Students kicked out

[bang]

How the heck did this guy end up at UND?

In a job interview you don't have to do anything. You just need to say the right things. That's his specialty.

[Ray77]

Fire Kupchella. Fire Kelly. Fire______

 

Hakstol?

[Siouxperfan7]

I'll put the debate on whether or not these kids had the right to hold up that sign or not aside for a second.  What were these kids protesting?  Kelly's involvement in the retirement of the Fighting Sioux nickname?  First of all, the settlement was signed before Kelley even took office.  So To think Kelley is the one that somehoe worked with the NCAA to get rid of the name is wimply wrong.  Second, the two involved were a freshman and a sophomore.  So that means that they were still in elelmentary school when all this went down initially.  Now Of course they are college kids and could have dome some research of what has happened in the last 10 years regarding the Fighting Sioux name in that time.  It is well documented.  Obviously they didn't.  Now you can be upset with how Kelley is handling the issue, that's fine.  But to me these kids are upset about the retirement of the name.  Blaming Kelley for the initial ritrement of the name is idiotic because he was not even here when it all went down.

 

Now of course these kids could have been protesting the cancellation of Springfest, well then that'sa different thing.  And outside the student population, you won't gain much support there.

[Maddogg1971]

I'll put the debate on whether or not these kids had the right to hold up that sign or not aside for a second.  What were these kids protesting?  Kelly's involvement in the retirement of the Fighting Sioux nickname?  First of all, the settlement was signed before Kelley even took office.  So To think Kelley is the one that somehoe worked with the NCAA to get rid of the name is wimply wrong.  Second, the two involved were a freshman and a sophomore.  So that means that they were still in elelmentary school when all this went down initially.  Now Of course they are college kids and could have dome some research of what has happened in the last 10 years regarding the Fighting Sioux name in that time.  It is well documented.  Obviously they didn't.  Now you can be upset with how Kelley is handling the issue, that's fine.  But to me these kids are upset about the retirement of the name.  Blaming Kelley for the initial ritrement of the name is idiotic because he was not even here when it all went down.

 

Now of course these kids could have been protesting the cancellation of Springfest, well then that'sa different thing.  And outside the student population, you won't gain much support there.

 

Oh please. Kelley wanted that nickname out as bad as the other 12 people in the state. Furthermore, you are correct, the deal was signed with the Lakota Sioux....back in the 50's.

[Old Time Hockey]

The majority of the student body present at the game did protest the retirement of the nickname at the game by chanting "Sioux Forever". This I found ironic due to the fact that some folks on this board believe the student body want to move on so they have something they can identify themselves with. Guess those present at the game Saturday night didn't get the memo!

[SiouxForever]

The majority of the student body present at the game did protest the retirement of the nickname at the game by chanting "Sioux Forever". This I found ironic due to the fact that some folks on this board believe the student body want to move on so they have something they can identify themselves with. Guess those present at the game Saturday night didn't get the memo!

 

Even better with Mark Mac and Gorder wearing Fighting Sioux hats as the crowd honors the seniors. I'm sure the higher ups weren't too fond of that. 

[Old Time Hockey]

Also, believe it or not, Bob Kelley was brought in here to make sure the nickname issue was put to rest. This was one of a select few items that was going to define his legacy at our flagship university. Instead of taking the reigns and showing leadership with compassion and competency, he dropped the ball. He would have been much better served by getting out front of the issue and stating that he understood the high level of sensitivity of the issue and got on "our" side. He could have said something like, "I know this sucks, but the NC$$ has tied our hands with this issue." To summarize, he never really showed any compassion nor leadership for those of us that are hurt by losing the nickname. Aside from a few coaches, no one from the University administration has spoke out on behalf of those of us who loved being known as the Fighting Sioux!

[The Sicatoka]

The majority of the student body present at the game did protest the retirement of the nickname at the game by chanting "Sioux Forever". This I found ironic due to the fact that some folks on this board believe the student body want to move on so they have something they can identify themselves with. Guess those present at the game Saturday night didn't get the memo!

