Coach Jones?

[darell1976]

Not a Jones fan, but... He is one of, if not the lowest paid DI bb coaches. He has to recruit to a team that plays third fiddle, not only to football, but to hockey during the same time of year. In your own statement, you acknowledge that UND was close to the dance last year and that WSU is very tough. Jones has an extremely difficult task. Would like to see better results, however, not sure even Ben Jacobson could do any better. Understand your frustration/impatience Darrell, but fo what he has to work with, can't see the UND administration firing Jones at this point.

There are two things I think of when salary is mentioned, first is he worth a raise, and second what kind of a coach can we get if there was more money pumped in, and to that thought is why haven't Faison pumped in more money I know we aren't a basketball school but we aren't a DII school either. I hope since he noticed football needed more money maybe he can open up the checkbook on basketball.

I am frustrated because I care about this school and playing well and getting to the top. I am sorry if I have pissed off a lot of people it's the type now think later and blame everyone instinct. I do hope for good for Jones and his team, I never ever cheer against UND in any sport. So let's all cheer this team to victory and maybe the young guys can mature as the season continues. Again I apologize to everyone and no hard feelings.

[bincitysioux]

I continue to have mixed feelings about Jones.  On one hand, he seems like a pretty darn good recruiter.  He seems to always have his team playing its best basketball at the end of the season, and that is so important.  His teams have been doing that for a long time.  To step into the Big Sky Conference and be one of the top 3 teams in their first two seasons is impressive.  I'm in the camp that the teams he had that were built around Huff, Anderson, and Webb were some of the most talented UND has had in years and years.  The amount of injuries that the team dealt with the past 4 years was borderline ridiculous. 

 

On the other hand, the Jeckyl & Hyde nature of his teams is tough to watch at times.  The second half collapses that have been going on for years are frustrating.  Makes me wonder if he is A) capable of making halftime adjustments, and B) capable of keeping his team motivated.  I've never really seen any sort of offensive philosophy from his teams.  It seems the strategy is far to often to go out there, hand the ball to our most athletic player and hope for the best.  The lack of fundamental displayed by his teams at times is down right irritating.

 

It seems as though Jones always does enough to keep his seat from getting too warm.  I'm guessing if he would have won a few CIT games and gotten into the NCAA's one of the last two years, this thread would not exist.  It seems like he is alway one or two wins from being revered, and one or two losses from being despised. 

 

I do know one thing, and that is that I don't like the idea that some feel simply making the Big Sky tournament would be exceeding expectations.  Sure, as far as preseason polls go, but my expectations are a lot higher than that for Sioux Basketball, and everyone elses should be too. 

[fightingsioux4life]

I continue to have mixed feelings about Jones.  On one hand, he seems like a pretty darn good recruiter.  He seems to always have his team playing its best basketball at the end of the season, and that is so important.  His teams have been doing that for a long time.  To step into the Big Sky Conference and be one of the top 3 teams in their first two seasons is impressive.  I'm in the camp that the teams he had that were built around Huff, Anderson, and Webb were some of the most talented UND has had in years and years.  The amount of injuries that the team dealt with the past 4 years was borderline ridiculous. 

 

On the other hand, the Jeckyl & Hyde nature of his teams is tough to watch at times.  The second half collapses that have been going on for years are frustrating.  Makes me wonder if he is A) capable of making halftime adjustments, and B) capable of keeping his team motivated.  I've never really seen any sort of offensive philosophy from his teams.  It seems the strategy is far to often to go out there, hand the ball to our most athletic player and hope for the best.  The lack of fundamental displayed by his teams at times is down right irritating.

 

It seems as though Jones always does enough to keep his seat from getting too warm.  I'm guessing if he would have won a few CIT games and gotten into the NCAA's one of the last two years, this thread would not exist.  It seems like he is alway one or two wins from being revered, and one or two losses from being despised. 

 

I do know one thing, and that is that I don't like the idea that some feel simply making the Big Sky tournament would be exceeding expectations.  Sure, as far as preseason polls go, but my expectations are a lot higher than that for Sioux Basketball, and everyone elses should be too. 

