Forum Opinion Hit Piece on the NCAA and the SIOUX

[HowBoutThemBison?]

Did anyone happen to hear anything about the Herd Terds this year that was covered outside of the fargo forum and the grand forks herald? I think the problem people in fargo are having is the news about the Sioux nickname has had more press than NDSU has had their entire existence...I always like how the fargo folks take such pride in being erroneously associated with real Division I championship hockey, but you never hear anyone confuse UND with the supposed FCS powerhouse out of fargo because most folks outside of ND don't even know there is a college in fargo to begin with...this should help feed the trolls...

BobIwabuchiFan

P.S. I am watching that all American from UND right now in the playoffs or should I say the many all-Americans...still looking for someone from the NDSU all-century basketball team whenever I quite watching golf and decide to watch the last 3 minutes of the NBA playoff games....

I'll be honest, you don't hear much about either school. Lately if you read some of the backwater sports websites they'll have a short article about the UND nickname issues, but no press is better than bad press. If UND makes the Frozen Four, they'll make it onto espn for a couples minutes with the other 3 teams. If NDSU wins against Kansas, Minnesota, something like that, they'll get on for a coupple minutes. NDSU isn't an FCS powerhouse, maybe sometime, but not right now. And no Bison fans take any pride in being associated with "Division I championship hockey," about half the teams aren't even D-I that are members of D-1. And lets be real here, I can tear apart any argument UND folks throw out there. UND folks will believe they can tear apart any of my arguments. The one thing you guys will never be able to touch(PETA INVOLVEMENT PENDING), is our nickname, Go Bison! 8>1 "Whioux Suck S hit"

P.S. We don't really worry too much about hockey all-americans, how many are United States citizens, Parise is I know, but other than him? last I checked being Canadian pretty much means you have to play hockey because you are too small/slow or all of the above to play basketball or football.

[petey23]

I'll be honest, you don't hear much about either school. Lately if you read some of the backwater sports websites they'll have a short article about the UND nickname issues, but no press is better than bad press. If UND makes the Frozen Four, they'll make it onto espn for a couples minutes with the other 3 teams. If NDSU wins against Kansas, Minnesota, something like that, they'll get on for a coupple minutes. NDSU isn't an FCS powerhouse, maybe sometime, but not right now. And no Bison fans take any pride in being associated with "Division I championship hockey," about half the teams aren't even D-I that are members of D-1. And lets be real here, I can tear apart any argument UND folks throw out there. UND folks will believe they can tear apart any of my arguments. The one thing you guys will never be able to touch(PETA INVOLVEMENT PENDING), is our nickname, Go Bison! 8>1 "Whioux Suck S hit"

P.S. We don't really worry too much about hockey all-americans, how many are United States citizens, Parise is I know, but other than him? last I checked being Canadian pretty much means you have to play hockey because you are too small/slow or all of the above to play basketball or football.

Just when I thought you had tapped your resources for stupidity you go and top yourself...well done.

[Boomer 40AAA]

Up a little late tonite,those classes you attend @ Ben Franklin Junior High .come early.Oh thats right you can sleep in because Ma and Pa will get you to school.Bet you can't wait for summer vacation.You can attend play town and maybe even go to a Bison day camp

I'll be honest, you don't hear much about either school. Lately if you read some of the backwater sports websites they'll have a short article about the UND nickname issues, but no press is better than bad press. If UND makes the Frozen Four, they'll make it onto espn for a couples minutes with the other 3 teams. If NDSU wins against Kansas, Minnesota, something like that, they'll get on for a coupple minutes. NDSU isn't an FCS powerhouse, maybe sometime, but not right now. And no Bison fans take any pride in being associated with "Division I championship hockey," about half the teams aren't even D-I that are members of D-1. And lets be real here, I can tear apart any argument UND folks throw out there. UND folks will believe they can tear apart any of my arguments. The one thing you guys will never be able to touch(PETA INVOLVEMENT PENDING), is our nickname, Go Bison! 8>1 "Whioux Suck S hit"

P.S. We don't really worry too much about hockey all-americans, how many are United States citizens, Parise is I know, but other than him? last I checked being Canadian pretty much means you have to play hockey because you are too small/slow or all of the above to play basketball or football.

