermind a 6-55 one?

 

Nobody can win at UND.  NOBODY.  Get it through your head already!!!  We are lucky to even have him stay as long as he has.  I am sure he has had many other offers to move on.  

 

It is too damn COLD.  17-17 is the best that any coach could do at UND and we should all accept that fact.  

[Oxbow6]

Nobody can win at UND.  NOBODY.  Get it through your head already!!!  We are lucky to even have him stay as long as he has.  I am sure he has had many other offers to move on.  

 

It is too damn COLD.  17-17 is the best that any coach could do at UND and we should all accept that fact.  

 

 

Again the bar has been set...................

[jdub27]

Men's hockey is a cash cow, so I don't think that can be listed as a detriment to the bottom line.

 

Women's hockey is a legitimate sport to bring up.

 

How much does tennis and swimming/diving cost to operate anyway?  I am guessing not as much as hockey, football or basketball.  I must ask the same question regarding wrestling at NDSU.

 

If we need to cut sports to help our higher profile sports get more funding, I am all for at least discussing it.  But I just don't know how much savings will be generated by doing that.

These are the 2013 numbers but take them with a grain of salt because of how college athletics accounting works.  I'm also not 100% sure how the "cost" of a scholarship is figured into the expenses, especially when related to in-state, out-of-state, etc (the total for Men's Athletic Aid is $1,975K and Women's is $1,908K).  And with the large amount of unallocated funds, its safe to say the numbers aren't completely accurate but it at least give somewhat of an idea of costs.  Regardless, this is how the expenses were reported:

 

Non-Revenue

Baseball: $469K

Men's Golf: $101K

Women's Golf: $264K

Women's Hockey: $1,252K

Soccer: $503K

Softball: $457K

Men's S/D: $298K

Women's S/D: $435K

Men's Tennis: $81K

Women's Tennis: $227K

Men's T/F: $372K

Women's T/F: $556K

 

Revenue

MBB: $1,028K

WBB: $1,109K

Football: $3,100K

Men's Hockey: $4,629K

VB: $624K

 

Unallocated - $6,340K

[Shawn-O]

A quick scan of the media guide tells me this is the worst stretch of UND basketball in over 50 years.  Demand better.   

[UND1983]

A quick scan of the media guide tells me this is the worst stretch of UND basketball in over 50 years.  Demand better.   

 

Well, you better demand for the weather to warm up then.  Jones doesn't stand a chance in this climate.  

 

And get the guy a damn video board.  How the hell is he supposed to win road games without a video board?

[Shawn-O]

These are ballpark numbers and don't include a large portion of the athletic budget that isn't specifically attributed to a single sport.  These are the 2013 numbers but take them with a grain of salt because of how college athletics accounting works.  I'm also not 100% sure how the "cost" of a scholarship is figured into the expenses, especially when related to in-state, out-of-state, etc.

 

Non-Revenue

Baseball: $469K

Men's Golf: $101K

Women's Golf: $264K

Women's Hockey: $1,252K

Soccer: $503K

Softball: $457K

Men's S/D: $298K

Women's S/D: $435K

Men's Tennis: $81K

Women's Tennis: $227K

Men's T/F: $372K

Women's T/F: $556K

 

Revenue

MBB: $1,028K

WBB: $1,109K

Football: $3,100K

Men's Hockey: $4,629K

VB: $624K

 

Unallocated - $6,340K

 

If I'm AD for a day?  Goodbye women's hockey, hello bowling.  

[jdub27]

If I'm AD for a day?  Goodbye women's hockey, hello bowling.  

Kind of the one that sticks out the most isn't it?  Unfortunately you'd need to come up with around 13 more scholarships, can only offer 5 women's bowling scholarships. 

 

But if we're thinking outside the box....Baseball offers 11.7, which if dropped would still put you a few short.  But something like Sand Volleyball offers up to 3.  Nebraska has a team, that makes almost as much sense.