The expectations for MBB should be the same as they are for WBB.  Brewster and his staff are setting a good example of what is not only possible, but probable as a mid-major basketball program.  I for one do not want to exist as a bargain basement, run-of-the-mill school that has the Division I name and not much else.  FB is now on the right track with Bubba and WBB is on the right track with Brewster.  Now it's time for MBB to get on the right track.  Whether Jones is the man to take us there has not been determined.

[darell1976]

I continue to have mixed feelings about Jones. On one hand, he seems like a pretty darn good recruiter. He seems to always have his team playing its best basketball at the end of the season, and that is so important. His teams have been doing that for a long time. To step into the Big Sky Conference and be one of the top 3 teams in their first two seasons is impressive. I'm in the camp that the teams he had that were built around Huff, Anderson, and Webb were some of the most talented UND has had in years and years. The amount of injuries that the team dealt with the past 4 years was borderline ridiculous.

On the other hand, the Jeckyl & Hyde nature of his teams is tough to watch at times. The second half collapses that have been going on for years are frustrating. Makes me wonder if he is A) capable of making halftime adjustments, and B) capable of keeping his team motivated. I've never really seen any sort of offensive philosophy from his teams. It seems the strategy is far to often to go out there, hand the ball to our most athletic player and hope for the best. The lack of fundamental displayed by his teams at times is down right irritating.

It seems as though Jones always does enough to keep his seat from getting too warm. I'm guessing if he would have won a few CIT games and gotten into the NCAA's one of the last two years, this thread would not exist. It seems like he is alway one or two wins from being revered, and one or two losses from being despised.

I do know one thing, and that is that I don't like the idea that some feel simply making the Big Sky tournament would be exceeding expectations. Sure, as far as preseason polls go, but my expectations are a lot higher than that for Sioux Basketball, and everyone elses should be too.

Good points. Seems like the injury bug hits more often like the football team is there a problem with strength and conditioning? The dance is the ultimate goal at least getting in the playoffs gives us a shot at the dance so there is a limit of excitement of getting into the tournament. Just seems like we run into a hotter team in the playoffs (just like hockey). Beating Weber would be our super bowl just get past them and you see the dance!!

[the green team]

Where are is all this money suppose to come from Darrell? From what I understand, Athletics already runs a budget deficit and basketball over the years has been asked to take on its fair share of money games...which one hopes to win, but more likely than not is a mismatch. I think if UND Athletics had more money, maybe Men's basketball might be able to afford to bring in a team for a change instead of going on the road all the time. I don't think it's Faison not giving money, when reality is probably closer to he probably doesn't have a lot to give considering budget constraints. Whenever we lose a nonconference road game, I try to think how a 6 foot 8 players body must feel after sitting in coach for a 3 hour plane ride. I know how mine feels even after 2,3 days and I'm 6 foot. It's not like this team flies charter like the big shool teams or hockey or womens hockey for that matter. Also, if you look at our road record in our first 2 years in the Big Sky you'll see our team has done pretty welll on the road in conference games as oppossed to our conference brethern. In my humble opinion, how we do on the road in conference play matters far more than non-conference.

[UND92,96]

There is talent in the program, and it's getting better. Hooker had something like a dozen dI offers. Crandall may have been a steal (although we haven't actually seen him play against college competition yet). Shanks was highly sought-after. Cashman and Shields should be pretty good with added strength and weight. And the group coming in next year looks very good on paper. So all the talk about salaries, facilities, location, weather, etc. being such huge challenges is somewhat overblown IMO. It may not be particularly easy to recruit talent to North Dakota, but clearly it can be done.

 

I had previously thought that anything less than about 12 wins this year would be unacceptable, but I'm going to back off a little on that considering most of the best young talent won't even be on the court until next season. Next season will be important, though. I think it will be pretty clear after 2015-16 whether the program is headed in the right direction or not. 

[the green team]

I continue to have mixed feelings about Jones.  On one hand, he seems like a pretty darn good recruiter.  He seems to always have his team playing its best basketball at the end of the season, and that is so important.  His teams have been doing that for a long time.  To step into the Big Sky Conference and be one of the top 3 teams in their first two seasons is impressive.  I'm in the camp that the teams he had that were built around Huff, Anderson, and Webb were some of the most talented UND has had in years and years.  The amount of injuries that the team dealt with the past 4 years was borderline ridiculous. 