[darell1976]

I'll be honest, you don't hear much about either school. Lately if you read some of the backwater sports websites they'll have a short article about the UND nickname issues, but no press is better than bad press. If UND makes the Frozen Four, they'll make it onto espn for a couples minutes with the other 3 teams. If NDSU wins against Kansas, Minnesota, something like that, they'll get on for a coupple minutes. NDSU isn't an FCS powerhouse, maybe sometime, but not right now. And no Bison fans take any pride in being associated with "Division I championship hockey," about half the teams aren't even D-I that are members of D-1. And lets be real here, I can tear apart any argument UND folks throw out there. UND folks will believe they can tear apart any of my arguments. The one thing you guys will never be able to touch(PETA INVOLVEMENT PENDING), is our nickname, Go Bison! 8>1 "Whioux Suck S hit"

P.S. We don't really worry too much about hockey all-americans, how many are United States citizens, Parise is I know, but other than him? last I checked being Canadian pretty much means you have to play hockey because you are too small/slow or all of the above to play basketball or football.

Why do Bison fans talk bad about Canadians on our hockey team? Have you checked your own rosters and how many Canadians are on your team?

[The Sicatoka]

... last I checked being Canadian pretty much means you have to play hockey because you are too small/slow or all of the above to play basketball or football.

Well, that, or that all the youth programs in Canada are geared to hockey and lacrosse because those are the two national sports of Canada.

You really need to dare to venture out into thinking of something other than a "it's all football or basketball" way of thinking. There's a whole world out there and the vast majority care more about ... football (i.e. what you'd call soccer). Neither you nor they are wrong, you just see things differently.

[airmail]

HowBoutThemBison? isn't my favorite poster on this forum, but I think he's closer to being a realist than many of you are giving him credit for. (nonsensical posts, of course, aside) I've fought this nickname fight vocally and financially, and was heartbroken when it took a path I didn't like. The fact is, we settled our suit. We didn't meet the terms of the settlement to keep the name for reasons I'm too frustrated to discuss. Now, the johnny-come-latelys are bring the fight back and making UND look like a pack of fools. WHERE WAS YOUR SUPPORT WHEN WE NEEDED IT? WHERE WAS YOUR ACTION WHEN WE NEEDED IT?

NEWSFLASH: IT'S TOO DAMNED LATE!!!!

Good piece by another vocal supporter of the nickname - I share his sentiments almost verbatim:

http://www.grandforksherald.com/event/article/id/201422

I do know one thing: It is time to put this issue to rest. We have squandered too much time, money and reputation on this fruitless fight with forces beyond our control.

[dakota fairways]

... Good piece by another vocal supporter of the nickname - I share his sentiments almost verbatim:

http://www.grandforksherald.com/event/article/id/201422

Since when is Mr Omdahl considered a vocal supporter of the nickname?

[mikejm]

Since when is Mr Omdahl considered a vocal supporter of the nickname?

You must not have read Lloyd's opinion piece:

Personally' date=' I love the Fighting Sioux logo. UND never will get a better one. And I do not agree with the NCAA that it is objectionable. But that is not for me to judge because I am not an American Indian. Not being the patient, I cannot say where it hurts.[/quote']

[airmail]

Since when is Mr Omdahl considered a vocal supporter of the nickname?

In fairness, I got a little fired up and a little wordy.

It's true that Omdahl, while a fan of the logo, is in favor of transitioning away - and has maintained that stand for a couple years now. Didn't mean to mislead or mis-quote anyone.

[Chewey]

You must not have read Lloyd's opinion piece:

I find Lloyd's support about as genuine and reliable as his powers of perception. A.) He does not agree with the NCAA that the nickname and logo are objectionable PLUS B.) Majorities of the NA's on Spirit Lake and on SR do not agree with the NCAA that the nickname and logo are offensive DOES NOT EQUAL C.) Not being a patient, I can not say where it hurts. This is just more gibberish that really counts for nothing at all except to serve as an example of how one can wax in intellectual disingenuousness and wallow in illogical desolation and, evidently, like it. The truly scary thing is that Lloyd's haphazard funny-speak actually resonates with some, particularly the anti-nickname twits who extol that stuff in the comment section.

