CMSioux Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 Ok guys lets keep this civil and non racist....which everyone has done to this point. No need to come up with name calling. Would you say that to a Native American face to face? Remember the name and logo are now history and this wasn't the fault of any Native American. The reason it's gone is because the school failed to gain a solid agreement with both tribes. One thing I'd be curious of....how many Sioux fans on here would be seen decked out in Sioux gear on one of nd's reservations, excluding the casino? Rez cafe, gas station, grocery store, clinic, hospital, housing development? Actually I wear it all the time and I have been in Devils Lake and at Pow Wows and I have never had any of them say a word - the reality is the real Native Americans either don't care or don't mind. Yes there are a few vocal ones that get the medias attention but my experience has been that most either don't care or don't mind. You have to remember this was driven by liberal minded people who have never been within 100 miles of a Native American community (but many are employed by UND). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 RNS you. Do not know the history of the entire name thing CM Sioux u are 100 percent correct To say NAs had nothing to do with it is ignorant Folks like u being gullible & senstive hurt the ones that tried to save the name Calling me racist pizzes me off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taz Boy Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 Nex time I get to Grand Forks I'm going to knock on the door of that sorority and hand a $20 bill to the first person who answers the door... Uhm, Good luck with that. Sorry. Just too easy. Seriously, I sent in my e-mail to Dr. Kelley, copied the GPB national office as well. Complete lack of leadership by the executive level and an embarrassment to the University. taz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redneksioux Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 RNS you. Do not know the history of the entire name thing CM Sioux u are 100 percent correct To say NAs had nothing to do with it is ignorant Folks like u being gullible & senstive hurt the ones that tried to save the name Calling me racist pizzes me off I do know the history of the fighting Sioux nickname. Before it was retired I was a strong supporter of it and I still appreciate that gear is still available. Don't get me wrong I still wear my Sioux sweater to every game I attend, when I travel, in the evenings, and weekends as well. I've done a lot of work on the area reservations the past few years though and have met a lot of people. Und's old nickname is not one of their concerns but is a Native American who was against the nickname and logo in the wrong for being against it? NO. That is that person's opinion. Is a supporter of the name wrong for wanting the school to keep it? NO that is that person's opinion as well. Most native Americans have much more bigger concerns and could care less what und uses or has use but that doesn't matter the name is gone and it wasn't because of a few Indians who were against it. It's gone because of the lack of a relationship built by und with the 2 Sioux reservations in this state. Like it or not that is the case. And when you drop the word Indian giver and say the Indians deserve the name for taking away the Sioux nickname....well sorry but that is a racist and uneducated comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redneksioux Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 With all that said, I do think Kelley's words were a little too pc and I would agree that sign was directed at the NCAA and not native Americans or time out week. I don't think the sorority deserves sensitivity training or should be punished. At the same time the name is gone. Get over it. We are still cheering for the same team! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darell1976 Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 If Kelley had a pair he would come out and say he was wrong and that the sign was not towards NA's but towards the NCAA, and leave it at that. If the PC crowd gets pissed, so what they can leave campus anytime they want. Can't take the name away again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 They gave it to us once & the State vote both Reservations took it away The term has been around a long time & I feel its accurate in this case & if that offends some now oh well I am not sensitive to them because they were not sensitive to me when all hope was gone & that vote was the last hope But I don't think hockey fans will ever let it go away Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 & misguided folks like u turned the whole thing more about football conferences that most who didn't really care wanted it all to end I do agree UND did not do enough to help keep the name - Kelly to make such a big deal over sometng like this just drags out all the bad feelings is is not smart there was plenty ofblame to go around was this Kelly showing he is tough to defend the sensitive pc crowd ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redneksioux Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 & misguided folks like u turned the whole thing more about football conferences that most who didn't really care wanted it all to end I do agree UND did not do enough to help keep the name - Kelly to make such a big deal over sometng like this just drags out all the bad feelings is is not smart there was plenty ofblame to go around was this Kelly showing he is tough to defend the sensitive pc crowd ? I'd have to disagree. Misguided fans that have used racial slurs definitely did not help the cause of keeping the Sioux name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 Ill admidt it is a racialslur but it fits the NA types that did everything to get the name removed- I was never one of those before Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagies Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 Ill admidt it is a racialslur but it fits the NA types that did everything to get the name removed- I was never one of those before Fetch, you really need to drop that argument. If you look at the history of the treaties that the US Gov't broke with the Native Americans, I think you'd agree that term is not appropriate. And regardless of any argument, as you said yourself, it's just not a good term to be using, especially in this conversation. We're on the same side of the argument as a whole, I'd just suggest a little more discretion here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 I may have to reconsider giving any more money to UND as long as Kelley is "El Commandante" .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 Agreed - it just pisses me off - don't know if I will ever let it go & right now I don't have to Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darell1976 Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2014/04/21/5-studies-prove-dan-snyder-wrong-about-redskins But, contrary to what Snyder and his supporters might have us believe, popular opinion does not make something right. And the real world is a very different place than his supporters suggest. And there’s a growing body of research that proves it. Here is a small sampling of five recent studies demonstrating, despite a combination of widespread support and apathy, that Native American team names and mascots do, in fact, have a serious harmful effect: 1. A study by Chaney, Burke, and Burkley (2011) found that many people, in fact, do not distinguish between their feelings between stereotypical Native mascots and actual, living, breathing, Native American people. 