 

On the other hand, the Jeckyl & Hyde nature of his teams is tough to watch at times.  The second half collapses that have been going on for years are frustrating.  Makes me wonder if he is A) capable of making halftime adjustments, and B) capable of keeping his team motivated.  I've never really seen any sort of offensive philosophy from his teams.  It seems the strategy is far to often to go out there, hand the ball to our most athletic player and hope for the best.  The lack of fundamental displayed by his teams at times is down right irritating.

 

It seems as though Jones always does enough to keep his seat from getting too warm.  I'm guessing if he would have won a few CIT games and gotten into the NCAA's one of the last two years, this thread would not exist.  It seems like he is alway one or two wins from being revered, and one or two losses from being despised. 

 

I do know one thing, and that is that I don't like the idea that some feel simply making the Big Sky tournament would be exceeding expectations.  Sure, as far as preseason polls go, but my expectations are a lot higher than that for Sioux Basketball, and everyone elses should be too.

This

[darell1976]

Where are is all this money suppose to come from Darrell? From what I understand, Athletics already runs a budget deficit and basketball over the years has been asked to take on its fair share of money games...which one hopes to win, but more likely than not is a mismatch. I think if UND Athletics had more money, maybe Men's basketball might be able to afford to bring in a team for a change instead of going on the road all the time. I don't think it's Faison not giving money, when reality is probably closer to he probably doesn't have a lot to give considering budget constraints. Whenever we lose a nonconference road game, I try to think how a 6 foot 8 players body must feel after sitting in coach for a 3 hour plane ride. I know how mine feels even after 2,3 days and I'm 6 foot. It's not like this team flies charter like the big shool teams or hockey or womens hockey for that matter. Also, if you look at our road record in our first 2 years in the Big Sky you'll see our team has done pretty welll on the road in conference games as oppossed to our conference brethern. In my humble opinion, how we do on the road in conference play matters far more than non-conference.

He found football more money maybe he needs to find basketball some more money too. Maybe drop baseball, just a thought.

[fightingsioux4life]

Where are is all this money suppose to come from Darrell? From what I understand, Athletics already runs a budget deficit and basketball over the years has been asked to take on its fair share of money games...which one hopes to win, but more likely than not is a mismatch. I think if UND Athletics had more money, maybe Men's basketball might be able to afford to bring in a team for a change instead of going on the road all the time. I don't think it's Faison not giving money, when reality is probably closer to he probably doesn't have a lot to give considering budget constraints. Whenever we lose a nonconference road game, I try to think how a 6 foot 8 players body must feel after sitting in coach for a 3 hour plane ride. I know how mine feels even after 2,3 days and I'm 6 foot. It's not like this team flies charter like the big shool teams or hockey or womens hockey for that matter. Also, if you look at our road record in our first 2 years in the Big Sky you'll see our team has done pretty welll on the road in conference games as oppossed to our conference brethern. In my humble opinion, how we do on the road in conference play matters far more than non-conference.

This goes back to a point I have made over and over again (and will continue to make no matter how much I get attacked for making it): If we can't afford to fund a competitive mid-major D-I product in MBB, WBB and VB and a competitive FCS FB program, we should not have moved up in the first place.  We have a cash cow in REA, which sells out every game when the students aren't gone.  The FB revenue situation should improve as the team improves.  And we are getting a nice payout from Midco to televise our games.  Also, I believe we get a check from the proceeds of the D-I Hockey and Basketball tournaments as a D-I school.  Those are some pretty good revenue streams.  I realize that D-I athletics is way more expensive than D-II, but that is what we signed up for when we moved up.  We must find a way to compete or the move up was a waste of time and resources.  I don't mind losing coaches to upper-level D-I schools (it has happened to NDSU).  What I don't want is to lose coaches to other mid-major schools that offer more money and/or benefits.  That would be a major red flag for all of us.

[fightingsioux4life]

He found football more money maybe he needs to find basketball some more money too. Maybe drop baseball, just a thought.

