Da Bears

[Irish]

3 minutes ago, UNDMOORHEAD said:

Well, their has got to be some worse then him. 

Had you never watched one of our games or had any awareness of our personnel, you would have to assume based on play calling, we have nothing to offer in the pass game. I'm a little worried it might hurt Bubba's ability to recruit a Kenny G type receiver.

Watching with the fans in my section, It is sad to see the entire row call the next play and predict the gain - usually about a yard.  We don't even try just keep opponents honest, let alone set them up for anything. 

[UNDMOORHEAD]

3 minutes ago, Irish said:

Watching with the fans in my section, It is sad to see the entire row call the next play and predict the gain - usually about a yard.  We don't even try just keep opponents honest, let alone set them up for anything. 

It'd be nice to use some play action to hit some long pass plays to the TE over the middle. Some screens and maybe at least try to throw deep to a receiver on 2nd or 3rd and short.

[jdub27]

Pretty impressive that UND managed to averaged 4.6 and 5.2 YPC the last two year with everyone, including the fans, knowing every single play call that was coming.

[UND-1]

5 minutes ago, Irish said:

Watching with the fans in my section, It is sad to see the entire row call the next play and predict the gain - usually about a yard.  We don't even try just keep opponents honest, let alone set them up for anything. 

I mean... every play, all game.  Never setting them up, never passing, always beef-batoning our own offensive lineman for 1 yard.  How the hell did we win the Big Sky?  

[UNDMOORHEAD]

3 minutes ago, UND-1 said:

I mean... every play, all game.  Never setting them up, never passing, always beef-batoning our own offensive lineman for 1 yard.  How the hell did we win the Big Sky?  

You can't tell me you were happy with the play calling against Utah. Of course it's not every single play every single game. It's just frustration with the fact that we seem to have more offensive talent then we did a couple years ago, but the play calling remains very similar.

[UND-1]

Just now, UNDMOORHEAD said:

You can't tell me you were happy with the play calling against Utah. Of course it's not every single play every single game. It's just frustration with the fact that we seem to have more offensive talent then we did a couple years ago, but the play calling remains very similar.

Well, our WRs couldn't get open when Utah brought pressure so we needed zone.  Our pass pro was OK so there was some time to throw but once again they couldn't get open.  

UND threw 14 times in first half.  Score was 17-9.

UND threw 17 times in the second half.  

[homer]

1 hour ago, UND08 said:

Most quarterbacks don't even change the play at the line themselves anymore...instead they look to the sideline and the coaching staff changes it as part of their dumbing things down no-huddle offense. 

Also...Rudolph needs to channel ZERO Mussman as far as I'm concerned...I don't really care how we win as long as we win.  Everyone keeps piling on Rudy...and I'm sure all issues are 100% his fault, since we all know Bubba couldn't possibly be part of the offensive game plan or have any input in play calling (that's sarcasm folks).  Our offense is a philosophy that comes from the head coach and is executed by the OC...and it's played a part in far more success than coach Mussman was ever capable of during his time in Grand Forks.  I may not like it all the time...but if it keeps us successful (i.e. scoring one or more points more than our opponent 8+ times per year) then I'm all for it.   

Unfortunately style points count for something in college football and just winning games by +1 that you could/should win by +10 adds up.  

Not asking for #chuckthepigskin guy.  Just a playaction on 1st down every once in a while.  Keep defenses honest.  Especially when he has recruited the personnel to run those plays effectively.  

[UNDMOORHEAD]

2 minutes ago, UND-1 said:

Well, our WRs couldn't get open when Utah brought pressure so we needed zone.  Our pass pro was OK so there was some time to throw but once again they couldn't get open.  

UND threw 14 times in first half.  Score was 17-9.

UND threw 17 times in the second half.  

Most of the times we pass are in obvious passing situations down and distance wise. Same goes with running situations. I'm just looking for the occasional curveball to throw the defense off. Hakstol took a lot of flack on here over the years for his rigid style of play. I'm willing to wait and see how they do against non-Utah competition. We had chances for TD's early in that game and stuck with the run, run, pass model.

[UND08]

Just now, homer said:

Unfortunately style points count for something in college football and just winning games by +1 that you could/should win by +10 adds up.  

