Change the name gaining support

February 20, 2012

Jeff Panzer, Dean Blaise Jay Panzer Dave Lennon, Luke S. What do they all have in common? They all are people I looked up to; however, they are all gone. People may play the game, but it is the name that has been here for a very long time. Ask anyone who watches sioux sports even those who don't and they can tell you who the Sioux are. Ask them who played for the sioux 8 years before and who scored to win games. No one will remember. Why should they. Fan go because they are a community built by the tradition. Tradition- A way of life supporting one another and knowing a face just by seeing the mascot. Tradition has nothing to do with how teams do.

I have sioux posters and news papers from sioux games wins and losses from  the last 12-16 years. Not just sioux chapion newspapers. When you say alum mean more it is hard to amagion. Just because people went to a school does't make it who they are. Many people go for a degree. Not because it is all they have known. I stayed awake many nights lissoning to games on the radio, because my parents could not afford to buy tickets to games. In yet I I was the one that talked none stop about the sioux. I still do. In an interview for a National scholarship  I said the University of North Dakota had been what/ who I looked up to. No not a person, but a university. The people who worked together throught the 97 flood and all the blizzerds.

So is a person who plays four years more3 important then a group of people who work to egther. Dean Robuck and Dean Blaise were Sioux citizens for long periods of times. They and the people of North Dakota represent the university; not the students or even past students. Jeff Panzer is and will always have a influence on my life; however, nothing can top seeing sioux gerseys at a Wyoming cowboy football game when they are playing Coldorado state or even UNLV.

So for those who want to ask What good a the Sioux without sports; I say memories, and a way of life. Don't worry there are people who love the Sioux more then because of sports. There has been great leaders that have done great things above sports. It is not a name; but a way of life. Sports are just sports.

homer · February 20, 2012

Jeff Panzer, Dean Blaise Jay Panzer Dave Lennon, Luke S. What do they all have in common? They all are people I looked up to; however, they are all gone. People may play the game, but it is the name that has been here for a very long time. Ask anyone who watches sioux sports even those who don't and they can tell you who the Sioux are. Ask them who played for the sioux 8 years before and who scored to win games. No one will remember. Why should they. Fan go because they are a community built by the tradition. Tradition- A way of life supporting one another and knowing a face just by seeing the mascot. Tradition has nothing to do with how teams do.

Its Dale Lennon and if Luke S stands for Luke Schleusner he's still at UND. You may want to follow more closely.

February 20, 2012

Sorry Dale. Just wondering Did you beg your parents at 6 to See Dale get his face redone after the big Championship game. Did you go to the airport to met the team after every away game. Again people do not mater as much as the ideas they hold. Do you really think Luke Schleusner came back to the college because he knew players on the current team. Not he came back because of the tradition. Tradition believe it or not does die withevery change.

February 20, 2012

How many of you know players before they arrive at North Dakota. It is because they come here that you care. When you see a Sioux jersey do you see your face light up? I am in my first year of college and even know when I see people with sioux jersys on I say " Hey You are one of us. " I am very shy and have a small self asteem because of being bullied after moving to Wyoming when I was growing up. when I started to got to an away game each year( not in hockey) I would feel at ease and save. Not because I knew the people, but because I knew from a peaceful childhood in GrandForks it was safe.

Again Is sportas that important or is the name that people like I see as family matter more.

February 20, 2012

_{I would agree that the Sioux would need to go if I knew I could have the tradition of rival games like NDSU, SOUTH DAKOTA AND MINN. again. For those who say it is the name that is stopping the rivals think again. The Sioux are just renewing the rival after how many years of having none. Name problem? I loved the Potato Bowl celerbration. How many alum were in Grand Forks for the bond fires where the engalsted is right now. Sorry to be making a big fuss about this, but if you are all going to say things like alum have more right, rivals will die, or it is just not worth the fight think again.}

February 20, 2012

By the way. I recall four children cheering on the track for all t5he games for a few years before the Program raised prices for kids club and regular tickes. I was one of them. In the rain snow wind ; it did not mater. Did I know the players names no. I know the picture on the jursey and I was prode of it. Only other person I could say the same about is Sioux spirit man(What I called him when I was little)

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82SiouxGuy · February 20, 2012

Sorry Dale. Just wondering Did you beg your parents at 6 to See Dale get his face redone after the big Championship game. Did you go to the airport to met the team after every away game. Again people do not mater as much as the ideas they hold. Do you really think Luke Schleusner came back to the college because he knew players on the current team. Not he came back because of the tradition. Tradition believe it or not does die withevery change.