 

You can chant "Sioux Forever" and still accept that a change is the reality. 

[The Sicatoka]

Also, believe it or not, Bob Kelley was brought in here to make sure the nickname issue was put to rest. This was one of a select few items that was going to define his legacy at our flagship university. Instead of taking the reigns and showing leadership with compassion and competency, he dropped the ball. He would have been much better served by getting out front of the issue and stating that he understood the high level of sensitivity of the issue and got on "our" side. He could have said something like, "I know this sucks, but the NC$$ has tied our hands with this issue." To summarize, he never really showed any compassion nor leadership for those of us that are hurt by losing the nickname. Aside from a few coaches, no one from the University administration has spoke out on behalf of those of us who loved being known as the Fighting Sioux!

 

With this we agree. He failed to lead on the key issue of his era. And he had a historic opportunity to lead and be a leader. 

 

As the cool kids (used to) say: Epic. Fail. 

[Redneksioux]

I'll put the debate on whether or not these kids had the right to hold up that sign or not aside for a second. What were these kids protesting? Kelly's involvement in the retirement of the Fighting Sioux nickname? First of all, the settlement was signed before Kelley even took office. So To think Kelley is the one that somehoe worked with the NCAA to get rid of the name is wimply wrong. Second, the two involved were a freshman and a sophomore. So that means that they were still in elelmentary school when all this went down initially. Now Of course they are college kids and could have dome some research of what has happened in the last 10 years regarding the Fighting Sioux name in that time. It is well documented. Obviously they didn't. Now you can be upset with how Kelley is handling the issue, that's fine. But to me these kids are upset about the retirement of the name. Blaming Kelley for the initial ritrement of the name is idiotic because he was not even here when it all went down.

Now of course these kids could have been protesting the cancellation of Springfest, well then that'sa different thing. And outside the student population, you won't gain much support there.

Since Jody has come out and say the sign was politically motivated Id assume that since Austin is a republican campus president it could be possible this was seen as a protest of kelley's liberal views. But all the sign said was "fire Kelley". So why exactly was Austin kicked out? And why is Jody denying the fact he was kicked out?

[siouxforcefans]

And Austin claims he was kicked out. Also I've also heard from a reliable source that one of the students was kicked out. Why the conflicting story?

This may have been a result of the "meeting in the office"?  We saw multiple students leave, so if only one of them was actually kicked out, one could be led to believe that student did/said something to escalate his consequence.  If it was just that he brought the banner, then that's not deserved.  If he became belligerent, or threw a temper tantrum, that'd be a different story...

[Siouxperfan7]

Like I said.  You can be upset with what Kelley has done in regards to the process of retiring the Fighting Siouc name.  But he had nothing to do with the actual decision to retirement of the name.  Of course one of his responsiblilities when he was hired was to handle the retirement of the name.  People, especially these students, are mad at the wrong person.  RObhert Kelley did not retire the Fighting Sioux name.  The NCAA did.  Be mad at them.  Make a sign voicing your upset with the NCAA.  Placing blame on the wrong person makes you look like a fool.

[Siouxperfan7]

This may have been a result of the "meeting in the office"?  We saw multiple students leave, so if only one of them was actually kicked out, one could be led to believe that student did/said something to escalate his consequence.  If it was just that he brought the banner, then that's not deserved.  If he became belligerent, or threw a temper tantrum, that'd be a different story...

 

When did the sign actually get displayes?  I wasn't there, but I am hearing that is was very late in the third period.  So it is a possiblilty that by the time that these kids were done meeting with REA officials, the game was already over. 

[Old Time Hockey]

Like I said.  You can be upset with what Kelley has done in regards to the process of retiring the Fighting Siouc name.  But he had nothing to do with the actual decision to retirement of the name.  Of course one of his responsiblilities when he was hired was to handle the retirement of the name.  People, especially these students, are mad at the wrong person.  RObhert Kelley did not retire the Fighting Sioux name.  The NCAA did.  Be mad at them.  Make a sign voicing your upset with the NCAA.  Placing blame on the wrong person makes you look like a fool.

