New Nickname

[tnt]

  Unfortunately there are folks who want to "stick it to the man", whether it be the NCAA or for those misinformed the Sioux people.   

 

At some point, you take responsibility for your actions or IN ACTION. The NA population had a chance, they passed, now it is time for UND to do what is best for itself.  If the name is not ND, then so be it.  Am I not going to wear my fighting sioux gear because thier name changed, heck no.  It is the history of the school.  But the NA population needs to understand that if it is Cavalry, there is a history of that in ND too.  That isn't sticking it to them.  My parents have a house that is less than 1 mile from Fort Lincoln state park.  Custer lived there and Mandan is proud of that history.  If UND takes that name, great, it honors its history. 

I could never understand how the people who thought the name was hostile and abusive and created that type of atmosphere for them on campus could overlook the possibility that there would be those type of people that wanted to "stick it to the man" after their beloved nickname was gone.  You can see the blind passion that some have for the nickname could create a hostility that was more real than the perceived hostility that some attached to having the Fighting Sioux nickname.  Guess what, there are jerks and racists around, and they aren't necessarily tied to a nickname. 

[Siouxphan27]

Wrong, Frank Kania (Jamestown), John Damet (Alexander) and William T de Zychlinski(Bismarck)   get the facts before you go spewing what you think is a fact.  And these were members of the 1st volunteer cavalry, there was also the 2nd volunteer cavalry(also known as the rough riders)from wyoming which recruited many ranchers from southern ND.

 

Nice article here about all the Roughriders born and raised in North Dakota.

 

 

http://bismarcktribune.com/news/columnists/curt-eriksmoen/last-rough-rider-noted-for-inventions/article_94347e19-be6b-538f-a6d7-533a0ffd5f9e.html

[Siouxphan27]

Your argument against Teddy R and the name Rough Riders is tiresome. I don't want to repeat myself, but again it doesn't matter how many ND residents fought for the Rough Riders, it doesn't matter how long Teddy R lived in ND, and it doesn't matter the Rough Riders isn't the "official," state nickname. 

 

What matters is the name is and has been engrained in the culture and the people of this state for as long as I can remember. How that came to be doesn't matter. North Dakota residents are proud to be associated with Teddy Roosevelt and they are proud to be associated with the name Rough Riders. You can stop with all the other talk because it doesn't matter. Facts are facts, and the Rough Rider name being tied to ND and ND residents is a fact. Did you actually grow up in ND or were you a transplant that just went to school here? If so I understand, but if you actually grew up in ND I don't see how you do not know how much that name has been apart of the states culture for a very long time. As a ND resident myself, I am proud to be associated with Teddy R and the Rough Rider name and would be proud to have UND take that as a nickname.  ND people are strong, tough, hard working people, who stand up for what's right.......kind of like a group of people Teddy R led to battle back in the day. 

 

 

Again lots of great names to choose from, but Rough Riders makes the most sense by far. As GFhockey and the GOBC like to say.....ROLLLLL RIDAS

I find your arguments and constant campaigning for Roughriders tiresome as well.  However, this is a discussion board for opinions is it not?  Roughriders may be a popular saying in the western part of the state, but not in the east. 

 

As to your question, yes, I did grow up in North Dakota.   My ancestors like i'm sure many others that post here walked across Wisconsin and Minnesota 136 years ago with an ox and cart and just the clothes on their back, and homesteaded in North Dakota.   If the nickname is intended to honor anyone, why not the actual settlers that came here and carved out a life here?   But yet the lame brain committee has struck down all names like Homesteaders, Settlers, Pioneers, (yes I've heard of Denver), as well as all Scandinavian related names. 

 

So we are left with Roughriders, which honors Teddy Roosevelt and something he did in another phase of his life.  It just doesn't make any sense to me.

 

Our ancestors spent the 1870s barely surviving a trek into the unknown wild prairies of Dakota Territory.  Teddy Roosevelt spent the 1870s as a child of wealthy New Yorkers, vacationing with his family in Europe and Egypt.  He later came here on a hunting trip, loved it, and plunked $14000 down on a ranch.  He hired cowboys, and a crew to build him one of the finest homes in the area, and then galloped his way back to New York to finish his term.   I guess I don't see him as one of us.  Great President, yes.  But not a North Dakotan.      