How much does baseball even cost?  I would think it is one of our cheaper programs.

[the green team]

This goes back to a point I have made over and over again (and will continue to make no matter how much I get attacked for making it): If we can't afford to fund a competitive mid-major D-I product in MBB, WBB and VB and a competitive FCS FB program, we should not have moved up in the first place.  We have a cash cow in REA, which sells out every game when the students aren't gone.  The FB revenue situation should improve as the team improves.  And we are getting a nice payout from Midco to televise our games.  Also, I believe we get a check from the proceeds of the D-I Hockey and Basketball tournaments as a D-I school.  Those are some pretty good revenue streams.  I realize that D-I athletics is way more expensive than D-II, but that is what we signed up for when we moved up.  We must find a way to compete or the move up was a waste of time and resources.  I don't mind losing coaches to upper-level D-I schools (it has happened to NDSU).  What I don't want is to lose coaches to other mid-major schools that offer more money and/or benefits.  That would be a major red flag for all of us.

I very much agree with what you say.  Unfortunately, I have a sneaking suspicion that with some supporters out there, that's all they are is words. When in reality we probably all have to dig into our pockets a little bit more and continue to give financial help to fund athletics to the level we believe it needs to be at.  You are absolutely right, if we can't afford it, we should not have moved in the first place.  I haven't seen any new sponsors in The Betty since it's been built, why?  If there is limited availability in The Ralph to advertise because it's sold out, a person would think where much more growth could be is with the basketballs, and volleyball at The Betty.   And yet, at the same time I haven't seen much additional revenue being generated over there...but that gets us going around in a circle again as there is no video boards, no LED scorers table etc... if I'm a potential sponsor, what can they offer me...other than have a person walk around with a sign of my business.   The PA isn't great there.  If they want to generate more revenue, I would think they would have to address the advertising infrastructure of The Betty.

 

Regarding baseball, I'm sure it's not cheap to be on the road for the first 30 days every season 20 plus players, coaches, hotels, food transportation.  I'm sure it adds up, with the early season schedule.

[darell1976]

I very much agree with what you say. Unfortunately, I have a sneaking suspicion that with some supporters out there, that's all they are is words. When in reality we probably all have to dig into our pockets a little bit more and continue to give financial help to fund athletics to the level we believe it needs to be at. You are absolutely right, if we can't afford it, we should not have moved in the first place. I haven't seen any new sponsors in The Betty since it's been built, why? If there is limited availability in The Ralph to advertise because it's sold out, a person would think where much more growth could be is with the basketballs, and volleyball at The Betty. And yet, at the same time I haven't seen much additional revenue being generated over there...but that gets us going around in a circle again as there is no video boards, no LED scorers table etc... if I'm a potential sponsor, what can they offer me...other than have a person walk around with a sign of my business. The PA isn't great there. If they want to generate more revenue, I would think they would have to address the advertising infrastructure of The Betty.

Regarding baseball, I'm sure it's not cheap to be on the road for the first 30 days every season 20 plus players, coaches, hotels, food transportation. I'm sure it adds up, with the early season schedule.

First, good point about sponsors at the Betty, where do you advertise besides consessions and maybe in the newspaper, a video board would help greatly. Second the baseball example you have would easily be an excuse to drop it. When you start on the road for 20+ games it's like what's the point of the sport.

[sioux2013]

I continue to have mixed feelings about Jones.  On one hand, he seems like a pretty darn good recruiter.  He seems to always have his team playing its best basketball at the end of the season, and that is so important.  His teams have been doing that for a long time.  To step into the Big Sky Conference and be one of the top 3 teams in their first two seasons is impressive.  I'm in the camp that the teams he had that were built around Huff, Anderson, and Webb were some of the most talented UND has had in years and years.  The amount of injuries that the team dealt with the past 4 years was borderline ridiculous. 

 

On the other hand, the Jeckyl & Hyde nature of his teams is tough to watch at times.  The second half collapses that have been going on for years are frustrating.  Makes me wonder if he is A) capable of making halftime adjustments, and B) capable of keeping his team motivated.  I've never really seen any sort of offensive philosophy from his teams.  It seems the strategy is far to often to go out there, hand the ball to our most athletic player and hope for the best.  The lack of fundamental displayed by his teams at times is down right irritating.