[dakota fairways]

You must not have read Lloyd's opinion piece:

Yes, I did read this piece, and several others that do not sound as if they support the nickname. If anything, those previous pieces were more in support of retiring the nickname.

[Knickball2]

How much Thundering Herd merchandise is sold nationally, as compared to the Fighting Sioux. Since the Fighting Sioux hockey logo was

voted the top hockey logo in the nation, I'm assuming significantly less than the Fighting Sioux. I mean really, when does one see the streets of

Minneapolis/St. Paul filled with people wearing Bisonwear. The bottom line is: The Fighting Sioux copyrighted and trademarked Logo and Nickname

equals $, the issue is really simple when one considers this fact. Fighting Sioux forever! When I see that the Bison logo is the top selling football logo

in the land, I will believe otherwise.

[Bison Dan]

I mean really, when does one see the streets of Minneapolis/St. Paul filled with people wearing Bisonwear.

You should have been there in 06 & 07 - 20,000 plus both times. Bars and restaurants full of Bison all weekend. It'll be the same this year.

[UND1983]

You should have been there in 06 & 07 - 20,000 plus both times. Bars and restaurants full of Bison all weekend. It'll be the same this year.

I'll bet not even close. This isn't the cavernous Metrodome, NDSU will have about 3-4k fans at the game if they are lucky and overpay for tickets. I am fairly certain that 15k others won't just show up to hang around campus. Plus, the stadium isn't downtown.

[HowBoutThemBison?]

HowBoutThemBison? isn't my favorite poster on this forum, but I think he's closer to being a realist than many of you are giving him credit for. (nonsensical posts, of course, aside) I've fought this nickname fight vocally and financially, and was heartbroken when it took a path I didn't like. The fact is, we settled our suit. We didn't meet the terms of the settlement to keep the name for reasons I'm too frustrated to discuss. Now, the johnny-come-latelys are bring the fight back and making UND look like a pack of fools. WHERE WAS YOUR SUPPORT WHEN WE NEEDED IT? WHERE WAS YOUR ACTION WHEN WE NEEDED IT?

NEWSFLASH: IT'S TOO DAMNED LATE!!!!

Good piece by another vocal supporter of the nickname - I share his sentiments almost verbatim:

http://www.grandforksherald.com/event/article/id/201422

I do know one thing: It is time to put this issue to rest. We have squandered too much time, money and reputation on this fruitless fight with forces beyond our control.

I made a friend!

[HowBoutThemBison?]

I'll bet not even close. This isn't the cavernous Metrodome, NDSU will have about 3-4k fans at the game if they are lucky and overpay for tickets. I am fairly certain that 15k others won't just show up to hang around campus. Plus, the stadium isn't downtown.

Can't overpay to see the Herd rocking and rolling. We'll see what happens(result of the game, how many fans are representing the herd there) I'll guess about 10-15 thousand herd fans.

[dmksioux]

Can't overpay to see the Herd rocking and rolling. We'll see what happens(result of the game, how many fans are representing the herd there) I'll guess about 10-15 thousand herd fans.

I have no doubt that Bison football fans travel well. However this is a different situation than it was in the Metrodome. The Gophers football stadium will only be in it's second year of operation. Plus they have a new coach which will breath some fresh air into the program and get the fan base a bit excited, at least initially. Factor those two items in and I would have to guess the tickets will be more difficult to come by. I don't see 10-15,000 for this game...I could be wrong but my guess would be closer to 5,000-6,000.