[UND1983]

I find your arguments and constant campaigning for Roughriders tiresome as well.  However, this is a discussion board for opinions is it not?  Roughriders may be a popular saying in the western part of the state, but not in the east. 

 

As to your question, yes, I did grow up in North Dakota.   My ancestors like i'm sure many others that post here walked across Wisconsin and Minnesota 136 years ago with an ox and cart and just the clothes on their back, and homesteaded in North Dakota.   If the nickname is intended to honor anyone, why not the actual settlers that came here and carved out a life here?   But yet the lame brain committee has struck down all names like Homesteaders, Settlers, Pioneers, (yes I've heard of Denver), as well as all Scandinavian related names. 

 

So we are left with Roughriders, which honors Teddy Roosevelt and something he did in another phase of his life.  It just doesn't make any sense to me.

 

Our ancestors spent the 1870s barely surviving a trek into the unknown wild prairies of Dakota Territory.  Teddy Roosevelt spent the 1870s as a child of wealthy New Yorkers, vacationing with his family in Europe and Egypt.  He later came here on a hunting trip, loved it, and plunked $14000 down on a ranch.  He hired cowboys, and a crew to build him one of the finest homes in the area, and then galloped his way back to New York to finish his term.   I guess I don't see him as one of us.  Great President, yes.  But not a North Dakotan.      

 

Is Teddy not "Roughrider" Enough?  A new book coming soon.  

[nodakhoops]

I find your arguments and constant campaigning for Roughriders tiresome as well.  However, this is a discussion board for opinions is it not?  Roughriders may be a popular saying in the western part of the state, but not in the east. 

 

As to your question, yes, I did grow up in North Dakota.   My ancestors like i'm sure many others that post here walked across Wisconsin and Minnesota 136 years ago with an ox and cart and just the clothes on their back, and homesteaded in North Dakota.   If the nickname is intended to honor anyone, why not the actual settlers that came here and carved out a life here?   But yet the lame brain committee has struck down all names like Homesteaders, Settlers, Pioneers, (yes I've heard of Denver), as well as all Scandinavian related names. 

 

So we are left with Roughriders, which honors Teddy Roosevelt and something he did in another phase of his life.  It just doesn't make any sense to me.

 

Our ancestors spent the 1870s barely surviving a trek into the unknown wild prairies of Dakota Territory.  Teddy Roosevelt spent the 1870s as a child of wealthy New Yorkers, vacationing with his family in Europe and Egypt.  He later came here on a hunting trip, loved it, and plunked $14000 down on a ranch.  He hired cowboys, and a crew to build him one of the finest homes in the area, and then galloped his way back to New York to finish his term.   I guess I don't see him as one of us.  Great President, yes.  But not a North Dakotan.      

 

I've stated multiple times I really don't care what UND chooses, just want what is best for UND. Yes, Roughriders is my favorite and based on what i've seen and heard i'm not the only one who thinks that, but i'd be fine with lots of different names. Even if it's something I don't like I'll get to like it over time because i support UND not a nickname. 

[scpa0305]

I've stated multiple times I really don't care what UND chooses, just want what is best for UND. Yes, Roughriders is my favorite and based on what i've seen and heard i'm not the only one who thinks that, but i'd be fine with lots of different names. Even if it's something I don't like I'll get to like it over time because i support UND not a nickname. 

What's hypocritical is you spout off your personal opinions (like the rest of us I guess) however you always come back later and back off saying "I only care about UND" and "a nickname is just a nickname".  Are you just trying to stir the pot or what?  You like Roughriders, others don't.  Most like just plain North Dakota, you don't.  You say you know committee members (as do others as well); I would like to know which one's.  Sorry last post to your responses as this seems to go no where.

[nodakhoops]

What's hypocritical is you spout off your personal opinions (like the rest of us I guess) however you always come back later and back off saying "I only care about UND" and "a nickname is just a nickname".  Are you just trying to stir the pot or what?  You like Roughriders, others don't.  Most like just plain North Dakota, you don't.  You say you know committee members (as do others as well); I would like to know which one's.  Sorry last post to your responses as this seems to go no where.

 

Sorry, not trying to be hypocritical and not trying to stir the pot. I'll break it up in bullet points for you.