Not asking for #chuckthepigskin guy.  Just a playaction on 1st down every once in a while.  Keep defenses honest.  Especially when he has recruited the personnel to run those plays effectively.  

And I hold out hope that you'll see that this weekend.  Remember playaction doesn't work very well if you can't run the ball effectively...

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

15 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Pretty impressive that UND managed to averaged 4.6 and 5.2 YPC the last two year with everyone, including the fans, knowing every single play call that was coming.

The problem arrises after you make a few first downs and then you have third and long and the defense knows your throwing. And exemplified when you play the real good teams.

[UNDMOORHEAD]

1 minute ago, UND08 said:

And I hold out hope that you'll see that this weekend.  Remember playaction doesn't work very well if you can't run the ball effectively...

I'm aware, but with 8 and 9 in the box geared to stop the run it may be an effective way to get the defense to back off a little bit.

[UND08]

Just now, UNDMOORHEAD said:

I'm aware, but with 8 and 9 in the box geared to stop the run it may be an effective way to get the defense to back off a little bit.

I don't remember Utah having 8-9 in the box...if Mizzou State does that this weekend I hope we can hit guys like Demun Mercer over the top and make them pay!

[gundy1124]

1 hour ago, UND08 said:

You mean the 2000s...or were you talking about his time at MSU-Mankato? 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Mussman

Sorry, the '99 QB was telling me while he did play by play, so 00's is correct.  Thanks for that.

[UNDMOORHEAD]

10 minutes ago, UND08 said:

I don't remember Utah having 8-9 in the box...if Mizzou State does that this weekend I hope we can hit guys like Demun Mercer over the top and make them pay!

I was under the impression that we were talking about Rudy's play calling as a whole. In the Utah game their LB's hugged the line of scrimmage with no fear of pass plays over the top of them.

[the green team]

2 hours ago, iramurphy said:

Tough crowd here.    I said I would like to see him change the play in the huddle or on LOS which is different than calling play in huddle.  I stand corrected.  Keaton had a great game.

I believe Color Analyst Mike Berg has said on the radio broadcast that Keaton usually goes to the LOS with 2 plays.  He also has auto checks of about 5 plays depending if he see's something specific.  Coach Berg, has been talking about this on radio broadcasts going back to Keaton's sophomore year at least.  I don't think he goes up there with 1 play and 1 play only.  That's why I bring my radio. That guy has some serious insight.

[Longtime fan]

3 hours ago, jdub27 said:

Pretty impressive that UND managed to averaged 4.6 and 5.2 YPC the last two year with everyone, including the fans, knowing every single play call that was coming.

It's incredibly impressive. Big sky defense maybe? Imagine if Rudolph opened his playbook instead of using it as a fly swatter!  UND wouldn't have to come from behind nearly every game for a victory.  They would/could have the defenses on their heels early and often and then power it down the throats of the opponent in the second half.  

Also, I hate worrying about Santiagos health taking a beating like he does.  Let him work the edge with pitches or screens, early in the game, to have the opposing "bigs" chase him around....possibly tiring them.  Powering it up the middle with a 175 pounder plays right into the hands of the 275 -300 men waiting for him.  They don't have to move. Have them run!! 

 

[homer]

1 hour ago, UND08 said:

And I hold out hope that you'll see that this weekend.  Remember playaction doesn't work very well if you can't run the ball effectively...

We've all been holding out hope for one season + 1 game.  (Minus the Richmond game)   Went against the grain on that one  

 

[RavenousUte]

3 hours ago, UND08 said:

Most quarterbacks don't even change the play at the line themselves anymore...instead they look to the sideline and the coaching staff changes it as part of their dumbing things down no-huddle offense. 

Also...Rudolph needs to channel ZERO Mussman as far as I'm concerned...I don't really care how we win as long as we win.  Everyone keeps piling on Rudy...and I'm sure all issues are 100% his fault, since we all know Bubba couldn't possibly be part of the offensive game plan or have any input in play calling (that's sarcasm folks).  Our offense is a philosophy that comes from the head coach and is executed by the OC...and it's played a part in far more success than coach Mussman was ever capable of during his time in Grand Forks.  I may not like it all the time...but if it keeps us successful (i.e. scoring one or more points more than our opponent 8+ times per year) then I'm all for it.   