No, I didn't beg my parents to go see Dale get his mustache cut off. I went to school with him at UND. I have been a fan of UND sports more than twice as long as you've been alive. You keep saying that sports don't matter, but the only reason you are interested in the nickname is because of sports. If UND didn't have football and basketball and hockey they wouldn't have the nickname. And you wouldn't love the nickname. You say that winning doesn't matter. The tradition of UND athletics involves winning. If it weren't for winning and success there wouldn't be the same interest in the program or the name.

You mention Dale Lennonn as someone that you look up to. Maybe you should listen to what he has to say. This is from a story in yesterday's Grand Forks Herald about a letter to the editor he sent in.

In a letter to the Herald, Lennon writes that he has first-hand evidence that the ongoing controversy “is hurting (UND’s) athletic programs in recruiting,” and that “any future NCAA sanctions could be disastrous to the completion of the Division I transition.”

Lennon also warned of the consequences of UND losing its conference affiliation and ability to schedule traditional rivals.

“I’m at a point where my understanding of this situation is extremely clear,” he writes. “If the name is kept, the future success of athletic programs at UND will be limited due to the NCAA sanctions. If conference affiliation is lost, the survival of the athletic department at the Division I level will be in jeopardy.”

He said a lot more. Coach Mussman said similar things in another letter to the newspaper. So did a bunch of UND Hall of Fame football players in yet another letter. Coach Hakstol said the same thing in his news conference on Wednesday. These are all people that have a much deeper connection to the Athletic Department, the teams and the nickname and logo than you do. Maybe you should listen to what they are saying.

By the way, it's also Dean Blais and Gene Roebuck.

February 20, 2012

Ok so you keep talking about how names are wrong and how leaders have said things are already changing. Just wondering how many of you would cheer for a new team because a playermoves on or because a coach switches teams.? I for one stay with the sioux. Funny thing is all I do is speak about the Sioux. People like Gene Roebuck are who I want to hear the ideas from. None not even alum. should have a say unless they have been following not only the sprots teams for many yeARS, BUT THE COLLEGE IT SELF AS WELL. In reality it should be the Native who get the choice and they have not gotton to speak if you remeber.

February 20, 2012

If all you can do is say I typed names wrong so my ideas are wrong then you have no reason to speak. This is about the college not a player or cooaches name.

February 20, 2012

Get Jeff Panzer and Dean to come back and speak to me on the sioux chat during games and I will think harder about the idea. I love those to and they have proven by their actions how loyal they are. By the way what ever happon to the " Home of the Sioux" I pretty sure most of you if not all have seen the sioux at the Ralph. What made you all call Sioux for if it is races. By the way did you all know that race only makes up 6% of our genes. We are alot closer then yopu may thing to the natives.

Hayduke · February 20, 2012

I grew up in Grand Forks loving the Fighting Sioux and enjoying their success. I am an alumnus of UND. I have more Fighting Sioux gear than I probably should. It's the best nickname in all of sports and easily the best logo. The logo means even more to me since I got to know how great of a guy Mr. Brine is from being in some of his art classes. I am also a very stubborn Norwegian/Swed that would love to keep everything to spite the NCAA. That being said we need to move on. There would be nothing more selfish for us to do than to bring about the death of UND athletics just so we can have a nickname and to keep dragging this nickname, which represents more than just the school, through the mud while in the process making the whole state look ignorant and short-sighted. We need to move on because what good is a nickname and logo if you have no sports teams worth cheering for.

Very good post. A kindred spirit. I have seven hockey jerseys, two football jerseys, a baseball jersey (which is oddy my favorite), six hoodies, four sweatshirts, about 25 t-shirts, 19 hats, two flags for my patio, two car flags, numerous posters, numerous pins, sioux hockey player christmas ornaments, a jacket, a rain jacket, three winter caps, etc...

I'll still wear what I can at games. But, it is time to move on. Drop the name. Satisfy the NC$$. Satisfy the BSC. Satisfy the scheduling needs of the hockey program. Help recruiting. A name is not worth it.