 

-  I honestly don't care what UND picks as I will support them either way that is why I said a nickname is just a nickname and my day isn't ruined no matter what they choose.

-  Of the nickname suggestions that are out there I honestly like Roughriders the best. I gave my opinions on why I liked that but like I've also said if it isn't chosen my day also isn't ruined. I'm fine with other names I just like that one the best. 

- I also do only care about UND in this situation and that is why I am not a fan of just North Dakota because in my opinion that is not what is best for the school long term. Having said that, if that is what's chosen I will still cheer for UND, just don't think it's the best decision for the school. 

 

 

To summarize

1. Roughriders (gave my thoughts on why)

2. Badlanders, Cavalry, North Stars, Flckertails, whatever

1000. North Dakota (Unofficially the Fighting Sioux) -gave my thoughts on why

 

I also wasn't "backing off," anything. I like Roughriders the best, I like some of the other names, and I don't like just North Dakota, but I'm being totally serious my day isn't ruined either way. No matter what I'm good, as I will still be at the Alerus, Ralph, and Betty for some games next year to cheer on UND. I just have a nickname preference much like everyone else.

 

I'll take my own advice of not caring either way and check out of this convo, because it is just a nickname. 

[Siouxphan27]

Is Teddy not "Roughrider" Enough? A new book coming soon.

No- "Roughriders" weren't North Dakota, at all. But some on here have a hard time digesting actual facts, and prefer their imagination land version of historical events.

I've heard the phrase We Are North Dakota.... But strangely enough I've never heard anyone yell We Are Teddy Roosevelt.

[Siouxphan27]

I've stated multiple times I really don't care what UND chooses, just want what is best for UND. Yes, Roughriders is my favorite and based on what i've seen and heard i'm not the only one who thinks that, but i'd be fine with lots of different names. Even if it's something I don't like I'll get to like it over time because i support UND not a nickname.

As do I- we just have vastly different opinions.

[Fetch]

Are we obsessed with not using the retired name? Massively fixated?? I thought the deal was we couldn't officially be the Sioux but there would never be any policy banning people from coming to an event in Sioux gear or exercising their free speech to say "go Sioux"? Why are you so hell bent on making sure it is eradicated? We have been removed from the "list" and a settlement was declared and followed. It's over or is there something more we must do??

..I can't wait for next year when the fans chant "Sioux Forever" in a deafening fashion and the announcers can't rationalize it based on some bogus assertion that it is being done because they are "the last ones to wear the Sioux Jersey".

The future will be bright for Sioux Fans. Come up with any nickname you want, I've quit caring about that.. it aint gonna work. Not in so much as we will still wear our Sioux gear and declare our team the Sioux..

People call themselves and call others what they want to be called. The only way to convince someone to change that is convince them that it is wrong and we all know that it was never wrong. The only thing that was/is wrong is the NCAA not minding their own business and further not for one second respecting the wishes of the majority of both Sioux members and everyone else.

Then there are those that keep trying to associate an asinine NCAA policy with right and wrong(see this forum for the last 12 years). It's simple; Adhere to the policy and don't do a damn thing more. We are Sioux fans! The NCAA can't say we aren't, Period!! end of story!!

It's funny, whenever I post on here about maintaining the integrity of the Sioux name I get these, "It's over. Move on." like I am some last of the Mohicans irrationally holding on to some relic that has been banished by the will of all else replies from the same old players who hang around on here like it is their job to be some sort of moral authority for "The Program",

yet when the vast majority of the people say they want to just be "North Dakota" these same clowns get back on their soap box, get all lathered with moral turpitude and proclaim that this is being done as chicanery to keep the name. Yeah I'm talking about you junior(not u Sikatoka).

For once, based on the majority (See any poll/ or a UND home game) I say to you all. Move on!!

This^ Sioux Forever screw the Admin. & Committee

Staying ND will not hurt UND

[Cratter]

The committee was hired to pick a new nickname for UND (Also the title of this thread).

So that's what they'll do. They aren't going to go through all this to not pick a name.

Some people just gotta get over it.

[yababy8]

Eradicated? No.

Do I want to make sure it doesn't become the de facto "official unofficial" name and we're back on the list? Yes. Don't believe that could happen? Can the NCAA control you as a fan, a booster, and what you say today? Yes, yes, it can.

