A UND NIL collective

[BigGreyAnt41]

28 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

Nonyo bidnez.
See: private employer and employee. 

So private employer is asking the public to donate money to pay their private employees?  Is that how these NIL Collectives work?

[sioux24/7]

I mean in other sports you’re seeing the NIL numbers being thrown out left and right. I think it’s a fair question. I get that it doesn’t need to be public but still. 

[HoopsFan03]

11 minutes ago, sioux24/7 said:

I mean in other sports you’re seeing the NIL numbers being thrown out left and right. I think it’s a fair question. I get that it doesn’t need to be public but still. 

Yeah I see no issue with him asking that question either.

I think the majority of people that saw that post thought the exact same thing. 

[The Sicatoka]

43 minutes ago, BigGreyAnt41 said:

So private employer is asking the public to donate money to pay their private employees?  Is that how these NIL Collectives work?

You understand (the adsurdity that is) a collective. 

If you become a donor/member/co-owner* I'd assume you'd have some rights to look at the books.

 

*not sure how the money sources are categorized 

[UND08]

1 hour ago, The Sicatoka said:

Nonyo bidnez.
See: private employer and employee. 

If I'm contributing to the collective it's 100% my business as a "member"...if I'm going to be treated as the "customer" then I better get something for what I'm paying!

Hence why I will likely never contribute to a collective.  Non-deductible "contributions" to a for-profit and I don't get to see that the money I am "donating" is actually going where I want it to...sorry that doesn't work for me.

I can't wait for the first case of cooked books/theft by a "collective" officer/CEO...I'm guessing there will be plenty!

[petey23]

It is only starting to get interesting with regard to collectives, transfer portals, and NIL.

Here are a few scenarios.

Big Money School, coach indicates a player they are targeting who has 3 years of eligibility left. Collective comes up with 4-500k for the athlete and he commits to school. Player comes in and averages 4 points and 1.5 rebounds a game and by end of year is losing playing time to lightly recruited walk-on. Say coach has overvalued guys in the portal a couple years in a row and the Collective has footed the bill for these "failures"....is the coaches seat hot with the alumni not happy?

Same scenario but the collective has been burned by guys coming in and grabbing the bag and then moving on to another school so since these are basically "employment contracts" they decide to structure them as 2-3 year agreements with the athletes. Coach moves on to another job or gets canned and new coach runs a different offense and brings a couple of his current players with him and does not really have a spot for the player with 2 years left on his "agreement" with the collective. Is there a buyout option? 

[SIOUXFAN97]

1 hour ago, The Sicatoka said:

You understand (the adsurdity that is) a collective. 

If you become a donor/member/co-owner* I'd assume you'd have some rights to look at the books.

 

*not sure how the money sources are categorized 

 i guess the above posters beat me to it.............isn't the whole point of the NIL is to show much deep your pockets are?

shouldn't that pic say Jackson Kunz...slightly above average grinder making 50k working with the 1883 NIL collective?

pretty sure that in the next few years every athletic program will "advertise" their NIL dollars on their webpage...

heck you might even have player bios being, name, position, hometown, height, weight, and NIL value on und.com

[SIOUXFAN97]

3 hours ago, 90siouxfan said:

Nosy

look at these nosy parkers on here.....how dare they?

[sioux24/7]

2 hours ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

look at these nosy parkers on here.....how dare they?

Hey that’s me!

[The Sicatoka]

15 hours ago, UND08 said:

If I'm contributing to the collective it's 100% my business as a "member"...

I think I said that ... 

15 hours ago, The Sicatoka said:

If you become a donor/member/co-owner* I'd assume you'd have some rights to look at the books.

 

[The Sicatoka]

14 hours ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

look at these nosy parkers on here.....how dare they?

I'll be calling your employer and asking then posting your rate of pay. Sound good?  

[Benny Baker]

On 4/17/2024 at 5:43 PM, SIOUXFAN97 said:

so how much does kunz get?

 

On 4/18/2024 at 7:03 AM, The Sicatoka said:

You just asked how much someone is being paid by a private employer. 

So w-2s are issued to recipients of NIL funds, and the NIL collectives have to pay payroll taxes?

[The Sicatoka]

1 minute ago, Benny Baker said:

So w-2s are issued to recipients of NIL funds, and the NIL collectives have to pay payroll taxes?

Could be 1099, but yes, taxable. 

[Benny Baker]

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/39974973/fedex-pledges-25m-5-years-nil-program-memphis

UND's collective is going to need a lot of folks to kick in the $25 bucks a month to compete with some of these other schools.