[krangodance]

Me and the dad discussed this already. My mom asked us what we'd think, I can care less what the Bison are called. I cheer for North Dakota State University, the Bison just happens to be our nickname. We were the Farmers a long time ago, if we were that now, I doubt it would affect how much I like the team. In the end, it is a nickname, not worth getting your school into more and more hot water. From the light reading I've done, the nickname has brought only more harm than good to the University. If you are a Sioux fan more than a University of North Dakota fan, well then I guess your sad little world is coming down. The writing has been on the wall since the 90's, time to face the music.

to be fair bison are just big, stupid animals. the Sioux are a people of rich tradition and history who have fought for centuries against those who meant to do them harm and belittle their beliefs and ways of life, which i believe is happening again with all this "hostile and abusive" nonsense and the Sioux people continue to fight against that one, the irony of which i've pointed out a couple dozen times on other threads.

so, although i believe your tune would change were you truly confronted with the prospect of losing your logo and nickname, i don't think it's a fair comparison when ndsuers say things along the lines of: "we'd be willing to get rid of our giant beast of a mascot so why don't you guys just get over it and let the ncaa, unethically, force you to drop a nickname and logo that pays homage to a people who deserve the respect that comes with that very nickname and logo".

[Siouxbooster#33]

I find Lloyd's support about as genuine and reliable as his powers of perception. A.) He does not agree with the NCAA that the nickname and logo are objectionable PLUS B.) Majorities of the NA's on Spirit Lake and on SR do not agree with the NCAA that the nickname and logo are offensive DOES NOT EQUAL C.) Not being a patient, I can not say where it hurts. This is just more gibberish that really counts for nothing at all except to serve as an example of how one can wax in intellectual disingenuousness and wallow in illogical desolation and, evidently, like it. The truly scary thing is that Lloyd's haphazard funny-speak actually resonates with some, particularly the anti-nickname twits who extol that stuff in the comment section.

Agreed.

Mr. Omdahl has been steadfasstly against the name for 30 years. For him to have the nerve to write this article is almost beyond words! He, along with Mr. Dennis and Mr. Jacobs, have been on a crusade for over 20 years to end the use of the name. They have thrown out every name, insult, accusation, and doomsday threat in the book -- all attempting to hook a few followers here, a few followers there.

I cannot imagine more gaul, more outright bile-filled gaul, than for this man to have the unmittigated NERVE to declare he has anything but outright contempt for the name? Hogwash.

Do not for any instant, ever, think that his goal has ever changed: He has written at least three-four articles a year, every year, for MANY years, extolling the necessity of killing the name.

Meanwhile, UND scheduled Kansas in basketball today.

Hmmmm . . .. yup . . . . those sanctions are killing us.

Required Reading for those who wish to listen to the Herald Editorial Opinions on this particular topic:

http://www.archive.org/stream/remarkablestoryo00bostiala/remarkablestoryo00bostiala_djvu.txt

[Chewey]

Agreed.

Mr. Omdahl has been steadfasstly against the name for 30 years. For him to have the nerve to write this article is almost beyond words! He, along with Mr. Dennis and Mr. Jacobs, have been on a crusade for over 20 years to end the use of the name. They have thrown out every name, insult, accusation, and doomsday threat in the book -- all attempting to hook a few followers here, a few followers there.

I cannot imagine more gaul, more outright bile-filled gaul, than for this man to have the unmittigated NERVE to declare he has anything but outright contempt for the name? Hogwash.

Do not for any instant, ever, think that his goal has ever changed: He has written at least three-four articles a year, every year, for MANY years, extolling the necessity of killing the name.

Meanwhile, UND scheduled Kansas in basketball today.

Hmmmm . . .. yup . . . . those sanctions are killing us.

Required Reading for those who wish to listen to the Herald Editorial Opinions on this particular topic:

http://www.archive.org/stream/remarkablestoryo00bostiala/remarkablestoryo00bostiala_djvu.txt

Kelley's very public sharing of the letter to the NCAA and the NCAA's response are both very transparent, especially when viewed in light of the recent concerted propaganda from Jacobs, Omdahl, etc. It's basically a situation where Kelley, with a nod and a wink (figuratively speaking)., asks the NCAA to "clarify" its policy in light of the new legislation (translation: Please restate your consequences language from the settlement agreement), the NCAA obliging and then the agenda-driven doomsayers at the Herald following suit with the "sky is falling" editorials. Others on this board called it correctly at the time when Kelley's letter went "public" and their conclusions certainly have been proven accurate.