82SiouxGuy · February 20, 2012

Very good post. A kindred spirit. I have seven hockey jerseys, two football jerseys, a baseball jersey (which is oddy my favorite), six hoodies, four sweatshirts, about 25 t-shirts, 19 hats, two flags for my patio, two car flags, numerous posters, numerous pins, sioux hockey player christmas ornaments, a jacket, a rain jacket, three winter caps, etc...

I'll still wear what I can at games. But, it is time to move on. Drop the name. Satisfy the NC$$. Satisfy the BSC. Satisfy the scheduling needs of the hockey program. Help recruiting. A name is not worth it.

I'm impressed. You've got more stuff than me. I always wanted a baseball jersey but the only ones I saw were in kids sizes.

But on your main point, both you and geaux_sioux stated it very well. It is time to move on to the next chapter of this story.

February 20, 2012

I will continue to commit to the the spirit of North Dakota. We are all fans. It is shown in the things being said. I agree it is time to move forward; however, for a different reason then sports. Are we all more concerned about sports then the feelings of the native tribes. When it was just their feelings everyone said no. Now everyone says yes because of the sports issue. Come on I know North Dakota people are Smarter then that. I say change the name if we need, but dio it for the right reasons. WE ARE NORTH DAKOTA.

Just wondering where did all the signings on the pats. come from? Everyone seems to think the time is now. Why all the agreement for change now. Don't say sports. Give me something better then that.

geaux_sioux · February 20, 2012

I will continue to commit to the the spirit of North Dakota. We are all fans. It is shown in the things being said. I agree it is time to move forward; however, for a different reason then sports. Are we all more concerned about sports then the feelings of the native tribes. When it was just their feelings everyone said no. Now everyone says yes because of the sports issue. Come on I know North Dakota people are Smarter then that. I say change the name if we need, but dio it for the right reasons. WE ARE NORTH DAKOTA.

Just wondering where did all the signings on the pats. come from? Everyone seems to think the time is now. Why all the agreement for change now. Don't say sports. Give me something better then that.

It's because of sports

82SiouxGuy · February 20, 2012

I will continue to commit to the the spirit of North Dakota. We are all fans. It is shown in the things being said. I agree it is time to move forward; however, for a different reason then sports. Are we all more concerned about sports then the feelings of the native tribes. When it was just their feelings everyone said no. Now everyone says yes because of the sports issue. Come on I know North Dakota people are Smarter then that. I say change the name if we need, but dio it for the right reasons. WE ARE NORTH DAKOTA.

Just wondering where did all the signings on the pats. come from? Everyone seems to think the time is now. Why all the agreement for change now. Don't say sports. Give me something better then that.

Many of the petitions were signed by people that don't realize the damage that will be done to the University, including some that thought it was just a show of support for the name.. Many were signed by people that believed others who said that it wouldn't damage the University. Some were signed by NDSU fans because they hoped that it would damage UND.

Yes there are Native Americans that support the use of the nickname. Some of them are very passionate. There are others that don't support it. And probably a lot who don't think it affects them much either way. The problem is that UND needed that support back in 2005 and 2006 when the issue first became important to the NCAA. If one tribe had stepped forward at that time we wouldn't have the problem right now. No one did. So UND sued the NCAA. They settled the lawsuit, and the terms included giving UND 3 extra years to find support, but they had to get both Spirit Lake and Standing Rock to support them. Spirit Lake agreed in 2009. Standing Rock has been against the nickname since at least 1992. Every other tribe in the region is against UND using the nickname. You want the NA to speak, that's what they have said. That is why UND is in the position that it is. Frankly, most of us believe that preventing damage from being done to the University is the best case scenario right now.

Gma loves hockey · February 20, 2012

After seeing reports listing the UND Sioux in South Dakota and hearing other parts of the country thinking it was the Sioux playing football when NDSU was playing, what would be the chances that recruits from other parts of the country could confuse NDSU and UND? Seems to me that recruiting could harm South Dakota as well as NDSU and UND as long as the sanctions are in place. Anyone else see this as a possibility?

Hayduke · February 20, 2012

I say change the name if we need, but dio it for the right reasons. WE ARE NORTH DAKOTA.

I just know you don't see the irony here. I just know it.