I fear the truth of the matter is that UND does not have a large enough alumni base nor is there a significant enough corporate presence in Grand Forks, North Dakota to enable UND to compete whatsoever in the NIL game.

[The Sicatoka]

NIL and taxes from the receiver's POV:

https://www.investopedia.com/nil-deals-tax-implications-8599929#:~:text=Money earned from NIL deals,to make estimated tax payments. 

[The Sicatoka]

4 minutes ago, Benny Baker said:

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/39974973/fedex-pledges-25m-5-years-nil-program-memphis

UND's collective is going to need a lot of folks to kick in the $25 bucks a month to compete with some of these other schools.

I fear the truth of the matter is that UND does not have a large enough alumni base nor is there a significant enough corporate presence in Grand Forks, North Dakota to enable UND to compete whatsoever in the NIL game.

You didn't realize this NIL stuff is just to widen the gap between the bigs and the rest? 

[nodak651]

I really wish this would stop being referred to as NIL.

[HoopsFan03]

I just don't see the ROI to donating to the collective if you're a business in Grand Forks, ND. 

It would have to be looked at as strictly a "donation" (but with no tax benefit since the collective is for-profit) and not an actual investment. 

[fightingsioux4life]

7 minutes ago, Benny Baker said:

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/39974973/fedex-pledges-25m-5-years-nil-program-memphis

UND's collective is going to need a lot of folks to kick in the $25 bucks a month to compete with some of these other schools.

I fear the truth of the matter is that UND does not have a large enough alumni base nor is there a significant enough corporate presence in Grand Forks, North Dakota to enable UND to compete whatsoever in the NIL game.

We have a huge alumni base, many of whom are fiercely loyal to their alma mater. We just need to make them aware of this thing and the importance of it. That means communicating with them better than we have communicated with Champions Club members, based on a few stories I have read on this forum.

We have never had as many alumni as the bigger schools in the NCAA. But we've always punched above our weight class in Division I hockey. I don't think NIL will be as big of a factor in FCS football and mid-major basketball, but even those sports will occasionally need NIL assistance.

I will say this: If we are not willing or able to raise the funds needed to really compete in FCS football and at a mid-major level in basketball, maybe we should move back down to Division 2. And no, I am not being hyperbolic either.

[The Sicatoka]

3 minutes ago, nodak651 said:

I really wish this would stop being referred to as NIL.

Pay-for-Play? 
Minor Professional?

[The Sicatoka]

3 minutes ago, HoopsFan03 said:

I just don't see the ROI to donating to the collective if you're a business in Grand Forks, ND. 

It would have to be looked at as strictly a "donation" (but with no tax benefit since the collective is for-profit) and not an actual investment. 

I donate to UNDAA&F because it's organized as a North Dakota nonprofit corporation, is exempted from federal income tax liability by Internal Revenue Code Section 501(c)(3) and qualifies as a public charity. <- tax write-off

A NIL collective is not a charity so no write-off. 

[The Sicatoka]

5 minutes ago, HoopsFan03 said:

I just don't see the ROI to donating to the collective if you're a business in Grand Forks, ND. 

Maaaaaaybe as part of an advertizing budget. 

[siouxfaninseattle]

Why not disclose what the NIL deals are? What's the difference between posting players salary in the NHL, NBA, etc and college players? Oh, must be because they are pros and the college kids are amat......or not. College athletes are now free agents (at least until the lawsuit is settled) and they get paid to play. Like it or not, and I don't, college athletes really aren't amateurs anymore.

[HoopsFan03]

1 minute ago, The Sicatoka said:

Maaaaaaybe as part of an advertizing budget. 

Possibly I suppose. Probably better ways to advertise though.

It is going to be hard to try and convince enough businesses/owners that this payment to the collective is anything other than just a donation. And if that is the case, I would think a lot of these people would rather donate to a group that gives them a tax benefit for their donation.

There is no/very very minimal chance of ROI through the collective at a small mid-major school. At the big schools there is definitely a ROI case by contributing to their local schools collective.

[The Sicatoka]

6 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said:

I will say this: If we are not willing or able to raise the funds needed to really compete in FCS football and at a mid-major level in basketball, maybe we should move back down to Division 2. And no, I am not being hyperbolic either.

Mandating 14 (FCS) or 16 (FBS) is intentionally fiscally predatory, separating bigs from not. NIL exacerbates that. 

This fiscal disparity will force the NCAA to relook at division membership, namely a play what you can afford model. And yes, that's the death of many Olympic type collegiate sports.