How do you know that was their motivation? There are a multitude of reasons they could have had that banner. Lack of leadership would be at the top of my list followed by many other issues that make me agree with the banner that was taken from the Ralph Saturday night! Would it be OK to have done this outside the Ralph prior to the game?

[rhenry8439]

they held up the sign against the glass at the end of the tunnel to get to the student section. so technically they werent blocking anyones point of view and it was while they were i belive on a tv timeout.

[siouxforcefans]

When did the sign actually get displayes?  I wasn't there, but I am hearing that is was very late in the third period.  So it is a possiblilty that by the time that these kids were done meeting with REA officials, the game was already over. 

It was in the third - we had a great view of all of it from across the rink.  After the sign was rolled/crumbled up, several students exited with security staff.  I called bullsh;t then, but did not notice if any returned.  People on here saying only one student was thrown out makes me believe there was more to his particular story.

[Northcountry]

If I am not mistaken, this was a hockey game.  What did this sign have to do with events on the ice?  I don't appreciate people distracting from the actual event going on so that their petty little gripes can be aired in public.  I suspect that one of them got a parking ticket and of course that is the fault of the president of the university.  There is a time and a place - I'm sure the Dakota Student would be willing to run a letter to the editor, or publish an article if one of them wanted to write it.  This to me is just another example of the self-centered, entitled attitude that so many students exhibit, and another example of boorish behavior on their part (the moment of silence interruption at the last home series is another).  Be loud, be boisterous, be creative, but this is HOCKEY, not a political rally so don't try to hijack it for your own selfish reasons.  End of rant.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

When did the sign actually get displayes?  I wasn't there, but I am hearing that is was very late in the third period.  So it is a possiblilty that by the time that these kids were done meeting with REA officials, the game was already over. 

 

This is very possible. I believe there was under a minute to play when the sign came out. The game was probably over by the time they got to the security office. At that point, yes they do have to leave the arena, just like the other 12k people in attendance.

[The Sicatoka]

One of the first committees* Kelley formed (way back when, say circa 2009) had both Leigh Jeanotte and Ed Schafer on it. Talk about the "Odd Couple" of ND politics.

Where is gets truly odd is that Schafer and Jeanotte agreed in that meeting: Neither could believe they weren't there to pick a new name and start the process to move forward, away from this bleeding, sucking chest wound. Now, each had reasons to want to pick a new name (Jeanotte: to finally "win"; Schafer: to keep what we're wallowing in now from happening); but, each agreed it was time to pick and move. At the time you'd have had a prominent UND alumnus and former governor and a lead of the "antis" both working to a common end.

The guy who was paralyzed at the thought of making a decision, defending it, and leading? Dr. Robert O. Kelley.

When you're president of a major university, one of just 47 with both a medical and a law school, you're paid to make decisions and take the heat for them. You're not there to orchestrate committee memberships.

*It's tough to remember them all and keep them all straight.

 

A wise adviser has pointed out to me that:

 

Jeanotte's concern was (in addition to "win") that if UND didn't give its fans a new identity for which to cheer, they would tend to cling to the identity they had; time has proven him correct. 

 

Schafer's point was that UND shouldn't "transition from something to nothing." He recognized the importance of the university having a recognizable brand for its athletic teams. Others at UND in athletics and student recruiting -- not just recruiting athletes -- told Kelley the same thing during the one and only meeting of that "transition" committee. 

 

Kelley believed, as Tim O'Keefe and Al Olson did at the time, that those who lost the nickname needed an appropriate amount of time to grieve for their loss, but their advice was in the minority.

 

The diversity of opinions urging Kelley to adopt a new nickname coming from so many different areas (from Jeanotte to Schafer) should have been a clue and a red flag about appropriate action and direction the leader of the university should have taken. He chose the "do nothing" approach. 