Interesting... most offenses in the Pac-12 are trending towards the read option.  And most QBs at the P5 level will change up plays if they read a blitz to a short passing play.  No huddle isn't about dumbing it down, its about keeping the defense gassed by stopping defensive substitutions.  I think UND is one of the few college teams that still uses a pro set offense.

[UNDvince97-01]

3 hours ago, UNDBIZ said:

Offensive Coordinator Mussman = Not bad

Offensive Coordinator Mussman = National Championship and the success thereafter.  

He took our offense to another level in terms of aggressiveness in playcalling.  Trust me, the defense noticed this and loved it.

[geaux_sioux]

2 minutes ago, UNDvince97-01 said:

Offensive Coordinator Mussman = National Championship and the success thereafter.  

He took our offense to another level in terms of aggressiveness in playcalling.  Trust me, the defense noticed this and loved it.

He just wasn't a head coach. He was a really really good OC though. People forget that I think due to his HC failure. 

[Bison06]

46 minutes ago, RavenousUte said:

Interesting... most offenses in the Pac-12 are trending towards the read option.  And most QBs at the P5 level will change up plays if they read a blitz to a short passing play.  No huddle isn't about dumbing it down, its about keeping the defense gassed by stopping defensive substitutions.  I think UND is one of the few college teams that still uses a pro set offense.

I agree with you that no huddle spread isn't  about dumbing down the offense, but it could be said that it does take away the "reading of the defense" from the QB and puts it in the hands of the play caller. Which in a way is "dumbing it down" for the QB. This is why you see so few "spread Qb's" make it in the NFL where all of that responsibility gets put on the QB. 

[RavenousUte]

12 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

I agree with you that no huddle spread isn't  about dumbing down the offense, but it could be said that it does take away the "reading of the defense" from the QB and puts it in the hands of the play caller. Which in a way is "dumbing it down" for the QB. This is why you see so few "spread Qb's" make it in the NFL where all of that responsibility gets put on the QB. 

Actually it takes a lot more reading of the defense and adjustments at the line of the play calling...

I think Aaron Rodgers, Marcus Mariota, Jared Goff and many others would argue the spread QB's not making it in the NFL point

[Bison06]

2 minutes ago, RavenousUte said:

Actually it takes a lot more reading of the defense and adjustments at the line of the play calling...

I think Aaron Rodgers, Marcus Mariota, Jared Goff and many others would argue the spread QB's not making it in the NFL point

Of course there are some that can make the transition, but the fact that there are so few college spread offense QB's that you can find with Goff being a huge question mark at this point shows that they are the "exception that proves the rule".

Watch the NFL draft and analysts talk about QBs and they always put a negative mark next to spread offense QB's as "let's see if they are able to call plays in the huddle and make the necessary reads themselves without the OC doing it for them from the sideline"

 

 

[Bison06]

15 minutes ago, RavenousUte said:

Actually it takes a lot more reading of the defense and adjustments at the line of the play calling...

I think Aaron Rodgers, Marcus Mariota, Jared Goff and many others would argue the spread QB's not making it in the NFL point

https://amp.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000472366/article/bruce-arians-criticizes-colleges-spread-offenses?networkId=4595&site=.news&zone=story&zoneUrl=url%3Dstory&zoneKeys=s1%3Dstory&env=&pageKeyValues=prtnr%3Daround-the-league%3Bteam%3Darz%3Bconf%3Dnfc%3Bdvsn%3Dncw%3Bplyr%3Dcolin_kaepernick&p.ct=Around the NFL&p.adsm=false&p.tcm=%23fff&p.bgc1m=%230964bf&p.bgc2m=%23053a74&sr=amp

Don't take my word for it.

Sorry for the long link.

[geaux_sioux]

19 minutes ago, RavenousUte said:

Actually it takes a lot more reading of the defense and adjustments at the line of the play calling...

I think Aaron Rodgers, Marcus Mariota, Jared Goff and many others would argue the spread QB's not making it in the NFL point

I wouldn't drop Goff's name at this point. The dude just learned which direction the sun rises in.