:lol:

The Sicatoka · February 20, 2012

This is good 108498. Get the emotion out. It the only way you'll be able to deal with a terrible situation pragmatically.

PS - I can plainly admit I dealt with the emotional aspect in 2000. I expected the name to go back then.

Hayduke · February 20, 2012

This is good 108498. Get the emotion out. It the only way you'll be able to deal with a terrible situation pragmatically.

PS - I can plainly admit I dealt with the emotional aspect in 2000. I expected the name to go back then.

Remember, let's keep the name. Also, "WE ARE NORTH DAKOTA". But, let's keep the name. :whistling:

geaux_sioux · February 20, 2012

Get Jeff Panzer and Dean to come back and speak to me on the sioux chat during games and I will think harder about the idea. I love those to and they have proven by their actions how loyal they are. By the way what ever happon to the " Home of the Sioux" I pretty sure most of you if not all have seen the sioux at the Ralph. What made you all call Sioux for if it is races. By the way did you all know that race only makes up 6% of our genes. We are alot closer then yopu may thing to the natives.

maybe you should change your name to 'facepalm' so it gives people a heads up to what they're about to read

ScottM · February 20, 2012

maybe you should change your name to 'facepalm' so it gives people a heads up to what they're about to read

:lol:

petey23 · February 20, 2012

I see no point why a degree should make or break someone's opinion. I grow up a Sioux fan and I am llaining on trasfering to UND in a year. Why should students like myself be left out when it is the students like my who go to the away games and stand cheering all game long. For anyone who saw the UND unc game tyhis fall should know who I am by the amount of cheering I was doing. Fans like myself live and die by the sioux tradition not by who we play and how well we do.

By the way do any of you really think the university would recieve the support they have gotton without the tradition. It rises above the games and college itself. It is a national thing. The sioux is what bond kids and adualts together.

I have held off on responding to your jibberish on here because I assumed your heart was maybe in the right place and that you were either very young(9 or 10 would be my guess) or "slow"....but this post seems to indicate that you are of college age? :ohmy: :sad:

The Sicatoka · February 20, 2012

I have held off on responding to your jibberish on here because I assumed your heart was maybe in the right place and that you were either very young(9 or 10 would be my guess) or "slow"....but this post seems to indicate that you are of college age?

Age? "Slow"? I'd say it's time to turn the screw cap back onto the Mad Dog 20/20.

rochsioux · February 20, 2012

Yes there are Native Americans that support the use of the nickname. Some of them are very passionate. There are others that don't support it. And probably a lot who don't think it affects them much either way. The problem is that UND needed that support back in 2005 and 2006 when the issue first became important to the NCAA. If one tribe had stepped forward at that time we wouldn't have the problem right now. No one did. So UND sued the NCAA. They settled the lawsuit, and the terms included giving UND 3 extra years to find support, but they had to get both Spirit Lake and Standing Rock to support them. Spirit Lake agreed in 2009. Standing Rock has been against the nickname since at least 1992. Every other tribe in the region is against UND using the nickname. You want the NA to speak, that's what they have said. That is why UND is in the position that it is. Frankly, most of us believe that preventing damage from being done to the University is the best case scenario right now.

This is just not true. Please point to any document that says UND only required one tribes support prior to the lawsuit, especially Spirit Lake.

The NC$$ specifically stated that Standing Rocks lack of support was directly responsible for denying UND's appeal: http://origin-minnes...4/28/ncaavsund/

Harrison says that letter from the tribal chairman, persuaded the NCAA committee to deny UND's appeal. The announcement pleased the Standing Rock tribal chairman. Ron His Horse is Thunder says the ruling does not ban the Fighting Sioux nickname during regular season games, but does force the school to make a tough decision.

UND has always been treated differently from the schools that got exemptions. There is not one school on the exemption list that was required to get any additional approval beyond the closest namesake tribe.

Prior to the lawsuit UND had approval from Spirit Lake. The NC$$ did not want to accept the resolution that was already on the books for this. They kept badgering them for additional statements which Spirit Lake ignored because the chairman at the time was opposed to the name.

Bison Dan · February 20, 2012

YOU calling ME self-righteous? Wow, that's funny stuff. That's like the Skipper calling Gilligan fat.

Now you're dating yourself..... 108498 won't know what you're talking about.

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