[Redneksioux]

These are the 2013 numbers but take them with a grain of salt because of how college athletics accounting works. I'm also not 100% sure how the "cost" of a scholarship is figured into the expenses, especially when related to in-state, out-of-state, etc (the total for Men's Athletic Aid is $1,975K and Women's is $1,908K). And with the large amount of unallocated funds, its safe to say the numbers aren't completely accurate but it at least give somewhat of an idea of costs. Regardless, this is how the expenses were reported:

Non-Revenue

Baseball: $469K

Men's Golf: $101K

Women's Golf: $264K

Women's Hockey: $1,252K

Soccer: $503K

Softball: $457K

Men's S/D: $298K

Women's S/D: $435K

Men's Tennis: $81K

Women's Tennis: $227K

Men's T/F: $372K

Women's T/F: $556K

Revenue

MBB: $1,028K

WBB: $1,109K

Football: $3,100K

Men's Hockey: $4,629K

VB: $624K

Unallocated - $6,340K

Other than hockey, why does the school spend more on the women's teams?

[jdub27]

Other than hockey, why does the school spend more on the women's teams?

Title IX.  NCAA allows for more scholarships on the women's side in a lot of the sports to help offset the huge number given in football.  Athletic aid is considered an expense in these reports, but unfortunately are not broken out by sport which would make the numbers a little more accurate.

 

Don't know that UND is fully funded in every one of these but here are some of the differences in the max amount of scholarships allowed (in 2013-2014 at least):

 

MBB - 13

WBB - 15

 

M T/F & CC - 12.6

W T/F & CC - 18

 

M Golf - 4.5

W Golf - 6

 

M Tennis - 4.5

W Tennis - 8

 

M S&D - 9.9

W S&D - 14

[darell1976]

If I'm AD for a day?  Goodbye women's hockey, hello bowling.  

http://www.collegebowling.com/teams.asp    

 

Here is the list of bowling schools. A lot of familiar local schools like Mankato, SDSU, and NDSU. 

[fightingsioux4life]

Great points. And here comes the "duckies and bunnies" onslaught. Wait for it, wait for it, wait for it. And go.

[NDSU grad]

http://www.collegebowling.com/teams.asp    

 

Here is the list of bowling schools. A lot of familiar local schools like Mankato, SDSU, and NDSU. 

That list must include club teams, because bowling is not an NCAA sanctioned sport at NDSU.

[siouxjoy]

And I suppose you think Mussman should still be in charge of football too?  We bought out Mussman thanks to some generous alumni.  I am thinking there would be more than a few basketball alums with deep pockets that might be willing to step up for their alma mater.

 

Please tell me what Jones has done over the last 9 years to justify keeping him around?  Has this program shown any signs of progress?  I say no.  What say you?

There is a difference between believing that someone should be fired but acknowledging that it isn't likely to happen (at least on a short time frame).

 

I personally would like to see some change in coaching (as do nearly everyone posting here), but I also understand that it will take a substantial amount of money to occur.  Probably so much money that it is worth waiting until his contract runs out or he really messes up (his Big Sky runs have bought him some time over the years, unfortunately).  That doesn't make me a Jones supporter. 

 

Also, I really wish you and others would stop with the duckies and bunnies line.  It is essentially a backhand slap to fellow Sioux fans, and I think you are better than that.  People are going to have different opinions than you...that's okay.  They may even voice those differing opinions...again, totally okay.  It's what make discussion boards more than just groupthink.

 

And that's my thoughts on that.    Happy holidays!

[fightingsioux4life]

There is a difference between believing that someone should be fired but acknowledging that it isn't likely to happen (at least on a short time frame).

 

I personally would like to see some change in coaching (as do nearly everyone posting here), but I also understand that it will take a substantial amount of money to occur.  Probably so much money that it is worth waiting until his contract runs out or he really messes up (his Big Sky runs have bought him some time over the years, unfortunately).  That doesn't make me a Jones supporter. 

 

Also, I really wish you and others would stop with the duckies and bunnies line.  It is essentially a backhand slap to fellow Sioux fans, and I think you are better than that.  People are going to have different opinions than you...that's okay.  They may even voice those differing opinions...again, totally okay.  It's what make discussion boards more than just groupthink.

 

And that's my thoughts on that.    Happy holidays!

Really?  It seems to me that it is people on your side that want to silence the critics with all your "everything is fine the way it is" rhetoric.  I get shouted down whenever I point out obvious truths about problems that exist in our athletic department instead of valid rebuttal points that offer a different point of view.  That is the real "backhand slap" to our alma mater and to those of us that don't want the MBB program to atrophy to the point of the FB program where it needs a total rebuild from the bottom up.

 

And don't think we can't come up with buyout dollars for Jones like we did for Mussman.  There are probably more than a few basketball alums who are not happy with the current state of the MBB program.