2. In their study on the effects of people who were not themselves the object of stereotypical depictions, Kim-Prieto, Okazaki, Goldstein, and Kirschner (2009) found that even people who had been exposed to Native American sports mascots were more likely to stereotype a different ethnic minority group. 3. Steinfeldt et al. (2010) examined racial attitudes about Native Americans expressed in online newspaper forums, focusing on the nickname and logo used by the University of North Dakota’s “Fighting Sioux.” The study found support for the positions of anti-mascot activists and organizations that Native American mascots, nicknames, and logos perpetuate stereotypes. It also found that “Because sports fans have the power to play Indian without the consent of American Indians, relations between both groups are negatively affected" (King et al., 2006; Staurowsky, 2007; Williams, 2006; Williams, 2007). Within the context of college sporting events, the “scripted form of White people “becoming” Indian renders invisible the ignominious history of American Indian genocide by the U.S. government, replacing it with a culturally comfortable and comforting myth of the ‘American Indian warrior’” (Staurowsky, 2007, p. 62). Thus, majority culture participants can disengage themselves from historic and ongoing marginalization of American Indians. In its place, a false sense of unity is forged between American Indians and European Americans through the assumption that American Indians feel honored and respected by racialized mascotery (Black, 2002).” (Steinfeldt et al. 2010: 7) 4. A 2011 study by LaRocque et al. of the emotional impact of the University of North Dakota’s “Fighting Sioux” nickname and logo on 33 Native American and 36 majority culture (MC) students found that Native Americans “may experience significantly higher levels of psychological distress when viewing even neutral images of AI (American Indian) nicknames/logos.” 5. Freng and Willis-Esqueda, in their 2011 investigation to determine if exposure to a Native American mascot activated Native American stereotypes, found that the “Chief Wahoo” image of the Cleveland Indians activated negative, not positive, Native American stereotypes when compared to other images. Cumulatively, these studies show in horrific clarity what supporters of the Red*kins--Native and non-Native alike--seem not to realize: that ethnic mascots are integrally intertwined with their offensive team names, and together they have the effect of perpetuating institutionalized racism. Institutionalized racism contributes to high rates of unemployment, poverty, health problems, and inadequate education for many Native Americans. In short, Native team names and mascots contribute to the very problems we should be focused on solving. That’s why ethnic team names and mascots aren’t just silly words and images we can afford to ignore. They have a real, measurable impact, and they hurt us all—no matter where we live, what our backgrounds are, and whether we are personally offended or not. So, in short the NA community will have mental issues from schools and teams with Indian Nicknames. So when are the protests scheduled at NA schools with NA nicknames? (Mahnomen Indians, Mandan Braves, Solen Fighting Sioux, Florida State Seminoles). If its bad for schools outside the reservations due to mental anguish what makes it right to have those same nicknames ON the reservations. Also I didn't know Chief Wahoo made the reservations live in poverty. That Chief must be hording all the employment and money those reservations could be getting. Lets hang, oh wait Chief Wahoo isn't a real person. Hmmm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 3. Steinfeldt et al. (2010) examined racial attitudes about Native Americans expressed in online newspaper forums, ... <comment here about "if it's on the internet it must be true" > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewey Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 His doucheness Harry Reid calling on the NFL to copycat Sterling vis-à-vis Redskins nickname....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 <comment here about "if it's on the internet it must be true" > I'm sure the peer reviews were exhaustive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Posted May 5, 2014 Share Posted May 5, 2014 https://vidd.me/tBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 His doucheness Harry Reid calling on the NFL to copycat Sterling vis-à-vis Redskins nickname....... That's not going to end well for Harry Reid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMSioux Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/258238391.html Not specifically nickname related but shows the direction we are going - will the shouting of "Sioux" at the end of the national anthem soon be a tradition of the past? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darell1976 Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 http://www.startribu.../258238391.html Not specifically nickname related but shows the direction we are going - will the shouting of "Sioux" at the end of the national anthem soon be a tradition of the past? There is nothing the University or the NCAA can do if "fans" yell Sioux at the end. Just like they can't prohibit Sioux gear at games, since the logo is "historical" (their words). UND has no "offensive" songs except Fight on Sioux which I am sure is renamed Fight on U as they still play the song at games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMSioux Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 I agree - of course it will sadly die a natural death through the years. Maybe it's just the games I attend but the chant seems to be less obvious at some games. While there continues to be liberals that think they can control where the Sioux logo shows up - there is no way UND will ever make any noise whatsoever about fans wearing Sioux clothing or cheering the SIoux name at their events. They will however control what they can which includes the pep band and anyone "representing the school". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 There is nothing the University or the NCAA can do if "fans" yell Sioux at the end. Just like they can't prohibit Sioux gear at games, since the logo is "historical" (their words). UND has no "offensive" songs except Fight on Sioux which I am sure is renamed Fight on U as they still play the song at games. Give it 5-10 years, darell1976, and we'll see...UND will put the hammer down on old-timers and the young 18 year old PC-indoctrinated freshman will be happy to point out folks yelling "Go Sioux" to ushers so they can be removed from the arena. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darell1976 Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Give it 5-10 years, darell1976, and we'll see...UND will put the hammer down on old-timers and the young 18 year old PC-indoctrinated freshman will be happy to point out folks yelling "Go Sioux" to ushers so they can be removed from the arena. 5-10 years people will start moving on to the new nickname. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 5-10 years people will start moving on to the new nickname. Not old-timers like you and me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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