 

It seems as though Jones always does enough to keep his seat from getting too warm.  I'm guessing if he would have won a few CIT games and gotten into the NCAA's one of the last two years, this thread would not exist.  It seems like he is alway one or two wins from being revered, and one or two losses from being despised. 

 

I do know one thing, and that is that I don't like the idea that some feel simply making the Big Sky tournament would be exceeding expectations.  Sure, as far as preseason polls go, but my expectations are a lot higher than that for Sioux Basketball, and everyone elses should be too. 

I have to agree with this.  Jones has done a great job of recruiting players to this frozen land and based on this past class of Huff, Anderson, Webb, Schuler and Brekke  they have accomplished a great deal with players that were not highly recruited.  They were stuck in the Great West for their first 2 years and all they did was win 2 conference championships and then in the Big Sky they finished third and second in there only years for the regular season and lost in the semi's by 2 points to Weber in their first year and then in the finals their final year with 3 of these 5 players injured and not playing.  Even though there are times I get very upset at the way the team is playing the end results are very impressive for a program that is still early in its D1 basketball program.  We are never going to be a Wisconsin or Minnesota but if we can be at the front of the Big Sky each year and compete with the Montana's and Weber's then this program will be a success.  I like the recruits he has this year and next and believe they will continue to get better as we become more established in the Big Sky.  Guys this is only our third year and yet we have finished in front of the perennial power Montana in the regular season and tournament last year.  The Big Sky is all that matters as we will continue to get beat up year after year in our non conference schedule due to who we are playing and where.  

[UND92,96]

I have to agree with this.  Jones has done a great job of recruiting players to this frozen land and based on this past class of Huff, Anderson, Webb, Schuler and Brekke  they have accomplished a great deal with players that were not highly recruited.  They were stuck in the Great West for their first 2 years and all they did was win 2 conference championships and then in the Big Sky they finished third and second in there only years for the regular season and lost in the semi's by 2 points to Weber in their first year and then in the finals their final year with 3 of these 5 players injured and not playing.  Even though there are times I get very upset at the way the team is playing the end results are very impressive for a program that is still early in its D1 basketball program.  We are never going to be a Wisconsin or Minnesota but if we can be at the front of the Big Sky each year and compete with the Montana's and Weber's then this program will be a success.  I like the recruits he has this year and next and believe they will continue to get better as we become more established in the Big Sky.  Guys this is only our third year and yet we have finished in front of the perennial power Montana in the regular season and tournament last year.  The Big Sky is all that matters as we will continue to get beat up year after year in our non conference schedule due to who we are playing and where.  

 

I have to disagree with you a bit on the bolded statement. A conference's RPI is a big deal in terms of where the conference champion is seeded in the NCAA tournament. The difference in money a conference gets with a win vs. a one-and-done appearance is substantial, and obviously you have a much better chance to get a win as a 13 or 14 seed compared to a 16. If we aspire to be one of the best programs in the Big Sky, we need to pull our own weight to help the conference's RPI, and not expect others to do it for us. Wins against an Indiana, like EWU pulled off, are pretty rare. But we can certainly do a better job of getting road wins against teams from the Summit, for example. I believe UND is 1-11 on the road against Summit teams under Jones, having lost the last 11 in a row.

[hoopster]

Jones said he has to play a ton of road games to fund team trip to Italy next summer....shoestring budget program

[bincitysioux]

I agree with UND92,96.  I don't think it does anybody any good to say the Big Sky season/tournament is all that matters.  UND is a program that should be competitive during the OOC season as well.  It is important to  build that RPI, not only for tournament seeding, but the higher your RPI, the better money games you get as well.  I am not saying I expected to beat Utah the other night, but I certainly didn't expect to get run out of the gym by Texas-PanAm.  This upcoming weekend is a great example of a game where we SHOULD have a chance to get a road win against lower level Missouri Valley team.  Drake is not head and shoulders above our program, but Jones' history in road games means that if we did come out with a victory, it would be a monumental upset, and it should not be. 