Do I want to make sure we don't look like a bunch of yokels who use a loophole (if there really is a loophole) to renege on a contract? Yes.

Am I dissatisfied with our neighbors at Spirit Lake and Standing Rock (at least the tribal governments) and wish to see them reap the rewards of their actions? Yes, yes I do.

I'm not sure your dissatisfaction should be directed toward Spirit Lake. They voted for the name in due time and followed with s law suite against the NCAA.

As far as Standing Rock goes, it was never really appropriate to include them in the settlement agreementgiven their distance from the university and their lack of governmental structure. you can't blame them for being who they are. they really just never cared and really never had any impetus to care.I think any fair analysis of the history of this whole debacle would only place dissatisfaction squarely on Kelly and the University of North Dakota administrations. Kelly should not be the president of the University of North Dakota at this time because of that. I can think of no stronger truth in the entire universe.

[yababy8]

My 3 year old son many times throws a tantrum when he does not want to eat his diner. He says "no, no, no" and sits there pushing his plate away. But I tell him that he has to eat his food, even though he doesn't want to. In many many ways, you and the other "sioux forever" crowd members remind me alot of him. Stubborn and set in your ways so much that nothing anyone says to you will ever change your mind. And you just sit their with your arms cross and a frown on your face saying "no, no, no."

All Sioux fans agree with you in that the Fighting Sioux name should have never been retired. We all agree that the NCAA overstepped their bounds in creating such rediculous new rule. We all agree that the Fighting Sioux was a great name. A name that was more than just a logo. It actually stood for something. We are all proud of the Fighting Sioux name and the rich heritage it has for the Sioux people and for the school.

What people don't agree on is what is best for UND. ?We had to retire a great nickname. It sucks. But that is reality. Do I wish it never happened, of course!! We all do. But welcome to the real world. Things happen that you may not lke and agree with. I am not asking you and the rest of the "Sioux forever" crowd to forget completely about the past and what the Sioux name has meant to this University. I am not asking you to fall head over heals in love with the new nickname. All I am asking is for those people that can't let go of the old name and refuse to recognize any new name the University selects to just think of what is best fo the University and its athletic teams and student atheletes. We can't let sefish pride and anger get in the way of doing what needs to be done and what is going to be done.

Funny thing about my 3 year old, once he realized that the food on his plate was good, and by eating it he would be hungry anymore, he was happy!

nice !@#$ analogy Ricky!

I guess that makes the NCAA our parent huh?

standing firm for what you believe in especially in a case where you know that those who attempt to change what you believe in are not acting with integrity is not the same thing as a three year old temper tantrum. Unless of course that three year old is throwing a temper tantrum because you have a knife to their hand and are about to chop it off. Then what say you about said temper tantrum?

I could go on all day with an analogies exemplifying the pathetic truths of this whole sham but it won't convince any of these fear mongering self righteous know more than the rest of us about what is good for the school lunatics of anything they haven't already been unable to grasp.

[UND1983]

nice !@#$ analogy Ricky!

I guess that makes the NCAA our parent huh?

standing firm for what you believe in especially in a case where you know that those who attempt to change what you believe in are not acting with integrity is not the same thing as a three year old temper tantrum. Unless of course that three year old is throwing a temper tantrum because you have a knife to their hand and are about to chop it off. Then what say you about said temper tantrum?

I could go on all day with an analogies exemplifying the pathetic truths of this whole sham but it won't convince any of these fear mongering self righteous know more than the rest of us about what is good for the school lunatics of anything they haven't already been unable to grasp.

The name is gone, Chief.

[bigskyvikes]

The name is gone, Chief.

This isn't directed at just you, but you stated something everyone knows!

I don't think he is denying that, but the BS around here on who is to blame and the scare tactics of why this has to happen and why that can't happen are mind numbing!

[UNDErmines]

Again, I said scientific.  You're citing two anonymous polls that a single person could cast as many votes as they please (and they did, see the multiple obvious copy and paste jobs or our good buddy the Ermine for proof).  On top of that, there was zero limitations on who could vote.  It was anonymous, you didn't have to be a stakeholder of any kind or have UND's best interests in mind.  The only "facts" that those polls show is that basically anyone can use the internet.