[Siouxperfan7]

If I am not mistaken, this was a hockey game.  What did this sign have to do with events on the ice?  I don't appreciate people distracting from the actual event going on so that their petty little gripes can be aired in public.  I suspect that one of them got a parking ticket and of course that is the fault of the president of the university.  There is a time and a place - I'm sure the Dakota Student would be willing to run a letter to the editor, or publish an article if one of them wanted to write it.  This to me is just another example of the self-centered, entitled attitude that so many students exhibit, and another example of boorish behavior on their part (the moment of silence interruption at the last home series is another).  Be loud, be boisterous, be creative, but this is HOCKEY, not a political rally so don't try to hijack it for your own selfish reasons.  End of rant.

 

Yet another example of the loud, vocal minority protesting something and making it more about themselves than the actual issue.  If it was about the issue, these students would have held the sign up in the first period right when the game started.  Instead, they "conveniently" did it in the waning seconds when the game was all but over.  So to me, watching the entire game was more important than the message they were trying to convey with the sign.

 

Agree that these types of protests have a time and place.  Typically if it is the wrong time an/or place, you will usually know it because you will be asked to stop your protesting actions. 

[Fetch]

the team has definitely arrived 

[Old Time Hockey]

Yet another example of the loud, vocal minority protesting something and making it more about themselves than the actual issue.  If it was about the issue, these students would have held the sign up in the first period right when the game started.  Instead, they "conveniently" did it in the waning seconds when the game was all but over.  So to me, watching the entire game was more important than the message they were trying to convey with the sign.

 

Agree that these types of protests have a time and place.  Typically if it is the wrong time an/or place, you will usually know it because you will be asked to stop your protesting actions.

I thought the timing was perfect. At the end of the game, the statement was made in case they were wrongly ejected. It was a great segway to the end if the game when the "Sioux Forever" chant came about. You know that meant a lot to the 7 seniors, who were the last class to wear the logo.

I am not saying the banner and chant were necessarily related, but it was definitely not hard to connect the dots.

[Siouxperman8]

 

A wise adviser has pointed out to me that:

 

Jeanotte's concern was (in addition to "win") that if UND didn't give its fans a new identity for which to cheer, they would tend to cling to the identity they had; time has proven him correct. 

 

Schafer's point was that UND shouldn't "transition from something to nothing." He recognized the importance of the university having a recognizable brand for its athletic teams. Others at UND in athletics and student recruiting -- not just recruiting athletes -- told Kelley the same thing during the one and only meeting of that "transition" committee. 

 

Kelley believed, as Tim O'Keefe and Al Olson did at the time, that those who lost the nickname needed an appropriate amount of time to grieve for their loss, but their advice was in the minority.

 

The diversity of opinions urging Kelley to adopt a new nickname coming from so many different areas (from Jeanotte to Schafer) should have been a clue and a red flag about appropriate action and direction the leader of the university should have taken. He chose the "do nothing" approach. 

 

I'm not sure if you are saying Kelley is to blame for not settling on a new nickname immediately or not but didn't the legislature eventually mandate a 3 year cooling off period where we weren't allowed to choose a new nickname anyway?

[Siouxperfan7]

I thought the timing was perfect. At the end of the game, the statement was made in case they were wrongly ejected. It was a great segway to the end if the game when the "Sioux Forever" chant came about. You know that meant a lot to the 7 seniors, who were the last class to wear the logo.

I am not saying the banner and chant were necessarily related, but it was definitely not hard to connect the dots.

 

If the students intended it to be related, it was very dumb on their part.  Kelley had absulutely nothing to d0 with the name being retired.  Sure he is involved in replacing it, but to be mad at Kelley for the NCAA coming up with a policy and the Standing Rock tribe not giving approval is just idiotic. 

[Old Time Hockey]

Maybe they are pissed at how he has handled the nickname issue in general. Or maybe they can't stand his liberal, "I know what's best for you" mentality.