[nodak651]

Jones said he has to play a ton of road games to fund team trip to Italy next summer....shoestring budget program

Sounds like they shouldn't go to Italy...

 

And it's absolutely ridiculous that we don't schedule USD instead of D2's.

[bincitysioux]

Sounds like they shouldn't go to Italy...

 

And it's absolutely ridiculous that we don't schedule USD instead of D2's.

I would like to see USD back on the schedule as well.  But I highly doubt they are choosing DII's over USD.  I would guess it just hasn't worked out yet.  It would be ideal IMO to have USD & SDSU at home on the years that we play NDSU in Fargo. 

[UND1983]

Jones said he has to play a ton of road games to fund team trip to Italy next summer....shoestring budget program

 

So that means its OK to lose them all, right?  UT Pan American sucks at basketball and UND got blasted.  

 

5 wins in 53 tries is a problem, especially when not every game is vs. a better team.  

[hoopster]

So that means its OK to lose them all, right?  UT Pan American sucks at basketball and UND got blasted.  

 

5 wins in 53 tries is a problem, especially when not every game is vs. a better team.  

UND top half of conference RPI last 4 years..which is good!...  What Big Sky Teams should UND be better than year in and out.  There are 11 other Big Sky teams ..go through each of the other 11 teams and objectively explain the pros and cons of each program and explain why UND should be better than all or most of the other teams on a year in year out basis.

[UND1983]

UND top half of conference RPI last 4 years..which is good!... What Big Sky Teams should UND be better than year in and out. There are 11 other Big Sky teams ..go through each of the other 11 teams and objectively explain the pros and cons of each program and explain why UND should be better than all or most of the other teams on a year in year out basis.

You didn't address anything I said, just rambling about the Big Sky. Why can't they not win on the road? EWash seemed to be able to struggle through flying in coach all the way to Indiana and win. Can't believe they were able to play well after that long flight.

[nodakhoops]

First - everyone needs to take a chill pill on Jones. We are 6 games into a season with a young roster still learning to play together. Enjoy the process of watching a young team come together. Yes Texas Pan Am was bad and so was the 2nd half at Utah but this is a long season. So far other than that I have been impressed with this team considering the scoring we lost.

Second - if you expect 20 wins and NCAA or NIT every year you need to either donate more to the program or attend more games because we need more support for those things to happen more frequently. i encourage you to try that before checking box scores and calling for people's jobs. If you aren't part of the solution (support) you are part of the problem (calling for coaches jobs after a bad loss without attending any games or supporting the program). That does no good for a team 6 games into the season. If you attend games and support the program and are calling for peoples jobs i would ask how you think that helps this team get better?

I am not calling anyone out that is just my opinion.

Third- Does women's hockey seriously fly charter? I hope this is a joke.

[Sampson]

Some of you guys are as bad as the Bison board. I keep reading posts on "He keeps losing to teams he should beat". What makes you guys think he should beat a lot of those teams? The Big Sky is one of the worst basketball conferences in D1. It's probably linked i with the Summit and a couple others on that 4/5 tier out of 5/6 tiers to estimate. The Bison board is just as bad. I don't get it. IMHO you overestimate the ability of your team just the same as Bison fans. The Bison have had 1 team that was legitimate on a National level (last year), and another team like 6years ago with a couple quality wins and that's it. Both the Big Sky and the Summit are 1 bid conferences, and will never be anything more. In the landscape of college basketball, both are at the bottom of the totem pole.

[Oxbow6]

Sounds like they shouldn't go to Italy...

This...^^^^^^^!

Plus they can get quality Italian food right in GF at the Moon!

[the green team]

This..^^^^^^^!

Plus they can get quality Italian food right in GF at the Moon!

Disagree. 1. It provides a great educational opportunity for young people. 2. The opportunity to begin practicing early as a team which is allowed by the NCAA can be an invaluable headstart to a season. Just ask the women's team how their trip worked out for them last year and if they thought it was worth it? Sure they didn't go to Italy, they went to Canada- but Women's Bball doesn't play for the kind of pay days that the men play for. In my mind bigger paydays= bigger trip. I think the most they can ever do this is once ever 4 years, and it's no guarantee that they will do it that frequently.