[HowBoutThemBison?]

to be fair bison are just big, stupid animals. the Sioux are a people of rich tradition and history who have fought for centuries against those who meant to do them harm and belittle their beliefs and ways of life, which i believe is happening again with all this "hostile and abusive" nonsense and the Sioux people continue to fight against that one, the irony of which i've pointed out a couple dozen times on other threads.

so, although i believe your tune would change were you truly confronted with the prospect of losing your logo and nickname, i don't think it's a fair comparison when ndsuers say things along the lines of: "we'd be willing to get rid of our giant beast of a mascot so why don't you guys just get over it and let the ncaa, unethically, force you to drop a nickname and logo that pays homage to a people who deserve the respect that comes with that very nickname and logo".

Rich tradition and history who have fought for centuries? Bud, Wounded Knee was 120 years ago. Since then, all the "sioux" have done is sit on reservations...drink cheap alcohol, smoke a lot, live in their own filth, get fat, and complain about their "people" having land stolen from them. And if it pays them so much "homage" why didn't the one tribe not even vote?

I've told people before that I would be more than happy to be the Farmers or Aggies, it is a nickname. A NICKNAME. Not like they are shutting down the program.

[HowBoutThemBison?]

I have no doubt that Bison football fans travel well. However this is a different situation than it was in the Metrodome. The Gophers football stadium will only be in it's second year of operation. Plus they have a new coach which will breath some fresh air into the program and get the fan base a bit excited, at least initially. Factor those two items in and I would have to guess the tickets will be more difficult to come by. I don't see 10-15,000 for this game...I could be wrong but my guess would be closer to 5,000-6,000.

We'll see what happens I suppose. Hopefully its more than 5 grand but if not, oh well. As long as I can see the team play I will be happy.

[dakota fairways]

Unfortunately, HowBoutThemBison, it is people like you with your derogatory mouth (or in this particular case, keyboard) that make the Sioux nickname any kind of a problem. You come on this fan board and spew your venom about Native Americans. I am not surprised at your high negative rep count in only a month an a half with the garbage you are posting. I asked earlier if "the dad" is lakesbison, but with the type of posts that have been coming from you recently, I am beginning to wonder if lakes has come on with a different moniker. You can now take your venom and go to your rivals' boards at USD and SDSU. It continues to surprise me how active you are on the SiouxSports board and I have to wonder what is your obsession with the Sioux and why don't you spend your time on the boards of the teams that NDSU will actually be facing on the field?

[Goon]

Rich tradition and history who have fought for centuries? Bud, Wounded Knee was 120 years ago. Since then, all the "sioux" have done is sit on reservations...drink cheap alcohol, smoke a lot, live in their own filth, get fat, and complain about their "people" having land stolen from them. And if it pays them so much "homage" why didn't the one tribe not even vote?

I've told people before that I would be more than happy to be the Farmers or Aggies, it is a nickname. A NICKNAME. Not like they are shutting down the program.

Wow! You really are insensitive aren't you... What you just said was racist and horribly stereotypical. With that kind of a statement some might refer to you as an asshat.

Edited April 26, 2011 by Goon

[IrishSiouxFan]

Unfortunately, HowBoutThemBison, it is people like you with your derogatory mouth (or in this particular case, keyboard) that make the Sioux nickname any kind of a problem. You come on this fan board and spew your venom about Native Americans. I am not surprised at your high negative rep count in only a month an a half with the garbage you are posting. I asked earlier if "the dad" is lakesbison, but with the type of posts that have been coming from you recently, I am beginning to wonder if lakes has come on with a different moniker. You can now take your venom and go to your rivals' boards at USD and SDSU. It continues to surprise me how active you are on the SiouxSports board and I have to wonder what is your obsession with the Sioux and why don't you spend your time on the boards of the teams that NDSU will actually be facing on the field?

Amen!