 

You claim legal jargon and then pass over the part where it specifically says "adopt" and "new nickname".  Yet you don't say how not adopting anything and using North Dakota (which has been used since 1883) qualifies as new.

 

 

As others have stated, I have a hard time seeing the representatives picked to represent the stakeholders putting North Dakota on the ballot.  It solves zero of the problems that UND is in and continues to give the group of people that regard the Fighting Sioux nickname as some sort of deity false hope that it will somehow be reinstated as UND's nickname some day.

 

Hey, Hey, HEY!  Don't undermine the Ermine.  Support for the Ermine was both broad and deep.  While I represented more than one suggestion, I was not even close to the 60 that were submitted by the Ermine Army.  I even heard that there were street demonstrations in some cities touting the new UNDermines motto, "Fur Kills".

[ringneck28]

This isn't directed at just you, but you stated something everyone knows!

I don't think he is denying that, but the BS around here on who is to blame and the scare tactics of why this has to happen and why that can't happen are mind numbing!

So I earned my BS at a different institution of higher learning.  Can I share my BS here?  Do I need to get my CDL to bring this BS from over here in western ND?

[UND1983]

This isn't directed at just you, but you stated something everyone knows!

I don't think he is denying that, but the BS around here on who is to blame and the scare tactics of why this has to happen and why that can't happen are mind numbing!

No scare tactics needed. This one sells itself. Name is gone and a new one is on the way.

[Siouxperfan7]

nice !@#$ analogy Ricky!

I guess that makes the NCAA our parent huh?

standing firm for what you believe in especially in a case where you know that those who attempt to change what you believe in are not acting with integrity is not the same thing as a three year old temper tantrum. Unless of course that three year old is throwing a temper tantrum because you have a knife to their hand and are about to chop it off. Then what say you about said temper tantrum?

I could go on all day with an analogies exemplifying the pathetic truths of this whole sham but it won't convince any of these fear mongering self righteous know more than the rest of us about what is good for the school lunatics of anything they haven't already been unable to grasp.

 

You talke about truth....here is the TRUTH!!  The Fighting Sioux name is retired.  It is never coming back.  UND will adopt a new name and logo.

 

Now, questions for you and the "Sioux forever" crowd: What are you a fan of, the Fighting Sioux name and logo, or the University of North Dakota?  Because if you are a fan of the University of North Dakota and it's athletic teams, you will cheer them on no mater what name they go buy. 

 

Does it suck that we had to retire the name?  Of course!!  But its time to accept reality.  There will be a new name and a new identity for UND and its athletic teams.  You can either choose to be stubborn and refuse to accept change, or embrace it support the teams that you love and have cheered for.

 

So what's it gonna be?  You ready to be a big boy?  Or are you going to throw a temper tantrum in the concourse at the Ralph because your team has a new name?

[ScottM]

The name is gone, Chief.

 

 

Gone? Did you say "gone"? Nothing is gone until we decide it is! Was it gone when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!

Otter: Germans?

Boon: Forget it, he's delusional.

 

[bigskyvikes]

So I earned my BS at a different institution of higher learning. Can I share my BS here? Do I need to get my CDL to bring this BS from over here in western ND?

You may have to, not sure...

[bigskyvikes]

No scare tactics needed. This one sells itself. Name is gone and a new one is on the way.

Yep....and that new one could end up being North Dakota!

[tnt]

Yep....and that new one could end up being North Dakota!

...and if it is, we will be right back here starting from scratch in 5 years or less. Not a scare tactic, but do you think that the people that shouted down the Sioux nickname won't start a campaign to find a politically correct name themselves? Jeanotte is probably already getting a plan ready because people are still yelling "Sioux", whether it has anything to do with having a nickname in place or not.

[UND1983]

Yep....and that new one could end up being North Dakota!

No it couldn't. They are already North Dakota.

[Hawkster]

Yep....and that new one could end up being North Dakota!

Kelley and/or the committee need to come out and just say having no nickname is just unacceptable and we aren't going there.  I will never understand why this idea was allowed to fester as long as it has.   Pick a damn name and move on, this has dragged out way too long.   I'm sorry, but if it goes much longer, I'm not going to give a rip what they pick.   Six months ago only a few names looked good to me, now anything except having no name is getting appealing.